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http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl General Discussion >> General Board >> MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1500173599 Message started by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 12:53pm

Title: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 12:53pm

Quote:

MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data In New Report: In No Way A “Valid Representation of Reality”

A new report which analyzed key global warming metrics such as Global Average Surface Temperature (GAST), the NOAA and HADLEY, confirms President Trump was correct in pulling out of the Paris Climate Agreement.

SHFTPLan reports:

According to the report, which has been peer reviewed by administrators, scientists and researchers from the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), The Massachusetts Institute of Technology (M.I.T.), and several of America’s leading universities, the data is completely bunk:

In this research report, the most important surface data adjustment issues are identified and past changes in the previously reported historical data are quantified. It was found that each new version of GAST has nearly always exhibited a steeper warming linear trend over its entire history. And, it was nearly always accomplished by systematically removing the previously existing cyclical temperature pattern. This was true for all three entities providing GAST data measurement, NOAA, NASA and Hadley CRU.

As a result, this research sought to validate the current estimates of GAST using the best available relevant data. This included the best documented and understood data sets from the U.S. and elsewhere as well as global data from satellites that provide far more extensive global coverage and are not contaminated by bad siting and urbanization impacts. Satellite data integrity also benefits from having cross checks with Balloon data.

The conclusive findings of this research are that the three GAST data sets are not a valid representation of reality.

In fact, the magnitude of their historical data adjustments, that removed their cyclical temperature patterns, are totally inconsistent with published and credible U.S. and other temperature data.

Thus, it is impossible to conclude from the three published GAST data sets that recent years have been the warmest ever –despite current claims of record setting warming.

Finally, since GAST data set validity is a necessary condition for EPA’s GHG/CO2 Endangerment Finding, it too is invalidated by these research findings. (Full Abstract Report)

Fulfilling a key campaign promise, President Trump shocked the world by pulling out of the Paris agreement. Axios’ Johnathan Swan was the first to report the President would pull out of the agreement.

On May 31st, Axios reported:

President Trump has made his decision to withdraw from the Paris climate accord, according to two sources with direct knowledge of the decision. Details on how the withdrawal will be executed are being worked out by a small team including EPA Administrator Scott Pruitt. They’re deciding on whether to initiate a full, formal withdrawal — which could take 3 years — or exit the underlying United Nations climate change treaty, which would be faster but more extreme.

Why this matters: Pulling out of Paris is the biggest thing Trump could do to unravel Obama’s climate legacy. It sends a combative signal to the rest of the world that America doesn’t prioritize climate change and threatens to unravel the ambition of the entire deal.

The other outliers: The only other two countries that aren’t supporting the deal are Nicaragua and Syria.

How it happened: A letter from 22 Republican Senators (including Mitch McConnell) that called for a clean exit had reinforced Trump’s instincts to withdraw, and the president had been telling confidants over the past week that he was going to pull out.

It’s no surprise that members of the liberal establishment shifted into meltdown mode following the decision, with Hollywood director Michael Moore and former President Obama being the most vocal.

As per The Hill:

Liberal filmmaker Michael Moore blasted President Trump’s decision Thursday to withdraw the U.S. from the Paris climate agreement, calling it “a crime against humanity.”

“This admitted predator has now expanded his predatory acts to the entire planet,” Moore tweeted.

“USA to Earth: F— YOU,” the filmmaker added in other tweets. “America First! Earth Last! My name is Michael Moore. I am an American. And I live in a Rogue State.”

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 12:53pm

Quote:

Obama’s statement was as follows:

A year and a half ago, the world came together in Paris around the first-ever global agreement to set the world on a low-carbon course and protect the world we leave to our children.

It was steady, principled American leadership on the world stage that made that achievement possible.

It was bold American ambition that encouraged dozens of other nations to set their sights higher as well. And what made that leadership and ambition possible was America’s private innovation and public investment in growing industries like wind and solar – industries that created some of the fastest new streams of good-paying jobs in recent years, and contributed to the longest streak of job creation in our history.

Simply put, the private sector already chose a low-carbon future. And for the nations that committed themselves to that future, the Paris Agreement opened the floodgates for businesses, scientists, and engineers to unleash high-tech, low-carbon investment and innovation on an unprecedented scale.

The nations that remain in the Paris Agreement will be the nations that reap the benefits in jobs and industries created. I believe the United States of America should be at the front of the pack.

But even in the absence of American leadership; even as this Administration joins a small handful of nations that reject the future; I’m confident that our states, cities, and businesses will step up and do even more to lead the way, and help protect for future generations the one planet we’ve got.

But of course, like all Champagne Socialists, their credo is “do as I say, not as I do,” with Obama jacking up his carbon footprint when abroad. Who could forget Obama’s massive convoy during a recent speaking gig in Milan?

The Independent Journal Review reported:

Former President Barack Obama traveled to Italy this week to make a speech on climate change at the “Seed & Chips: The Global Food Innovation Summit” in the city of Milan.

It seems like Obama has taken a page out of Leonardo DiCaprio’s book of “do as I say, not as I do” and took a private jet to Milan. Not only that, he had a 14 car convoy to get into the city, which also included protection from above with a helicopter.

It doesn’t end there. According to The Daily Mail, 300 police officers were used to protect the former president.

The fleet of 14 included multiple SUVs, police cars, and sedans — not to mention a few motorcycles.

Here’s another look at the convoy:

While in Milan, Obama also met with former Italian Prime Minister Matteo Renzi, who was a close partner during their respective times in office.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Ajax on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:05pm

Thank God there are still some institutions that speak the truth and aren't corrupted by the oligarchy and its finances.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:09pm

We still had most of the US above freezing instead of below it last NH winter.

The NH is still suffering heatwaves, extreme weather events and wildfires this NH summer.

We are still having a very mild winter.

I doubt all this will come to very much at all.

Greenland and the Antarctic are still contributing to sea level rise as is the thermal expansion of the heating oceans.

I will have a look at it but I bet this does not mean what The Moronic thinks it does.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:10pm

I notice The Moronic did not include a link. Never mind, the source will be easy enough to find.

It was:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-15/research-team-slams-global-warming-data-new-report-not-reality-totally-inconsistent-

Seems to be an argument about homogenisation—again.

Will report back soon on this storm in a teacup.

AGW is real, no mistake about that at all.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The_Barnacle on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:14pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:10pm:

I notice The Moronic did not include a link.

Mechanic doesn't know how to post links
He's not the sharpest tool in the shed

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:31pm

Yeah, the article is just the latest in the shitfight over homogenisation, it does not say global warming isn’t happening, just the speed at which it is happening.

We know AGW is happening from the spectrometry evidence.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:45pm

As a bit of a counter to the article in the OP:

Quote:

A new paper published in the Journal of Climate reveals that the lower part of the Earth’s atmosphere has warmed much faster since 1979 than scientists relying on satellite data had previously thought.

