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discipline vs domestic violence (Read 7609 times)
Lisa Jones
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discipline vs domestic violence
Oct 23rd, 2010 at 11:48am
 
It's time we voiced our concerns/opinions and discussed/dispelled some of the myths which exist in this area.

There are differing perspectives which affect the area of discipline .. and some even have a religious basis.

Irrespective of your stance .. this topic is an opportunity to discuss your viewpoint/experiences.

Regards to all

Lisa
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Lisa Jones
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #1 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:44pm
 
Oi you lot!!!

In here or else lol Tongue
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Lisa Jones
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #2 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:48pm
 
From http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1287049789/30

gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:23pm:
mantra wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:17pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:05pm:
[Nah Lisa...I got a few bruises as a youngster from some (very well deserved) smackings....And my parents were christian....But I'd never smack a small child anywhere but on the bum, with my hand....

Older children though....they sometimes need a little more to get there attention.....It avoids the necessity of having to punch out your 17 yr old......


There's the answer - religious teachings. Australia used to be predominantly Christian and a good smack meant you were a good parent - "spare the rod, spoil the child" was the doctrine most parents were taught.

It looks as though the teachings from the Bible are only about 25 years behind that of the Koran in Australia.

In another 25 years - there will probably be no discernible difference.


I don't think it's religious of itself.....more societal....
The only reason for the current lack of disciplining children was the 'rise' of the do-gooder child  psychologists, like Dr Spock and his ilk.....
40 years ago, children did (more or less) what they were told, or got a smack.....

Now, with laws against smacking, children do what they WANT, and 10yr olds do armed robberies.....

Which system do YOU think is better???


I personally believe a system which protects children from actual or potential physical/emotional harm should be supported and maintained.
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Lisa Jones
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #3 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:56pm
 
From http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1287049789/30

It_is_the_Darkness wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:40pm:
I remember in the bowels of Mt Druitt at Shalvey High when I thought I could be a smartarse tough-guy like the other dickheads in the class. The teacher took me down the corridor and gave me five sweet "Uppercuts" and then returned me 'bloodied' to the classroom.
Even the dickheads were quiet. It was a lesson I learnt well and for the better too.

Some kids need 'physical' punishment, others need some 'mental' punishment - depends upon the crime and wether the kid is clever or smart.

The worst punishment I ever copped was being put up a grade or down a grade where the students gave me hell from both ends of the candle burning. Humilation was my bane. The cane was nothing, even when I manipulated the teacher to stand under a moving fan Grin.

These days, Public Teachers have not 'physical' discipline to hand out at all and so kids are just getting far, far worse - even bringing weapons to school. I would hate to go to Public School these days - absolutely hate it.
Its like the Academics 'know' everything and change the entire Educational structure to suit them.
Long ago, "clever" kids had to drop out at Year 10, because Years 11 & 12 only catered to the "smart" kids who went onto Uni for Academic reasons.



I'm actually quite amazed to read this Jas.

I have no idea how old you are .. but from reading the above account .. I am concluding you must be older than me.

I grew up in an era where teachers were not allowed to touch us.

Personally .. I would NOT want ANY OTHER PERSON .. hurting my child .. even if the behaviour of my child was questionable.

I am the child's parent and as such .. I have the right to discipline my child. NO one else has that prerogative IMO.
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If I let myself be bought then I am no longer free.

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Deborahmac09
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #4 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 6:03pm
 
The problem comes in when parents do not know where to draw the line.
There is a fine line between discipline and abuse. When in doubt, don't.
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Lisa Jones
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #5 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 6:19pm
 
There is a fine line between discipline and abuse. When in doubt, don't.

- Deborah

Err on the side of caution .. that principle again. Well said!
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It_is_the_Darkness
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #6 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 7:46pm
 
I have no problem with what the teacher did.
I deserved it!

also, I think that if you hand over your child unto the responsibility of others - like a School, then you must hand over a certain right of disciplinary action on behalf of the school as a whole.
The Govt Co-Ed system lacks any sort of disciplinary action at all these days and this is why few 'male' teachers apply, let alone any teachers to the Public system. There is a so-called "shortage" of teachers...mostly in the Public Sector.

