Australian Politics Forum - Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low

Bobby.

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #15 - Feb 19^th, 2017 at 12:39pm

The_Barnacle wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 11:17am:

Bobby, don't start spamming my thread with your ice age rubbish. Keep that crap in your own thread.

Quote:

Definition of irony: Global warming scientists travel to Antarctica to study the melting ice, and get stuck in the ice.

It's only ironic to the ignorant and ill informed

The Antarctic plateau is one of the coldest places on earth and averages about -55 degrees C. Clearly no amount of AGW is going to melt this ice. AGW does however allow the air to hold more moisture, hence ironicly, global warming is actually responsible for more ice on the Antarctic plateau.

The coastal areas of Antarctica are much warmer and are the areas most affected by global warming.

OK - I understand -

so when we have global warming there's more ice?

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 43580 Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #16 - Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:47pm Not more sea ice and the Antarctic Plateau is not affected by AGW.
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16397 Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #17 - Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:55pm Jovial Monk wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:47pm: Not more sea ice and the Antarctic Plateau is not affected by AGW. You mean it is not warming globally? Oh horrors. What will they think of next?
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Bobby. Moderator Online Australian Politics Posts: 95101 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #18 - Feb 19^th, 2017 at 5:56pm lee wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:55pm: Jovial Monk wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:47pm: Not more sea ice and the Antarctic Plateau is not affected by AGW. You mean it is not warming globally? Oh horrors. What will they think of next? Thanks Lee - Jovial deserves a hard time.
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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 43580 Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #19 - Feb 19^th, 2017 at 6:22pm Why is that, Blooby? Because you cannot answer my questions?
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TheFunPolice

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #20 - Feb 20^th, 2017 at 4:35pm

Bobby. wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 12:39pm:

The_Barnacle wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 11:17am:

Bobby, don't start spamming my thread with your ice age rubbish. Keep that crap in your own thread.

Quote:

Definition of irony: Global warming scientists travel to Antarctica to study the melting ice, and get stuck in the ice.

It's only ironic to the ignorant and ill informed

The Antarctic plateau is one of the coldest places on earth and averages about -55 degrees C. Clearly no amount of AGW is going to melt this ice. AGW does however allow the air to hold more moisture, hence ironicly, global warming is actually responsible for more ice on the Antarctic plateau.

The coastal areas of Antarctica are much warmer and are the areas most affected by global warming.

OK - I understand -

so when we have global warming there's more ice?

ices aint ices Shocked

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TheFunPolice

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #21 - Feb 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm

Bobby. wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 5:56pm:

lee wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:55pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:47pm:

Not more sea ice and the Antarctic Plateau is not affected by AGW.

You mean it is not warming globally? Oh horrors. What will they think of next? Grin

Thanks Lee - Jovial deserves a hard time.

lee knows less than you Grin

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TheFunPolice

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #22 - Feb 20^th, 2017 at 4:38pm

TheFunPolice wrote on Feb 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Bobby. wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 5:56pm:

lee wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:55pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Feb 19^th, 2017 at 4:47pm:

Not more sea ice and the Antarctic Plateau is not affected by AGW.

You mean it is not warming globally? Oh horrors. What will they think of next? Grin

Thanks Lee - Jovial deserves a hard time.

lee knows less than you Grin

..atleast he pretends he does because it pays well Shocked

Go mining and banking- bugger the kids and the people who actually died for democracy Roll Eyes

Hey, go Turnbull et al.... go business acumen at the same time Embarrassed

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Jovial Monk

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #23 - Feb 21^st, 2017 at 1:28pm

Snow in Vic (and NSW to smaller extent) in summer? Little Ice Age cry dupes.

Real story is a bit more complicated, to do with extremes as the climate warms and there is more energy and moisture in the atmosphere—I do keep mentioning that, don’t I?

Quote:

“Climatologists who deal with the day-to-day data see a change, that this variation will become stronger. There’s more energy in the atmosphere. [My emphasis]

“It’s like a pendulum, when you put more energy in, it has a larger effect and variation. This is with a pendulum and the same goes with the climate. If we put more energy in so the variation will get larger.”

Ms Ewenz, who has a PhD in meteorology, said we are seeing significant changes in temperatures one week to the next because of rapid shifts in high and low pressure systems around the country.

“What makes the difference at the moment is we get all these cold fronts from the southern ocean coming through, which brings the cold air and then the next thing – in the same week and cycle – we get the high pressure cells moving a little bit closer and we get the hot weather from the north,” she said.

Victoria and NSW cop snow, heatwave subsides

New South Wales residents recovering from more than 100 bushfires across the state last week have been treated to an unseasonable dusting of snow.

In the early hours of Monday morning, Victoria’s Mt Hotham and NSW’s alpine regions including Thredbo and Perisher copped “quite substantial” February snow fall with 5-10cm.