Researchers from Remote Sensing Systems (RSS), based in California, have released a substantially revised version of their lower tropospheric temperature record.

After correcting for problems caused by the decaying orbit of satellites, as well as other factors, they have produced a new record showing 36% faster warming since 1979 and nearly 140% faster (i.e. 2.4 times larger) warming since 1998. This is in comparison to the previous version 3 of the lower tropospheric temperature (TLT) data published in 2009.

Climate sceptics have long claimed that satellite data shows global warming to be less pronounced than observational data collected on the Earth’s surface. This new correction to the RSS data substantially undermines that argument. The new data actually shows more warming than has been observed on the surface, though still slightly less than projected in most climate models

https://www.carbonbrief.org/major-correction-to-satellite-data-shows-140-faster-warming-since-1998

So corrections to drifts by satellites shows warming after 1998 is faster than previous satellite data showed. One fault due to satellite drift was temperatures supposed to be measured at 2.00pm were actually taken at 6.00pm or even 8.00pm. Correcting the satellite record brings it into line with terrestrial records.

AGW is happening.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:27pm

MIT nailed it...

with all of this adjusting of records pretty soon no one will even know what the true historical records were...

meanwhile... Greenland is smashing the ice out... wasn't it meant to not have ice ever again?? :D

in other parts of the world where they say the seas are rising Islands are forming due to the sea levels lowering...

fair dinkum... only a halfwit would follow the fraudulent government climate bodies... ::)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:42pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:45pm:

After correcting for problems caused by the decaying orbit of satellites

As I pointed out on another thread; they have adjusted for satellite drift since 1998.

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:45pm:

as well as other factors

And they have adjusted for diurnal drift for a similar amount of time.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:48pm

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:27pm:

Yeah, Greenland is smashing its ice out. . .into the surrounding seas. Loses like 200gigatons of ice a year. Considering just how thick the ice sheet on Greenland is nobody but a pure idiot has ever said anything like “Never thought to see ice on Greenland again.”

The world is warming and GHGs are the reason.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Mr Hammer on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:51pm

All week on ABC radio I've been hearing about the massive ice shelf that broke off the Antarctic mainland. What I didn't hear was the Antarctic ice shelf has been increasing over the last few years. So what is it? Cooling that theoretically caused the ice to increase or warming that caused the massive iceberg to break off?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:56pm

Larsen A & B ice shelves have previously broken off and they have not reformed. The glaciers that used to end on the ice shelves now end in the warmer seas lapping the Antarctic Peninsula and so melt more quickly. So there has been some sea level rise because of that.

If the rest of the Larsen C ice shelf follows the big bit that broke off the sea level rise will get a bit quicker.

If the Thwaites glacier goes—a metre of sea level rise will happen.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Super Nova on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:06pm

I prefer the views from more reliable rags like Scientific American.

Converted Contrarian Argues Humans "Almost Entirely" to Blame for Climate Change
Physicist Richard Muller has been convinced by his own analysis of the data that global warming is real and humans are causing it.

Richard Muller's conversion is complete.

The University of California, Berkeley, physicist once doubted the existence of climate change. Now he is convinced it's not only real but man-made, based on the latest results from his controversial review of temperature records.

"Call me a converted skeptic," Muller wrote in an op-ed published yesterday in The New York Times.
According to his Berkeley Earth Surface Temperature project, the average temperature on land has risen 1.5 degrees Celsius -- roughly 2.7 degrees Fahrenheit -- since 1753. That warming has tracked closely with the rise in greenhouse gas emissions from human activities, with little apparent contribution from natural factors like changes in solar activity, the group's latest paper concludes.

The researchers analyzed 14.4 million observations of average monthly land temperatures from 44,455 sites around the world, looking back about 100 years further and using five times more data than independent analyses by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, NASA and the U.K. Hadley Centre.

"Three years ago I identified problems in previous climate studies that, in my mind, threw doubt on the very existence of global warming," Muller wrote. "Last year, following an intensive research effort involving a dozen scientists, I concluded that global warming was real and that the prior estimates of the rate of warming were correct. I'm now going a step further: Humans are almost entirely the cause."
It is a marked about-face. Muller initially sought to investigate skeptics' claims that flawed data and methods had skewed prior examinations of global temperature trends. His startup kitty included $150,000 from a foundation started by oil billionaire Charles Koch that has supported efforts opposing mainstream climate change science.

'Stronger' results than IPCC

Even after the Berkeley project's initial findings last year agreed with prior analyses by NASA, NOAA and the Hadley Centre, Muller resisted pinning the blame for climate change on man-made greenhouse gas emissions.

"The amount that's due to humans is still open, and there are very big uncertainties in that," he said in November at a Washington, D.C., briefing organized by Democratic lawmakers (ClimateWire, Nov. 15, 2011).

Now Muller says Berkeley Earth's new results "are stronger than those of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change," because they found solar activity had a "negligible" role in warming observed since the 1750s.

In its 2007 report, the IPCC concluded with 90 percent certainty that human-caused greenhouse gas emissions have been the primary factor in Earth's overall temperature rise since 1950. But the U.N. panel said natural causes, including changes in the sun's output, may have been a significant factor before then.
Still, the new findings are not likely to alter the polarized U.S. debate on climate change.

Derision from deniers
Muller's work has been rejected by climate skeptics, including some he once called collaborators. And mainstream climate researchers have greeted the Berkeley Earth research with exasperation, sometimes tinged with amusement (ClimateWire, Oct. 21, 2011).

Tonya Mullins, a spokeswoman for the Charles Koch Foundation, said it "has long supported and will continue to support sound, nonpartisan, scientific research."
"Our grants are designed to promote independent research," she said. "As such, recipients hold full control over their findings. In this support, we strive to benefit society by promoting discovery and informing public policy."
But several prominent skeptic blogs offered harsh criticism of Muller yesterday, even as they praised his former associate Anthony Watts.

Watts, who runs the skeptical blog "Watts Up With That?" has derided the Berkeley Earth results as "post-normal political theater" and "incomplete and rushed, non-quality controlled, error riddled" science. He has repeatedly criticized Muller for posting results on the Web before they have undergone formal peer review.
But yesterday, in a pointed move, Watts released his own non-peer-reviewed findings, which purport to show that poorly sited U.S. weather stations have exaggerated the magnitude of recent warming -- a claim Muller's Berkeley Earth group analyzed and rejected (as did a peer-reviewed, published analysis by scientists at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration).

"Anthony Watts delivers devastating scientific blow to Muller's claims," screamed a banner headline on ClimateDepot, run by vocal skeptic Marc Morano. "Breaking: From BEST to worst in less than a day," began a post on the conservative Powerline blog.

Meanwhile, Judith Curry, a Georgia Institute of Technology climate scientist who co-authored the Berkeley Earth group's first four papers, said she declined to work on the latest analysis because of disagreements about Muller's methods.