If I were to return to Shalvey as a Teacher, I would have to carry a Gun and knock some heads in before I was able to earn the respect, let alone the attention of the Students. Even then, I would have to admit that Co-Ed was mostly about 'Relationships' rather than an education. Roll Eyes
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« Last Edit: Oct 23rd, 2010 at 10:14pm by It_is_the_Darkness »  

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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #7 - Oct 23rd, 2010 at 10:18pm
 
I mostly wagged school, even long before High School, and hung out in Libraries wherever I could. Imagine a 10 year old hanging out in the University Library ...I think it was the Fisher Library ?
I also jigged school a lot on behalf of my favourite subject - School Excursion (it was the only subject where everyone seemed happy and relaxed.)
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #8 - Oct 24th, 2010 at 10:27am
 
So what was your school experience like Lisa?
(especially in regards to violence and abuse, if any?)
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #9 - Oct 24th, 2010 at 1:08pm
 
We had a headmaster who used stand over tactics on students, he used the threat of the cane to get students to admit to things, somethimes that they had not done. I call that abuse of power.
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gizmo_2655
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #10 - Oct 24th, 2010 at 1:22pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:48pm:
From http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1287049789/30

gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:23pm:
mantra wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:17pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:05pm:
[Nah Lisa...I got a few bruises as a youngster from some (very well deserved) smackings....And my parents were christian....But I'd never smack a small child anywhere but on the bum, with my hand....

Older children though....they sometimes need a little more to get there attention.....It avoids the necessity of having to punch out your 17 yr old......


There's the answer - religious teachings. Australia used to be predominantly Christian and a good smack meant you were a good parent - "spare the rod, spoil the child" was the doctrine most parents were taught.

It looks as though the teachings from the Bible are only about 25 years behind that of the Koran in Australia.

In another 25 years - there will probably be no discernible difference.


I don't think it's religious of itself.....more societal....
The only reason for the current lack of disciplining children was the 'rise' of the do-gooder child  psychologists, like Dr Spock and his ilk.....
40 years ago, children did (more or less) what they were told, or got a smack.....

Now, with laws against smacking, children do what they WANT, and 10yr olds do armed robberies.....

Which system do YOU think is better???


I personally believe a system which protects children from actual or potential physical/emotional harm should be supported and maintained.


That's sort of where it gets complicated though isn't it Lisa....

We all know some kids can be a bit 'prima-donna' when it comes to discipline don't we???

Some (smaller) kids will burst into tears of terror if you look, or speak, harshly to them......is that 'emotional harm'....or the child playing the system??

Physical harm....like broken bones, bleeding welts and massive bruising......YES these are things that children should be protected from...

But discipline is still required so a child (which is an almost perfectly self-centre individual....ALL children) learns that there are adjustments need to function in a society.

Some form of punishment is needed....even if it's only a display of parental displeasure, like a swat on the nappy or a 2 finger tap on the wrist....
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #11 - Oct 25th, 2010 at 2:58pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:56pm:
From http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1287049789/30

It_is_the_Darkness wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:40pm:
I remember in the bowels of Mt Druitt at Shalvey High when I thought I could be a smartarse tough-guy like the other dickheads in the class. The teacher took me down the corridor and gave me five sweet "Uppercuts" and then returned me 'bloodied' to the classroom.
Even the dickheads were quiet. It was a lesson I learnt well and for the better too.

Some kids need 'physical' punishment, others need some 'mental' punishment - depends upon the crime and wether the kid is clever or smart.

The worst punishment I ever copped was being put up a grade or down a grade where the students gave me hell from both ends of the candle burning. Humilation was my bane. The cane was nothing, even when I manipulated the teacher to stand under a moving fan Grin.

These days, Public Teachers have not 'physical' discipline to hand out at all and so kids are just getting far, far worse - even bringing weapons to school. I would hate to go to Public School these days - absolutely hate it.
Its like the Academics 'know' everything and change the entire Educational structure to suit them.
Long ago, "clever" kids had to drop out at Year 10, because Years 11 & 12 only catered to the "smart" kids who went onto Uni for Academic reasons.



I'm actually quite amazed to read this Jas.

I have no idea how old you are .. but from reading the above account .. I am concluding you must be older than me.

I grew up in an era where teachers were not allowed to touch us.

Personally .. I would NOT want ANY OTHER PERSON .. hurting my child .. even if the behaviour of my child was questionable.

I am the child's parent and as such .. I have the right to discipline my child. NO one else has that prerogative IMO.



You must have a problem with state imposed laws then. The law does discipline us and children are at the mercy of the law just as adults are.

