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When in doubt compare Aus to cripples (Read 1362 times)
Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #15 - May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 10:51am:
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 10:35am:
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 10:28am:
How would the Howard years compare to China Maqqa?
After all that's what you want to use as a benchmark now.
Haven't they had double digit growth for a decade or more?



Compared to China? Are you kidding?

The Chinese economy cannot be compared to the Australian economy in terms of growth. This is the whole argument that China presented when it argued against Kyoto.

A developing economy grow at a different rate than a developed economy.

Developing economy can sustain double digit growth whereas a a country like Australia would soon crash if it grew at anywhere about 5%.

With a population of 1.3Billion - growth will continue in double digits for a long time. It's been growing this way for 20 years now and will continue for at least another 20


So we can't compare our economy to other developed nations because apparently now that their in the toilet it distorts the truth in your eyes.
It's not about "in my eyes". Its the truth and it is a distortion because our banks were never caught up in the triggers that set of the GFC. We only experienced the ripple effect.


We cant use emerging economies because then it would taint the Howard/Costello legacy.
Then you don't understand basic economic theories. Neither did Swan for that matter when Turnbull mentioned about the "two-speed economy" and he didn't know what it meant. There are huge differences between an emerging economy and an established economy. If you don't know - then admit it and I'll explain it to you.


So what do you wish to compare our economy too?
Lets compare it to economies unaffected by the triggers of the GFC. Or compare it by GDP. Or compare economic indicators from one government to the next. Debt, surpluses, interest rates, unemployment, CPI. Lets have a look at the bigger picture rather than allowing Swan to deceive you by focusing on one or two factors


Scandinavian Countries, probably best to stay away from them as they have mining taxes + high individual tax rates(socialist bastards) & have done so for decades , yet Tony wishes to scrap ours.
Their economy and social systems is different to ours. There demography and geography is also different than ours which changes the policies you implement. case in point was when Rudd compared Singapore's implemented broadband technology against Aust's broadband technology. The land size of Singapore is the difference ie geography.

Arabic Countries, Theocracies & Kingdoms that hand millions in oil wealth to every individual yearly.
Not really a fair comparison for a democracy.
Our democracy was originally based on Christian values which evolved into the system it is now. These Arab countries have based their system on Sharia law and/or Islamic belief. Can't compare! Even if you do comapre - need to compare at least GDP/capita so see how individuals are doing against the country as a whole


So who?

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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
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buzzanddidj
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #16 - May 29th, 2012 at 11:08am
 
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 9:55am:
The rest of the developed world - lets see - is Spain, Greece, Ireland, Portugal





You seem to have forgotten ...



The United States of America

...


The United Kingdom

...


Japan

...


Canada

...


Germany

...


France

...


... and the REST of the EURO

...



















...

...

...





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Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #17 - May 29th, 2012 at 11:52am
 
I have already posted the comparison for the rest of the world buzz so your example is moot as per usual

Just in case you wonder here it is again

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/


If Swan wants to go on growth numbers alone then Mongolia, Rwanda and Bangladesh are doing better than Australia
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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
"You'd turn them back," he said of boats approaching Australia
 
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buzzanddidj
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #18 - May 29th, 2012 at 3:56pm
 
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:52am:
I have already posted the comparison for the rest of the world






And AGAIN ...






You seem to have CONVENIENLY forgotten ...



The United States of America

...


The United Kingdom

...


Japan

...


Canada

...


Germany

...


France

...


... and the REST of the EURO

...








Just FACE it ...


Australia is the LEADER and the ROLE MODEL that economies - WORLD-WIDE - aspire to






...

...

...





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'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
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Kat
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #19 - May 29th, 2012 at 4:31pm
 

Not forgotten, Buzz.

Ignored.

Because the facts don't suit the Coalition's agenda.
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...
 