"Their latest paper on the 250-year record concludes that the best explanation for the observed warming is greenhouse gas emissions," she told New York Time opinion blogger Andrew Revkin. "Their analysis is way oversimplistic and not at all convincing in my opinion."

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Super Nova on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:07pm

Part II

Applause, and gentle mocking, from climate scientists
Michael Mann, the Pennsylvania State University climate scientist who created the "hockey stick" analysis of past temperatures, had a very different reaction.

"At this rate, Muller should be caught up to the current state of climate science within a matter of just a few years!" he tweeted yesterday.

Mann, a favorite target of climate skeptics, later published a fuller reaction on his Facebook page.
"There is a certain ironic satisfaction in seeing a study funded by the Koch Brothers -- the greatest funders of climate change denial and disinformation on the planet -- demonstrate what scientists have known with some degree of confidence for nearly two decades: that the globe is indeed warming, and that this warming can only be explained by human-caused increases in greenhouse gas concentrations," he wrote.
"I applaud Muller and his colleagues for acting as any good scientists would, following where their analyses led them, without regard for the possible political repercussions (they are of course almost certain to be attacked by climate change deniers for their findings)."

In the meantime, the Berkeley Earth group is working to publish its findings, said Elizabeth Muller, Richard Muller's daughter and the project's executive director.

The group has submitted the new paper, and its four previous studies, to the Journal of Geophysical Research-Atmospheres, she said.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/converted-contrarian-argues-humans-to-blame-for-climate-change/

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Super Nova on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:10pm

All Climate Change Deniers will be held responsible for the disaster that is looming.

Your place in history is assured.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:13pm

Mr Hammer wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 6:51pm:

the ice has been breaking records this year..

and now that its summer in the NH the ice breaks off...

like it is right now with all of the climate loons going into hysteria... :D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:14pm

Super Nova wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:10pm:

All Climate Change Deniers will be held responsible for the disaster that is looming.

Your place in history is assured.

dur.... ::)

when finkle was asked recently what effect it would have on the world if AustralIA went to 0% emissions ... he said...

none...

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Mr Hammer on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:16pm

Super Nova wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:10pm:

All Climate Change Deniers will be held responsible for the disaster that is looming.

Your place in history is assured.

Speaking for myself, I have zero belief in the return of any sky fairy. I do have questions about 'climate change' (or global warming as it's now called). Those questions don't seem to get a run in the hysterical left-media.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:18pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-FoCXIwrH8

Quote:

Did you think the first day of winter felt a little nippy? Well, if you were in Adelaide it wasn't all in your head because the city has shivered through its coldest start to the season

but Jackass Monk says its a ho hum... just an average winter here folks... dur. :D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:18pm

Super Nova wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:10pm:

All Climate Change Deniers will be held responsible for the disaster that is looming.

Who these people who deny climate changes?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Super Nova on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:24pm

Mr Hammer,

Try this article is is one of the best explainations i have read for a while.

When Will The Planet Be Too Hot For Humans? Much, Much Sooner Than You Imagine.

http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/techandscience/when-will-the-planet-be-too-hot-for-humans-much-much-sooner-than-you-imagine/ar-BBEdx7f?li=AAmiR2Z&ocid=spartanntp

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:34pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:09pm:

Quote:

by Tom Saunders

Start chopping wood because you're going to need a bonfire to keep warm over southeast Australia this weekend. Temperatures will drop to near record levels at night, with a deep freeze engulfing inland parts of southern Queensland, NSW, Victoria, Tasmania and eastern SA. Here is a snapshot of the cold snap on Saturday morning:

The subzero temperatures will lead to widespread frost, which should develop even in the centre of the larger urban regions of Hobart and Melbourne - often protected from frost by the nearby sea and the build up of heat in roads and buildings during the day. For inland towns, especially along the ranges the temperatures will drop below -5C, cold enough to freeze the water in pipes. This will make plumbing non operational for a few hours early in the morning.

yes... very "mild" winter... ::)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:35pm

How does AGW work?

A number of molecules present in the atmosphere that contain three atoms or more can absorb and re-emit infrared (IR) photons (think of them as rays of infra red light if you like.)

Some of the Greenhouse gases are:

H2O present as water vapor (clouds are not water vapor but collections of tiny droplets of water) H2 + O = 3 atoms

CO2 is present as a gas, unlike water vapor it doesn’t eventually precipitate out as rain etc. 3 atoms, see?

CH4, methane, also present as a gas. A much (30x) stronger GHG than CO2 but does get oxidised to CO2 and H2O so not present all the time. 5 atoms.

N2O, nitrous oxide. 200x as powerful a GHG as CO2. Hangs around for ever.

O3, ozone, 3 atoms of oxygen in an unstable molecule.

So what happens? Visible light from the sun (UV can be disregarded) hits the earth, some gets reflected some hits the surface, some gets reflected, some gets absorbed. A rock or a cement pavement that has been baking in the sun all day radiates heat at night—you can feel the warmth. Oceans absorb a lot of light, warming the water.

So, the earth radiates infrared. If it couldn’t do that—we would bake!

So imagine a ray (photon) of infrared heading out from the surface of the earth. It hits a molecule of a GHG. The molecule absorbs the photon which ‘excites’ the molecule meaning it vibrates and spins etc faster. The molecule can’t hold on to the photon for long so re-emits it. However, it could be pointing to the surface and sends the photon back down to the surface.

There are other molecules of GHG in the atmosphere, a photon could be absorbed and re-emitted several times, increasing the chance it heads back to the surface.

Now, this is not something I am spinning out of nothing. NASA has satellites studying the radiation from the earth. At the frequencies corresponding to the spectrum lines of the various GHGs there is less radiation than expected. Infrared radiation IS being trapped in the atmosphere, warming the globe.

AGW is a soundly based scientific theory.

You know it is happening:

1. Glaciers are retreating (bar a very few)

2. Greenland is losing like 200gigatons of ice a year

3. Arctic sea ice is thinning and decreasing in extent.

4. The Himalayan ice sheet is retreating—this may cause a second nuclear war between India and China.

5. We have seen Antarctica is losing more and more ice (tho East Antarctica is gaining ice West Antarctica is losing more than East Antarctica gains.

That is the story in a nutshell.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:36pm

Australia has generally had a very mild winter.

Bits of frost here and there? Color me surprised, frost in winter? Tell me it ain’t so! :D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:37pm

AGW doesn’t mean we have hot winters and hellish summers. Just that we are moving in that direction.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:49pm

The Moronic and Boobhead believe the lies told by an oil seed salesman called David Dubyne.

I know hardly anyone watches the lying videos Dubyne makes and publishes on Youtube.

