Australian Politics Forum - Boycotting the internal combustion engine....

BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Jul 6^th, 2008 at 5:48pm Is it time to start withdrawing support of this technology for the daily commute via body, mind and soul??? (Withdrawal of financial support, of course, being the main avenue of attacking the problem.)
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King Billy New Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 25	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #1 - Jul 7^th, 2008 at 5:35pm Givne the virtual dependance most families have on the internal combustion engine, such a boycott is only a pipe dream. Bill
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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #2 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 6:16pm

King Billy wrote on Jul 7^th, 2008 at 5:35pm:

Givne the virtual dependance most families have on the internal combustion engine, such a boycott is only a pipe dream.

Bill

But can they not purchase less expensive vehicles, even second hand, and thus enact a virtual financial boycott of the petrol-car industry therefore giving a price signal to the alternatives to enter the market?!?

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freediver

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #3 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 6:46pm

It is fairly easy to significantly reduce your dependence on cars, though I wouldn't want to give them up completely. I ride a bike to work, which is the only regular exercise I get right now. I used to spend about an hour and a half each day commuting to and from work, but since I started being more rational about where I live, my commute is far more enjoyable and only takes about 20 minutes in total. It also saves me a lot of money in fuel bills, car maintenance and depreciation. I hope I never have to go back to driving to work.

Buying second hand vehicles is not a boycott of the car industry.

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Acid Monkey

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #4 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 6:54pm

freediver wrote on Jul 14^th, 2008 at 6:46pm:

....but since I started being more rational about where I live, my commute is far more enjoyable and only takes about 20 minutes in total.

Thus minimising the rate of the urban sprawl. However, not everyone can afford to live close to the city. I used to live 10 minutes from the city but had to move further out due to spiraling rent prices. For the same price of a 2 bedroom flat in the inner suburbs I'm now living in a 3 bedroom stand-alone unit. The downside is that its now approx 50 minutes commute into town.

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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47346 At my desk.	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #5 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 7:09pm Did you factor travel costs into that decision?
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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #6 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 7:11pm

freediver wrote on Jul 14^th, 2008 at 6:46pm:

It is fairly easy to significantly reduce your dependence on cars, though I wouldn't want to give them up completely. I ride a bike to work, which is the only regular exercise I get right now. I used to spend about an hour and a half each day commuting to and from work, but since I started being more rational about where I live, my commute is far more enjoyable and only takes about 20 minutes in total. It also saves me a lot of money in fuel bills, car maintenance and depreciation. I hope I never have to go back to driving to work.

Buying second hand vehicles is not a boycott of the car industry.

I argue that it does mean withdrawal of financial support for new petrol-fuelled cars.

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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freediver

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #7 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 7:15pm

Not really. It pushes up the price of second hand cars, which reduces the total cost of new cars over whatever period people own them for. It also makes new cars more attractive by reducing the upfront price differential. If someone is considering buying a new car, they will take the price they can get for their current one into account, which is where you come in...

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Acid Monkey

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #8 - Jul 14^th, 2008 at 9:24pm

freediver wrote on Jul 14^th, 2008 at 7:09pm:

Did you factor travel costs into that decision?

Yes, formerly I was travelling into the city via train within Zone 1; now I'm travelling from Zone 2 - an increase monthly railway ticket fee of $57.00. The upside is that in the morning I get on at a train station near the start of the line so I will almost certainly to get a seat whereas previously I would have to stand in the crush. Grocery is cheaper by about $15.00 each major trip to the supermarket. And, as I've said I'me getting a 3 bedroom unit with a patio and backyard (almost 2.5 x bigger than my previous flat) for the same rent.

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #9 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 2:13am

freediver wrote on Jul 14^th, 2008 at 7:15pm:

Not really. It pushes up the price of second hand cars, which reduces the total cost of new cars over whatever period people own them for. It also makes new cars more attractive by reducing the upfront price differential. If someone is considering buying a new car, they will take the price they can get for their current one into account, which is where you come in...

True, I suppose, I'm relying on a coordination between consumers to abandon new cars(or atleast the pricier ones).

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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47346 At my desk.	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #10 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 10:20am What exactly do you want to achieve?
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muso

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Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine....
Reply #11 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 11:23am

Well if you want to boycott the Internal Combustion Engine, what about the External Combustion Engine? That's a type of engine that's been around for years. You can even run it on waste biomass, including garbage. The only downside might be that it could take some time to heat up.

In our house, that could be workable.

"I'm just getting ready now"
Thinks - that means I have 90 minutes at least....
"Ok, dear I'll just stoke the furnace and check the water level"

On the other hand, just think of the public transport implications. Think of the smiles on the commuters' faces when they jump from their Zone 2 station on to a train pulled by a new efficient version of Thomas the Tank Engine.

http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=669

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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #12 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:19pm freediver wrote on Jul 15^th, 2008 at 10:20am: What exactly do you want to achieve? A signal for the alternatives to make the plunge. Tesla is on it's way for instance...I want more to follow!
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Acid Monkey Gold Member Offline Goth Father Posts: 1064 EU Gender:	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #13 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:26pm What will be the price tag of a Tesla? It's probably viable in Europe but will it be in Oz?
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freediver Gold Member Online www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 47346 At my desk.	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #14 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:28pm I meant, what is your ultimate goal? Why are you doing this?
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Acid Monkey Gold Member Offline Goth Father Posts: 1064 EU Gender:	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #15 - Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:34pm Tesla Darkstar - 100% electric.
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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #16 - Jul 16^th, 2008 at 2:52am freediver wrote on Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:28pm: I meant, what is your ultimate goal? Why are you doing this? To get off using oil as a fuel for the daily commute.
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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #17 - Jul 16^th, 2008 at 2:54am Acid Monkey wrote on Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:26pm: What will be the price tag of a Tesla? It's probably viable in Europe but will it be in Oz? It's over $100K American I believe. There is supposedly a cheaper sedan coming from them about 2010, tho, with further plans to go cheaper after that.
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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Boycotting the internal combustion engine.... Reply #18 - Jul 16^th, 2008 at 11:20am Acid Monkey wrote on Jul 15^th, 2008 at 5:34pm: Tesla Darkstar - 100% electric. Yeah - I've had my beady eyes on the Tesla roadster for many years. Pity it's so expensive.
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