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Race and IQ (Read 94286 times)
freediver
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #30 - Jun 15th, 2007 at 6:34pm
 
I think it was mentioned in the other thread that from a genetic perspective, race does not exist. However, I have heard that there is more genetic variation in a single African village than there was in the entire world outside of Africa, prior to recent mass movements out of Africa.
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #31 - Jun 15th, 2007 at 8:59pm
 
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DT, AN and sprint implied (or stated explicitly) that certain races are inherently (ie genetically) inferior and have a lower IQ. This is not true and is based on prejudice rather than evidence. Where IQ differences have been detected, they have been small and attributable to cultural influences on the test. They have always been insignificant compared to the variation in IQ within a group.


Okay... here's some stats I dug up...


Source: Richard Lynn, "Race Differences in Intelligence: An Evolutionary Analysis" 2006 Table 16.2 (indigenous populations)

  • Arctic Peoples      91
  • East Asians      105
  • Europeans      99
  • Native Americans (north & south)      86
  • Southern Asian & Northern Africans      84
  • Bushmen (southern Africa)      54
  • Africans (subsaharan)      67
  • Australians (aboriginals)      62
  • Southeast Asians      87
  • Pacific Islanders      85




Ausnat Quote:
Because they are the second most stupid race on earth.  I wasnt going to mention Abo's  first but now that you've mentioned it-  The Aboriginal people of Australia are the most backwards people on earth.


Ausnat's statement can be somewhat backed up by the stats.




Quote:
Nothing wrong with recognising a gene that somehow proves that maori's are more prone to violence.

But it doesn't prove that.


How doesn't it prove that, freediver?


Quote:
The European, Aboriginal and African races are separated by thousands of years of evolution. Pretty big gap between us.

They are not separated, and thousands of years is not significant in evolutionary terms.


My respose to that is this freediver:

Quote:
According to recent genetic studies, the first humans came out of Africa. This is a widely-accepted theory by all scientists today. It was about 60,000 years ago.

Africans / negroes - 60,000 years ago

Middle-Easterners to SouthEast Asians - 50,000 years ago - 41,000 years ago

East Asians (Chinese, Japanese) - during the period of 40,000 to 36,000 years ago.

Native Americans / "Indians" - 15,000 years ago

Whites / Europeans - 35,000 years ago

All of this data has been confirmed by genetic markers and fossils. Just read Stanford geneticist Spencer Well's two books "Deep Ancestry" and "The Journey of Man." The books are sponsored by National Geographic. You can find the books at any Barnes And Nobles or Borders bookstore near you.

1. Deep Ancestry by Spencer Wells, p. 104-106, 96-102
2. Journey of Man by Spencer Wells, p. 66 and 120




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I don't particularly think Aboriginals have very civilised genes. IQ differences...

What IQ differences? Are you just making this up DT?


See above.
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #32 - Jun 15th, 2007 at 9:04pm
 
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Performance IQ and gene link confirmed

By Jim Dryden

If you're particularly good with puzzles or chess, the reason may be in your genes.

A team of scientists led by School of Medicine psychiatric geneticists has gathered the most extensive evidence to date that a gene that activates signaling pathways in the brain influences one kind of intelligence. The researchers confirmed a link between the gene CHRM2 and performance IQ, which involves a person's ability to organize things logically.

"This is not a gene for intelligence," said Danielle M. Dick, Ph.D., assistant professor of psychiatry and lead author on the study. "It's a gene that's involved in some kinds of brain processing, and specific alterations in the gene appear to influence IQ. But this single gene isn't going to be the difference between whether a person is a genius or has below-average intelligence."
Danielle Dick

Dick's team comprehensively studied the DNA along the gene and found that several variations within the CHRM2 gene could be correlated with slight differences in performance IQ scores, which measure a person's visual-motor coordination, logical and sequential reasoning, spatial perception and abstract problem-solving skills. When people had more than one positive variation in the gene, the improvements in performance IQ were cumulative.


http://record.wustl.edu/news/page/normal/8918.html
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #33 - Jun 15th, 2007 at 9:07pm
 
Calculated average IQ of indigenous populations from the book Race Differences in Intelligence by Richard Lynn. Lynn's datasets are criticized as being unrepresentative (Heredity April 2004, Volume 92, Number 4, Pages 359-360).[38] Some of the IQ values are inferred based on a few tests in a nearby country.

...
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #34 - Jun 15th, 2007 at 9:10pm
 
...

An example of one kind of gap found in the average intelligence of races are these cumulative IQ gaps by race or ethnicity based on 1981 U.S. distributions.[7] According to these findings, WAIS IQs for Whites (mean = 101.4, SD = 14.7) were higher than those for Blacks (mean = 86.9, SD = 13.0); distributions for Hispanics (mean = 91), East Asians (mean = 106), and Ashkenazi Jews (mean = 112-115) are less precise because of overlap and small sample size. These curves only show scores from the 1st to the 99th percentile (covering 98% of the population).
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Australia remains racist, says academic
Reply #35 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 12:21pm
 
http://www.smh.com.au/news/breaking-news/australia-remains-racist-says-academic/2007/06/15/1181414539797.html

Australia remains a racist society, allowing governments to erode many of the gains made since the landmark Mabo decision, a leading Aboriginal academic says.