One of the lies will do as an illustration:

1. Dubyne said veges were being rationed in UK supermarkets because of his imaginary Ice Age. (this was early 2017.)

2. Dubyne lied. A Google search showed me that veges were rationed because the Murcia and Valencia parts of Spain that supplied 80% of Europes winter veges had been hit by so much rain the fields were unworkable.

Lies like this make up most of the videos. Bullshit makes up the balance.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:55pm

Greenland Coldest Temperature Ever Recorded in Northern Hemisphere in July

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuw9gMSIOLs

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:56pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:09pm:

We still had most of the US above freezing instead of below it last NH winter.
Link?

The NH is still suffering heatwaves, extreme weather events and wildfires this NH summer.
Link?

We are still having a very mild winter.
Link?

I doubt all this will come to very much at all.

Greenland and the Antarctic are still contributing to sea level rise as is the thermal expansion of the heating oceans.
Link?

I will have a look at it but I bet this does not mean what The Moronic thinks it does.
Ad hominem attack.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:02pm

I have linked all the above in the Environment board.

Nah, calling you Boobhead and mentioning The Moronic is purely descriptive.

Why don’t you mention all the times you called me fool, bloody fool and troll just because you could not refute any of the criticisms I made of the STUPID, LYING Dubyne videos?

NOBODY but you and The Moronic watches the stupid, lying videos.

Face it Boobhead, the world is warming, ice is melting just about everywhere!

I have explained the mechanism, you could not refute or rebut a letter of my explanation.

You are a homophobe longing for a major ice age to clean the world of poofs so you no longer have to fight against your urges.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:08pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:09pm:

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:10pm

I have posted links and details of all the above in Environment, Boobhead!

Only you and the Moronic watch the videos, when I am Environment Mod I will move your stupid Ice Age thread to The Moronic’s board and you and he can watch the crap videos together.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:12pm

Actually, Boobhead, a lot of the info re the VERY WARM US winter came from comments to the lying videos Dubyne was putting out at the time.

You should be able to find those posts since you actually get the comments emailed to you.

Have you found the three socks I use on the Dubyne site nowadays??? ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:12pm

interesting comment...

Quote:

did you hear that the record cold of -10.4C at Goulburn New South Wales Australia was removed by our corrupt weather service here?

they posted it on their website then removed it thinking it was a 'mistake' after public backlash, they then reinstalled the data,

mains water pipes bursting too, we have never had this happen before, usually we have local pipes, like mine freezing but they are now bursting under pressure of the freezing,

but according to JokeMonk .... its a very mild winter here.... ::)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:13pm

A few locations get a bit cold at night, in midwinter? TELL ME IT AINT’T SO!

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:17pm

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:12pm:

interesting comment...

Quote:

but according to JokeMonk .... its a very mild winter here.... ::)

Well - the Winter is here & it's not warm as AGW people would like you to believe:

http://www.weatherzone.com.au/news/coldest-morning-of-winter-for-nsw-alps/526602

Coldest morning of winter for NSW Alps

Rob Sharpe, Sunday July 16, 2017 - 14:57 EST

In Thredbo, Perisher and Cooma, this morning was the coldest it has been all winter.

The coldest location was Perisher Valley, where the mercury tumbled to -12 degrees soon after sunrise. At Thredbo it was -10.4 degrees, making it colder than any other morning so far this season.

The most startling was Cooma, which had it's coldest July night in six years, dropping to -9.7 degrees.

Elsewhere in NSW it was a little warmer than forecasts suggested earlier in the week as the coldest air with this event stayed a little further south.

Winds will pick up over the ranges tonight in anticipation of a cold front, meaning that temperatures won't quite be so cold. However for those outdoors the wind will probably help make it feel colder.

- Weatherzone

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:18pm

BOOM>!!

caught red handed...

Climate Change Global Temperatures Plummet as BOM Australia Hides Away Data Capture

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TPC6LOvFmg

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:20pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 7:49pm:

Lies like this make up most of the videos. Bullshit makes up the balance.

And then of course Jovial Monk posts "facts", which turn out not to be true.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:26pm

Oh dear, so much fuss, was it -10°C or -10.4°C??

Does anybody really care?

I imagine BoM has some quality control checkpoints here and there. What the temperature was, even if it was -12°C is of absolutely no concern to anyone except little boobies wanting to pretend AGW isn’t cooking the planet.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:32pm

The Heartland Institute paid shill, JoNova, wrote a blog about a thermometer reading 127°F (or whatever) some time in the 1800s but really WHO FLIPPING CARES?

The thermometer was maybe in the sun for part of the day? But single hot days here or there in the late 1800s are not the point.

What are large tracts of the world experiencing over long periods of time? How are temperatures trending? Not individual readings here or there.

And even looking at individual readings: how are hot and cold records trending?

They are trending to increasing temperatures. Goulburn had one night a bit chillier than normal? MOST of the contiguous US states had a VERY WARM WINTER!

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:33pm

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:18pm:

BOOM>!!

caught red handed...

Climate Change Global Temperatures Plummet as BOM Australia Hides Away Data Capture

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TPC6LOvFmg

Yes it's a good video & shows how Monk's ideas
are based on fabricated evidence.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:36pm

It is not a good video because it is made by a paid liar.

Posts about GHG molecules absorbing IR photons go right over your flat head, don’t they, Boobhead?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:58pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 8:32pm:

The Heartland Institute paid shill, JoNova, wrote a blog about a thermometer reading 127°F (or whatever) some time in the 1800s but really WHO FLIPPING CARES?

Got credible proof or is this another of your "facts"?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:03pm

IPCC lies and dud predictions that never come true and those who made the dud predictions are never held to account... >:(

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oODkLTizy0

meanwhile in NZ...

people are getting trapped and cut off due to record snowfalls...

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:10pm

ahahahaha what bullshit some flatheaded m0re ons love to believe. I guess AGW is frightening to contemplate, but real men don’t shy from difficult problems. Only scared little eunuchs do that: Boobhead, Loser Lees, The Moronic, Ajax and so on.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:24pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:10pm:

but real men don’t shy from difficult problems.

Then why do you shy from statements that you make up "facts"?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:38pm

These clown being so upset by Goulburn going as cold as -10.4°C make me laugh.

Most of the continental US was many degrees above freezing instead of below freezing the last NH winter. But don’t talk about that, talk about if Goulburn was -10.4°C or only 10°C one night.

If you think about the display of mass stupidity you could despair.

But I do not despair. A stupid little factoid—who the hell cares?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:48pm

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:49pm

Now Boobhead is copying others’s posts because Boobhead has NOTHING!

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:58pm

Heh, didn’t take long to refute the OP.

Like I keep saying, we can see AGW in action, the retreating glaciers, the ice loss from Greenland, the ice loss from Antarctica, the thinning Arctic sea ice etc.

Quibbling over a temperature reading here or there, quibbling about homogenisation means nothing in the face of the self evident warming we see. Like nearly all of the continental US having a WARM winter, not one with below freezing weather.

