Australian Politics Forum - Dissent or Sedition?

Grendel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #75 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 10:11am

oh and aboo...

your oft repeated statistic..

Quote:

Catholics, Orthodox and Protestant make up 99.99% of all Christians.

is totally incorrect.

Without looking up the most recent accurate stats (and using your parameters) it would be more like 82% and if you also take into account that not all Protestants adhere to trinitarian doctrine (and they don't) if you take just 1/3 of them you can add another 7% which drops your figure down to 75%...

Also if you look at the differing understandings of the trinity between those who believe in it you are still left with only Catholics believing what Catholics believe and Catholics only make up just over half of the world's Christians.

YAWN... Roll Eyes

Now can we get back on topic? hmmm.
Or don't you want to discuss Muslim bad behaviour and sedition within the communities they inhabit in the West?

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« Last Edit: Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 10:16am by Grendel »

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abu_rashid

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #76 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 8:03pm

Quote:

oh and Aboo calling a church after a Saint aint creating a Saint

It means they obviously believe in saints. Can't believe in something that hasn't been created (actually beatified is the correct term).

Quote:

Without looking up the most recent accurate stats (and using your parameters) it would be more like 82%

You think 18% of Christians are neither Catholic, Orthodox or Protestant? Got some actual references to back that up?? Which large minorities make up this 18% in your estimation?

Quote:

which drops your figure down to 75%..

3/4 is still an overwhelming majority. Anyway, the Protestant Churches adopt the Nicene Creed, unless you can show statistics to prove that large amounts of Protestants don't believe in it, we'll just go with the established facts shall we?

Quote:

Also if you look at the differing understandings of the trinity between those who believe in it you are still left with only Catholics believing what Catholics believe and Catholics only make up just over half of the world's Christians.

This was your original (and incorrect) claim, that Cathlics only adopt the Trinity. It's quite obviously false, and you even admit above, it's perhaps only those not of the major 3 denominations, and you speculate there might be large numbers of Protestants that don't. Even if your speculation were reliable evidence, Orthodox quite clearly believe in the trinity...

Quote:

YAWN...

If you're tired, or don't want to participate in the discussion, don't. You'll find I'm a little more respectful of others and myself, and won't run around from thread to thread boasting I beat you, as others might...

Quote:

Or don't you want to discuss Muslim bad behaviour and sedition within the communities they inhabit in the West?

Not particularly. Since I don't behave badly, nor seditiously, It doesn't affect me.

Because Christians beave badly and/or seditiously, should you answer for them? why must individual Muslims answer for all other Muslims? Are we a monolithic entity or something?

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Grendel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #77 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 8:09pm

Quote:

It means they obviously believe in saints. Can't believe in something that hasn't been created (actually beatified is the correct term).

rotflmao

You are sooooo ignorant.
Do you understand that Saints are just considered "Holy" men by many Christians... that you don't pray to them or carry idols of them around etc. etc, etc... they are part of history.

I guess you don't.

Nor do you have the guts to admit you were wrong... as I clearly showed.

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mozzaok Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 6741 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Dissent or Sedition? Reply #78 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 8:19pm Catholics pray to saints, and keep pictures, medals, statues, etc. I always thought of them a bit like four leaf clovers, sort of good luck charms. I never thought of god as the super jealous type though. I mean, who would expect the supreme being to have self esteem, and insecurity issues?
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Gaybriel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #79 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 8:28pm

mozzaok wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 8:19pm:

Catholics pray to saints, and keep pictures, medals, statues, etc.

I always thought of them a bit like four leaf clovers, sort of good luck charms.

I never thought of god as the super jealous type though.

I mean, who would expect the supreme being to have self esteem, and insecurity issues?

I know you're kinda joking but I'll answer seriously anyway!

isn't it more about god saying that there is no other god but him so worshipping any other would be worshipping a false god?

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abu_rashid

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #80 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 8:35pm

Grendel,

Here's your original statement, no mention of praying to the Saints, just that they 'create' them.
Quote:

Catholicism departs quite fundamentally from other churches in its practices and that it believes in the Trinity, creates Saints, has a Pope(and all that entails), prays to/through idols etc, and believes in confession etc, etc, etc...

Afterwards you modified it AFTER I already answered it and showed you to be wrong. You want to move the goal posts after the goal's been kicked, bit late sonny jim, it just shows you're incapable of actually engaging in a dignified discussion.

All your claims have been addressed and you've been proven to be wrong in all but 1 of them. Please go and read about the Nicene creed, about the Orthodox Popes and about all the other stuff you've debated yet have no idea whatsoever about.

Have some self respect and just admit you spoke without thinking or checking the facts. You really do yourself a disservice by going on like this, and completely avoiding the facts already presented to you.

Or... you could just fill another post with 'rotflmao' and other childish little acronyms that you often use to disguise the fact you have no post-worthy reply.

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Grendel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #81 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:09pm

I didn't modify it at all... aboo...

you haven't shown me to be wrong about anything in fact it is you whom keeps creating strawmen and showing an ignorance of the subject.

I did my study of Catholicism a couple of decades ago goober... nothing much I cant remember about them.

As to your 2nd non-point statistics... yes my stats are far more accurate than yours a quick google with show that to be true.

as for... Quote:

3/4 is still an overwhelming majority. Anyway, the Protestant Churches adopt the Nicene Creed, unless you can show statistics to prove that large amounts of Protestants don't believe in it, we'll just go with the established facts shall we?

Mine was probably an under-estimate. So just where did you get your statistics from. oh that's right an uninformed guess. Did you read anything I wrote? Well if you did, get your brain in gear and try to process the information.

This is all pretty moot re this topic and eventually I will get back on it with a vengeance but for now I'm happy to make you look stupid.

25% is a lot bigger that .1% isn't it. In fact it is 250 times bigger give or take.

My point re the creation of saints and other Christian religions still hold btw and I did explain and expand on it just for you. seems though i'm just wasting my time educating you.

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« Last Edit: Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:19pm by Grendel »

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Gaybriel Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1191	Re: Dissent or Sedition? Reply #82 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:22pm ok guys lets move it over here http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1224674475
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Grendel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #83 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:28pm

hello aboo... trinity time again.

yes I commented on the Trinity.
yet you still fail to get it.
One... not all Christians believe in the trinity.
Two... Not all those that do share the same definition/belief in the trinity.

Oh dear... so therefore as has been my argument from the very start... Not all Christians have the same belief as Catholics

yet you measure Christians as Catholics... how stupid is that.

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Gaybriel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #84 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:42pm

Grendel wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:28pm:

hello aboo... trinity time again.

yes I commented on the Trinity.
yet you still fail to get it.
One... not all Christians believe in the trinity.
Two... Not all those that do share the same definition/belief in the trinity.

Oh dear... so therefore as has been my argument from the very start... Not all Christians have the same belief as Catholics

yet you measure Christians as Catholics... how stupid is that.

grendel-please move this discussion to the other thread posted above.

this has gotten too off topic

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Dissent or Sedition? Reply #85 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:51pm That's what they do gaybriel... I didn't start going off topic... But in order to avoid a topic... they go off topic.
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Gaybriel

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Re: Dissent or Sedition?
Reply #86 - Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 10:08pm

Grendel wrote on Oct 22^nd, 2008 at 9:51pm:

That's what they do gaybriel... I didn't start going off topic...

But in order to avoid a topic... they go off topic.

actually I think I got this off topic.

a lot of convos go off topic- I don't have a prob with that, just when they do let's put them in another thread....which I now have Tongue

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