They have their fingers in too many pies? You can't take two steps without needing a permit or license of some kind.

What you're talking about is dangerous - that powerless acceptance of incompetency just leads to more complacency, which is never good. Is it too late to change it? I don't think so, but until we as a nation decide we've had enough it will continue as it is or deteriorate further.

freediver wrote on Feb 18^th, 2010 at 7:43pm:


What exactly is governments core business that would stop it too from being outsourced?  The idiotic antics we see in parliament could just as well be supplied by a bunch of school children. No more than a clerk is required to receive our foreign policy from the USA and pass it on to the rest of us to obey.  Big business and the banksters could continue to dictate commercial practices to suit themselves as they do now, free of charge. The opportunities for savings are immense!

I'm not disputing what you say muso, but that still doesn't tell us what governments core business is, nor why it couldn't be outsourced.

Absolutely Mozz, I agree.

Remember the days when you rang your Govt dept and you were a citizen, not Dear Customer. That BS sprang from private enterprise as they began the dismantle services and devalue the Citizen, not in favour of the country or the community but for the monetary bottom line and the creation of another level of management parasites.

As you say, the infrastructure that these corporate leeches benefit from was build by generations of hard working and tax paying Australians. I use the word with all sincerity and with the full force of it's traditional weight when I say that selling Telecom, CBA and the other govt enterprises you mentioned is simply Treasonous.

Quote:


Making new laws and spending money.

freediver wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2010 at 9:41pm:


Well governments certainly do those things in abundance... all too often producing laws that border on stupidity, and the money being wasted. But any small office could do those things, so why not outsource?

NorthOfNorth wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2010 at 10:03am:


Ooooh I do love it when you write so obnoxiously about me!

NorthOfNorth wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2010 at 10:03am:


Whilst you are getting bogged down in the minute details of accountability, who is watching the big picture, the important things the government should be doing, to tell if they are good or bad?  Just because it might be legal for the government to send our military to fight unnecessary wars on the other side of the world, that does not mean it is a good thing. Just because it might be legal for the government to sell off our publicly owned infrastructure doesn't mean that is a smart thing to do. And even when a government minister is convincingly blamed for incompetently managing his department (as has happened with Peter Garrat this week)  what punishment does your accountability demand? Nothing, it seems!

NorthOfNorth wrote on Feb 23^rd, 2010 at 10:03am:


Now that's something we can agree on. And we are forced to pay, whether the excesses it provides are wanted or not.

Quote:


They probably do outsource a lot of the technical legal work, but the actual decisions on what should be put into law needs to remain in the hands of elected representatives. It is fundamental to democracy. Plus you can't outsource everything. Someone has to decide what to outsource and who to.

fawkes wrote on Feb 24^th, 2010 at 7:52am:

No, I mean sensibility. We share the same historical roots, were founded by the same empire, we share the same language, the same political ideals and have done almost since the beginnings of our nation. We take from American culture and adopt it as our own almost immediately as it develops in the States.  Overwhelmingly we identify with Americans before any other people on earth. It is no surprise that we collectively not only want to be but to be seen, for right or for wrong, on the side of the Americans.

fawkes wrote on Feb 24^th, 2010 at 7:52am:

There ya go, now you're talking. All you've got to do now is walk the talk.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Feb 24^th, 2010 at 8:02am:


I'll grant you that there are a large number of meatheads in Australia who behave as you described, but I'm lucky to know many Australians who are far more discriminating than that. I can also remember when our culture was more British than American, and can think of another people I would prefer to identify with before either of them. Those who behave as you describe should cringe in shame; their only excuse is that they are now bombarded with American culture emanating from the mass media.

Nevertheless, opinion polls taken when we were on the brink of being sucked into the war against Iraq showed that most Australians did not want Australia to be involved. It was the politicians and media that took us into that unjustified and unnecessary war, not Australians clamouring to be seen on the side of the Americans.

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lol, good point FD, the way we are going, we'll be left with a note for the last guy to turn out the lights on his way out.

But why have we seen this transition from at least, reasonable competence, to the assumption that anything run by governments as always being totally incompetent?

I think Helian hit on the point of people trying to rort anything they have got through government contract, and I must agree that has been my experience as well, it is seen as an opportunity to profiteer, and that should not be something we put up with.

The trouble is that by simply outsourceing everything, we are seeing many people profiteering our hard earned taxes away, when there should be absolutely no reason why government run enterprises could not deliver world class services.