The world is warming up and that is that.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 6:23am

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:38pm:

you are either just stupid or deflecting..

no one cares what temperature it was...

what is important... is that they are fraudulently adjusting temperatures like the one above...

caught out red handed...

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by bogarde73 on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 6:47am

Global normalcy deniers have no clothes!

Can we now have an enquiry to find out where the big money came from and who were the projected big beneficiaries?

Qui bono?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 6:57am

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 6:23am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:38pm:

Just proves that Jovial is biased.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Ajax on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 8:48am

If your a corporation who deals energy today, you in the money, times couldn't be better.

You receive billions of dollars in government subsidies for fossil fuel energy.

You also receive billions of dollars of government subsidies for clean energy.

They're making a killing, times couldn't be better.

Government subsidies = Tax payers money

BTW they also increase consumer prices at will again making a killing.

Anthropogenic Global Warming is the vehicle that made all the above possible............ :D

The oligarchy swindle the plebs once again with the help of our government.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:15am

Meantime sea levels just keep rising due to AGW:

Tidal gauge data.

RATE OF CHANGE
3.4 millimeters per year margin: ±0.4

https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/sea-level/

If we were in an ice age sea levels would be falling.

But we are not in an ice age, are we?

1. Glaciers, nearly all of them, keep retreating.

2. Arctic and Antarctic sea ice extent is shrinking

3. The three main land based ice sheets, Greenland, Antarctica and the Himalayan, are all shrinking.

4. Most of the NH had a mild winter, parts, most of US and Canada had a warm winter.

But let us worry if Goulburn was -10.4°C or -10°C. Let us concentrate on a bit of summer snow falls here or their. Well, you do that if you are brain damaged.

Larsen C is in the process of breaking up like Larsen A& B. These broke up and have not reformed meaning glaciers now melt ever more quickly into warming ocean where ice sheets used to be.

Thwaites glacier is retreating. There is some doubt about how fast but Thwaites by itself can increase sea levels by 1m.

I would rather look at that than a couple slightly colder nights at half a dozen alpine towns in winter.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 11:35am

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:15am:

1. Glaciers, nearly all of them, keep retreating. Some are not? How can this be GLOBAL warming?

2. Arctic and Antarctic sea ice extent is shrinking. Only when you take into account Antarctica just lost a bit, which wasn't due to AGW.

3. The three main land based ice sheets, Greenland, Antarctica and the Himalayan, are all shrinking. Citation required

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:18pm

Bobby. wrote on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 6:57am:

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 17^th, 2017 at 6:23am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 9:38pm:

Just proves that Jovial is biased.

yes...

see how he ignores/deflects any evidence of tampering and fraudulent dealings with these Political Warmists?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:23pm

I imagine the BuMet has quality control checks in place.

In any case, .4°C and you think there is a case for anything? :D :D :D :D

Yes, Loser Lees, a few high latitude glaciers in favorable position wrt prevailing winds benefit from the extra evaporation/precipitation caused by AGW. They actually grow, slightly.

Most glaciers are in headlong retreat, but focus on the handful that don’t if it makes you feel comfortable.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:37pm

lee wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 11:35am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:15am:

No, Antarctica is losing land based ice. The glaciers formerly ending on the Larsen A & B ice shelves are now ending in ocean and are shedding ice. West Antarctic glaciers like Pine Island and Thwaites are also losing land based ice.

So are the Himalayan and Greenland land based ice sheets. So is sea ice extent at both poles. All this documented in the Environment board. Of course, to find the articles documenting all this will take lots of wading through the bullshit, deflection and obfuscation Loser Lees always posts. If you don’t want to do all the wading, have a look at NASA, NOOA, ice and snow centre, BuMet etc sites.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:43pm

So, The Moronic and Boobhead. You say we are in an Ice age. Please tell me then:

1. Why are glaciers in retreat?

2. Why has Arctic sea ice decreased in thickness and extent? Why is there so little multiyear ice?

3. Why is the Himalayan ice sheet in retreat? The meltwater from this waters a quarter of the world’s population via rivers like the Ganges, Yellow River and Mekong.

4. Why is Antarctic sea and land ice in decline? I suggest you search “Thwaites Glacier” and “Amundsen Sea”

5. Why are sea levels rising? In an Ice Age sea levels fall. But tide gauge and satellite data confirms sea levels are rising and at an increased rate.

Try arguing this rationally, point by point.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:56pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 12:43pm:

5. Why are sea levels rising? In an Ice Age sea levels fall. But tide gauge and satellite data confirms sea levels are rising and at an increased rate.

Why was the acceleration higher 1930-1960, before AGW?

"Both observations and models have a maximum rate of rise in the 1930–1950 period, a minimum rate in the 1960s and a maximum rate over the last two decades (Figure 13.7b)."

https://www.ipcc.ch/pdf/assessment-report/ar5/wg1/WG1AR5_Chapter13_FINAL.pdf

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:01pm

Or perhaps you like this

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:10pm

So there was a pause but now sealevels are rising faster than recorded previously?

They are now rising at 3.3mm a year.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:31pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:10pm:

So there was a pause but now sealevels are rising faster than recorded previously?

Not distinguishable from 1930 -1960. Why is that? Natural variation? ;)

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:10pm:

They are now rising at 3.3mm a year.

Only in the satellite data. Remember Jason 2?

"Sea surface height accuracy is currently 3.4 centimetres, with 2.5 expected in the future."

https://www.eumetsat.int/jason/print.htm#page_1.3.0

So they are using a satellite "data" that has errors more than 10 times more than the measured "data". ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:56pm

I remember a paper I posted caused you to don the brown underpants. Talking about the acceleration in sea level rise. You then posted some unrelated paper, dunno why.

It is obvious AGW started some time in the 18th or 19th centuries. There is natural variation in the various readings—we know the combination of the PDO and ADO that saw a reduction in Arctice sea ice. When that refroze we expect sea level rise would have reduce.

That is natural variation. The increase in temperatures, the acceleration of sea level rise is not natural, it is manmade, AGW.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 2:13pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:56pm:

It is obvious AGW started some time in the 18th or 19th centuries. T

So you disagree with the IPCC and climate scientists?

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 1:56pm:

the acceleration of sea level rise is not natural,

From 1930-1960? :D :D :D :D :D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 4:03pm

The acceleration of sea level rise is not natural. Greenland and Antarctica are shedding ice because of AGW.

This is all clear, kids doing fifth grade science can understand it. Why can’t you, Loser Lees?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 5:43pm

What about the early 20th century sea level rise? Stop hiding.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:07pm

You do agree Greenland and Antarctica are shedding ice?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:18pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:07pm:

You do agree Greenland and Antarctica are shedding ice?

Greenland has until recently. The current melt season is putting shivers up the tails of the Alarmists.

You do expect Greenland to lose ice in Summer?

