Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 2 3 ... 11
Send Topic Print
Who are the Conservatives? (Read 17578 times)
#
Gold Member
*****
Offline


A fool is certain: an
ignorant fool, absolutely
so

Posts: 2603
Who are the Conservatives?
Dec 26th, 2013 at 3:30pm
 
Former Prime Minister John Howard is a Conservative. So is current Prime Minister Tony Abbott. Matty pridefully declares himself a Conservative from an improbably early age. I was a Conservative, but grew out of it.

So who are these Conservatives? Why don't they all grow out of it?

Political divides begin in the brain

10 April 2012 by Chris Mooney

JOHN HIBBING used to be a traditional political scientist. He studied elections, ran opinion polls and researched why some politicians opt to retire rather than wait around to be defeated by challengers. "About as traditional as it gets," he says.

Roughly a decade ago, though, Hibbing shifted to a new approach that is starting to revolutionise how we think about politics. He began to explore whether political preferences might be partly based in biology. The idea initially met with great scepticism from his peers. But Hibbing and his collaborators at the Political Physiology Lab at the University of Nebraska-Lincoln now have a stack of scientific publications backing the idea.

For example, when they measure the physical reactions of liberals and conservatives to aversive stimuli, they find major differences. Tough-on-crime, pro-military conservatives have a more pronounced startle reflex after hearing a sudden loud noise. They also show stronger skin responses when shown threatening images and look at them more rapidly and for longer.

It is conventional to think about political ideology as a set of ideas people consciously hold about the way society should be ordered. A tacit assumption is that we come to these beliefs rationally, by reading and thinking about the issues. If we differ, it is because we reason to different conclusions.

Hibbing's results suggest otherwise. "One of the things we're trying to get people to realise is that those who disagree with them politically really do experience the world in a different fashion," he says.

Many other seemingly apolitical differences between liberals and conservatives have also been discovered. For example, they tend to organise their living spaces differently, with conservatives favouring tidiness and conventionality, and liberals more tolerant of clutter. They also seem to have different art preferences and even senses of humour.

Most recently, and controversially, focus has shifted to differences in brain structures and functions. In one experiment, conservatives on average had a larger right amygdala, a region of the brain that processes responses to fear and threat. Liberals, in contrast, had more grey matter in the anterior cingulate cortex, an error-detecting region that is thought to be involved in causing us to stop repeated patterns of behaviour and change course.

Results like these need to be treated with caution. They involve relatively small samples and it is far from clear whether your brain causes you to have a particular political outlook or vice versa - or some combination of both. Moreover, in these studies liberalism and conservatism are largely based on self-description, which introduces a fair amount of variability - especially as politically left and right are perhaps better thought of as a continuum than a binary choice.

Nevertheless, the amygdala finding dovetails nicely with Hibbing's work on startle reflexes. Conservatives on average really do seem to respond to fear and threat differently, and to focus on what Hibbing calls the "aversive" in life, rather than the "appetitive".

These experiments are themselves an extension of an older and long-standing body of research on personality differences between liberals and conservatives. Across a range of studies, liberals consistently rate higher on a trait called openness to experience. They are both ideologically liberal - comfortable with policy innovation and social and political change - and also personally liberal.

Conservatives, in contrast, tend to be less open and also consistently rate higher on conscientiousness, which means that they tend to prize orderliness and structure. Conscientious people are driven, competent, organised - and, on average, politically conservative.

Finally, there are a substantial number of genetic studies. Again and again, these show that identical twins (who share all of their DNA) tend to be far more politically similar to one another than fraternal twins (who share half of it). The studies suggest that 40 per cent or more of the variance in ideological views may ultimately be rooted in genes.

If all of this is true, it may reflect something we've always sort of known, but never really been willing to admit: liberals and conservatives are different sorts of people. Rational thinking about politics is not irrelevant, but seems to be less important than we thought. And this raises some important questions about how the new science of politics could be received and used.

[continued ...]
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
#
Gold Member
*****
Offline


A fool is certain: an
ignorant fool, absolutely
so

Posts: 2603
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #1 - Dec 26th, 2013 at 3:31pm
 
[... continued]

Hibbing is devoted to the idea that his work ought to be used to promote greater political tolerance. "The notion that our opponents are not simply obstinate or uninformed but have this way of experiencing the world that we don't understand could be useful," he says.

