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Why does the government reward bludgers? (Read 6252 times)
woody2014
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #60 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:30pm
 
mantra wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:27pm:
woody2014 wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:22pm:
The amount of part Age Pension you receive is not only based on the assets you have. It is also determined by your income. For each dollar of income you receive over the income limit, which is currently $268 for a couple combined, your pension will be reduced by 50 cents. In terms of the asset limit, your Age Pension is reduced by $1.50 for every $1000 over a certain threshold, until you reach the disqualifying amount. You will need to speak with a Centrelink Financial Information Services officer to ascertain what your payment rate will be.

As self-funded retirees, if you do not qualify for an Age Pension, you may be entitled to a Commonwealth Seniors Health Card (CSHC), which will give you access to concessions on pharmaceuticals, medical services, transport to name but a few. Also, as holders of a CSHC, you may also be eligible for a Seniors Supplement to assist with household bills.



That's a little ambiguous, although thanks for the info. It doesn't say specifically what the threshold is. The figure I provided is what has appeared fairly regularly in the media for a couple with an income from investments. I don't think the family home is included in the threshold.

family home is not included but the family farm can be included   Angry
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woody2014
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #61 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:32pm
 
mantra wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:27pm:
woody2014 wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:22pm:
The amount of part Age Pension you receive is not only based on the assets you have. It is also determined by your income. For each dollar of income you receive over the income limit, which is currently $268 for a couple combined, your pension will be reduced by 50 cents. In terms of the asset limit, your Age Pension is reduced by $1.50 for every $1000 over a certain threshold, until you reach the disqualifying amount. You will need to speak with a Centrelink Financial Information Services officer to ascertain what your payment rate will be.

As self-funded retirees, if you do not qualify for an Age Pension, you may be entitled to a Commonwealth Seniors Health Card (CSHC), which will give you access to concessions on pharmaceuticals, medical services, transport to name but a few. Also, as holders of a CSHC, you may also be eligible for a Seniors Supplement to assist with household bills.



That's a little ambiguous, although thanks for the info. It doesn't say specifically what the "certain threshold" is. The figure I provided has appeared fairly regularly in the media based on a couple with an income from investments. I don't think the family home is included in the threshold.

family home not included family farm can be included
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mantra
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #62 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:38pm
 
woody2014 wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:30pm:
family home is not included but the family farm can be included



That seems a little unfair - the family farm is usually the family home for generations. Perhaps if the farm is very prosperous - it's thrown into the mix, although so should those homes worth $1 million plus. I read somewhere that all family homes over a certain market price are going to be included soon, so if you can afford to - it's better to stay away from Centrelink altogether.

This is a Coalition initiative.
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woody2014
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #63 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:41pm
 
mantra wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:38pm:
woody2014 wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:30pm:
family home is not included but the family farm can be included



That seems a little unfair - the family farm is usually the family home for generations. Perhaps if the farm is very prosperous - it's thrown into the mix, although so should those homes worth $1 million plus. I read somewhere that talk about all family homes over a certain market price are going to be included soon, so if you can afford to - it's better to stay away from Centrelink altogether.

This is a Coalition initiative.

haven't heard that yet. Luckily to family farms and two sons  Wink Wink Wink
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mantra
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #64 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 5:37pm
 
woody2014 wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 4:41pm:
haven't heard that yet. Luckily to family farms and two sons  Wink Wink Wink



Don't get too comfortable. One government or another will eventually reintroduce death duties to bring in more revenue.
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Bobby.
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #65 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 5:48pm
 
TheGreenLight wrote on Mar 13th, 2014 at 7:44pm:
I turn 65 soon, and i am not entitled to receive a pension. I have saved all my life, and apparently too much, I can live off of the money and Super that I have saved over the years. I know people who have blown all of their money, or at least a lot of it, and they get $20,000 a year from the taxpayer, and I get bigger all. Both sides do this, Labor and the Coalition. Why is this? Where is the incentive to save, where is the incentive to be prudent and wise with your money? Why do we reward those who waste their money? bugger I have completely lost it with all sides of politics in this country.



Life is full of injustices & there are millions of stories just like yours.

