Australian Politics Forum - Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?

Bobby.

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #300 - Jan 29^th, 2013 at 8:40pm

brumbie wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 8:11pm:

I'm lost here...How can a war be a war crime?..there's no logic?

I thought Karnal explained it very well

Quote:

You’re right, Bobbie. No one in the US will ever stand trial, but of course Vietnam was a war crime.

Just as the Nazi invasion of Poland was a war crime. The Soviet invasion of Afghanistan was a war crime. Saddam in Kuwait, the US in Iraq (the second time), Israel in Lebanon (numerous times), the US in Panama, Guatemala, El Salvador, and a number of other wars- all war crimes. And look - one prosecution.

There are laws for some, and laws for others. Every time someone in the Hague gets hot and horny about some new international court, along comes the US or UK to start a war and spoil the whole thing.

Quite a few New York food joints stopped selling French fries back in 2003 - the New World versus Old Europe. What a crock - the US just wants a license to breach what the rest of the world calls civilisation.
No matter what dumb excuse you can dream up to justify your own side’s use of unnecessary force, it’s a war crime, and everybody knows.

It’s just a pity the diggers copped it when they returned - rather than the politicians.

Goering called the Nuremberg trials victors justice and he was right.

Too many other countries have been involved in some very nasty wars that included war crimes &
there have been only a few trials except at the Hague.

The Hague has unfinished business - they haven't even started on Vietnam yet - yet alone
as Karnal says

The Soviet invasion of Afghanistan was a war crime. Saddam in Kuwait, the US in Iraq (the second time), Israel in Lebanon (numerous times), the US in Panama, Guatemala, El Salvador,

Let's not forget Afghanistan - what has gone on there?

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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 111593 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #301 - Jan 29^th, 2013 at 8:42pm Just look at the video:
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it_is_the_light Gold Member Offline Christ Light Posts: 41434 The Pyramid of LIGHT Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #302 - Jan 29^th, 2013 at 8:44pm FORMER FBI CHIEF SAYS 9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB
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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 111593 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #303 - Jan 29^th, 2013 at 9:00pm Good video Light but no real evidence. I think we've had 911 threads before haven't we? What about the little hole in the Pentagon & the 2 big engines never found? What about Building 7? No one will know the truth for at least 100 years.
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metal_j

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #304 - Jan 29^th, 2013 at 10:06pm

Bobby. wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 9:00pm:

Good video Light but no real evidence.

I think we've had 911 threads before haven't we?
What about the little hole in the Pentagon & the 2 big engines never found?
What about Building 7?
No one will know the truth for at least 100 years. Wink

I place the 9/11 debate right beside the " who shot JFK " debate....we will probably never know what really happen even though the evidence is right in front of us.

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'never let the fear of striking out, keep you from playing the game' - Babe Ruth.

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Chard

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #305 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 12:08pm

Bobby. wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 7:16pm:

Refer to the Nuremberg principle

Did you actually read any of that? Reason I'm asking is because not a damn bit of that applies to the Vietnam War. It wasn't a war of aggression on our part. In fact, it wasn't technically a war at all for us. The South Vietnamese asked for our aid, so how the hell you think that qualifies as a "war of aggression" makes me serious question just how fragile your grasp of reality really is.

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Deterrence is the art of producing in the mind of the enemy... the FEAR to attack.

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Chard

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #306 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 12:26pm

Oh, almost forgot... Bobby, I asked for laws or treaties the US is actually a signatory of. We never signed any documents that codified the Nuremburg Principles into law, and we have never and will never acknowledge the validity of the ICC as having any jurisdiction over the US military, so the Nuremburg Principles wouldn't have any relevance anyway.

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Deterrence is the art of producing in the mind of the enemy... the FEAR to attack.

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Fit of Absent Mindeness Gold Member Offline We need more fits of absent mindedness Posts: 1622 Brisbane Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #307 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 1:01pm It's an interesting proposition.
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Karnal

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #308 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 1:24pm

Chard wrote on Jan 30^th, 2013 at 12:26pm:

Oh, almost forgot... Bobby, I asked for laws or treaties the US is actually a signatory of. We never signed any documents that codified the Nuremburg Principles into law, and we have never and will never acknowledge the validity of the ICC as having any jurisdiction over the US military, so the Nuremburg Principles wouldn't have any relevance anyway.

If I'm not mistaken, the Nuremburg trials were based on violations of German law.