As far as toleration goes, the research certainly suggests that liberals and conservatives alike have strengths and weaknesses, and ought to fare better in some situations than others. Liberals are better at handling nuance, uncertainty and flexibility, while conservatives do better with leadership, duty and loyalty. There are good things about both ideologies.

The problem with the tolerance approach, though, is that it requires the acceptance of contentious new science on both sides. How do we know that's going to occur? What's to say conservatives won't reject the growing body of science on our political differences - as is their wont - and defensively assume that this is all just a way of putting them down and calling them inferior even though it isn't? In that case, the research could prove divisive, not helpful.

Frankly, in light of the polarisation of everything else in the US, it's hard not to fear that outcome.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Postmodern Trendoid III
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 10259
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #2 - Dec 26th, 2013 at 6:44pm
 
Not a bad article. I agree that politics, like morality (is there much difference?), can be reduced to physiology or brain structures. But reductionism doesn't actually refute the ideas each group espouses. It merely describes the state of the body or mind at the time of making a moral/political decision. While "progressives" seem to think fear is not the way to think, often it is a very natural instinctive reaction to phenomena. And, to say "progressives" are free of fear is myth. Just look at how they fear Christians, confident white males, successful businessmen and the like.

The article is welcome, in my opinion, because the trend in the social sciences in the past 50 years has been to reduce politics to just "ideas"; free-floating ideas where the body and mind play little part. Foucault and other post-structuralist clowns see the body as a passive unit that merely absorbs ideas and acts them out like an automaton. Physiology and biology really, really needs to come back in and fill in the blanks.

Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Kat
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Socialism IS the answer.

Posts: 17709
Everywhere and no-where
Gender: female
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #3 - Dec 26th, 2013 at 8:29pm
 
And he got PAID for this?

smack ME!
Back to top
 

...
 
IP Logged
 
#
Gold Member
*****
Offline


A fool is certain: an
ignorant fool, absolutely
so

Posts: 2603
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #4 - Dec 26th, 2013 at 8:41pm
 
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 6:44pm:
... to say "progressives" are free of fear ...
Does the article say that? Does it instead say that, in progressives, fear reactions are generally less uncontrolled (if you'll forgive the double negative)?
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
#
Gold Member
*****
Offline


A fool is certain: an
ignorant fool, absolutely
so

Posts: 2603
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #5 - Dec 26th, 2013 at 8:43pm
 
Kat wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 8:29pm:
And he got PAID for this?

smack ME!

# wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 3:31pm:
... What's to say conservatives won't reject the growing body of science on our political differences ...
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
salad in
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 5941
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #6 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 6:45am
 
I don't care if people and our government are conservative or progressive. What I do care about is that both people and governments of whatever hue advance Australia. That may mean changing anything that needs changing or retaining something that is working and nothing better is on offer.
Back to top
 

The ALP, the progressive party, the party of ideas, the workers' friend, is the only Australian political party to roast four young Australians in roof cavities. SHAME! SHAME! SHAME!
 
IP Logged
 
aquascoot
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 32825
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #7 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 8:01am
 
my gut instinct is that a lot of young ones start out to the left and then get married, have kids, have a mortgage, run a business, see the destructive nature of leftist trendy ideas and drift to the right.  that would seem to be the opposite of what you see happening but it has been my experience.

eventually, you realise that the policies of whitlam and bob brown , as intellectually appealing as they may be  Wink Wink, are almost certain to fail and dont help pay the school fees.  in the end
"its the economy stupid" and people instinctively come to realise , the right side of politics is the natural homeland of economic management.  one need only check out whitlam, kirner, bligh and gillard swan to recognise this.  as we have discussed before, keating was a good economic manager but he was a true blue blood liberal Wink
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Swagman
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Beware of cheap imitations......

Posts: 15095
Illawarra NSW
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #8 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 8:01am
 
# wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 3:30pm:
Former Prime Minister John Howard is a Conservative. So is current Prime Minister Tony Abbott.


You say this like it is somehow a bad thing?  Grin
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
skippy.
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 20882
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #9 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 8:54am
 
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 6:44pm:
to say "progressives" are free of fear is myth. Just look at how they fear Christians, confident white males, successful businessmen and the like.

.


