With Facebook shutting down an anti-Islam hate group from using it's site, we saw one comment from a University Professor which made me smile.

Quote:


lol, I couldn't help but reflect on what our "anti" members here would think of that?

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/06/12/2596603.htm?site=news

mozzaok wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 7:40am:


Remember under the Howard government the repeat offender from Russia or somewhere in Europe who had been here since he was 3, but wasn't registered as a citizen. He was sent back to his birth country and ended up wandering the streets homeless, hungry and cold and couldn't speak the language. He had a nervous breakdown. I can't remember whether they brought him back.

I don't think he roused much pity at the time. I think the US does this as well.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 8:49am:

Some morality coming from a theist.

As you demonstrate, your theism has not imbued you with any sense of empathy at all.

helian - see ??
I ain't any better than an athiest.

mozzaok wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 7:40am:


I think he should leave. I'd even pay for his ticket to go.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 8:50am:




Personally i believe that empathy, and forgiveness, should be principally for those who repent of wrong doing.

But what you seem to be suggesting is that empathy, and forgiveness, should be extended to all, including evil doers and the wicked?

And that course, is effectively what already happens in Australia today, in what we quaintly refer to, as our 'Justice system'.

A misnomer, if ever there was one!

And what an unjust system of justice we have in Australia, where evil doers walk free, every day!





helian,

If you think that the Christian ideal is that, when Jesus returns to judge the world [mankind], that everyone is going to be forgiven, then i think that you are labouring under a misapprehension.

God's mercy will extend to the repentant [i believe].





Deuteronomy 25:1
If there be a controversy between men, and they come unto judgment, that the judges may judge them; then they shall justify the righteous, and condemn the wicked.

Proverbs 21:2
Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts.
3  To do justice and judgment is more acceptable to the LORD than sacrifice.

Isaiah 1:21
How is the faithful city become an harlot! it was full of judgment; righteousness lodged in it; but now murderers.
22  Thy silver is become dross, thy wine mixed with water:
23  Thy princes are rebellious, and companions of thieves: every one loveth gifts, and followeth after rewards: they judge not the fatherless, neither doth the cause of the widow come unto them.

John 7:24
Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.




What did John the Baptist say, about those who seek and expect forgiveness?

He said,

"Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:"

Matthew 3:7
But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
8  Bring forth therefore fruits meet for repentance:
9  And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham.
10  And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: therefore every tree which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.

The wicked are "....cast into the fire." ???







And what did Jesus say?


Matthew 7:1
Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2  For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

What did Jesus mean?
It seems pretty clear doesn't it!

DON'T JUDGE OTHERS, AND THEREBY AVOID YOUR OWN JUDGEMENT.

Poppycock.

False doctrine.




Again, the words of Jesus,

Luke 6:43
For a good tree bringeth not forth corrupt fruit; neither doth a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
44  For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes.
45  A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth speaketh.
46  And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?


Good trees and bad trees??

Read Ezekiel 15:1-5

Ezekiel 15:1  And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
2  Son of man, What is the vine tree more than any tree, or than a branch which is among the trees of the forest?
3  Shall wood be taken thereof to do any work? or will men take a pin of it to hang any vessel thereon?
4  Behold, it is cast into the fire for fuel; the fire devoureth both the ends of it, and the midst of it is burned. Is it meet for any work?
5  Behold, when it was whole, it was meet for no work: how much less shall it be meet yet for any work, when the fire hath devoured it, and it is burned?

".....For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again."

And how do men judge?

When they find a tree that does not bear fruit.

They hew it down, for firewood!

And so will our God!

What are you trying to say Mozz... because he's a professor he's right?

Pull the other one.

His statement is demonstrably idiotic.  Wonder what that makes him?  

locutius wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 10:54am:



Yes, Jesus said that.

Jesus also said,

Luke 17:3
Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.
4  And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.





The Church today is very 'ecumenical'.

We have to be 'tolerant', and to forgive [the wicked], just like Jesus commanded.
/sarc off

But Jesus rebuked the religious leaders of his day, for their social 'compromises', and self-serving doctrines.

Jesus understood the pervasiveness of evil.

Mark 8:15
And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.

Jesus understood the nature of evil.




Once a society say's to itself,

"Evil and wickedness is not so bad. We should not punish people harshly, for doing wicked things."

