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Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms? (Read 1871 times)
Bam
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Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Aug 5th, 2016 at 10:00pm
 
Greens call on Labor to support 'fairer' method to share six-year Senate terms
(Excerpt quoted)
Quote:
The New South Wales Greens senator Lee Rhiannon has warned Labor to abide by fairer Senate rules in the allocation of six and three-year Senate terms following the double dissolution election.

“If Labor supports the first-six-elected method rather than the fairer method of a half Senate recount then Labor will be helping the Coalition boost their Senate numbers at the next election,” Rhiannon said.

“The main reason for is that under a recount method [Justice party’s] Derryn Hinch wins a long-term Senate seat at the expense of a Liberal senator.”

At issue is how long senators have before they face the next election. Senators are elected on six-year terms but only half the Senate faces an election at the end of every three-year House of Representatives term.

Malcolm Turnbull’s decision to call a double-dissolution election means the Senate needs to determine which senators are on a three-year term and which are on a six-year term, in order to fall back into the usual election pattern.

There are two counting methods which are available to the Senate. The first, which has been used historically in double dissolutions, sees the first six of 12 state senators receive the six year terms and the remainder appointed for three years. The second is a Hawke government reform known as section 282 which creates a second Senate count to allocate positions that more closely replicate a half-Senate election.

“Section 282 is more democratic and the Senate has acknowledged that on previous occasions,” Rhiannon said. “If the crossbenchers are interested in reducing the power of the major party duopoly then they would support the fairer recount method.”

The Australian Electoral Commission has yet to conduct the second count but the Senate is not legally committed to use the s282 results to determine the terms. Previously the “first six” method has been used.

An early analysis by data expert, Grahame Bowland, who is also co-convenor for the Western Australia Greens, found that under the s282 count, Rhiannon and Hinch would receive six-year terms over Victorian Liberal Scott Ryan and NSW Labor senator Deb O’Neill.

If the Australian Electoral Commission second Senate counts supports that analysis (and Bowland’s work has mirrored the AEC count thus far), this would force the major parties to decide whether to marginalise Hinch and the Greens, who have a balance of power bloc, or support longer terms for their own senators.

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Belgarion
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #1 - Aug 5th, 2016 at 10:05pm
 
The government will go with whatever method it thinks will best serve the Lib/Lab duopoly.
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sir prince duke alevine
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #2 - Aug 5th, 2016 at 11:11pm
 
This is a toughy.  While I'd like to see a more diverse senate, giving the antisemite Rhiannon  a 6 year term is 6 years too much.
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Ye Grappler
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #3 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:42am
 
What was their crime to get a six year term?
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #4 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:43am
 
Belgarion wrote on Aug 5th, 2016 at 10:05pm:
The government will go with whatever method it thinks will best serve the Lib/Lab duopoly.


That's why I'm here and elsewhere - to ensure that duopoly vanishes from this earth.
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longweekend58
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #5 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 11:40am
 
I think you will see labor and liberal combine to force to historical method. We get rid of Hinch and at least one hanson senator quickly. That cant be bad.
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #6 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 11:42am
 
sir prince duke alevine wrote on Aug 5th, 2016 at 11:11pm:
This is a toughy.  While I'd like to see a more diverse senate, giving the antisemite Rhiannon  a 6 year term is 6 years too much.


Agree
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #7 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 11:59am
 
longweekend58 wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 11:40am:
I think you will see labor and liberal combine to force to historical method. We get rid of Hinch and at least one hanson senator quickly. That cant be bad.


I agree!
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cods
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #8 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:09pm
 
Ye Grappler wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:43am:
Belgarion wrote on Aug 5th, 2016 at 10:05pm:
The government will go with whatever method it thinks will best serve the Lib/Lab duopoly.


That's why I'm here and elsewhere - to ensure that duopoly vanishes from this earth.



well we did get a taste of that with the gillard govt.....two wishy washy senators got masses of support for their electorates....by all accounts.... is that really how its meant to work?..

