Australian Politics Forum - debt and deficit Bill..

Swagman

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #15 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:10am

macman wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 6:53am:

Regards poll, sow doesn't post as much but has a lot more content. How many times has swag's post been' get a job you loafers'.

Wutsamadda Mac, can't handle some reality? Cheesy

Looks like the reality is that apart from you the rest of your lefty clan has trouble counting?

I'd back the content of my posts to SOW's any day of the week and twice on Sunday (Penalty Rate included) Grin

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St George of the Garden

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #16 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:15am

Deflation:
Quote:

The greater the grip deflation gains on the global economy, the larger the budget deficits become. At some stage, printing money to paper over the cracks will no longer work. What happens to welfare, healthcare and warfare spending?

Second, businesses all set themselves ambitious growth targets. We know from the corporate reporting season that not all companies achieve their stated objectives. Some fall woefully short. In a deflationary world, growth projections (even modest ones) become difficult to achieve. It relies on gaining market share from bankrupt competitors; reducing labour costs; squeezing suppliers — all of which further feeds into the deflationary loop and increases unemployment. Lower or stagnating profits translates to lower or stagnating share prices — especially if social mood is sombre and P/E ratios fall to reflect this new found cautiousness.

Finally, households are currently loaded up on debt under the perpetual assumption that next year will deliver higher incomes, higher house prices, and higher share markets. What happens if this cycle goes into reverse? Indebted households are likely to embark on a debt reduction program (forcibly or voluntarily). Another negative feedback loop.

The interlinking of private, corporate and public sector (mis)fortunes is likely to make the deflationary phase we’re on the cusp of entering much more destructive than people believe possible.

Deflation is made to appear evil. But that’s yet another lie from the truly evil central bankers. You cannot borrow to prosperity. Society has been dumbed down to the point that hardly anyone realises they’ve been duped. Deflation is nothing to fear — that is, if you have no debt, live within your means and save. The problem is that this applies to precious few.

http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20150122/prepared-deflation.html

Thanks to Howard & Costello our private sector is very highly indebted. As property values fall (deflation!) will bankers demand households pay more off their mortgages to make up for falling property values? Will they repossess houses and evict families leading to higher and higher personal bankruptcies and family breakups? We won’t be able to afford all the crap Howard built into the spending side of the Budget and the revenue side will have to be looked at as well.

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« Last Edit: Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:23am by St George of the Garden »

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Dnarever Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 57150 Here Gender:	Re: debt and deficit Bill.. Reply #17 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:22am Quote: Does suppository of wisdom post more than swag ? Yes and no.
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #18 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:17am

crocodile wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:04am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 6:42am:

Meantime the CPI as of last quarter amounts to only 1.7% annualised, so deflation is beginning to loom as a major problem, a problem much worse than a low rate of inflation.

Does Abbott or Hokey or any of the shambles have a plan to avert deflation?

Current fuel prices have dropped significantly. That would certainly affect inflation.

Question is - is it a sign of the End of Days? A last desperate attempt to plug the leaks in the hull of the global economy by cheapening transport for as long as the petroleum runs?

A desperate lunge by governments worldwide to stave of the righteous wrath of the people for the incessant rorting?

A last gasp attempt to stimulate spending and thus the economy by actually giving the peasants a little more in the pocket?

She's going down... grab a life jacket.....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: debt and deficit Bill.. Reply #19 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:29am The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators. But growth of our GDP is slowing.
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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: debt and deficit Bill.. Reply #20 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:32am St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:29am: The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators. But growth of our GDP is slowing. Yes gross and outrageous anti-competive behaviour from a cartel trying to influence the market. Just like a trade union in the labour market
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #21 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:33am

[quote author=GeorgeH link=1422529222/19#19 date=1422581367]The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators.

Shale oil notoriously inefficient and costly to procure...yeah - it's a sign of the end of days when the West starts down that road - like fracking gas - instead of getting it from oil field deposits they get it from the uneconomical stuff and ruin the landscape doing it...

Lif dat gas an' sink my hole....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: debt and deficit Bill.. Reply #22 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:34am St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:29am: The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators Such behaviour used to start wars....
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Grappler Truth Teller Feller

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #23 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:35am

Swagman wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:32am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:29am:

The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators.

But growth of our GDP is slowing.

Yes gross and outrageous anti-competive behaviour from a cartel trying to influence the market.

Just like a trade union in the labour market Cheesy

Either:-

a) a fair minded and equal approach to both sides..

b) the incredible ability to draw a criticism of the working man from anything at all, including the very things that are destroying him..

c) a sign of the need to go out and get a job and pay some taxes....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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St George of the Garden

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #24 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:35am

Swagman wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:32am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:29am:

The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators.

But growth of our GDP is slowing.

Yes gross and outrageous anti-competive behaviour from a cartel trying to influence the market.

Just like a trade union in the labour market Cheesy

I agree—VERY similar to the behavior of the BCA!

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crocodile

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #25 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:40am

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:15am:

Deflation:
Quote:

The greater the grip deflation gains on the global economy, the larger the budget deficits become. At some stage, printing money to paper over the cracks will no longer work. What happens to welfare, healthcare and warfare spending?

Second, businesses all set themselves ambitious growth targets. We know from the corporate reporting season that not all companies achieve their stated objectives. Some fall woefully short. In a deflationary world, growth projections (even modest ones) become difficult to achieve. It relies on gaining market share from bankrupt competitors; reducing labour costs; squeezing suppliers — all of which further feeds into the deflationary loop and increases unemployment. Lower or stagnating profits translates to lower or stagnating share prices — especially if social mood is sombre and P/E ratios fall to reflect this new found cautiousness.