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Dsmithy70
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #20 - May 29th, 2012 at 4:38pm
 
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
It's not about "in my eyes". Its the truth and it is a distortion because our banks were never caught up in the triggers that set of the GFC. We only experienced the ripple effect.


And yet our banks continue to bemoan the cost of money.
Are you saying they are lying?
It's true thanks to Costello & APRA they were not exposed to as much junk stock but the cost of lending is global so they were and still are exposed to those forces.

Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Then you don't understand basic economic theories. Neither did Swan for that matter when Turnbull mentioned about the "two-speed economy" and he didn't know what it meant. There are huge differences between an emerging economy and an established economy. If you don't know - then admit it and I'll explain it to you.



Yet you claim we cannot compare established with established.
When we(well Swan) compares our economy to UK/USA, you have said we should look to economies like China/India.
So when I say then we should use those economies to re-acess the past performance of your favoured party  suddenly we cant.

Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Lets compare it to economies unaffected by the triggers of the GFC. Or compare it by GDP. Or compare economic indicators from one government to the next. Debt, surpluses, interest rates, unemployment, CPI. Lets have a look at the bigger picture rather than allowing Swan to deceive you by focusing on one or two factors


You just cannot cut out the GFC as you would like, I agree with your acessment of only periferial damage to us  but we are still effected.
You cannot compare key economic indicators from good times to indictors of bad or recovering.
Apples & oranges my friend.

Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Their economy and social systems is different to ours. There demography and geography is also different than ours which changes the policies you implement. case in point was when Rudd compared Singapore's implemented broadband technology against Aust's broadband technology. The land size of Singapore is the difference ie geography.


On this we find common ground

Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Our democracy was originally based on Christian values which evolved into the system it is now. These Arab countries have based their system on Sharia law and/or Islamic belief. Can't compare! Even if you do comapre - need to compare at least GDP/capita so see how individuals are doing against the country as a whole


There's that ground again Smiley
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That's it! You people have stood in my way long enough. I'm going to clown college!
 
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longweekend58
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #21 - May 29th, 2012 at 5:28pm
 
MOTR wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:23am:
Maqqa wrote on May 28th, 2012 at 6:25pm:
One of the favorite tricks of a bride is to choose really ugly bridesmaids so she can look good on the day

Looks like Swan is doing the same thing. To make himself look good he compares himself to cripples.

If you want to know how well we are doing - the current GDP is still way below what it was when Swan came in.


What are you talking about Maqqa, Real GDP growth has been positive since 2007
. If you live in talkback world you might not think so, but our economy is still growing and growing fast enough to keep unemployment in check.


actually there was one quarter of negative growth and you write it as if there was endless recession prior to labors belevolent reign. actually it was 12 years of recession free boom times. THAT is the point. BOOM times.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #22 - May 29th, 2012 at 6:53pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:38pm:
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Lets compare it to economies unaffected by the triggers of the GFC. Or compare it by GDP. Or compare economic indicators from one government to the next. Debt, surpluses, interest rates, unemployment, CPI. Lets have a look at the bigger picture rather than allowing Swan to deceive you by focusing on one or two factors


You just cannot cut out the GFC as you would like, I agree with your acessment of only periferial damage to us  but we are still effected.
You cannot compare key economic indicators from good times to indictors of bad or recovering.
Apples & oranges my friend.




for goodness sake dsmithy

I'll explain the GFC to you again.

It started out as US banks re-selling their mortgages books to other banks.

The banks that purchased the mortgages in turn sells it to other banks both in the US and overseas and so on and so on.

It got to a point when the loans are called and they found there was not enough liquidity and/or collateral to cover the loans

Hence the write offs of bank assets. Which triggers the GFC - Global Financial Crisis. Its a name given the the fall out of the events I have described.