"A key barrier in achieving social justice for Aboriginal people ... is the prevalence of racism in Australian society," said Professor Larissa Behrendt said.

"Studies increasingly show that Australians are resistant to the notion that they are a racist society and resent the use of the term 'racism' to describe their attitudes and actions to any sector of the community, including Aboriginal and Torres Strait islanders," she said.

"But it explains why it is that the government can loosely and misleadingly assert that 'they are not going to throw any more money at the situation' and many Australians agree.
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Re: Australia remains racist, says academic
Reply #36 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 12:28pm
 
freediver wrote on Jun 16th, 2007 at 12:21pm:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/breaking-news/australia-remains-racist-says-academic/2007/06/15/1181414539797.html

Australia remains a racist society, allowing governments to erode many of the gains made since the landmark Mabo decision, a leading Aboriginal academic says.

"A key barrier in achieving social justice for Aboriginal people ... is the prevalence of racism in Australian society," said Professor Larissa Behrendt said.

"Studies increasingly show that Australians are resistant to the notion that they are a racist society and resent the use of the term 'racism' to describe their attitudes and actions to any sector of the community, including Aboriginal and Torres Strait islanders," she said.

"But it explains why it is that the government can loosely and misleadingly assert that 'they are not going to throw any more money at the situation' and many Australians agree.


True
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Lynn is biased by racism
Reply #37 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 12:48pm
 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Lynn

Lynn's work on global racial differences in cognitive ability, mostly surveys of other scientists' studies, has been criticized for its associated measurement difficulties.

Leon Kamin accused Lynn in a Scientific American book review (1995) critical of the Bell Curve of disregarding scientific objectivity, misrepresenting data, and racism.[14] Kamin argues the studies of cognitive ability of Africans in Lynn's meta-analysis cited by Herrnstein and Murray show strong cultural bias. Kamin also criticized Lynn for "concocting" IQ values from test scores that have no correlation to IQ.[15] Furthermore, Kamin argues Lynn selectively excluded a study that found no difference in White and Black performance, and ignored the results of a study which showed Black scores were higher than White scores.[16]

Often left unmentioned by champions of Richard Lynn is that he has also been known to argue based on eugenic principles for the extinction of entire cultures based on their "incompetence." In Lynn's own words,

"What is called for here is not genocide, the killing off of the populations of incompetent cultures.[15] But we do need to think realistically in terms of "phasing out" of such peoples. If the world is to evolve more better humans, then obviously someone has to make way for them. ... To think otherwise is mere sentimentality."

Elsewhere Lynn makes clear which "incompetent cultures" need "phasing out": "Who can doubt that the Caucasoids and the Mongoloids are the only two races that have made any significant contributions to civilization?" (cited in New Republic, 10/31/94)"

http://www.amazon.com/Race-Differences-Intelligence-Evolutionary-Analysis/dp/159368021X

Secondly, the early evolution within east Africa (p. 225) is poorly argued. The contemporary IQ of 67 is not the one to use, as it factors in present-day malnutrition. In the `environment of evolutionary adaptedness', this would not have been the case, so why not use 80? Lynn then appears to suggest there is a `continual directional selection for intelligence' based on its utility, as if species always got smarter and smarter. However intelligence comes with large costs, in terms of the energy required for big brains, so one would expect instead an equilibrium where a species is no smarter than it has to be. So rather than a drift to smartness in Africa, isn't it more likely that we saw waves of replacement populations radiating from groups who got smarter in more isolated niches where they were stressed more?
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #38 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 2:35pm
 
Excellent work Donald, Does anyone disagree now? of course there is... THE BIGOTS.
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #39 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 4:47pm
 
If race can affect how well you can run or swim i cant see why it wouldnt affect how well you can solve puzzles etc...
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #40 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 4:51pm
 
Almost all of the effects on sporting ability which we usually attribute to race are actually attributable to diet, wealth, culture etc.
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #41 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 5:31pm
 
genetically black people run and jump better, genetically white people swim faster.

thats what i heard anyway
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #42 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 5:35pm
 
Why would people from northern europe be better swimmers?

On 'average,' the best swimmers around are Australians, regardless of their ethnic background.
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #43 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 5:45pm
 
freediver - so what is YOUR explaination why all the runners at the 100 meter sprint for as long as I can remember at the olympics are blacks ?
As well as repeating my previous question for time #4 and counting .
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Re: Race and IQ
Reply #44 - Jun 16th, 2007 at 5:47pm
 
Sprint I'm not going to keep repeating my answer just because you don't understand it.

all the runners at the 100 meter sprint for as long as I can remember at the olympics are blacks ?

Are you sure about that?

Why does Australia dominate the swimming, when we have such a small population? Why do we dominate the rugby? It's because of our environment and our culture. Effects like that completely swamp any genetic difference, if it even exists.
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