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Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court (Read 9507 times)
gizmo_2655
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #105 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:05pm
 
Jaykaye_09 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:00pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 1:57pm:
Hi jaykaye...

The question I've always wondered about is this...
Is the DP more expensive than having to feed, cloth and house a convicted (and guilty) person for anywhere from 25 to 60 years????



Certainly in the United States (which would be most comparable to uor own system).

Granted, much of the cost comes from inefficiencies within the system, but these stem from processes which I don't think any of us would want to see removed (or made more "cost efficient" in the manner we generally tend to).

I should highlight though, that my opposition of the DP is primarily based on those factors outside of cost.


But I thnk were the American system falls down is too many appeals...

I think some states allow 10 or 12 appeals, and each one costs over $150k...

That's really just a silly idea.....Unless there is new evidence, or reasonable evidence of mistakes etc, what's the point of representing the exact same evidence from a trial that the convict has already lost.....
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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Jaykaye_09
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #106 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:12pm
 
gizmo_2655 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:05pm:
But I thnk were the American system falls down is too many appeals...

I think some states allow 10 or 12 appeals, and each one costs over $150k...

That's really just a silly idea.....Unless there is new evidence, or reasonable evidence of mistakes etc, what's the point of representing the exact same evidence from a trial that the convict has already lost.....


I've heard of multiple appeals, yes, but never that many (where nothing new is brought to trial)...?

It would also be difficult to establish what is deemed valid grounds for an appeal - a process in itself which delays execution and increases costs - however, this is surely something that must remain.
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If I don't respond to a post directed toward me, it's probably because I've gone offline, not because I'm rude.&&&&Or maybe I don't like you. In which case, sod off. Ta.
 
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #107 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:15pm
 
Jaykaye_09 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:12pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:05pm:
But I thnk were the American system falls down is too many appeals...

I think some states allow 10 or 12 appeals, and each one costs over $150k...

That's really just a silly idea.....Unless there is new evidence, or reasonable evidence of mistakes etc, what's the point of representing the exact same evidence from a trial that the convict has already lost.....


I've heard of multiple appeals, yes, but never that many (where nothing new is brought to trial)...?

It would also be difficult to establish what is deemed valid grounds for an appeal - a process in itself which delays execution and increases costs - however, this is surely something that must remain.


I think it varies from state to state....the average is about 7 or something....I'm not sure, but I'll look it up.

I do know that some Death Row inmates can delay execution for 10 years, just by the appeals process....
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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Jaykaye_09
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #108 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:29pm
 
gizmo_2655 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:15pm:
I do know that some Death Row inmates can delay execution for 10 years, just by the appeals process....


Aye, some have sat on death row for ridiculously long periods of time.

Incidentally, Wikipedia has some links to additional resources concerning the process involved with the DP and subsequent appeals.
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If I don't respond to a post directed toward me, it's probably because I've gone offline, not because I'm rude.&&&&Or maybe I don't like you. In which case, sod off. Ta.
 
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #109 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:48pm
 
Jaykaye_09 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:29pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:15pm:
I do know that some Death Row inmates can delay execution for 10 years, just by the appeals process....


Aye, some have sat on death row for ridiculously long periods of time.

Incidentally, Wikipedia has some links to additional resources concerning the process involved with the DP and subsequent appeals.


Cool, thanks for that..
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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aikmann4
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #110 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:56pm
 
Quote:
Exactly. Our first responsibility as a society should be to protect our innocents. As long as the death penalty is carried out in an humane manner, I support it completely for serial rapists, pedophiles and in some cases, murder.


I don't care about execution with humanity. I'd be in favour of gladitorial combat for convicted felons and public executions again.
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it_is_the_light
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #111 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 5:04pm
 
i would suggest forgiveness.

how is it that major nations do not get done for trafficking drugs?

the US proven drug runners air america in vietnam.

now they admit growing opium in afghanistan so the taliban

do not get the drugs....such a deception again.

and the masses once more fooled by the despots

however

the LIGHT burns BRIGHT now on mother earth and many are

awakening to the hoodwink

namaste
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ॐ May Much LOVE and CHRISTS LIGHT be upon and within us all.... namasté ▲ - : )  ╰დ╮ॐ╭დ╯
it_is_the_light it_is_the_light Christ+Light Christ+Light  
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #112 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 5:13pm
 
aikmann4 wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 2:56pm:
Quote:
Exactly. Our first responsibility as a society should be to protect our innocents. As long as the death penalty is carried out in an humane manner, I support it completely for serial rapists, pedophiles and in some cases, murder.


I don't care about execution with humanity. I'd be in favour of gladitorial combat for convicted felons and public executions again.



Absolutely...put the baddest of the bad on an island, last man standing wins his freedom. 
Of course, if he's THAT bad, he'll be back in the clink in no time.

But yeah, this 'humane' execution bizzo is just garbage.  Just kill the fker...they're not on death row for being great guys.
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In the fullness of time...
 
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muso
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #113 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 5:40pm
 
mozzaok wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 5:34pm:
what about pedos?, I mean they are the worst of the worst in my book, often far more deserving of death than some kid who gets led astray by the wrong crowd and impulsively kills from fear or stupidity?
Surely we should be allowed to kill pedos?



Disgusting as the crime may be, the perpetrators have often had their brains addled by experiences in their own childhood. Some people survive the trauma, in other cases victims become predators in later life.  Should we kill pedos totally regardless of what kind of horrors they suffered in their childhood?

I don't know the answer to that, and I wouldn't be too fast to make the call.