Then that society is, in effect, itself, embracing wickedness,
.....and in reality, that society is saying,

"See how 'compassionate' and 'tolerant' we are? We don't even punish people for vile, and cruel, and wicked acts."

locutius, can you explain the logic of that position, to me?

Because i just don't 'get it'.

"Forgive them for they know not what they do."

I would argue that,

If we tolerate evil, and wickedness, in others [among ourselves],
....WE WILL BECOME EVIL AND WICKED OURSELVES!

Look at how wicked the world is, today.

And look at how wicked our society is, today.


And today, ppl [including nominal Christians] just don't get that TRUTH, IN FACT THEY TURN AWAY FROM IT.

"Don't worry about evil, and wickedness, our God is loving and forgiving."

/sarc off

No, he is not!

Our God, is not forgiving, of unrepentant wickedness.

Ezekiel 33:11
Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord GOD, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?






WE ARE TO REPROVE WICKEDNESS, AND SEPARATE OURSELVES FROM THE WICKED

Wicked behaviour should be exposed and reproved - that is scriptural.

And those who consider themselves to be God's children are called on, to separate themselves from the wicked - that is scriptural.


2 Timothy 3:16
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

2 Timothy 4:2
Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.
3  For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
4  And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

Ephesians 5:6
Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
7  Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
8  For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
9  (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;)
10  Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
11  And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

1 Thessalonians 5:19
Quench not the Spirit.
20  Despise not prophesyings.
21  Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
22  Abstain from all appearance of evil.

2 Corinthians 6:14
Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
15  And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
16  And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
17  Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
18  And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

Revelation 18:4
And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

Yadda wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 12:17pm:

What you seem to be implying here, but don't quite have the guts to say it, is that your holy book commands if the trespasser doesn't repent then you can take to him, say, with an axe and hack him to death. It's only if he repents that he is worthy of forgiveness.

Grendel wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 12:55pm:

Have to ask a theist about that. Seems we're regaled with all these little metaphors about offending trees being cut down with an axe and deadwood being gathered up and thrown into fires...

Yadda wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 1:41pm:

Yes, Christians like us to believe that retribution is not for them... Until they gain power.

Yadda wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 1:41pm:

Those questions for even a non-Christian (let alone a non-theist) are easy to answer. No sympathy for them. But I'm not the one who is constrained by the command to love his enemies. You are.

tallowood wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 2:38pm:

Which explains why you are keen to legitimise the term 'atheist'.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 2:52pm:


I didn't realise that atheists are illegitimate bastards on top of being murderers. Thank you  for your insider insight, hellian.

NorthOfNorth wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 3:43pm:



Yes, you are well trained.

tallowood wrote on Jun 24^th, 2009 at 2:38pm:


That's some fallacious reasoning there.

I saw a tiger when I was drunk, therefore, drinking conjures tigers.

mozzaok wrote on Jun 25^th, 2009 at 9:36pm:


Ah Mozz, but it all makes sense in that special religious kind of way. You know the three equals one, God has a mother, and the admirable God that couldn't find a better plan than murdering a nations babies.

tallowood wrote on Jun 26^th, 2009 at 11:48am:


What's a holly pig?

I've said again and again, not believing in something is just that, not believing. You can believe in God if you want, I don't care. I just don't.

There may be things you do not believe in. Do you believe in vampires? Yes/No? If you say No, are you part of the Great Anti-Vampire Religion? If you say No, are you 'closed minded', or 'intellectually dishonest' or 'on some crusade to convert the whole world to your anti-vampire religion?'

Are you intellectually arrogant to deny the existence of vampires, given all the many folk tales and stories about them throughout Europe?

Or maybe you just don't believe in vampires, like I don't believe in God.

Oh, a HOLY pig. There you go.

What's your Holy Cow of Anti-Vampirism?

tallowood wrote on Jun 26^th, 2009 at 6:08pm:


I thought that it was supposed to be the Invisible Pink Unicorn of atheism?

Acid Monkey wrote on Jul 4^th, 2009 at 9:02pm:

tallowood wrote on Jun 26^th, 2009 at 8:34pm:


No. Do you?

tallowood wrote on Jul 5^th, 2009 at 1:07am:


Oh Lord. You know I didn't mean parasitic animals. I mean *vampires*. Yes ok, mosquitos are vampires, so are ticks and fleas....

Yes I know there is a vampire bat, but its not a vampire. So do you believe in vampires?