Australian Politics Forum - first islamic enclave gone

Sprintcyclist Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 39522 Gender:	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #90 - Jun 19^th, 2016 at 10:11pm Aussie is rarely worth replying to. He's got worse over the past year or less.
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polite_gandalf

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #91 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 10:58am

Aussie wrote on Jun 19^th, 2016 at 9:20pm:

freediver wrote on Jun 19^th, 2016 at 9:03pm:

Aussie would you mind quoting the first time I made that claim about Malek Fahd?

Just remember, no bombs.

Dunno if this is the first because a zillion come up on my search.

Post # 122

Quote:

So because I am concerned that the money ended up with terrorists, it is unreasonable to ask what the AFIC thinks is so much more important than educating Muslim school children?

here:

Link.

See here:

Link.

I have already quoted the post in question - post#25. Sprint started a thread stating that some muslim donation was going to terrorists. FD's first reply was the single line "So do government funds given to Muslim-run private schools in Australia." I've been pressing him on this ever since he wrote it over a year ago - why he said it and how can he justify such a baseless accusation. Not once has he given a straight answer, but you'll see from the linked thread that he came up with the most unbelievably dumb justifications, including demands that I produce the receipts for him (you konw, the old 'prove it isn't so' fallacy). He knows what it is, he knows what he said, he's just playing this childish game - probably I suspect because he knows it was wrong, but is too cowardly to own up to it. And more importantly, he knows it makes a complete joke of his current moral crusade against deceitful muslims.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47436 At my desk.	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #92 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 11:05am Gandalf are you aware of any Muslim school initiating anti-fraud reforms without micromanagement by the federal government? How did your school overcome what you previously described as the insurmountable obstacle of AFIC ownership?
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polite_gandalf

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #93 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 11:16am

freediver wrote on Jun 19^th, 2016 at 8:50pm:

How did you get over the previously insurmountable obstacle of AFIC owning the government funds that were given to your school?

Who said it was insurmountable?

Quote:

Has the government insisted that all Islamic schools sever ties with AFIC?

Ah yes, the "typical muslim" again, who of course knows everything about AFIC affiliated schools - all across the country.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
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Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #94 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 11:28am

Gandalf, you previously said it was important to find out what happened to the money, but everything else you say indicates complete disinterest and that you are more concerned with 'moving on'. You also claimed your own school was not disadvantaged by its relationship with AFIC, but then conceded you had no way of knowing. Do you think it would be reasonable for people to see this as suspicious? Are you at least a little bit concerned that terrorism funding was happening right under your nose and you are now helping to sweep it under the carpet? Are you aware of any Muslims actively looking into what happened to the money that we know was obtained fraudulently, or whether the problem was more widespread - including for example your own school?

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 18^th, 2016 at 2:07pm:

I don't know what steps Malek Fahd are taking (different school, different state), but my school has been given a lease of life precisely because we have been proactive in changing the governance of the school to rid ourselves of AFIC involvement - exactly as per the governments conditions.

Gandalf why do you describe it both as being pro-active and responsive to government demands?

polite_gandalf wrote on Jun 19^th, 2016 at 10:22am:

But as I've said before, until now the school itself had no say because it was entirely controlled by AFIC - who owned the premises and obtained legal rights to exclusive control over the finances. But what I can tell you is that the school wasn't deprived in any way in terms of financial needs - which logically suggests only one of two things: 1. there was no financial mismanagement going on or 2. the government was paying far more than the school needed - thus allowing AFIC to pocket some excess.

How did you overcome this obstacle Gandalf? And in what sense did AFIC own the rights to federal government handouts?

Quote:

Ah yes, the "typical muslim" again, who of course knows everything about AFIC affiliated schools - all across the country.

It was just a question Gandalf. Has the government insisted that all Islamic schools sever ties with AFIC?

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polite_gandalf

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #95 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 1:53pm

freediver wrote on Jun 20^th, 2016 at 11:28am:

Are you at least a little bit concerned that terrorism funding was happening right under your nose and you are now helping to sweep it under the carpet?

Unbelievable.

freediver wrote on Jun 20^th, 2016 at 11:28am:

It was just a question Gandalf. Has the government insisted that all Islamic schools sever ties with AFIC?

Yes, 'just a question' from someone who states as fact that government school funds go to terrorists based on nothing whatsoever, and then tries to twist it into some sort of reasonable concern for the mere possibility that terrorist funding might be happening.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47436 At my desk.	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #96 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:00pm Do you think it is important to find out where the money went Gandalf? Does it bother you that none of the Muslims involved are tracking it down?
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polite_gandalf Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20023 Canberra Gender:	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #97 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:35pm Does it bother you when people state as fact that an Islamic organisation is funding terrorists - without a shred of evidence?
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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47436 At my desk.	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #98 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:44pm Where else do you think they get their money from? Does it bother you when people state as fact that AFIC did not defraud your school, when they have no way of even knowing?
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polite_gandalf

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #99 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:52pm

freediver wrote on Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:44pm:

Where else do you think they get their money from?

Thats the argument your going with?

I'll baselessly accuse government school funding of going to terrorists... cause I can't think of where else it would come from.

Sounds legit.

freediver wrote on Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:44pm:

Does it bother you when people state as fact that AFIC did not defraud your school, when they have no way of even knowing?

who stated it as fact FD?

Does it bother you when people state as fact that no one defrauded your tennis club - when you have no way of even knowing?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47436 At my desk.	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #100 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:55pm Most terrorism funding comes from Muslims and Islamic organisations Gandalf. Do you think it is important to find out where the money went Gandalf? Does it bother you that none of the Muslims involved are tracking it down?
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Mattyfisk Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 92345 Gender:	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #101 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 3:30pm FD, do you blame Islam for this terrorism?
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polite_gandalf

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #102 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 3:32pm

freediver wrote on Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:55pm:

Most terrorism funding comes from Muslims and Islamic organisations Gandalf.

You seem to be trying to cryptically justify a baseless claim - while being very careful to not directly do so. Let me make it more simple - do you still think the claim, which is baseless, that the misused government funding for Malek Fahd went to terrorists is ok to make?

freediver wrote on Jun 20^th, 2016 at 2:55pm:

Do you think it is important to find out where the money went Gandalf?

And why FD? Is it not enough to be satisfied it never went towards anything good? Do you think it makes me just that little bit less outraged at the fact of misuse than I should be? Do you think it doesn't make me motivated to want to stop it in the future? Get real. The problem here is not where misused money went, the problem is misuse itself.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver

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Re: first islamic enclave gone
Reply #103 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 3:42pm

It is not cryptic Gandalf. It is just one of the many versions you offered:

Quote:

Does it bother you when people state as fact that an Islamic organisation is funding terrorists - without a shred of evidence?

Quote:

And why FD? Is it not enough to be satisfied it never went towards anything good? Do you think it makes me just that little bit less outraged at the fact of misuse than I should be? Do you think it doesn't make me motivated to want to stop it in the future? Get real. The problem here is not where misused money went, the problem is misuse itself.

Gandalf, do you think that helping to sweep past crimes under the carpet, potentially including the use of millions of dollars of government funds for terrorism when they should have gone towards educating your own kids, is a good way to prevent it from happening again?

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Mattyfisk Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 92345 Gender:	Re: first islamic enclave gone Reply #104 - Jun 20^th, 2016 at 4:06pm FD, do you blame Islam for this terrorism?
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