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Mary MacKillop will be a Saint. (Read 9971 times)
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #30 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:44pm
 
mellie wrote on Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:19pm:
If Mary MacKillop could whisper from her tomb, what would she say?

Cool


She'd say "Don't give them any more money because they use and exploit people and then hang them out to dry" Wink
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #31 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:47pm
 
whoever of you said you were baptised a protestant (bobbybat?) - that's the problem.

saints are only made in the catholic church after they are dead, and then only after a process that takes often hundreds of years of documentation and evidence which includes cures of incurable disease without any medical intervention.
If there is a God, you can see all around you that that God isn't on tap like beer in a pub. From what I have read and what I understand you actually have to *believe*, (totally) in God, if you want a response. The absolute vast majority of people in the world can't do that to that degree, including yourselves, so why are you so surprised that there aren't miraculous cures for everything for everyone, everyday. Even if it is just the power of the mind and positive thinking which effects these cures, how about you try that out, if you're so sure about everything. I would bet you can't make that work for you either. All this takes more than most people know about.
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #32 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:47pm
 
mellie wrote on Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:00pm:
Bobby. wrote on Oct 16th, 2010 at 10:56pm:
Mellie,
Quote:
But you know...come to think of it,  it wouldn't be the first time they have awarded status, power to those who serve to compromise their church now would it.


What about Galileo?
He was under home imprisonment for suggesting that the earth
revolved around the sun -
after viewing the 4 visible moons of Jupiter orbiting that planet.
He was only recently pardoned & was lucky that he wasn't
burnt at the stake for heresy.


Yes and Einstein was a fraud, plagiarist, and a dumb-ass... though we still revere him. Smiley


No he wasn't.
Einstein was one of the greatest minds in human history.
He had to be in the top 10 - maybe top 5.
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #33 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:50pm
 
Mary MacKillop and the Sisters of St Joseph had a duty to report child sex abuse,(so this is no biggie plenty of others have reported child sex abuse)  ...though did Mary MacKillop herself not play her own divine part in a Stolen Generation?

And will the children who were permanently scathed, often brutally, sexually, emotionally by such unspeakable inhumane acts of abuse  by the Sisters of St Joseph be inspired by her sainthood?

There were other generations they abused and used, such as white children who's parents surrendered them to convents, this and spent 6 hours+ each day in the laundry, in order to receive 3 hours of education and a roof over their heads...even Saturdays and Sundays.

Often, these nuns were quite cruel, unforgiving, this and turned a blind eye to the rampant clergy abuse.

Does the canonisation of but one Australian Nun who spoke-up about this atrocity wash away a churches sins, this or condone the abuse these children suffered at the hands of those like Mary MacKillop and the sisters of St Joseph?

It's going to take more than the canonisation of one of our rebellious outspoken deceased old nuns to improve their churches image here in Australia.

They might like to start by surrendering the long-awaited documents concerning child sex-abuse currently being withheld by the Vatican.

Faith and trust being synonymous and all...

Cool
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« Last Edit: Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:01am by mellie »  

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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #34 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:52pm
 
Champas.
Quote:
Even if it is just the power of the mind and positive thinking which effects these cures, how about you try that out, if you're so sure about everything. I would bet you can't make that work for you either. All this takes more than most people know about.


If positive thinking can be proven in scientific studies then
I would be inclined to believe it.
I think it has been proven actually.
This still doesn't prove that a ghost called Mary intervenes
in ill health & causes a miracle.
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #35 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:54pm
 
Albert Einstein was a bullsh1tt artist, and his theories to this day, (those he didn't plagiarise or borrow from others)  remain just that, theories.

Whilst he's the face of modern science, more specifically, physics, he was unable to prove his own theories.

Cool  He was a fraud, plagiarist and a liar.



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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #36 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:55pm
 
Will the power of positive thought hand back the stolen generation?