Antarctica? Are you including Larsen C, which is not due to AGW? What is the net loss from Antarctica? The latest I see is some say losing some say gaining. I guess you only look for the loss side.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:41pm

That is still Greenland losing ice, from the top of the icesheet. We know it has lost a humungous amount of ice at sea level.

So now is Antarctica. So sea level rise is accelerating.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:46pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:41pm:

That is still Greenland losing ice, from the top of the icesheet. We know it has lost a humungous amount of ice at sea level.

And less than normal. Doesn't sound like acceleration.

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 6:41pm:

So now is Antarctica. So sea level rise is accelerating.

No citation I see. More "facts" from the JM ~~Junk~~ "fact" file.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 7:46pm

Plenty citations in the environment board, not my fault you run screaming away.

Thwaites Glacier, that goes, BOOM 1m sea level rise.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 8:30pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 7:46pm:

Plenty citations in the environment board, not my fault you run screaming away.

You just forget the others

"NASA Study: Mass Gains of Antarctic Ice Sheet Greater than Losses"

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/nasa-study-mass-gains-of-antarctic-ice-sheet-greater-than-losses
;)

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 7:46pm:

Thwaites Glacier, that goes, BOOM 1m sea level rise.

Ah speculation. Got money on it?

"The melt rate of West Antarctica's Thwaites Glacier is an important concern, because this glacier alone is currently responsible for about 1 percent of global sea level rise. A new NASA study finds that Thwaites' ice loss will continue, but not quite as rapidly as previous studies have estimated."

"The glacier has the potential to add several inches to global sea levels."

https://phys.org/news/2017-06-thwaites-glacier-ice-loss-quickly.html#jCp

OHH, only inches. ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 9:22pm

Depends on the speed it collapses.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 9:25pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 9:22pm:

Depends on the speed it collapses.

lee wrote on Jul 18^th, 2017 at 8:30pm:

"The glacier has the potential to add several inches to global sea levels."

https://phys.org/news/2017-06-thwaites-glacier-ice-loss-quickly.html#jCp

OHH, only inches. ;D ;D ;D

The potential for melt depends on the rate of collapse? ;D ;D ;D ;D
The potential for melt is the entire glacier. It contains only so much ice. It won't matter how fast it melts, once it has all gone it will be all gone.

But you can always quote Rolling Stone, right? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:20am

Of course. Depends on the time frame talked about.

Estimates have been 2' to 1m.

Then we have the other West Antarctica marine terminating glaciers. They all give way we have 10' of sea level rise.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 11:37am

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:20am:

Of course. Depends on the time frame talked about.

No. A glacier can only melt as much ice of which it is composed. It can't melt more.

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:20am:

Estimates have been 2' to 1m.

Actually the reference I provided said inches. The reference you provided from the garudian said 2'. You exaggerated to 1 metre.

Quote:

Quote:

The study honed in on the Thwaites glacier – a broad glacier that is part of the Amundsen Sea. Scientists have known for years that the Thwaites glacier is the soft underbelly of the Antarctic ice sheet, and first found that it was unstable decades ago.

The University of Washington researchers said that the fast-moving Thwaites glacier could be lost in a matter of centuries. The loss of that glacier alone would raise global sea level by nearly 2ft.

Thwaites also acts as a dam that holds back the rest of the ice sheet. Once Thwaites goes, researchers said, the remaining ice in the sheet could cause another 10 to 13ft (3-4m) of global sea-level rise.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/may/12/western-antarctic-ice-sheet-...

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:20am:

Then we have the other West Antarctica marine terminating glaciers. They all give way we have 10' of sea level rise.

IF they all melt. ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 11:39am

JM says - Loser Lees was dropped on his head on too many times as a baby.

Yet he is the one who maintains a glacier can melt more ice than it contains.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 4:06pm

Will take a long time to melt. Sea level rise from it depends on what time you base your estimate on.

Not hard to understand if you have a bit of reasoning ability.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 4:48pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 4:06pm:

Will take a long time to melt.

Agree. The garidian article said centuries and phys.org said it was melting slower.

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 4:06pm:

Sea level rise from it depends on what time you base your estimate on.

Except that it can't be more than the ice mass of the glacier. That is its potential capability.

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 4:06pm:

Not hard to understand if you have a bit of reasoning ability.

But you finally got there. ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:24pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:09pm:

We still had most of the US above freezing instead of below it last NH winter.

The NH is still suffering heatwaves, extreme weather events and wildfires this NH summer.

We are still having a very mild winter.

I doubt all this will come to very much at all.

Greenland and the Antarctic are still contributing to sea level rise as is the thermal expansion of the heating oceans.

I will have a look at it but I bet this does not mean what The Moronic thinks it does.

wrong again..

Snow in July and caught red handed corruption from NOAA, NASA and Hadley CRU...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWoabXwIiGw

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:33pm

Summer snow is reasonably common. Means nothing. Happens in the Australian and NZ Alps too.

See the discussion of the Thwaites glacier? Even Lees admits it is melting and will cause sea level rise.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:41pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:33pm:

Summer snow is reasonably common. Means nothing. Happens in the Australian and NZ Alps too.

See the discussion of the Thwaites glacier? Even Lees admits it is melting and will cause sea level rise.

you've been exposed as a fraud and a liar like NOAA, NASA and Hadley CRU....

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Karnal on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:49pm

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:41pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:33pm:

Summer snow is reasonably common. Means nothing. Happens in the Australian and NZ Alps too.

See the discussion of the Thwaites glacier? Even Lees admits it is melting and will cause sea level rise.

you've been exposed as a fraud and a liar like NOAA, NASA and Hadley CRU....

You don't need your usual weak krap, Mechanic. I checked out your unsourced post. I did your work and Googled it.

For once, it actually holds up. It's a good paper. If you could understand it, you could use facts to argue your case.

Have you considered this? Lee is running rings around you because he does just this.

This is a pity. We could have a decent debate if you could only be bothered to read.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 10:07pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:33pm:

See the discussion of the Thwaites glacier? Even Lees admits it is melting and will cause sea level rise.

Actually I did nothing of the sort. I said that was what the paper said, IF it continues. Of course it could all turn around tomorrow.

You keep projecting. So how much would sea level rise? The garudian says 2 feet. The new paper says several inches, you say 1 metre. And that is if the whole glacier melts.

Why do you keep exaggerating?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 10:25pm

President Elect, The Mechanic wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 9:24pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 16^th, 2017 at 1:09pm:

wrong again..

Snow in July and caught red handed corruption from NOAA, NASA and Hadley CRU...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWoabXwIiGw

Actually, talking about corruption of data, Dubyne told a wopper!

Coldest ever temperature in the northern hemisphere -33°C (recorded on the summit of Greenland.) Idiotic, a minute with Google and I found that Greenland got down to -66°C some time in the ’50s. Big lie.