Therefore, if the domino theory had been correct and the Vietnamese won and came down here, they would have been able to try the Vietnam war defendants under Australian law.

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Chard Gold Member Offline Mein Führer! I can walk! Posts: 1077 Alabama, USA Gender:	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #309 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 1:42pm Karnal wrote on Jan 30^th, 2013 at 1:24pm: If I'm not mistaken, the Nuremburg trials were based on violations of German law. Based partially on applying various parts of the old Imperial German army officer manual and the 1899 and 1907 Hague Conventions.
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Karnal

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #310 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 3:38pm

Yes, well it would seem that the Nuremberg trials were a complete farce and had no basis in German law. Not unlike the suggestion that the Vietnam war constituted some sort of crime against humanity. Fancy trying the Amerikans for killing over a million people - what about the Viet Cong? What about Ho Chi Minh?

After all, they waged their war on Vietnamese soil, thus putting millions of Vietnamese lives at risk of Amerikan bombs, daisy cutters, flame throwers, claymores, landmines, hand grenades, bullets, nepalm and good old fashioned cold steel.

Typical.

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corporate_whitey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 8896 Archivist	Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime? Reply #311 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 5:30pm All war is a crime against humanity Bobbythebat, war is not the path to peace...
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gizmo_2655

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #312 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 5:41pm

metal_j wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 10:06pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 9:00pm:

Good video Light but no real evidence.

I think we've had 911 threads before haven't we?
What about the little hole in the Pentagon & the 2 big engines never found?
What about Building 7?
No one will know the truth for at least 100 years. Wink

I place the 9/11 debate right beside the " who shot JFK " debate....we will probably never know what really happen even though the evidence is right in front of us.

I place the 9/11 debate conspiracy theories right beside the "Queen Elizabeth II is shape-shifting reptile from Space".....we all get a good laugh out of the idea that someone would post such tosh and expect to be taken seriously

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat

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Bobby.

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #313 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 5:47pm

Chard wrote on Jan 30^th, 2013 at 12:08pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 29^th, 2013 at 7:16pm:

Refer to the Nuremberg principle

Did you actually read any of that? Reason I'm asking is because not a damn bit of that applies to the Vietnam War. It wasn't a war of aggression on our part. In fact, it wasn't technically a war at all for us. The South Vietnamese asked for our aid, so how the hell you think that qualifies as a "war of aggression" makes me serious question just how fragile your grasp of reality really is.

Do you read it?

Quote:

(a) Crimes against peace: (i) Planning, preparation, initiation or waging of a war of aggression or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances; (ii) Participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the acts mentioned under (i).

(b) War crimes: Violations of the laws or customs of war which include, but are not limited to, murder, ill-treatment or deportation to slave labor or for any other purpose of civilian population of or in occupied territory; murder or ill-treatment of prisoners of war or persons on the Seas, killing of hostages, plunder of public or private property, wanton destruction of cities, towns, or villages, or devastation not justified by military necessity.

(c) Crimes against humanity: Murder, extermination, enslavement, deportation and other inhumane acts done against any civilian population, or persecutions on political, racial, or religious grounds, when such acts are done or such persecutions are carried on in execution of or in connection with any crime against peace or any war crime."

You can hardly say that the Nuremberg principles don't stand when the Yanks
& our Allies hanged Nazis for those principles.

Who are you - a CIA operative?

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Soren

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Re: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
Reply #314 - Jan 30^th, 2013 at 6:00pm

Karnal wrote on Jan 30^th, 2013 at 3:38pm:

Yes, well it would seem that the Nuremberg trials were a complete farce and had no basis in German law. Not unlike the suggestion that the Vietnam war constituted some sort of crime against humanity. Fancy trying the Amerikans for killing over a million people - what about the Viet Cong? What about Ho Chi Minh?

After all, they waged their war on Vietnamese soil, thus putting millions of Vietnamese lives at risk of Amerikan bombs, daisy cutters, flame throwers, claymores, landmines, hand grenades, bullets, nepalm and good old fashioned cold steel.

Typical.

And look at them now! They are stitching Amerikan brand name shoes and garments for the Yankee Dollar. Fooking patriotik, like.

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Poll
Question: Was the Vietnam war a War Crime?
yes 12 (42.9%) no 15 (53.6%) not sure 1 (3.6%) Total votes: 28 « Created by: Bobby. on: Jan 25^th, 2013 at 8:27am »