Cool

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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #37 - Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:57pm
 
the catholic church (like the anglican church, and most other churches and religions, including islam) has been a non-democratic patriarchy. In MacKillop's day almost everyone, clergy and lay people alike were not brave enough or did not have the education, confidence or support to challenge that sort of hierarcy. It is incredible that MacKillop did that, especially on an issue like that, back in the days of colonial Australia. The woman was excommunicated from the church for doing so, which if you knew about it, is a fate worse than death for an old time catholic like MacKillop. It is even more stunning that the Australian bishop who was responsible for that later retracted it, I believe, on his deathbed. That never happens in that organisation.
She was an extremely brave person who did not give one damn about not having money or power. Not many around like that today.
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #38 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:03am
 
shampain socialist wrote on Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:57pm:
the catholic church (like the anglican church, and most other churches and religions, including islam) has been a non-democratic patriarchy. In MacKillop's day almost everyone, clergy and lay people alike were not brave enough or did not have the education, confidence or support to challenge that sort of hierarcy. It is incredible that MacKillop did that, especially on an issue like that, back in the days of colonial Australia. The woman was excommunicated from the church for doing so, which if you knew about it, is a fate worse than death for an old time catholic like MacKillop. It is even more stunning that the Australian bishop who was responsible for that later retracted it, I believe, on his deathbed. That never happens in that organisation.
She was an extremely brave person who did not give one damn about not having money or power. Not many around like that today.



There are saints all around us, this and who are brave also.

It's just they don't get canonised by the Catholic church.

Cool
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #39 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:03am
 
the catholic church did not run the anglo-protestant colonial governments of Australia, or Britain, which came up with policies which gave rise to social agendas like stolen generations.

and please do tell me where the perfect human organisation exists, and I will gladly join it. All of them are flawed institutions and often end up, through the usual process of degradation being often run by people with more ambition than intellect, compassion or a healthy grip on reality.
why stop the blame with the catholics? It just sounds like bias.
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #40 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:06am
 
"There are saints all around us, this and who are brave also.

It's just they don't get canonised by the Catholic church." mellie

like most anglo protestants, you just don't get it. in the catholic church process you actually have to be dead before you get made a saint and only then on evidence (that they accept) that you have interceded in some situation (usually a medical one) (because that's the sort of situation where most people resort to prayer - on their deathbed or close to it). "saint" in the catholic church doesn't mean what "saint" means in a protestant perspective. 'sainthood" in the catholic context actually signifies that despite bodily death, the person still exists. That is a big idea - it is actually the only thing that christianity is on about.
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #41 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:09am
 
When the Vatican hand over the documents concerning child abuse, this will be a true miracle.



Catholicism needed rejuvenating here in Australia, what better way of doing so than canonising one of our nations old favourites.

The Vatican would have enjoyed our publicity and tourism also.... Cool



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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #42 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:12am
 
mellie wrote on Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:54pm:
Albert Einstein was a bullsh1tt artist, and his theories to this day, (those he didn't plagiarise or borrow from others)  remain just that, theories.

Whilst he's the face of modern science, more specifically, physics, he was unable to prove his own theories.

Cool  He was a fraud, plagiarist and a liar.


Mellie,
Don't insult a great scientist.
Here's one example for you:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_(planet)

Quote:
Mercury is the innermost and smallest planet in the Solar System,[a] orbiting the Sun once every 87.969 Earth days. The orbit of Mercury has the highest eccentricity of all the Solar System planets, and it has the smallest axial tilt. It completes three rotations about its axis for every two orbits. The perihelion of Mercury's orbit precesses around the Sun at an excess of 43 arcseconds per century; a phenomenon that was explained in the 20th century by Albert Einstein's General Theory of Relativity.[
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #43 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:14am
 
mellie wrote on Oct 16th, 2010 at 11:54pm:
Albert Einstein was a bullsh1tt artist, and his theories to this day, (those he didn't plagiarise or borrow from others)  remain just that, theories.

Whilst he's the face of modern science, more specifically, physics, he was unable to prove his own theories.

Cool  He was a fraud, plagiarist and a liar.



They have been more than proven beyond reasonable doubt. You are a complete idiot !!
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Re: Mary MacKillop will be a Saint.
Reply #44 - Oct 17th, 2010 at 12:14am
 
Australia is a very small outpost to the Vatican. It would be viewed as almost a completely secular, albeit previously an anglo protestant dominated country, much like the U.S. The country has been like that right from the start of English arrival. Catholic clergy were actually banned from this country for close to a generation after the arrival of the English. Irish catholics were actively discriminated against for generations, and there was a penchant on the part of the anglo colonial masters to string them up it they could find a good enough excuse.

The centre of the Vatican's focus in the world, as far as religion goes anyway, is latin America and Africa, where there are millions upon millions of catholics, not to mention Russia of all places and to a lesser extent the rabidly catholic countries of Europe that remain. Australia is not their focus.
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