Therefore I am not cutting out the GFC. I am stating the GFC

If you say - we can not compare key indicator from each of the times then why are you accepting Swan's comparison?
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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
"You'd turn them back," he said of boats approaching Australia
 
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Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #23 - May 29th, 2012 at 6:56pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:38pm:
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
It's not about "in my eyes". Its the truth and it is a distortion because our banks were never caught up in the triggers that set of the GFC. We only experienced the ripple effect.


And yet our banks continue to bemoan the cost of money.
Are you saying they are lying?
It's true thanks to Costello & APRA they were not exposed to as much junk stock but the cost of lending is global so they were and still are exposed to those forces.



Because the funds are coming from overseas banks and not the Aust government

Overseas banks hold Aust cash, so do fund managers and they demand a certain return for their money. It's got nothing to to with APRA
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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
"You'd turn them back," he said of boats approaching Australia
 
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Dsmithy70
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #24 - May 29th, 2012 at 7:11pm
 
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 6:53pm:
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:38pm:
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Lets compare it to economies unaffected by the triggers of the GFC. Or compare it by GDP. Or compare economic indicators from one government to the next. Debt, surpluses, interest rates, unemployment, CPI. Lets have a look at the bigger picture rather than allowing Swan to deceive you by focusing on one or two factors


You just cannot cut out the GFC as you would like, I agree with your acessment of only periferial damage to us  but we are still effected.
You cannot compare key economic indicators from good times to indictors of bad or recovering.
Apples & oranges my friend.




for goodness sake dsmithy

I'll explain the GFC to you again.

It started out as US banks re-selling their mortgages books to other banks.

The banks that purchased the mortgages in turn sells it to other banks both in the US and overseas and so on and so on.

It got to a point when the loans are called and they found there was not enough liquidity and/or collateral to cover the loans

Hence the write offs of bank assets. Which triggers the GFC - Global Financial Crisis. Its a name given the the fall out of the events I have described.

Therefore I am not cutting out the GFC. I am stating the GFC

If you say - we can not compare key indicator from each of the times then why are you accepting Swan's comparison?


Thanks for that but I do know the reasons for the GFC.

Swan is at least comparing current figures with traditional comparative economies, which you now assert is misleading.

Whatever why you want to cut it our economy is strong.
2 speed yes but if it was a liberal government you would be claiming the current indicators were the result of strong economic management.
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That's it! You people have stood in my way long enough. I'm going to clown college!
 
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Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #25 - May 29th, 2012 at 7:18pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 7:11pm:
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 6:53pm:
Dsmithy70 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:38pm:
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 11:02am:
Lets compare it to economies unaffected by the triggers of the GFC. Or compare it by GDP. Or compare economic indicators from one government to the next. Debt, surpluses, interest rates, unemployment, CPI. Lets have a look at the bigger picture rather than allowing Swan to deceive you by focusing on one or two factors


You just cannot cut out the GFC as you would like, I agree with your acessment of only periferial damage to us  but we are still effected.
You cannot compare key economic indicators from good times to indictors of bad or recovering.
Apples & oranges my friend.




for goodness sake dsmithy

I'll explain the GFC to you again.

It started out as US banks re-selling their mortgages books to other banks.

The banks that purchased the mortgages in turn sells it to other banks both in the US and overseas and so on and so on.

It got to a point when the loans are called and they found there was not enough liquidity and/or collateral to cover the loans

Hence the write offs of bank assets. Which triggers the GFC - Global Financial Crisis. Its a name given the the fall out of the events I have described.

Therefore I am not cutting out the GFC. I am stating the GFC

If you say - we can not compare key indicator from each of the times then why are you accepting Swan's comparison?


Thanks for that but I do know the reasons for the GFC.

Swan is at least comparing current figures with traditional comparative economies, which you now assert is misleading.

Whatever why you want to cut it our economy is strong.
2 speed yes but if it was a liberal government you would be claiming the current indicators were the result of strong economic management.