All this “caught redhanded” crap is just an argument about homogenisation. The world is clearly warming and all three major ice sheets are melting and retreating.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 10:37pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 19^th, 2017 at 10:25pm:

Coldest ever temperature in the northern hemisphere -33°C (recorded on the summit of Greenland.)

Really? What is the summit of Greenland? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm

So idiotic, ooh, bai goom, we be in ice age we be!

So why is the Arctic sea ice decreasing in extent and thickness? No answer from any of the ice age drongoes.

Why is Antarctica sea and land ice reducing in extent?

Why is the Himalayan ice sheet reducing in extent?

Why is sea level still rising, even accelerating recently. Even The Moronic should be able to work out that in an ice age sea water gets locked up into ice and sea levels drop. They are rising, ever faster.

Why are there so many wildfires every summer? Why are wild fire seasons lengthening?

Fires in Aust & Chile last summer.

Fires in Portugal and Spain this NH summer. Also the US, Siberia, China etc.

Fires in West Canada:

Quote:

Australia is sending 50 firefighters and Canada is deploying military aircraft to battle rapidly spreading wildfires in British Columbia that have forced 39,000 people in the Canadian province from their homes.

Key points:

Canada's wildfires expected to worsen
Australian military sent two planes, five helicopters to help with evacuations and first responder transportation

British Columbia announced $100 million in emergency funds
Public Safety Minister Ralph Goodale said the western province had made two requests to the Federal Government for military assistance to fight the fires, which were expected to worsen.

The military has sent two planes and five helicopters to help with evacuations and transportation for first responders, according to the Department of National Defence.

British Columbia chief fire information officer Kevin Skrepnek said the Australians were due to arrive on Wednesday.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-18/australia-to-send-firefighters-to-battle-wild-fires-in-canada/8721024

Only a brain damaged m0re on, congenital idiot or someone hopelessly lost in conspiracy theory thinking would think we are in an ice age now. The Dubyne videos are rubbish. Nobody has yet found that galactic cosmic rays cause clouds, etc. He lies too, all the bloody time: the fox was frozen by a farmer, not flash frozen in the Danube, veges were rationed in UK supermarkets early this year not because of a non-existent ice age but because of the fields of Murcia and Valencia in Spain, that grow 80% of Europes winter veges, had been hit with so much rain the fields were unworkable.

But I love Dubyne’s explanation for the very hot NH summer: the jetstream has been weakened and is meandering (due to AGW which the liar Dubyne did not say) and so allowed Arctic air into mid latitudes WARMING them! ;D ;D ;D

Of course, liar Dubyne did not spell it out like that and the brainless sheep following him swallowed without a protest the thought of Arctic air, allowed into the mid latitudes by the meandering Jet Stream, causing a hot summer ;) Loony toons!

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:34pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Why is Antarctica sea and land ice reducing in extent?

Citation needed

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Why is the Himalayan ice sheet reducing in extent?

Some is, some isn't. How strange.

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Why is sea level still rising, even accelerating recently.

You mean using satellite altimetry that has accuracy in centimetres and they are talking millimetres in sea level rise?

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Why are there so many wildfires every summer?

Why is this supposed to be new?
Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Why are wild fire seasons lengthening?

You mean compared to 1970? Why not use the whole data length?

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Fires in Aust & Chile last summer.

Fires in Portugal and Spain this NH summer. Also the US, Siberia, China etc.

And it has never happened before?

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

Fires in West Canada:

So were these "wild" fires deliberately lit? or do they have mommy issues?

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 4:36pm:

e jetstream has been weakened and is meandering (due to AGW which the liar Dubyne did not say) and so allowed Arctic air into mid latitudes WARMING them!

You know the meandering jet stream goes back to before 1880 when your version of AGW starts?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:40pm

You didn’t think it funny that the weakened, meandering Jet Stream allowed Arctic air into mid latitudes causing the very hot NH summer?

You so dead set against allowing any info on AGW to breach your defences that you have lost your sense of humor? How sad ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:43pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:40pm:

ou didn’t think it funny that the weakened, meandering Jet Stream allowed Arctic air into mid latitudes causing the very hot NH summer?

You do understand the meaning of meandering?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:45pm

You don’t see the humor in the implicit claim Arctic air caused a very hot NH summer? Really? ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 6:17pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:45pm:

You don’t see the humor in the implicit claim Arctic air caused a very hot NH summer? Really?

So you don't understand the meaning of meandering.

If cool air meanders down somewhere, then its place has to be taken at the periphery. That would generally mean warm air meandering up to replace it. ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 6:26pm

"Natural catastrophes worldwide were less devastating in the first half of 2017 than the average over the past 10 years, reinsurer Munich Re said Tuesday, while highlighting the role of climate change in severe US storms."

https://www.yahoo.com/news/natural-disasters-less-devastating-2017-munich-103904188.html

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:14pm

Its bad here and over there it was worse.

Wildfires killed 60 in Portugal. Yeah everything was hunky dory.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:16pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:14pm:

Its bad here and over there it was worse.

Wildfires killed 60 in Portugal. Yeah everything was hunky dory.

Now link it to AGW.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:21pm

Spectrometry. Greenhouse effect.

There, done.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:23pm

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 8:36pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:21pm:

Spectrometry. Greenhouse effect.

There, done.

You do know that doesn't prove AGW.

So tell us again how that greenhouse works. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 8:40pm

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 8:44pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 8:40pm:

Bringing this to the front again.

Rocky, what a horror

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pah4O_6elJI
;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 8:45pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:14pm:

Its bad here and over there it was worse.

Wildfires killed 60 in Portugal. Yeah everything was hunky dory.

oh dear god.. a fire?

oh wow... that has never happened before :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

they had one last year as well.. arson..

Global Warming made the arsonist light the fire.. :D :D :D :D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by AnotherJourneyByTrain on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:03pm

lee wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 6:17pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 5:45pm:

You don’t see the humor in the implicit claim Arctic air caused a very hot NH summer? Really?

W e h a v e a t r u e G e n i u s on our hands ::)

Next thing you know lee will be telling us all about advection of heat ;D

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:05pm

Yeah, a fire. Portugues wildfire season is now 5 months long not two months like before.

The number and size of wildfires is increasing. That is why I mentioned wild fires.

Care to have a go about the retreat of the ice sheets both land and sea?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by AnotherJourneyByTrain on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:06pm

lee wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 8:36pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 7:21pm:

Spectrometry. Greenhouse effect.

There, done.

You do know that doesn't prove AGW.

So tell us again how that greenhouse works. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

...you actually have to disprove in science: something lee refuses to acknowledge as fact!

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:08pm

TheFunPolice wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:06pm:

.you actually have to disprove in science: something lee refuses to acknowledge as fact!

