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Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002 (Read 764 times)
Unforgiven
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Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Oct 25th, 2016 at 8:52pm
 
That's 14 consecutive years of below average (1981 - 2010) sea ice.

http://www.climatecentral.org/gallery/graphics/arctic-sea-ice-extent-below-avera...[/url]

Quote:
Since 2002, every September ice extent minimum has been below the long-term average (1981-2010), and the last 10 record lows have all occurred since 2005.

Arctic sea ice minimums are declining at a rate of 13.4 percent per decade, while the maximums are declining at a rate of 3.2 percent per decade. Overall, the ice is shrinking between 3-4 percent per decade.

In addition, Arctic sea ice has been getting thinner, making it more vulnerable to melt. In fact, only 3 percent of the total ice cover is made up of ice that is five years old or older, with first year ice accounting for up to 70 percent of of the total ice cover. While the Arctic is not going to be ice free (less than 15 percent ice concentration) next summer, many scientists are estimating that it will be in the next 20-30 years.


...
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #1 - Oct 25th, 2016 at 10:10pm
 
Wow Does that include the data from 1975 that the IPCC and everybody else tries to ignore?

On mo of course not. The new paradigm is that we don't have reliable data beyond 1979. Wink

And of course we didn't have sailing ships sailing the Arctic about 1917.  And Adolf Erik Nordenskiöld sailed the North East Passage in 1878. Wink

It's just not as bad as you thought. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Unforgiven
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #2 - Oct 26th, 2016 at 1:06am
 
lee wrote on Oct 25th, 2016 at 10:10pm:
Wow Does that include the data from 1975 that the IPCC and everybody else tries to ignore?

On mo of course not. The new paradigm is that we don't have reliable data beyond 1979. Wink

And of course we didn't have sailing ships sailing the Arctic about 1917.  And Adolf Erik Nordenskiöld sailed the North East Passage in 1878. Wink

It's just not as bad as you thought. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy


Smile. Things could be worse.

...

http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~archer/cartoons/climate-models-vs-skeptic-models.png

...
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #3 - Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:36pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 1:06am:
lee wrote on Oct 25th, 2016 at 10:10pm:
Wow Does that include the data from 1975 that the IPCC and everybody else tries to ignore?

On mo of course not. The new paradigm is that we don't have reliable data beyond 1979. Wink

And of course we didn't have sailing ships sailing the Arctic about 1917.  And Adolf Erik Nordenskiöld sailed the North East Passage in 1878. Wink

It's just not as bad as you thought. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy


Smile. Things could be worse.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/1b/58/a5/1b58a5797fbe8d6f9a9a2c09bfd79...

http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~archer/cartoons/climate-models-vs-skeptic-models.png

http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~archer/cartoons/climate-models-vs-skeptic-models.png



You mean those climate models that have never been verified, never been calibrated, never been right? The ones the alarmists say "see if we slice it up into tiny time slices, they are not so bad? They just don't talk about the ever widening error bars overall, because that isn't what they want to see. Those climate models? Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Unforgiven
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #4 - Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:37pm
 
lee wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:36pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 1:06am:
lee wrote on Oct 25th, 2016 at 10:10pm:
Wow Does that include the data from 1975 that the IPCC and everybody else tries to ignore?

On mo of course not. The new paradigm is that we don't have reliable data beyond 1979. Wink

And of course we didn't have sailing ships sailing the Arctic about 1917.  And Adolf Erik Nordenskiöld sailed the North East Passage in 1878. Wink

It's just not as bad as you thought. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy


Smile. Things could be worse.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/1b/58/a5/1b58a5797fbe8d6f9a9a2c09bfd79...

http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~archer/cartoons/climate-models-vs-skeptic-models.png

http://geosci.uchicago.edu/~archer/cartoons/climate-models-vs-skeptic-models.png



You mean those climate models that have never been verified, never been calibrated, never been right? The ones the alarmists say "see if we slice it up into tiny time slices, they are not so bad? They just don't talk about the ever widening error bars overall, because that isn't what they want to see. Those climate models? Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy


Invisible denialist models?
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #5 - Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:45pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:37pm:
Invisible denialist models?



