.

"Indonesia will have 180 of the latest Russian fighter planes if we do nothing.
What's the solution?"


The 180 copies of Russian crap does not worry me, they are too far away to attack Australia anyway!  They simply do NOT have the range.  Th only nations that buy Russian gear are the ones that cannot afford American.

When Indonesia starts buying warships and landing craft,  then i will sit up and take notice, not before.


OC

Old Codger wrote on Oct 17^th, 2013 at 5:18pm:



All I'm saying is give peace a chance.

If not this arms race will lead to miscalculation & war.

"If not this arms race will lead to miscalculation & war."


They have been saying that since 1945.

Two things, MAD - 'Mutually Assured Destruction' and 'Mutual Terror' saved the world from WW3,  and in particular the Cuban Missile Crisis where we came VERY close!

In fact at the time i would say we are NOT in an arms race!   That ended in 1991.



OC

Yes, i know about SALT 1   and SALT 2   and START.   I have even seen the  guillotined B52s at Davis-Monthan AFB in Tucson AZ.   All lined up so the Russian satellites could photograph and count them to confirm destruction.

The US Congress refused to ratify SALT 2,  and so Pres Reagan ordered them chopped up anyway.



OC

Bobby. wrote on Oct 17^th, 2013 at 4:57pm:


One of your most highly informative posts yet, Bobby.   

Old Codger wrote on Oct 17^th, 2013 at 3:42pm:


Doesn't exist as an effective organisation any more.  Basically started to fall apart the moment the treaty was drafted when it deliberately left the Indo-Chinese nations out, merely making them an "area of special interest."  This gave everybody a "get out of Jail free" card which they could play when the North Vietnamese attacked South Vietnam.   Despite what Menzies claimed, there were no "treaty obligations" WRT to South Vietnam when he announced the commitment of Australian troops to that country's defence.

When the Vietnam War ended, SEATO was quietly disbanded in 1977 and ceased to exist as an effective organisation.

SEATO's major problem was that it was created in the mistaken belief that Communism was under centralised control from the Kremlin, when in reality as a political movement it was made up of a lot of different organisations and individuals who all had their own ideas on how to bring about the Socialist Utopia.

A good case in point were the Vietnamese Communist Party.  While in the Republic of Vietnam, in the South, the US created a complete shadow government and were essentially running the country and the war, in the North, the Politburo would hold meetings to conduct the war in the South and keep the Soviet Ambassador cooling his heels outside in the corridor.  Once a decision had been reached, he was called in and presented with requests for aid.   

Chinese involvement was even more distant.  While 25,000 Chinese troops (primarily labourers on the railways) were committed to North Vietnam, none ventured South and all had been withdrawn by 1970.  The PRC was more of a hindrance than a help in the late 1960s because of the ideological schism between it and the fUSSR.  During the Cultural Revolution it got so bad that Chinese Red Guard cadres would lead riots against trains carrying war materieale' to Hanoi from the fUSSR, damaging essential war supplies. 

That in turn lead the fUSSR to resort to shipping by sea and that in turn allowed the USA to mine the harbour at Haiphong and that, alone with the Christmas Bombing campaign in 1972 brought the North back to the negotiating table and to accept an Armistice.