Australia's wild weather

“It’s pretty unusual,” BoM forecaster Dean Stewart told The New Daily. “Sometimes we get it in the summer months but most of the time it occurs in December, sometimes January, but it’s rarer to get it in February.

“It’s not unprecedented, but it is fairly rare this time of the year and for it to actually settle on the ground.”

NSW forecaster Andrew Haigh explained the reason we see big contrasts in temperature from one state to the next at the end of summer is due of sweeping cold fronts that close out the season.

“Sometimes towards the end of summer we tend to get some swings of temperature when we have cold fronts come through,” he told The New Daily.

“Basically a cool air mass replaces the warm air mass and that leads to quite big contrasts in temperature between one area and the other even between one day and the next.”

http://thenewdaily.com.au/weather/2017/02/20/australias-wild-weather/

I saw the cold front and southerly winds on the BuMet map. Anybody can.

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 43580 Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #24 - Feb 22^nd, 2017 at 8:40am I have created an Anthropogenic Global Warming thread in General. I will post there articles based on science as and when I see something worthwhile. Two articles have been posted there so far with some of my comments on each article.
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16397 Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #25 - Feb 22^nd, 2017 at 4:10pm Jovial Monk wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2017 at 8:40am: I have created an Anthropogenic Global Warming thread in General. I will post there articles based on science Where is the science attached to your "kelp" piece?
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The_Barnacle

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #26 - Sep 27^th, 2017 at 9:14pm

Sea ice around Antarctica has shrunk about 2 million square kilometres in just three years, swinging from a record large maximum area covered to a record low, in a shift that could have implications for the global climate.

While a late burst in ice cover this spring cannot be ruled out, it appears the sea ice around Antarctica has peaked for the sea at about 18.013 million square kilometres, the smallest maximum extent in the 30-plus years of satellite readings.

For Antarctica, the lowest maximum extent, recorded on September 12, follows a record low minimum sea ice coverage recorded on March 1 after the summer thaw. As with the Arctic, the warming oceans are undercutting sea ice from below, while the warming atmosphere is melting ice from above.

Antarctica's variability, though, makes it a more complex problem to understand than its polar opposite. For instance, the freshwater from melting land-based glaciers more readily freezes than salty sea water, increasing sea ice in some regions of the continent.

While the climate change signal is much clearer in the northern latitudes - where longer-term records show a relatively steady retreat of Arctic sea ice - evidence of global warming's impact around Antarctica is also showing up in the observations.

Scientists are less sure of the trends in sea ice volume in the southern hemisphere than in the north, given the difficultly satellites have in distinguishing sea ice from the snow that has accumulated on it, for instance.

http://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/attacked-from-two-sides-antarct...

Those that were trumpeting the record sea ice of 2014 have gone strangely quiet. But then denialists always have been known for cherry picking data

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TheFunPolice Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9009 waggawagga Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #27 - Sep 27^th, 2017 at 9:21pm https://sites.google.com/site/arctischepinguin/home/global-sea-ice https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/sep/27/easyjet-electric-planes-wright-...
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lee

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Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low
Reply #28 - Sep 27^th, 2017 at 9:53pm

""This combination of factors, all these things coming together in a single year, was basically the 'perfect storm,' for Antarctic sea ice," said corresponding author Malte Stuecker, a UW postdoctoral researcher in atmospheric sciences. "While we expect a slow decline in the future from global warming, we don't expect such a rapid decline in a single year to happen very often."

The area of sea ice around Antarctica at its peak in late 2016 was 2 million square kilometers (about 800,000 square miles) less than the average from the satellite record. Statistically, this is three standard deviations away from the average—an event that would be expected to occur randomly just once every 300 years.

The record low was not predicted by climate scientists, so UW researchers looked at the bigger picture in ocean and atmospheric data to explain why it happened.

The previous year, 2015-16, had a very strong El Niño in the tropical Pacific Ocean. Nicknamed the "Godzilla El Nino," the event was similar to other monster El Niños in 1982-83 and 1997-98. Unlike the 1997-98 event, however, it was only followed by a relatively weak La Niña in 2016.

Far away from the tropics, the tropical El Niño pattern creates a series of high- and low-pressure zones that cause unusually warm ocean temperatures in Antarctica's eastern Ross, Amundsen and Bellingshausen seas. But in 2016, when no strong La Niña materialized, researchers found that these unusually warm surface pools lingered longer than usual and affected freeze-up of seawater the following season.

"The study was published Aug. 24 in Geophysical Research Letters."

https://phys.org/news/2017-08-record-low-antarctic-sea-ice-due.html#jCp

So how much was due to climate change? What to believe a peer-reviewed paper or an opinion piece?

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Arctic and Antarctic sea ice at record low Reply #29 - Sep 27^th, 2017 at 10:02pm Oh FGS Monk is back.... just when things were getting more sensible. So the scientists don't understand weather or climate change... goodo. Told you Monk.
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