Australian Politics Forum - Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic

Sappho

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Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 4:59pm

Quote:

The Victorian Government has cast the rules of Parliament aside to reintroduce a bill that will allow faith-based groups to discriminate on grounds such as religion, marital status or gender.

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This is so wrong, so backwards, so dark ages. Those that will wear the brunt of this draconian law will be women and homosexuals.

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #1 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:02pm

Sappho wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 4:59pm:

Quote:

The Victorian Government has cast the rules of Parliament aside to reintroduce a bill that will allow faith-based groups to discriminate on grounds such as religion, marital status or gender.

source

This is so wrong, so backwards, so dark ages. Those that will wear the brunt of this draconian law will be women and homosexuals.

And the alternative is dictating that (religious) people may not live their lives according to their principles and beliefs.

That sits fine with you?

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Sappho

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #2 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:06pm

... wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:02pm:

And the alternative is dictating that (religious) people may not live their lives according to their principles and beliefs.

That sits fine with you?

Denying people the right to discriminate is not the same thing as denying the faithful their right to live their religion.

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #3 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:11pm

Sappho wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:06pm:

... wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:02pm:

And the alternative is dictating that (religious) people may not live their lives according to their principles and beliefs.

That sits fine with you?

Denying people the right to discriminate is not the same thing as denying the faithful their right to live their religion.

What's the difference?
If their religious beliefs condemn homosexuality, and the vast majority agree that it does, denying them the right to live according to those principles most certainly IS discrimination.

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Sappho

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #4 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:36pm

... wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:11pm:

What's the difference?
If their religious beliefs condemn homosexuality, and the vast majority agree that it does, denying them the right to live according to those principles most certainly IS discrimination.

It's one thing to preach against homosexuality in your church or bible study group... it's a whole other thing to preach that on the secular streets of Victoria. And anyways... there is nothing in the bible that says you should preach against homosexuality... merely that to engage in homosexual behaviour in an abomination in the eyes of god.

But now, thanks to this stupid Vic Gov... faith based groups can denigrate homosexuals as abominations publicly and legally. That's wrong.

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Equitist Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9632 NSW	Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic Reply #5 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:40pm Meantime, it's not OK to let out the odd expletive in public!? To that, I would say: bugger these self-righteous control-freaks!
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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #6 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:44pm

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Wesley Pipes wrote...
What the? Preaching on the streets? What's that got to do with anything?

FAITH-BASED organisations can live and act according to the tenets of their FAITH. That is all.

You know that whole 'seperation of church and state' bizzo? Yeah - it works both ways.

PS: Sorry Wes... I stuffed up your original quote when responding to it, but have captured all you said nonetheless.

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« Last Edit: Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 6:07pm by Sappho »

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Sappho

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #7 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 6:08pm

... wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:44pm:

Quote:

Wesley Pipes wrote...
What the? Preaching on the streets? What's that got to do with anything?

FAITH-BASED organisations can live and act according to the tenets of their FAITH. That is all.

You know that whole 'seperation of church and state' bizzo? Yeah - it works both ways.

PS: Sorry Wes... I stuffed up your original quote when responding to it, but have captured all you said nonetheless.

Allowing faith based groups to discriminate means more of this ^^^

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Grey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5341 Gender:	Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic Reply #8 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 6:18pm
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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #9 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 6:22pm

Weeeell i didn't see anyone being pulled from a wheelchair, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and accept that it did actually happen, and won't get into the game of 'who started it'

But, the exemptions don't go so far as allowing assault, so it's really irrelevant.

How do you feel about certain gyms, fernwood for example, being allowed to choose memebrs on the basis of their gender alone? That too is legal discrimiantion, yet you never hear anyone complaining that that's grossly unfair.

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic Reply #10 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 8:24pm Sappho wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 4:59pm: a bill that will allow faith-based groups to discriminate on grounds such as religion, marital status or gender. Thank God for that!
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freediver

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #11 - Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 8:54pm

Sappho wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:36pm:

... wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2011 at 5:11pm:

What's the difference?
If their religious beliefs condemn homosexuality, and the vast majority agree that it does, denying them the right to live according to those principles most certainly IS discrimination.

It's one thing to preach against homosexuality in your church or bible study group... it's a whole other thing to preach that on the secular streets of Victoria. And anyways... there is nothing in the bible that says you should preach against homosexuality... merely that to engage in homosexual behaviour in an abomination in the eyes of god.

But now, thanks to this stupid Vic Gov... faith based groups can denigrate homosexuals as abominations publicly and legally. That's wrong.

Sappho there is a distinction between discrimination and bashing gays publicly. Obviously the Church has a right to discriminate against people of the wrong religion, orientation etc in choosing people to fill roles within the organisation.

What you are talking about seems more like vilification which is covered (barely) under a different set of laws. We are still allowed to say things that aren't nice about gays, blacks, women or whatever and do not need any special justification to do so.

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Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic
Reply #12 - Jun 3^rd, 2011 at 12:08pm

Quote:

A GAY softball association in the US can limit the number of heterosexual players on its teams, a federal judge ruled today.
The decision to allow the North American Gay Amateur Athletic Association (NAGAAA) to enforce a rule of two "straight" players came in a lawsuit filed by three bisexual men who claim they were kicked out of the Gay Softball World Series because they "weren't gay enough," the Courthouse News Service reported.

US District Judge John Coughenour wrote in his ruling, "Plaintiffs have failed to argue that there is a compelling state interest in allowing heterosexuals to play gay softball."

"NAGAAA might very well believe that given the history of gay exclusion for sports, the only way to promote competition for all persons, and ensure that gay athletes have the same opportunities as straight athletes, is to create an exclusively gay community with exceptions for a small number of straight players," the ruling states. "It is not the role of the courts to scrutinize the content of an organization's chosen expression."

However, Coughenour said the lawsuit could proceed to trial because questions remained about the way the softball association applied its rule.

The suit was sparked when three men playing for a San Francisco-based team in the Gay Softball World Series in Washington state in 2008 were challenged about their sexuality by a rival team.

According to their complaint, the trio were summoned to a hearing room and quizzed about their sexual interests or attractions in front of around 25 people.

The men said organizers told them, "This is the Gay World Series, not the Bisexual World Series."

A trial is set for Aug. 1.

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/gay-softball-league-can-limit-straight-players-judge-rules/story-e6frfku0-1226068573943#ixzz1OAtbvjSW

OK so it's not religious related, and it's in the US, but how do you feel about THIS discrimination?
Is this also so wrong, so backwards, so dark ages? If not, why not?

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Cliff Richard Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 558	Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic Reply #13 - Jun 3^rd, 2011 at 1:22pm cool everybody should be allowed to discriminate
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Astroboy Full Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 100	Re: Faith based groups can legally discriminate in Vic Reply #14 - Jun 3^rd, 2011 at 1:28pm This is getting ridiculous.
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