But some of these economies are impacted directly from the GFC (US, UK) and some aren't (Aust)

There are some that are further impact by their own government mismanagement eg Greece and Ireland

So lets compare economies that are indirectly impacted

Rwanda v Australia - Rwanda grew faster than Australia therefore Swan is worse than Rwanda?

Of course not. This is why I said we also need to include key economic indicators as well as taking into account the impact of the GFC.

Swan simply pick and choose the economies that makes him look good despite knowing that these are apples, pears and oranges
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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
"You'd turn them back," he said of boats approaching Australia
 
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Dsmithy70
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #26 - May 29th, 2012 at 7:36pm
 
Maqqa wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 7:18pm:
Swan simply pick and choose the economies that makes him look good despite knowing that these are apples, pears and oranges


Swan can do what he wants.
I'm basing my opinion on the fact that according to the ABS unemployment is low, inflation is well within the RBA's 2 to 3%pa and interest rates are low.
As I said indictors you would be spruking as good economic management if a Liberal government.
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That's it! You people have stood in my way long enough. I'm going to clown college!
 
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MOTR
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #27 - May 29th, 2012 at 9:04pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 5:28pm:
MOTR wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:23am:
Maqqa wrote on May 28th, 2012 at 6:25pm:
One of the favorite tricks of a bride is to choose really ugly bridesmaids so she can look good on the day

Looks like Swan is doing the same thing. To make himself look good he compares himself to cripples.

If you want to know how well we are doing - the current GDP is still way below what it was when Swan came in.


What are you talking about Maqqa, Real GDP growth has been positive since 2007
. If you live in talkback world you might not think so, but our economy is still growing and growing fast enough to keep unemployment in check.


actually there was one quarter of negative growth and you write it as if there was endless recession prior to labors belevolent reign. actually it was 12 years of recession free boom times. THAT is the point. BOOM times.


I didn't say anything of the kind, Longy. All I said is that we have had positive growth since 2007. If you want to point to one quarter of negative growth in the midst of the worst global recession in 75 years, go ahead. The fact is that year on year we have enjoyed economic growth for the last five years. Maqqa's claim that the economy is smaller today than in 2007 is absolute bollocks. Unfortunately, Maqqa's economic illiteracy probably reflects a fair chunk of the talk back audience.
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Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #28 - May 29th, 2012 at 10:57pm
 
MOTR wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 9:04pm:
longweekend58 wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 5:28pm:
MOTR wrote on May 29th, 2012 at 4:23am:
Maqqa wrote on May 28th, 2012 at 6:25pm:
One of the favorite tricks of a bride is to choose really ugly bridesmaids so she can look good on the day

Looks like Swan is doing the same thing. To make himself look good he compares himself to cripples.

If you want to know how well we are doing - the current GDP is still way below what it was when Swan came in.


What are you talking about Maqqa, Real GDP growth has been positive since 2007
. If you live in talkback world you might not think so, but our economy is still growing and growing fast enough to keep unemployment in check.


actually there was one quarter of negative growth and you write it as if there was endless recession prior to labors belevolent reign. actually it was 12 years of recession free boom times. THAT is the point. BOOM times.


I didn't say anything of the kind, Longy. All I said is that we have had positive growth since 2007. If you want to point to one quarter of negative growth in the midst of the worst global recession in 75 years, go ahead. The fact is that year on year we have enjoyed economic growth for the last five years. Maqqa's claim that the economy is smaller today than in 2007 is absolute bollocks. Unfortunately, Maqqa's economic illiteracy probably reflects a fair chunk of the talk back audience.



http://www.google.com.au/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&met_y=ny_gdp_mktp_...

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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
"You'd turn them back," he said of boats approaching Australia
 
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Maqqa
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Re: When in doubt compare Aus to cripples
Reply #29 - May 29th, 2012 at 11:07pm
 
Here's a heads up about the GDP measures.

The Australia $ was higher than the USD in the last 12-18 months and GDP is measured in USD
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23 Nov 2007 Kevin Rudd said
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