As far as Scott Rush is concerned.... Scott Who? Isn't there something more important to discuss? Leave  the Indonesian legal system to find justice. There is nothing we can or should do.

Going back to pedophiles, how many of them are spurred on to commit their crimes as a result of taking illegal drugs. Should we be tackling the causes (of brain addling) as opposed to the symptoms?

I oppose the death penalty on principle, but maybe drug dealers and couriers should have harsher punishments. Maybe Indonesia hasn't got it all wrong.

What did Scott Rush get on his IQ Test?
..drool
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« Last Edit: Aug 31st, 2010 at 5:55pm by muso »  

...
1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not 
 
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #114 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 5:48pm
 
muso wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 5:40pm:
mozzaok wrote on Aug 30th, 2010 at 5:34pm:
what about pedos?, I mean they are the worst of the worst in my book, often far more deserving of death than some kid who gets led astray by the wrong crowd and impulsively kills from fear or stupidity?
Surely we should be allowed to kill pedos?



Disgusting as the crime may be, the perpetrators have often had their brains addled by experiences in their own childhood. Some people survive the trauma, in other cases victims become predators in later life.  Should we kill pedos totally regardless of what kind of horrors they suffered in their childhood?

I don't know the answer to that, and I wouldn't be too fast to make the call.

As far as Scott Rush is concerned.... Scott Who? Isn't there something more important to discuss? Leave  the Indonesian legal system to find justice. There is nothing we can or should do.

Going back to pedophiles, how many of them are spurred on to commit their crimes as a result of taking illegal drugs. Should we be tackling the causes as opposed to the symptoms?


And 'some of them aren't 'spurred on by anything'...in some cases there is NO chemical or enivronmental reasons for what they do....

With some of the pedophiles, they are just evil bastards.....

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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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aikmann4
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #115 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 6:05pm
 
The problem with the argument that attempts to ascribe pedophilia to childhood experiences with molestation is it has not properly ascertained the genuine line of causation. If, and it is a perfectly reasonable "if", sexual attraction to children is partially a genetically inherited disposition, it should only be expected that many pedophiles would have been molested in their youth, as their fathers were also pedophiles. It's a chicken and egg problem that can be better disentangled using studies of people who have NOT been molested, born to convicted pedophiles, who were adopted into functional households. Studies like this have been done concerning criminality, for instance.
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« Last Edit: Aug 31st, 2010 at 6:15pm by aikmann4 »  
 
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #116 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 11:31pm
 
scott rush - oh boy, what an unfortunate surname............

i really don't care what he or the other eight did.
THEY ARE OURS.
each Australian, no matter what color, creed, or disposition, is worth 10 Indonesians.
and that's any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
these ppl politically are our worse enemies.
look past what these poor souls have done and into the politics in this region.
WAKE UP.
they are ours, like it or not.
and yet we turn our backs on them.
it our shame, not theirs.
THERE'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING WRONG WITH OUR EMPLOYMENT SYSTEM HERE
IF THESE MISGUIDED YOUNGSTERS HAVE TO RESORT TO THIS TO MAKE MONEY.
J.
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #117 - Aug 31st, 2010 at 11:49pm
 

djrb - it's a bloody great trajedy.
It's terrible.
But Scott is outside of Aussies powers now, there's nothing we CAN do.
Nothing anyone can do.

It's a complete loss to all.
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aussiefree2ride
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #118 - Sep 1st, 2010 at 8:19am
 
djrbfm wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 11:31pm:
scott rush - oh boy, what an unfortunate surname............

i really don't care what he or the other eight did.
THEY ARE OURS.
each Australian, no matter what color, creed, or disposition, is worth 10 Indonesians.
and that's any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
these ppl politically are our worse enemies.
look past what these poor souls have done and into the politics in this region.
WAKE UP.
they are ours, like it or not.
and yet we turn our backs on them.
it our shame, not theirs.
THERE'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING WRONG WITH OUR EMPLOYMENT SYSTEM HERE
IF THESE MISGUIDED YOUNGSTERS HAVE TO RESORT TO THIS TO MAKE MONEY.
J.


"THERE'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING WRONG WITH OUR EMPLOYMENT SYSTEM HERE
IF THESE MISGUIDED YOUNGSTERS HAVE TO RESORT TO THIS TO MAKE MONEY."

No, Scott Rush and his group are low life crimials. They only have themselves to blame for the position they`re now in.
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locutius
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Re: Scott Rush pleads for his life in Bali court
Reply #119 - Sep 1st, 2010 at 10:44am
 
djrbfm wrote on Aug 31st, 2010 at 11:31pm:
scott rush - oh boy, what an unfortunate surname............

i really don't care what he or the other eight did.
THEY ARE OURS.
each Australian, no matter what color, creed, or disposition, is worth 10 Indonesians.
and that's any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
these ppl politically are our worse enemies.
look past what these poor souls have done and into the politics in this region.
WAKE UP.
they are ours, like it or not.
and yet we turn our backs on them.
it our shame, not theirs.
THERE'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING WRONG WITH OUR EMPLOYMENT SYSTEM HERE
IF THESE MISGUIDED YOUNGSTERS HAVE TO RESORT TO THIS TO MAKE MONEY.
J.


I have about as much time for Indonesia as I do for drug pushers. They can have each other as far as I'm concerned.
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« Last Edit: Sep 1st, 2010 at 10:58am by locutius »  

I dream of a better tomorrow, where chickens can cross the road and not be questioned about their motives.
 
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