Finally, households are currently loaded up on debt under the perpetual assumption that next year will deliver higher incomes, higher house prices, and higher share markets. What happens if this cycle goes into reverse? Indebted households are likely to embark on a debt reduction program (forcibly or voluntarily). Another negative feedback loop.

The interlinking of private, corporate and public sector (mis)fortunes is likely to make the deflationary phase we’re on the cusp of entering much more destructive than people believe possible.

Deflation is made to appear evil. But that’s yet another lie from the truly evil central bankers. You cannot borrow to prosperity. Society has been dumbed down to the point that hardly anyone realises they’ve been duped. Deflation is nothing to fear — that is, if you have no debt, live within your means and save. The problem is that this applies to precious few.

http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20150122/prepared-deflation.html

Thanks to Howard & Costello our private sector is very highly indebted. As property values fall (deflation!) will bankers demand households pay more off their mortgages to make up for falling property values? Will they repossess houses and evict families leading to higher and higher personal bankruptcies and family breakups? We won’t be able to afford all the crap Howard built into the spending side of the Budget and the revenue side will have to be looked at as well.

I don't see too much property price deflation.

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Very funny Scotty, now beam down my clothes.

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crocodile Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6682 Gender:	Re: debt and deficit Bill.. Reply #26 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:43am Swagman wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:34am: St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:29am: The petrol thing is OPEC trying to bankrupt US shale oil operators Such behaviour used to start wars.... Yes but the pressure on the Russians and Venezuelans is even greater. The enemy of my enemy and all that.
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St George of the Garden

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #27 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:49am

crocodile wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 11:40am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 30^th, 2015 at 7:15am:

Deflation:
Quote:

The greater the grip deflation gains on the global economy, the larger the budget deficits become. At some stage, printing money to paper over the cracks will no longer work. What happens to welfare, healthcare and warfare spending?

Second, businesses all set themselves ambitious growth targets. We know from the corporate reporting season that not all companies achieve their stated objectives. Some fall woefully short. In a deflationary world, growth projections (even modest ones) become difficult to achieve. It relies on gaining market share from bankrupt competitors; reducing labour costs; squeezing suppliers — all of which further feeds into the deflationary loop and increases unemployment. Lower or stagnating profits translates to lower or stagnating share prices — especially if social mood is sombre and P/E ratios fall to reflect this new found cautiousness.

Finally, households are currently loaded up on debt under the perpetual assumption that next year will deliver higher incomes, higher house prices, and higher share markets. What happens if this cycle goes into reverse? Indebted households are likely to embark on a debt reduction program (forcibly or voluntarily). Another negative feedback loop.

The interlinking of private, corporate and public sector (mis)fortunes is likely to make the deflationary phase we’re on the cusp of entering much more destructive than people believe possible.

Deflation is made to appear evil. But that’s yet another lie from the truly evil central bankers. You cannot borrow to prosperity. Society has been dumbed down to the point that hardly anyone realises they’ve been duped. Deflation is nothing to fear — that is, if you have no debt, live within your means and save. The problem is that this applies to precious few.

http://www.moneymorning.com.au/20150122/prepared-deflation.html

Thanks to Howard & Costello our private sector is very highly indebted. As property values fall (deflation!) will bankers demand households pay more off their mortgages to make up for falling property values? Will they repossess houses and evict families leading to higher and higher personal bankruptcies and family breakups? We won’t be able to afford all the crap Howard built into the spending side of the Budget and the revenue side will have to be looked at as well.

http://images-2.domain.com.au/2014/01/02/5047793/wide-housing-prices-620x349.jpg

I don't see too much property price deflation.

1. I never said deflation was here now.

2. How many of those sales are to investors, including overseas investors? If investors have to unload houses in a deflationary market oh boy, talk about turbulence!

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Swagman

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Re: debt and deficit Bill..
Reply #28 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 12:30pm

Quote:

Thanks to Howard & Costello our private sector is very highly indebted. As property values fall (deflation!) will bankers demand households pay more off their mortgages to make up for falling property values?

Home loans aren't margin loans the Bank can't make anyone pay back any uncontracted amounts if they are not in default.

Home lending is strongly regulated thanks to Peter Costello's creation APRA and by ASIC. High LVR loans are also propped up by Lender's Mortgage Insurance.

Australia's home lending and property market is way different to the US and Europe. Booming prices are the result of (Baby Boomers) investing their retirement incomes into property instead of the more risky shares and low return cash. Home prices aren't going down any time soon.

Cheap oil should be a boom for most. It should make goods cheaper and anyone with a car will have more cash in their pocket with petrol prices down to $1/L.

Tony's free trade agreement with Japan has just taken effect. Cars are cheaper too and appliances.

Quit being a Grim Reaper. Cheesy

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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: debt and deficit Bill.. Reply #29 - Jan 30^th, 2015 at 12:47pm APRA was just putting together of existing bank regulators. That is what Costello called “reform.” If equity drops I bet banks will ask people to top up mortgage repayments.
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Poll
Question: Does suppository of wisdom post more than swag ?
Yes 0 (0.0%) No 5 (100.0%) Total votes: 5 « Last Modified by: Its time on: Jan 29^th, 2015 at 10:33pm »