Unfortunately the Govt. is broke so they have introduced unfair rules
to try & reduce their costs.
Right now they are paying public servants & social security with borrowed money.
We'll end up like Greece before long.
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hawil
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #66 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 6:28pm
 
TheGreenLight wrote on Mar 13th, 2014 at 7:44pm:
I turn 65 soon, and i am not entitled to receive a pension. I have saved all my life, and apparently too much, I can live off of the money and Super that I have saved over the years. I know people who have blown all of their money, or at least a lot of it, and they get $20,000 a year from the taxpayer, and I get bigger all. Both sides do this, Labor and the Coalition. Why is this? Where is the incentive to save, where is the incentive to be prudent and wise with your money? Why do we reward those who waste their money? bugger I have completely lost it with all sides of politics in this country.

Please give me your opinion on this letter to Penny Wong, because she would not answer.

To the
Hon.P Wong MP
PO Box 6237
Halifax Street
ADELAIDE SA 5000

12’th March 2013


Dear Ms.Wong.
In the AFR article “PM keeps superannuation tax-free for over -60s” 7.Feb 2013 you are quoted as saying: “the government would listen to all ideas”.
Here is what the government should look at very seriously.


This is how the retirees are treated in Australia.
Retiree: 1)
Worked for 45 years and paid taxes, but did not accumulate enough assets to be completely independent of the age-pension. For every dollar of extra income for him and his wife above $6,500, the couple loses $0.50 of age pension, and if their income exceeds $45,000 per annum, the couple will pay tax of $0.315 in the dollar including medicare levy, leaving them with an income of $0.185 from every dollar extra income. For the defined benefit income a 10% tax-offset applies if paid from an Australian super fund, but not if the income comes from an overseas fund.
Retiree 2)
Has accumulated assets of $1.5million,mostly with huge tax concessions, and the assets are in a so-called taxed Self Managed Super Fund. To be very conservative, the assets are in a term deposit earning 7.0% income of $122,500 per annum and even if the retiree is single, he/she will not pay a cent of tax.
Now if the assets are in fully franked shares, like banks, and return $100,000 worth of franked dividends, he/she will again pay no tax on the dividend, and the government will send him/her a cheque of $30,000 for the franking credits.
Should the assets of these retirees fall below a certain level, they will be entitled to the age pension as anyone else, therefore why does the government provides the rich retirees with such huge tax concessions, while punishing the retirees at the lower income scale with the punitive means-test of the age pension?
Retiree 3)
Is an ex-politician or highly paid public servant, in receipt of a defined benefit pension of $100,000, on which he/she will have to pay tax, but he/she gets a 10% tax offset, which equals $10,000 after reaching retirement age, but before retiring, the public servant can establish a SMSF and contribute into it extra with tax concessions if the $25,000 total for under fifty and $50,000, if over fifty is not exceeded and in addition he/she can contribute $150,000 from after tax income, and the earnings from the SMSF will only attract 15% tax, and when the person reaches the age of 60 even the income will be completely tax-free for the SMSF.
Retiree’s 2) are well represented by the media and the super industry, as well as the Unions, and retiree’s 3) are represented by the government, and ironically by the leadership of various retiree Associations, like ACPSRO and its affiliated Associations, but who represents retiree’s 1) the part- pensioners who are being robbed of a decent standard of living in retirement by the means-test of the age pension.
What is the fairest solution; scrap the mean test of the age pension and scrap all tax concessions for super.
Will Gillard have the courage and scrap the tax concessions for super and the means test for the age pension. After all Howard introduced the tax-free super in one fell swoop.
Is there any other country which treats its citizens in such a discriminatory manner?
I would like to refer you to two recent articles;
1st) AFR ,Dec 8-9. 2012 by Brian Toohey, “Compulsory super makes little sense.
2nd)AFR 13.Feb 2013 by Alison Kahler, “Don’t put super over the national good.
Recently there was a lot written about changes in super, which  now seems to have disappeared, because the super industry and the Unions seem to be secure that the government will not make any drastic changes to the tax concessions for super.
Last year, a record number of Australians travelled to other countries, a drain on the Australian economy, and many of the travellers were probably self-funded retirees, who benefit enormously from the tax concessions for super.
Yours truly
Hawil



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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #67 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:03pm
 
Interesting letter. I will definitely will look and think about what you are saying. On the face of it, and I have no reason to doubt you, knowing how OAP recipients(1) are treated regarding income and the breaks the well off get, I think it's a question that needs addressing. Pity you didn't receive a response, the contents of the letter certainly deserved it.
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #68 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:10pm
 
Always found it quite bizarre that people struggle in their retirement.