Please make sense. Oh I forgot, beyond your comprehension.
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #6 - Oct 26th, 2016 at 1:10pm
 
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2016/10/enric-sala-global-warming-climate-cha...

[quote]In his new documentary, Before the Flood, Leonardo DiCaprio takes viewers on an eye-opening tour of how climate change is affecting the planet's oceans right now, from rising seas threatening Miami to the perilously melting Arctic.

One of the experts DiCaprio meets in the film is Enric Sala, a marine biologist and National Geographic explorer-in-residence. Sala is working to study, document, and protect some of the most biologically important areas of the ocean through the Pristine Seas project.

We spoke with Sala about his work and role in the new film.

Watch Before the Flood on National Geographic channels on October 30 at 9/10c, or online for free.
In Before the Flood, you take DiCaprio to the tip of Canada’s Baffin Island in the far Arctic. There, you warn that by 2040 the Arctic will have no sea ice left. Can you tell us what that will mean for the environment and for us?

The melting of the sea ice has consequences on all levels, from local to global. Locally, all the animals that live up there have evolved to live with the sea ice, so its disappearance will have major effects through the entire food web.

For example, there are certain algae that need to live under the ice. Those organisms are an important food source for little shrimplike creatures called amphipods. Those organisms, in turn, are eaten by Arctic cod, which are eaten by seals, which are eaten by polar bears. There are projections that the polar bear population is going to crash as the ice keeps melting. Already in the Beaufort Sea, we have seen a 30 percent decline in the polar bear population.

Melting sea ice also sets up a feedback loop. Ice reflects a lot of the sun’s energy back up toward space, while open water absorbs more of that heat. So the less ice and the more water, the more the planet warms. (Read about the astronaut who is using his final days to fight for climate change awareness.)

You also said the Arctic is like the air-conditioning of the Northern Hemisphere, affecting weather patterns, currents, and disasters like droughts and floods. Can you explain how this works?

A warming Arctic is going to affect our planet’s systems of ocean currents and wind patterns, which help drive a lot of our weather. Now, there is a giant conveyor belt in which cold water that forms near the edge of sea ice sinks, only to be replaced by warmer water from the south. This process makes the British Isles comfortable to live in, for example, instead of frigid. But this whole conveyor system is in danger of disruption as the poles warm.


As the Arctic warms, it may also impact air currents, such as the jet stream, which drives a lot of weather in North America by blocking or shuttling cold air.

In the film you call the warming of the Arctic “the most dramatic transformation of a large environment ever.” Can you explain why this part of the world is so susceptible to climate change?

The Arctic is warming two to three times faster than the average for the rest of the planet. It’s ironic, because the carbon emissions that are warming the planet are not produced in the Arctic, yet the Arctic is suffering the most. At the same time, what happens there is going to affect the rest of the planet.

Part of the problem is that at lower latitudes you often have more mixing of air and water, but the Arctic is more isolated at the top of the world. Also, warming of one or two degrees there has a bigger impact than other places because that’s enough to melt a huge amount of ice. That leads to dramatic changes in the landscape and sets up that feedback loop that leads to even more warming.

As the planet warms, species in temperate zones have been migrating northward. But Arctic species have nowhere to go. That’s a problem of living at the top of the world.

In Before the Flood we also meet local guide Jake Awa of Pond Inlet, who says the ice around his home used to be thick and solid, but now it is often the consistency of ice cream. Awa relies on hunting polar bears and other Arctic animals for much of his livelihood. How are indigenous people affected by climate change?

A warming Arctic is going to impact the people who live up there. The animals they depend on, such as seals and polar bears, are going to decline, so they are going to have a hard time preserving their hunting traditions.

Hear more about the film and climate change from DiCaprio.
Beyond the Arctic, the rest of the world’s ocean is also under threat from a changing climate, right? How serious is the problem?

For the past 40 years or so, the Earth has absorbed more heat from the sun than it has reflected away, and about 90 percent of that has been stored in the ocean. That means if the ocean wasn’t there, the lower parts of the atmosphere—where we live—would be 36 degrees Celsius (97 degrees Fahrenheit) warmer! Earth would be like Venus: uninhabitable. Bye-bye economy, bye-bye human race. The ocean also absorbs a quarter of the carbon dioxide we put in the atmosphere every year.