Yet many progressives are white male successful businessman and the like. As for fearing Christians, many progressives are Christians, there are stupid people on all sides of politics.
Back to top
 

  freedivers other forum- POLITICAL ANIMAL
Click onWWW below 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Grendel
Gold Member
*****
Offline


OzPolitic

Posts: 28080
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #10 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 11:37am
 
If you grew out of Conservatism Skippy instead of into it you'd have to be a Regressive.

Variations on a theme...

"If you're not a socialist at the age of 20, then you have no heart. If you're not a conservative at the age of 40, then you have no brain."

“If you are not a socialist at the age of 20 you have no heart, if you are still a socialist at the age of 40 you have no brain.”

“If you are not a leftist at 20 you have no heart, but if you are still a leftist at 40 you have no brains.”

“Anyone who isn't a socialist at the age of 20 hasn't got a heart and anyone who isn't a capitalist at the age of 50 hasn't got a head. "

"It is normal for people to be Progressives in their youth, but foolish for them to still be so in maturity."
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
skippy.
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 20882
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #11 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 11:42am
 
Grendel wrote on Dec 27th, 2013 at 11:37am:
If you grew out of Conservatism Skippy instead of into it you'd have to be a Regressive.

Variations on a theme...

"If you're not a socialist at the age of 20, then you have no heart. If you're not a conservative at the age of 40, then you have no brain."

“If you are not a socialist at the age of 20 you have no heart, if you are still a socialist at the age of 40 you have no brain.”

“If you are not a leftist at 20 you have no heart, but if you are still a leftist at 40 you have no brains.”

“Anyone who isn't a socialist at the age of 20 hasn't got a heart and anyone who isn't a capitalist at the age of 50 hasn't got a head. "

"It is normal for people to be Progressives in their youth, but foolish for them to still be so in maturity."

Yes I've read your little ditty before, written by a loony fringe like yourself of course.
Back to top
 

  freedivers other forum- POLITICAL ANIMAL
Click onWWW below 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
The_Barnacle
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 6205
Melbourne
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #12 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 11:51am
 
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 6:44pm:
And, to say "progressives" are free of fear is myth. Just look at how they fear Christians, confident white males, successful businessmen and the like.



More crap from MM.
Tim Costello, baptist minister and current CEO of World Vision is certainly more progressive than his brother Peter.
Back to top
 

The Right Wing only believe in free speech when they agree with what is being said.
 
IP Logged
 
Postmodern Trendoid III
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 10259
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #13 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 12:03pm
 
The_Barnacle wrote on Dec 27th, 2013 at 11:51am:
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 6:44pm:
And, to say "progressives" are free of fear is myth. Just look at how they fear Christians, confident white males, successful businessmen and the like.



More crap from MM.
Tim Costello, baptist minister and current CEO of World Vision is certainly more progressive than his brother Peter.


This is a problem with the thinking of "progressives" more than anything. "Progressivism" is usually anti-religious (well, anti-Christian; they seem to like Muslims for some weird reason). Get rid of religion they say and we can be closer to the socialist paradise on earth. Yet, many charity organisations have a Christian base. An interesting contradiction there in "progressive" thinking. Perhaps there needs to be some journal articles written on this phenomenon.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
skippy.
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 20882
Gender: male
Re: Who are the Conservatives?
Reply #14 - Dec 27th, 2013 at 12:15pm
 
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 27th, 2013 at 12:03pm:
The_Barnacle wrote on Dec 27th, 2013 at 11:51am:
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 26th, 2013 at 6:44pm:
And, to say "progressives" are free of fear is myth. Just look at how they fear Christians, confident white males, successful businessmen and the like.



More crap from MM.
Tim Costello, baptist minister and current CEO of World Vision is certainly more progressive than his brother Peter.


This is a problem with the thinking of "progressives" more than anything. "Progressivism" is usually anti-religious (well, anti-Christian; they seem to like Muslims for some weird reason). Get rid of religion they say and we can be closer to the socialist paradise on earth. Yet, many charity organisations have a Christian base. An interesting contradiction there in "progressive" thinking. Perhaps there needs to be some journal articles written on this phenomenon.

Yes by your thinking Tim Costello hates Christians, the stupidity of the loony fringe is never ending. Roll Eyes
Back to top
 

  freedivers other forum- POLITICAL ANIMAL
Click onWWW below 
WWW  
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 ... 11
Send Topic Print