We have talented planners, people managers, and well skilled work forces, what we seem to lack is the vision and drive from those in power, to get these groups together, and all working for a common goal.

We need that to change, before we outsource ourselves out of our whole country, where we are left to just fill the roles of miners and leisure industry workers.

We really need to see governments starting to setup viable, efficient departments that can hold their own in any company, without being hamstrung by bureaucratic nonsense and idiotic paper shufflers, who seem to justify their existence, by making everybody else's more difficult.

We need to strip away the unnecessary levels of bureaucracy and streamline the whole system of government, and to do that we need to start by removing one level of government, at least.

We need to revisit whitlam's old plan of a federal government, overseeing a group of regional governments replacing the current state, and local systems.

The fact is our system is so clogged by red tape and incompetence that it really does need tearing down, and starting again, from the bottom up.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Feb 24^th, 2010 at 12:00pm:


God I wish I had seen it!

It tickles my funny bone no end when people tell me that in the modern world "we (people) are too smart and the days of the dictator are dead."  I'm chuckling as I write it.

locutius wrote on Feb 24^th, 2010 at 4:47pm:

Here's a clip

It's hard to know whether utopianism masks defeatism or an Orwellian sense of order. But the catch cry of all three is always the same and pack loaded with absolutes... Nothing can just be modified, everything must be torn down, nothing works, the entire system is corrupt... & etc..

fawkes wrote on Feb 25^th, 2010 at 6:03pm:

Did I say the current system is corrupt?

That's a pretty silly basis to judge their performance on.

Actually, in a true democracy government is there to do whatever the people collectively want done. Amongst other things that includes everything too big or too important to be trusted to private enterprise.

freediver wrote on Feb 28^th, 2010 at 8:27pm:


The market is not free. It is controlled by govt checks and measures. These checks and measures along with sound economic policy ensure the majority have the means to satisfy food and shelter needs.

Soren wrote on Feb 26^th, 2010 at 8:04pm:


Agreed. People are the greatest good.

fawkes wrote on Mar 1^st, 2010 at 9:42am:


Yes for us! As to the planet... well, if we want to survive its wrath, we need to work together and adapt to the changing challenges the planet presents.

Only a fool assumes we are more powerful than the planet and somehow a virus that can over-run it... odds are good that when we are long gone, the planet will be still here exploring new life to evolve. 

Sappho wrote on Mar 1^st, 2010 at 1:46pm:


We've done a pretty good job of messing it up so far, and we haven't even had our first major nuclear conflagration yet. We have driven numerous species to extinction, over-fished the world's fisheries to the point where fishing is uneconomical in large areas, chopped down most of the world's forests  and are currently arguing about whether we have destroyed the planet's climate patterns. Meanwhile, in a growing number of places we are becoming so angry and frustrated with other members of our own species that we elect politicians who border on madness whilst we try to bomb each other to pieces.

Sappho wrote on Mar 1^st, 2010 at 1:46pm:


You are right about that. The way we are going, the planet is likely to remain in a different condition long after we have gone.

fawkes wrote on Mar 1^st, 2010 at 5:38pm:

As opposed to those Idyllic days when benign dictators ruled the earth... y'know... before the Westminster system sacked Utopia... I think there were elves as well.... yeah... I'm pretty sure the elves were involved.

Or were they dwarves? Or gnomes? I can never remember the difference. One lot are just very short people and the other lot are short as well but also magical.

Anyway, elves were definitely involved.

freediver wrote on Mar 1^st, 2010 at 8:55pm:


I wasn't talking about welfare. I was talking about entities such as Australian Prudential Regulation Authority or Australian Securities and Investment Commission. These bodies restrict the free market.

freediver wrote on Feb 28^th, 2010 at 8:27pm:


With some restrictions. Shelter is important and mainly provided by private enterprise, but government too has a role, enforcing safe building codes for safe construction for everyone, and continually providing public housing for people neglected by the "free market".

Food is important too, but it would be wrong to think that the "free market" provided it all without government involvement. To provide just a couple of examples, it is government regulation that prevents shonky free market providers poisoning us with residues and dangerous ingredients left in some of their products. It is government regulation that helps free market providers produce profitably, by keeping plant and animal diseases out of our country.


freediver wrote on Feb 28^th, 2010 at 8:27pm:


I would be interested to know what those justifications are, if you reckon importance is not one of them.

mozzaok wrote on Mar 3^rd, 2010 at 6:10pm:


I forgive you everything, Mozz.     Make me completely happy and say that you also have Vanya on 42nd Street in there among your mental furniture.