I guess we would need to define "discipline" better?
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« Last Edit: Oct 25th, 2010 at 3:06pm by Postmodern Trendoid III »  
 
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #12 - Oct 25th, 2010 at 3:03pm
 
Lisa Jones wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:48pm:
From http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1287049789/30

gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:23pm:
mantra wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:17pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 23rd, 2010 at 1:05pm:
[Nah Lisa...I got a few bruises as a youngster from some (very well deserved) smackings....And my parents were christian....But I'd never smack a small child anywhere but on the bum, with my hand....

Older children though....they sometimes need a little more to get there attention.....It avoids the necessity of having to punch out your 17 yr old......


There's the answer - religious teachings. Australia used to be predominantly Christian and a good smack meant you were a good parent - "spare the rod, spoil the child" was the doctrine most parents were taught.

It looks as though the teachings from the Bible are only about 25 years behind that of the Koran in Australia.

In another 25 years - there will probably be no discernible difference.


I don't think it's religious of itself.....more societal....
The only reason for the current lack of disciplining children was the 'rise' of the do-gooder child  psychologists, like Dr Spock and his ilk.....
40 years ago, children did (more or less) what they were told, or got a smack.....

Now, with laws against smacking, children do what they WANT, and 10yr olds do armed robberies.....

Which system do YOU think is better???


I personally believe a system which protects children from actual or potential physical/emotional harm should be supported and maintained.



You would need to define "emotional harm".
In my experience, emotional harm actually strengthens oneself internally if dealt with the right way. If you resent those that harm you, then it'll eat you up inside, but if you take it as character building or as an oppotunity to compete and outdo your opponent in a legal activity of some description it can be very rewarding. Sublimating perceived 'emotional harm' is a potent driving force.
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #13 - Nov 3rd, 2010 at 6:33pm
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01jPbed7YLE

http://www.galacticfriends.com/updates/galactic-federation/5261-sheldon-nidle-sirian-update-nov-210.html

Update by Sheldan Nidle for the Spiritual Hierarchy and the Galactic Federation

2 Imix, 19 Tzec, 7 Ik

Selamat Balik! We come again with much to tell you. Our Earth allies are poised for the deliveries of the prosperity programs. Also, those involved in the change of government are ready at a moment's notice to fulfill these vital tasks. Once these two requisites are manifested, the long-awaited announcements can happen. We are preparing our own scenario to ensure that this critical turn of events takes place at the right divine time. As you know only too well, the dark cabalists have hung on to their positions of power and wealth for far too long. Heaven has instructed us, therefore, to back up our Earth allies with a full range of contingency planning, which allows us to make sure that the various components of the plan are carried out as directed by heavenly decree. And so our personnel are now strategically placed to assure one and all that what our Earth allies do is done successfully. Over the past few months, we have monitored the activities of the dark's minions very closely, and this surveillance has revealed a veritable bedlam of mischief making!

In every corner of the globe the dark is busy with plots to delay the successful implementation of the new banking regulations. Its dark agents are working hard to put up obstacles to the reformation of the new banking system and these obstructions have been somewhat successful. However, most of those being roped in to these stratagems are deeply resistant to the dark's overtures. Meanwhile, the present system is approaching a vast currency meltdown. This escalating rate of failure is undermining the way the banking system operates, which in turn triggers the systemic crash that will secure the failure of the worldwide chain of large interlocked banks. Ironically, it is these two coming collapses that will pull the rug out from under the cabal's treacherous activities. Several weeks ago, we extracted a number of grudging agreements from the dark's chief directorates to stand down and permit the grand changes to roll out unhindered. Naturally, these agreements are being reneged upon, and we quite understand their state of panic and the levels of anxiety that now beset them.

Nevertheless, it is high time for an about-face, as the old dark order is on the brink of free fall. Indeed, all aspects of your world are in crisis mode. The ecosystems are losing their biodiversity and a mass extinction is underway. These things have been studied by a number of scientific councils and intergovernmental agencies, such as your UN. So far, the recommendations of these committees have been largely ignored. Sadly, this represents the normal approach to change on the part of the large corporations, but willful clinging to the status quo is unable to sustain your globe over the coming decades. The same modus operandi holds true for the major universities, whose role it is to advise the world about what is occurring. This glacial rate of adaptation to urgent new conditions fosters not only overwhelming crises but sets you on a slippery slope to extinction. Many perceptive groups and thinking individuals realize this and are committed to a wholly new paradigm. Once we explained to them what our Earth allies were doing, they became powerful new adherents to our cause.