Unfortunately, all that heat is raising the temperature of the ocean, which is killing corals. That leads to the decline of the fish and other organisms that depend on corals. And all that carbon dioxide dissolving in the ocean is making the water more acidic. That makes it hard for corals, oysters, and other an
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #7 - Oct 26th, 2016 at 2:30pm
 
Wow. Now we have science by an actor of sorts.

Where do they say it has never happened before? Wink

You do realise they weren't alive in the late 19th and early 20th century when vessels were sailing the Arctic? So they can't comment on that aspect.

Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 1:10pm:
There, you warn that by 2040 the Arctic will have no sea ice left.



Well he may be alive to see how close he is to his prediction.

Is he one of those non-climate scientists that we shouldn't put faith in? Or is that only the sceptic that applies to? Wink

Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 1:10pm:
Unfortunately, all that heat is raising the temperature of the ocean, which is killing corals.



Really? Or is it the algae, which is what gives coral its colour?
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #8 - Oct 27th, 2016 at 6:16pm
 
lee wrote on Oct 25th, 2016 at 10:10pm:
Wow Does that include the data from 1975 that the IPCC and everybody else tries to ignore?

On mo of course not. The new paradigm is that we don't have reliable data beyond 1979. Wink

And of course we didn't have sailing ships sailing the Arctic about 1917.  And Adolf Erik Nordenskiöld sailed the North East Passage in 1878. Wink

It's just not as bad as you thought. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

What happened in the single year of 1878 again?
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #9 - Oct 27th, 2016 at 6:17pm
 
lee wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:45pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:37pm:
Invisible denialist models?



Please make sense. Oh I forgot, beyond your comprehension.

He's saying you have none einstein  Cheesy
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #10 - Oct 29th, 2016 at 4:30pm
 
TheFunPolice wrote on Oct 27th, 2016 at 6:16pm:
lee wrote on Oct 25th, 2016 at 10:10pm:
Wow Does that include the data from 1975 that the IPCC and everybody else tries to ignore?

On mo of course not. The new paradigm is that we don't have reliable data beyond 1979. Wink

And of course we didn't have sailing ships sailing the Arctic about 1917.  And Adolf Erik Nordenskiöld sailed the North East Passage in 1878. Wink

It's just not as bad as you thought. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

What happened in the single year of 1878 again?


You are so erudite you do not understand examples?

It is an example of the Arctic being ailed before. This current melt is not unprecedented.

Yep you still sound like a sock.
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #11 - Oct 29th, 2016 at 4:31pm
 
TheFunPolice wrote on Oct 27th, 2016 at 6:17pm:
lee wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:45pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:37pm:
Invisible denialist models?



Please make sense. Oh I forgot, beyond your comprehension.

He's saying you have none einstein  Cheesy


Is he? Are you another NostraDumbArse?
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Unforgiven
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #12 - Oct 29th, 2016 at 4:44pm
 
lee wrote on Oct 29th, 2016 at 4:31pm:
TheFunPolice wrote on Oct 27th, 2016 at 6:17pm:
lee wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:45pm:
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 26th, 2016 at 12:37pm:
Invisible denialist models?


Please make sense. Oh I forgot, beyond your comprehension.

He's saying you have none einstein  Cheesy


Is he? Are you another NostraDumbArse?


What a vacuous statement. Is denizen Valkie coaching you in debating strategy?
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lee
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #13 - Oct 29th, 2016 at 5:01pm
 
Unforgiven wrote on Oct 29th, 2016 at 4:44pm:
What a vacuous statement. Is denizen Valkie coaching you in debating strategy?



Nope. You are. Wink
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longweekend58
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Re: Global warming: Sea ice below average since 2002
Reply #14 - Oct 29th, 2016 at 5:10pm
 
Sceptics are not allowed to use meteorologists, Nobel Prize Laurates, physicists or non-conforming climate scientists...

but they expect us to take an ACTOR seriously???



you lot would be funny if not so painfully stupid.
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