It's not like turning 65 is a surprise is it?

I mean you only had the 40 years to save for it......
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #69 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:21pm
 
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:10pm:
Always found it quite bizarre that people struggle in their retirement.

It's not like turning 65 is a surprise is it?

I mean you only had the 40 years to save for it......


You've made it clear on a number of occasions that you would find it extremely hard to live on 80k@annum. The basic wage is 32k, how much out of that can you put away for your retirement do you think if a frugal person such as yourself could not live on it? You know this yet you continue this ivory tower talk Andrei. Let's not forget when super became compulsory here, 1991 from memory, there's not a lot a minimum wage earner can put away in that time.
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Andrei.Hicks
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #70 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:33pm
 
If I was living on my own, I could live off $80k quite easily.

What killed me in Australia on a family wage well in excess of that was mortgage, cars, energy bills, kids stuff, flights etc

If it were just me, I would breeze on $80k. When I was at college, I lived off $5.50 per hour man. I know what its like down there because I've been there.
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #71 - Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:47pm
 
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:33pm:
If I was living on my own, I could live off $80k quite easily.

What killed me in Australia on a family wage well in excess of that was mortgage, cars, energy bills, kids stuff, flights etc

If it were just me, I would breeze on $80k. When I was at college, I lived off $5.50 per hour man. I know what its like down there because I've been there.


If that's the case Andrei, why step on their heads? Many in Australia live on combined incomes of less that 80k. Could your family afford a mortgage on that? The cars they need to get to work to earn it? We have pitiful public transport in most areas. Why if you know what it's like do you continue with the ivory tower crap? Not everyone can be an accountant or some other professional, why should we step on them because of it? Don't they deserve a life however meagre? If you had a handicapped kid would you throw it off of the mount of Taygetos into Kaiada?
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #72 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 12:08am
 
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 14th, 2014 at 10:33pm:
If I was living on my own, I could live off $80k quite easily.

What killed me in Australia on a family wage well in excess of that was mortgage, cars, energy bills, kids stuff, flights etc

If it were just me, I would breeze on $80k. When I was at college, I lived off $5.50 per hour man. I know what its like down there because I've been there.


What Andrei means is, if he was living independently of his parents and had a decently paying job rather than relying on Disability Support from Centrelink, he would be able to live off $80k quite easily. Roll Eyes Tongue Smiley
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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #73 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 12:09am
 
Let me explain it to you.

> I grew up with nothing and have been on my own since I was sixteen and totally broke

> I've served this country

> I've worked years of eighteen + hour days and endured hazards on a daily basis.

> I've endured affirmative action and consequent destruction of career prospects

>  I've endured two divorces and total asset stripping as a result

> I've endured piss poor management that has destroyed companies I've worked with

>  I've endured an escalating number of disabilities for years - they now total fifteen

>  I've been kicked around from pillar to post to satisfy every goddamned politically correct idea in our totally lost and confused society

> I've never been a criminal - unlike some in government who have delighted in ripping me off repeatedly

>  I'm 64 - 65 this year and am still working and working on developing a company of my own so no idiot can ruin it.

Now - all that said - what part of 'bludger' comes into the fact that I receive around $20k a year and all medicals from the government?


...


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Re: Why does the government reward bludgers?
Reply #74 - Mar 15th, 2014 at 12:11am
 
Grappler Truth Teller Feller wrote on Mar 15th, 2014 at 12:09am:
Let me explain it to you.

> I grew up with nothing and have been on my own since I was sixteen and totally broke

> I've served this country

> I've worked years of eighteen + hour days and endured hazards on a daily basis.

> I've endured affirmative action and consequent destruction of career prospects

>  I've endured two divorces and total asset stripping as a result

> I've endured piss poor management that has destroyed companies I've worked with

>  I've endured an escalating number of disabilities for years - they now total fifteen

>  I've been kicked around from pillar to post to satisfy every goddamned politically correct idea in our totally lost and confused society

> I've never been a criminal - unlike some in government who have delighted in ripping me off repeatedly

>  I'm 64 - 65 this year and am still working and working on developing a company of my own so no idiot can ruin it.

Now - all that said - what part of 'bludger' comes into the fact that I receive around $20k a year and all medicals from the government?


http://oi60.tinypic.com/316xoxf.jpg




Dad??? Shocked Shocked Grin
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