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What is Truth? (Read 9684 times)
aikmann4
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #45 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 9:34pm
 
But what about the all important philosophical question that is hanging on the mind of every dentist?

What is tooth?
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aikmann4
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #46 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 9:36pm
 
Quote:
The port to which your ship is destined


Or perhaps the port that you are attempting to purposely travel in the opposite direction of. Maybe you might even try to obscure the judgment of the navigators of other ships so that they will not be headed in its direction.

At least to us, there may be awful things at that port. Prostitutes hanging out by the docks with syphillis, etc.
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #47 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 9:54pm
 
aikmann4 wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 9:36pm:
Quote:
The port to which your ship is destined


Or perhaps the port that you are attempting to purposely travel in the opposite direction of. Maybe you might even try to obscure the judgment of the navigators of other ships so that they will not be headed in its direction.

At least to us, there may be awful things at that port. Prostitutes hanging out by the docks with syphillis, etc.

Do you really think you could set foot on the land opposite to that of truth? (Where would that be? Lies?) And even if you could... really... would you want to be there?

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Conviction is the art of being certain
 
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aikmann4
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #48 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 9:58pm
 
If you're into prostitutes with syphillis, maybe.
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #49 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:05pm
 
aikmann4 wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 9:58pm:
If you're into prostitutes with syphillis, maybe.

Ships, whores, ports, sailing thereto... Don't overegg the metaphor... We're talking about truth.
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aikmann4
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #50 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:11pm
 
I already gave my serious two cents.

I'm just screwing around in this thread now.
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #51 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:19pm
 
aikmann4 wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:11pm:
I already gave my serious two cents.

I'm just screwing around in this thread now.

Impy, m'y boy...  The best only just get started, 'bout now.

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aikmann4
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #52 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:21pm
 
You can be odd. Wink
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #53 - Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:26pm
 
aikmann4 wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:21pm:
You can be odd. Wink

I got a team to run... All I gotta be is good.

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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #54 - Jul 22nd, 2010 at 8:25am
 
Soren wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 8:21pm:
aussiefree2ride wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:59am:
Truth is an honest representation of facts.

What is 'honest'?

(just kidding. this is a silly a question as 'what is truth'.)


Not quite true... but anyway... It's asking demonstrates that, like the search for the definition of a Socratic virtue (What is courage), we can't say what it is because it seems we can't know what it is and every attempt to define it will result in a Socratic wild goose chase (because maybe without context, 'truth', (like Socratic virtue), is a meaningless concept)... And yet we would all claim to recognise it - to know it - when we experience it... In context.

Yet despite this generally self-accepted agnosis, in a theistic context, the term is necessarily applied to god, as either a synonym or, more commonly, as an attribute. Despite almost universal self-confessed ignorance as to what truth is in itself, all theisms nevertheless necessarily dictate its definition, which must by necessity be less than what it is or not what it is at all.

If we cannot know what truth is, (nor for that matter what any virtue is in itself) then we cannot know what god is in itself much less ‘know’ what it thinks, feels or desires and the concept of this kind of gnosis is as asinine as knowing what truth is and wants of us.

Yet we could hardly live as if truth (or virtue) does not exist (as for most of us we at least expect to know what truth is when we experience it). We can however, live without a concept of or belief in the existence of god. In that context, the concept of truth/virtue (insofar as we can know it when we see it) is greater than that of ‘god’.


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« Last Edit: Jul 22nd, 2010 at 9:01am by NorthOfNorth »  

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muso
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #55 - Jul 22nd, 2010 at 9:00am
 
I think the true answer is that truth is like art. You can't really define it, but you know it when you see it.

Quote:
Truth is like a blanket that always leaves your feet cold. You push it, stretch it, it'll never be enough. Kick at it, beat it, it'll never cover any of us. From the moment we enter crying, to the moment we leave dying, it'll just cover your face as you wail and cry and scream.
Dead Poets Society
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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #56 - Jul 22nd, 2010 at 9:02am
 
muso wrote on Jul 22nd, 2010 at 9:00am:
I think the true answer is that truth is like art. You can't really define it, but you know it when you see it.

True! Knowledge of it (such that it can be called knowledge) results from the practice of the art of certainty.
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Soren
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #57 - Jul 22nd, 2010 at 10:22am
 
The question is a realist one (positing the universality of 'truth' to be real) while many of the answers derive from nomionalist (only particular instances are real) mindsets. Hence the cross-talk nature of most exchanges on this sort of question.

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NorthOfNorth
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #58 - Jul 25th, 2010 at 7:38am
 
And a question I imagined would interest theists particularly... Given that for them if god is real, then absolute truth (as a synonym for or an attribute of god) must necessarily be real (being a temporal manifestation of its presence).

But then, of course, what is absolute cannot be defined except as something less than what it is...

Quote:
Through the clamour and kaleidoscopic masquerade of the many, comes to me, at times in brilliant opalescence, the rhythm of my soul, which is the truth I feel.

Unmitigated by intellect, nor advocated by authority and without the verification of any sense perception, yet doubtlessly the deepest of realities - In harmony with all.

It cannot be described, nor its rhythm codified, for it has no need of words to impress upon my mind its esoteric meaning or its practical application.

For it is the truth I feel - A vision from my soul - Infinite and personal -
Perceived only as complete...

Or not perceived at all.

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« Last Edit: Jul 25th, 2010 at 11:32am by NorthOfNorth »  

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freediver
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Re: What is Truth?
Reply #59 - Jul 25th, 2010 at 10:07am
 
NorthOfNorth wrote on Jul 22nd, 2010 at 8:25am:
Soren wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 8:21pm:
aussiefree2ride wrote on Jul 20th, 2010 at 10:59am:
Truth is an honest representation of facts.

What is 'honest'?

(just kidding. this is a silly a question as 'what is truth'.)


Not quite true... but anyway... It's asking demonstrates that, like the search for the definition of a Socratic virtue (What is courage), we can't say what it is because it seems we can't know what it is and every attempt to define it will result in a Socratic wild goose chase (because maybe without context, 'truth', (like Socratic virtue), is a meaningless concept)... And yet we would all claim to recognise it - to know it - when we experience it... In context.

Yet despite this generally self-accepted agnosis, in a theistic context, the term is necessarily applied to god, as either a synonym or, more commonly, as an attribute. Despite almost universal self-confessed ignorance as to what truth is in itself, all theisms nevertheless necessarily dictate its definition, which must by necessity be less than what it is or not what it is at all.

If we cannot know what truth is, (nor for that matter what any virtue is in itself) then we cannot know what god is in itself much less ‘know’ what it thinks, feels or desires and the concept of this kind of gnosis is as asinine as knowing what truth is and wants of us.

Yet we could hardly live as if truth (or virtue) does not exist (as for most of us we at least expect to know what truth is when we experience it). We can however, live without a concept of or belief in the existence of god. In that context, the concept of truth/virtue (insofar as we can know it when we see it) is greater than that of ‘god’.




So because courage is hard to define we can't define truth. The problem with truth is not in defining it, but in finding it. It's like saying that it is impossible to define what a unicorn is unless you see one.

muso wrote on Jul 22nd, 2010 at 9:00am:
I think the true answer is that truth is like art. You can't really define it, but you know it when you see it.

Quote:
Truth is like a blanket that always leaves your feet cold. You push it, stretch it, it'll never be enough. Kick at it, beat it, it'll never cover any of us. From the moment we enter crying, to the moment we leave dying, it'll just cover your face as you wail and cry and scream.
Dead Poets Society


I think that is what distinguishes truth from quality.
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