Australian Politics Forum - Deconstructing the electric grid

Grey

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Deconstructing the electric grid
Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:52pm

It's 19thC technology. It's ugly, it's inefficient, it's dangerous, it's time it was localised and buried underground.

Like the work of a deranged robotic spider it covers the landscape. You get used to seeing it and so you don't see it; but unconsciously it niggles away at your asthetic sense. Imagine, a landscape free of the tyranny of power lines. No more poles and pylons, no more disfigured trees, avenues of palms with one side lopped off, rotting carcases of birds and possums.

No more wasted power to pay for. No more fires started by unmaintained equipment, writhing tentacles of death in storms, no more, (or a lot less) poles to collide with. No more extensive blackouts because of one small fault. No more megapower 'plants' of physical and visual pollution. No more rental payments for having it pass by whether you use it or not.

This is now possible. All that is needed in a aolar world is a battery or two per block connecting houses with an underground grid. The ability to link to adjoining blocks to deal with emergencies when a fault produces a LOCALISED black out.

Industrial volumes of power can be delivered by industrilal power stations where its needed. A combination of solar and wind turbines can cover the roof spaces of areas already asthetically unpleasant.

Let's have some visions of the future. Let's tell THEM what we want - BEFORE they tell us what we are going to get.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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jackflash Junior Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 88	Re: Deconstructing the electric grid Reply #1 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:59pm Not another Bob Brown clone on the loose.
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qikvtec Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1846 Queensland	Re: Deconstructing the electric grid Reply #2 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:59pm Power and comms lines in Brisbane are downright offensive, putting them underground would be horribly expensive but it'd be worth it for the improvement in liveability. I live in an area where powerlines are underground and the difference is amazing.
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Kat

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #3 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:13pm

qikvtec wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:59pm:

Power and comms lines in Brisbane are downright offensive, putting them underground would be horribly expensive but it'd be worth it for the improvement in liveability.

I live in an area where powerlines are underground and the difference is amazing.

Bob Carr had that idea in NSW, but pulled his head in when he
discovered how prohibitively expensive it would have been.

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Grey Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5341 Gender:	Re: Deconstructing the electric grid Reply #4 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:20pm jackflash wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:59pm: Not another Bob Brown clone on the loose. Do you want to debate or pontificate Jack? Jumping out may be your nature of course; but questions and criticisms are easier to respond to. No. I'm not a clone in anyway, shape or form.
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Grey

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #5 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:31pm

Kat wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:13pm:

Bob Carr had that idea in NSW, but pulled his head in when he
discovered how prohibitively expensive it would have been.

Nothing is cheaper than doing nothing, that's why we'd have to push. But it would save money in the long term and wouldn't have to be done all at once. It would make sense to run gas, water, electricity and sewerage through the same conduit/tunnel beneath the road so installing a rationalised system could take place as and when roads are being resurfaced.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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jackflash

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #6 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:46pm

Grey wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:31pm:

Kat wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:13pm:

Bob Carr had that idea in NSW, but pulled his head in when he
discovered how prohibitively expensive it would have been.

Nothing is cheaper than doing nothing, that's why we'd have to push. But it would save money in the long term and wouldn't have to be done all at once. It would make sense to run gas, water, electricity and sewerage through the same conduit/tunnel beneath the road so installing a rationalised system could take place as and when roads are being resurfaced.

Dumb idea.

You haven't really thought this through. How bloody deep do you think they go to resurface a road?

Let me help you here. Sometimes they scarify the bitumen but mostly the hotmix is put straight over the top of the old bitumen.

If you think electricity is dear know can you imagine the cost to cover the implementation of your idea.

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Grey

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #7 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 9:33pm

jackflash wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:46pm:

You haven't really thought this through. How bloody deep do you think they go to resurface a road?

Let me help you here. Sometimes they scarify the bitumen but mostly the hotmix is put straight over the top of the old bitumen.

If you think electricity is dear know can you imagine the cost to cover the implementation of your idea.

Costings depend on methodology. We buy a car from Japan, that costs Australia (let's say) $10,000. That's a cost that disappears. We dig a hole, that's not cost Australia anything. That's money that has just been moved around. To maintain the antiquated grid costs a lot too.

I'm not suggesting that we replace the grid though. I'm suggesting that modern terchnology has made it obsolete. Residential areas can be made self sufficient in power on a block by block basis. If a block is self sufficient in power it shouldn't have to pay for the maintenance of the grid.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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Bobby.

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #8 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:08pm

Grey.
Quote:

All that is needed in a solar world is a battery or two per block connecting houses with an underground grid. The ability to link to adjoining blocks to deal with emergencies when a fault produces a LOCALISED black out.

It's a bit harder than that.
You would need a lot of solar cells & giant dangerous batteries
& it would cost a fortune.
Feeding power from solar panels into the grid is a better idea -
no batteries required.

What about solar farms underneath high tension power lines?
The land is wasted as is now.

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gizmo_2655

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #9 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:30pm

Grey wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:31pm:

Kat wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:13pm:

Bob Carr had that idea in NSW, but pulled his head in when he
discovered how prohibitively expensive it would have been.

Nothing is cheaper than doing nothing, that's why we'd have to push. But it would save money in the long term and wouldn't have to be done all at once. It would make sense to run gas, water, electricity and sewerage through the same conduit/tunnel beneath the road so installing a rationalised system could take place as and when roads are being resurfaced.

Do you really think running an explosive gas and two sources of ignition through the same conduit or tunnel is a good idea???

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It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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perceptions_now

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #10 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:42pm

qikvtec wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:59pm:

Power and comms lines in Brisbane are downright offensive, putting them underground would be horribly expensive but it'd be worth it for the improvement in liveability.

I live in an area where powerlines are underground and the difference is amazing.

The WA Pollies had the idea a while back about slowly replacing the overhead power lines over time.

We are still waiting and I expect it will still be a lot longer wait, yet!

That said, they did implement undregorund power in all new suburbs, one of which we are now in and yes, it has quite a few pluses!

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Prevailing Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 7169 Stop Men	Re: Deconstructing the electric grid Reply #11 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 10:48pm The Australian Government is completely unhinged with its energy obsession, the whole country is laughing at them and their extremism and at the same time nervous of the regimes insanity.
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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 95426 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Deconstructing the electric grid Reply #12 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 11:04pm Please delete that ugly photo.
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gizmo_2655 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 16010 South West NSW Gender:	Re: Deconstructing the electric grid Reply #13 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 11:08pm Agreed..
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buzzanddidj

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Re: Deconstructing the electric grid
Reply #14 - Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 11:17pm

Kat wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 8:13pm:

qikvtec wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2011 at 7:59pm:

Power and comms lines in Brisbane are downright offensive, putting them underground would be horribly expensive but it'd be worth it for the improvement in liveability.

I live in an area where powerlines are underground and the difference is amazing.

Bob Carr had that idea in NSW, but pulled his head in when he
discovered how prohibitively expensive it would have been.

So did Premier Baillieu, in Victoia, in the Liberal Party election platform
He's

pulled the plug on yet ANOTHER election pledge

-

on the realisation it would cost around $12 BILLION for bush-fire prone areas, alone

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