Our Earth allies have expanded their inner core on several occasions, and it is this inner core that works directly with our liaison teams and diplomatic corps. We provide assistance that is creating the viable structure for change because despite their many resources and deep commitment to their cause, the Earth allies' success requires our presence. The dark regards the Earth allies as mere do-gooders but truly fears what we are capable of. It is this technological superiority that ensures the Earth allies' success. We know that the cabalists intend to weasel out of everything they sign or agree to, and we have expressed our displeasure at this improbity. When we force them to toe the line, they do so unwillingly, and so we watch them closely to ensure that all goes according to plan. We update our Earth allies continuously and prepare them for what needs to be done next. These tactics have brought the Light to the very brink of victory!

As we work toward new government and full UFO disclosure, we see how your planet's energies are changing: Gaia deeply wishes to transform into a 5-D planet. The same is true of your solar system, into which the Sun is flooding every nook and cranny with new Light. Your scientists are noticing the many anomalies popping up throughout the solar system, like the unusual activity on Mercury and the curious happenings on distant Pluto and Neptune. In addition, a new grid, in which all the planets 'ride', is beginning to manifest. This phenomenon was first widely identified at the start of this decade. Our ever-strengthening presence, too, has alarmed many scientists associated with those governments that run space programs. Many aspects of our mission here have required us to bring in the facilities needed for transforming this solar system into a fully conscious one.
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ॐ May Much LOVE and CHRISTS LIGHT be upon and within us all.... namasté ▲ - : )  ╰დ╮ॐ╭დ╯
it_is_the_light it_is_the_light Christ+Light Christ+Light  
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Re: discipline vs domestic violence
Reply #14 - Nov 3rd, 2010 at 6:34pm
 
As we often remind you, this particular mission has evolved over time into a most unusual one. We are not only part of your transformation into full consciousness but also a vehicle for altering your entire reality. Normally, these aspects would be left up to your local Spiritual Hierarchies, and we would merely follow the decrees of these sacred organizations. In your case, we have been drawn into actually carrying out the final steps of moving your world and yourselves into full consciousness. This unique undertaking has taught us much about who you are and who we are. This opportunity to gain such wisdom is a joy! Most of what we are learning is being recorded in our sacred texts. These writings are opening up sacred knowledge and new rituals, which are giving us insights on Creation and on the workings that are transforming physicality.

As we approach success, we notice the way the divine plan has set up the coming events. The dark is relinquishing its hold on you most reluctantly as each day sees its power diminishing on various fronts. This decrease is noted by us and explained to our Earth allies. Most of you are too caught up in the drama of daily survival to notice much else, but this diversion makes it easier for our Earth allies to carry out their agenda. We observe the way the power centers are changing, making it harder and harder for the cabal to hew to its original plan. This is not to say that a degree of effectiveness does not still remain, but what is important is that the dark ones realize that their grip has loosened to the point where the Light's agenda is manifesting more and more in every moment of every day. This is why we see our victory as now actually happening.

What is now happening is an ever-accelerating move to the Light, to abundance, to freedom, and to Truth! The old dark ways are falling away and the awakening of Earth's humanity is in full swing. This means that radical new ways of doing things can surge ahead. Events are about to pop which will validate these statements for all to see. We watch over you from our ships, and at night we commune with you while you are in a special, relaxed state of consciousness. The Galactic Federation medical teams responsible for your physical progress are assiduously getting you ready for direct contact with us because once we arrive the move toward completion of full consciousness will be full steam ahead!

Today, we relayed to you what is happening on your world. You are progressing quickly toward full consciousness and we look forward to our coming interactions with you. The time is approaching swiftly for first contact and the events that are to lead up to it. Know, dear Ones, in your Heart of Hearts that the countless Supply and never-ending Prosperity of Heaven are indeed Yours! So Be It! Selamat Gajun! Selamat Ja! (Sirian for Be One! and Be in Joy!)

____________

there must be discipline for the domestic violence

upon humanity

and so it shall be

namaste

-:)
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ॐ May Much LOVE and CHRISTS LIGHT be upon and within us all.... namasté ▲ - : )  ╰დ╮ॐ╭დ╯
it_is_the_light it_is_the_light Christ+Light Christ+Light  
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