I have always hoped whoever runs and is blessed with a seat........  govt reps or senate they are there for all of us....

why would I ever think that? Sad

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You missed it, you inveterate foolish sot (yes that's me beginning to fire back.....)  because it never happened.
 
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Ye Grappler
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #9 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:35pm
 
cods wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:09pm:
Ye Grappler wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 12:43am:
Belgarion wrote on Aug 5th, 2016 at 10:05pm:
The government will go with whatever method it thinks will best serve the Lib/Lab duopoly.


That's why I'm here and elsewhere - to ensure that duopoly vanishes from this earth.



well we did get a taste of that with the gillard govt.....two wishy washy senators got masses of support for their electorates....by all accounts.... is that really how its meant to work?..



why would I ever think that? Sad




If your hope had been anything more than just hope with both Labor and Liberal, there would be no call for a divided house.  If their policies and approach to issues actually stacked up for the majority, there would be no problem.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #10 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 1:15pm
 

6 year terms?

They should all get life!

...
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #11 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 2:11pm
 
The senate is the important house of review.  We don't want it to become a rubber stamp, for labor or liberal.   Smiley
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #12 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 2:23pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 11:40am:
I think you will see labor and liberal combine to force to historical method.

I'm not so sure. The order of election method would favour the Coalition.

ORDER OF ELECTION (states)

NSW: 3 Coalition 3 ALP, 2 Coalition, 1 ALP, 1 Grn, 1 ON, 1 LDP.
VIC: 3 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 Grn, 2 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 Grn, 1 Hinch.
QLD: 3 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 ON, 2 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 Grn, 1 ON.
WA: 3 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 Grn, 2 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 Grn, 1 ON.
SA: 2 Coalition, 2 ALP, 2 NXT, 2 Coalition, 1 ALP, 1 NXT, 1 Grn, 1 FFP.
TAS: 2 Coalition, 2 ALP, 1 Grn, 1 Lambie, 2 Coalition, 3 ALP, 1 Grn.

TOTALS: 16 Coalition, 13 ALP, 3 Grn, 2 NXT, 1 ON, 1 Lambie, 12 Coalition, 11 ALP, 6 Grn, 3 ON, 1 LDP, 1 Hinch, 1 FFP, 1 NXT.

This split would strongly favour the Coalition 16-12, the ALP slightly 13-11 and heavily disadvantage the Greens 3-6. Sum of these differences is 9.

The s282 method would give Hinch and a NSW Green 6-year terms instead of a Victorian Liberal and NSW Labor candidate. This would give much fairer splits of 15-13 for the Coalition, 12-12 for ALP and 4-5 Greens. Sum of differences is 3 - clearly the s282 method is MUCH fairer.

longweekend58 wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 11:40am:
We get rid of Hinch and at least one hanson senator quickly. That cant be bad.

Hinch was elected 10th, so under the order of election mwthod he would get a 3-year term. Hinch would get a 6-year term under the recount method.

The same for the One Nation candidates - I think three of them would end up with 3-year terms under both methods. Hanson herself may get a 6-year term under both methods.
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« Last Edit: Aug 6th, 2016 at 2:43pm by Bam »  

You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #13 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 2:55pm
 
Good way of getting the cross bench offside, early in the term.

Could see a boycott of all noncore issues by them. That would stuff up the coalition's recession causing agenda.
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Re: Senate: Who gets the 6-year terms?
Reply #14 - Aug 6th, 2016 at 3:24pm
 
Deleted wrote on Aug 6th, 2016 at 2:55pm:
Good way of getting the cross bench offside, early in the term.

Could see a boycott of all noncore issues by them. That would stuff up the coalition's recession causing agenda.

I don't see why. Senators like Day, Lyonhjelm and most of the ON senators would get three-year terms under both methods.
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