reediver,
Quote:This is a major problem in the approach of the muslim community. Maybe it answers my question about why they are so impotent against their own extremists.
As has been mentioned plenty of times already, Muslim militias are just a reaction to the Western hostilities. If the West just gets their act together and stops being so aggressive and meddling towards Muslims, chances are those militias would either wither away, or meld into a conventional military of a country.
It's the Western actions which have led to this situation, and the US government has been well aware of this escalating situation since at least the Eisenhower administration. They don't want to do anything to reverse it, as they're quite happy with it like that. Now you, as a citizen of a Western country, have a responsibility to make it overtly clear to your leaders that you're not happy with them doing that, if you don't like the outcomes of their policies, which they themselves have openly admitted have caused this conflict.
It seems you want them punished, rather than neutralised, and this is a worry, because that kind of sentiment is going to further prolong any kind of sincere peace effort from coming to fruition.
Quote:Their neighbours? If a community rejects extremists then it will be easy to track them down.
Ahh, you mean the people who've been bombed relentlessly for the past 7 years? Probably lost some of their children/siblings/parents etc. to US terrorist attacks. Or who've been tortured under successive pro-US regimes in the region? Yeh I'm sure they'd be glad to help you. I can't believe you're so blinded as to not be able to see how you've made this mess for yourself.
Quote:Sure, it would be easier if the locals turfed him out, but for some reason the locals support what he did. Hence my question.
Gee I wonder what it could be that would cause them to support it... *thinks*... hmmm, could it be that we've bombed them to smithereens, oppressed them and their co-religionists for decades to satisfy our energy needs, installed regimes that oppress and torture and impoverish them?? Support their enemies against them.. Or could it be that they're just evil savage stone-age Muslims... Yep I'll go with the latter, makes me feel a bit better about myself.
Now I hope your thought processes are *at least* that evolved on the subject? Don't tell me that didn't even come to mind and you're still just completely oblivious as to what on earth could possibly cause them to support this?
Ahh, I remember, the Muslim code of silence... of course. It is shallow thinkers like you freediver that will allow this conflict to go on and on.
Quote:They do appear to be pulling their finger out, which is a good sign. But it is baby steps.
Musharraf was a much more loyal servant, too bad you let that become too well known though, because it meant he couldn't stay in office. The US really need to learn how to keep their distance from their pet dictators, like they did in Saudi, by pulling all their troops out, when it finally become so unpopular it threatened the stability of the pets.
Quote:Are you suggesting that Muslims would only track down terrorists because the US asked them to?
Nope, I'm suggesting the whole concept would only even exist in your fantasy world.
As mentioned above, people who you bomb and murder their kids and stuff, generally wouldn't help you out for any reason. When will people like you finally wake up to this fact?
Quote:Is all that mouthing off about 'we don't support terrorists' just BS?
I don't remember mouthing off. I said targetting civilians is not permitted in Islam and it's most definitely not. But I'm not the one who's their neighbour (which is who you claim should rein them in), the guy whose son has a leg blown off, his daughter was blown to bits by a US dropped bomb, his brother is languishing in a US run prison camp for no reason whatsoever is the one you gotta convince... Good luck, you're gonna really need it.
Quote:Why can't they even act in their own self interest?
Put yourself in their shoes. If you'd been a victim of a US bomb or some other hostilities, would you consider aiding the one who'd committed atrocities against you to be in your interest?
The fact is, the allies are now actually admitting that they've painted themselves into a corner. They've alienated the population with their open aggressions against the civilian population. Why can't you see it freediver? Bit slow on the uptake are you?
What's even more amazing is that you consider yourself a bit of a freethinker who's not duped by the Allied propaganda, but it seems you're even more duped than they are. They are publically admitting these things I'm stating to you, and yet you still haven't caught on. do you listen to the news?
Quote:You don't want the US invading any more middle eastern countries. Neither do we. Even from the perspective of a nation, an army, or a Caliphate
If you really don't want it, then lobby your leaders to pull out. Since none of these hostilities existed prior to the invasions (btw, creation and maintenance to Israel is considered part of the invasions)
Quote:Sure. Saddam had to kill thousands of people to get them to stop killing each other.
Saddam is considered a one-man pre-invasion force by most Muslims. He was recruited by the CIA in the late 1950's and was a loyal servant since.