Yes, I do admit that. Now tell that to JM. ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by AnotherJourneyByTrain on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:09pm

Higher temperatures mean drier vegetation and more lightning. And in a combination of scenarios involving computer models of atmospheric circulation and carbon emissions through the end of the century, scientists from Canada’s government and the University of Alberta found that would mean large increases in the number of fires “where existing suppression resources become ineffective.”
“They’re extreme fires that are uncontrollable, at least for a period of time,” said Mike Flannigan, a professor of wildland fire at the University of Alberta and a co-author of the new study.
Think of the 1.5 million-acre blaze that ripped into the Alberta city of Fort MacMurray in 2016, sending tens of thousands of people fleeing through smoke so thick they could barely see the roads. Or the quarter-million acre Rim Fire in northern California three years earlier. Or the swift-moving fires that killed more than a dozen people in Gatlinburg, Tennessee, in November — and more than 60 in Portugal in June. Once a fire reaches a certain intensity, firefighters can’t work on the ground, and even aircraft are little help.

source: https://www.seeker.com/earth/climate/uncontrollable-wildfires-could-double-in-canada-due-to-climate-change

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by AnotherJourneyByTrain on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:10pm

lee wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:08pm:

TheFunPolice wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:06pm:

.you actually have to disprove in science: something lee refuses to acknowledge as fact!

Yes, I do admit that. Now tell that to JM. ;)

No you don't.... we all know that :)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:12pm

TheFunPolice wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:10pm:

No you don't.... we all know that

Perhaps you should tell JM, in words of one syllable, the null hypothesis.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:14pm

TheFunPolice wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:09pm:

And in a combination of scenarios involving computer models of atmospheric circulation and carbon emissions through the end of the century, scientists from Canada’s government and the University of Alberta found that would mean large increases in the number of fires “where existing suppression resources become ineffective.”

Oh, Computer models. ;)

You do know faster computers just means the results come out faster. GIGO Garbage In Garbage Out.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global EcWarming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:17pm

Excellent post, DRAH!

Wildfires really have been increasing in frequency and size and wildfire seasons have been lengthening. Weird if we are in an Ice Age, logical if AGW is raising temperatures, drying out fields and forests etc.

There is another aspect of AGW is going to kick our butt. There may be two posts in the thread in Relationships on this aspect: it is that important.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:28pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:17pm:

Wildfires really have been increasing in frequency and size and wildfire seasons have been lengthening.

Citation needed,

Not the CSIRO study that only studied from about 1970. The data goes back to 1925.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:36pm

All covered in Environment where you. . .covered it up.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:40pm

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:40pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:36pm:

All covered in Environment where you. . .covered it up.

Nope. I corrected you because you used the CSIRO study.
Why do you want to only use the data from 1973?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:42pm

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:01pm

Still trying to get your bullshit story across?

"Research into the economic impacts from natural disasters now spans many parts of the world. What is evident from studies to date is an increasing trend in the cost of natural disasters over time. The main drivers of the increasing trend are demonstrably socio-economic factors. No study has yet been able to detect an anthropogenic climate change influence. Anyone asserting the contrary now has a mountain of peer-reviewed literature to climb over."

"Senate Standing Committee on
Environment & Communications"

"sub09_1.pdf"

"Professor John McAneney is the Director of Risk Frontiers and a Professorial Fellow in the Department of Geography and Environment at Macquarie University. Ryan Crompton is a
Catastrophe Risk Scientist with Risk Frontiers."

From 2013

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:06pm

Another interesting take -

https://theconversation.com/climate-change-and-bushfires-youre-missing-the-point-19649

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:17pm

Quote:

A new analysis of 35 years of meteorological data confirms fire seasons have become longer. Fire season, which varies in timing and duration based on location, is defined as the time of year when wildfires are most likely to ignite, spread, and affect resources.

In the map above, areas where the fire season lengthened between 1979 and 2014 are shown with shades of orange and red. Areas where the length of the fire season stayed the same are yellow. Shades of blue show where the fire season grew shorter. Gray indicates that there was not enough vegetation to sustain wildfires.

The analysis, led by U.S. Forest Service ecologist Matt Jolly, focused on four meteorological variables that affect the length of fire season: maximum temperatures, minimum relative humidity, the number of rain-free days, and maximum wind speeds. A combination of high temperatures, low humidity, rainless days, and high winds make wildfires more likely to spread and lengthens fire seasons. Jolly and colleagues used data from NOAA’s National Center for Environmental Prediction Reanalysis, NOAA’s NCEP-DOE Reanalysis, and the European Centre for Medium-Range Weather Forecasts Interim Reanalysis.

The researchers found that fire weather seasons have lengthened across one quarter of Earth’s vegetated surface. In certain areas, extending the fire season by a bit each year added up to a large change over the full study period. For instance, parts of the western United States and Mexico, Brazil, and East Africa now face wildfire seasons that are more than a month longer than they were 35 years ago.

The authors attribute the longer season in the western United States to changes in the timing of snowmelt, vapor pressure, and the timing of spring rains—all of which have been linked to global warming and climate change. On the other hand, the easing of droughts in Western Africa and the Pacific coast of South America likely contributed to the shortening of fire seasons in those areas.

In some parts of the world, tough fire seasons have also become more frequent. “The map at the top of the page depicts steady trends in season length, while the map below shows changes in variability,” explained Jolly. “In other words, the map below shows where long seasons are becoming more frequent, even if they aren’t becoming steadily longer.”
While many of the same areas that saw fire seasons grow progressively longer also faced more frequent fires seasons, the two measures differed significantly in some areas. Australia, for instance, has not experienced an increase in the length of fire seasons. However, eastern Australia has seen the years with long and severe fire seasons become more frequent.

Overall, 54 percent of the world’s vegetated surfaces experienced long fire weather seasons more frequently between 1996 and 2013 as compared with 1979-1996, according to Jolly. This amounted to a doubling in the total global burnable area affected by long fire weather seasons. (For this calculation, “long fire season” was defined as a length that was one standard deviation above the historical mean.)

https://visibleearth.nasa.gov/view.php?id=86268

Wildfire seasons lengthening, fires getting bigger.

Sea level rising ever faster.

Something else, too.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:19pm

Temperatures are getting colder:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVLZ2_wxiDI

Temperature Data Faked NOAA, NASA and HadCRU Caught Red Handed (418)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:26pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:17pm:

A new analysis of 35 years

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:17pm:

In the map above, areas where the fire season lengthened between 1979 and 2014

Why do you insist on the shorter time frames? We do have the data.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:27pm

Can you answer the questions I asked Booby or do your skills only extend to watching paid propaganda videos that you can neither explain nor defend?

All three major ice sheets are shrinking

About all glaciers are retreating.

Wild fire seasons are lengthening and the fires getting bigger

Southern Australia is warming and drying out.

Can you explain any of this?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:32pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:27pm:

Links?

At least I give evidence & links.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:34pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:27pm:

All three major ice sheets are shrinking

Some Himalayan ones are shrinking, some expanding and some doing nothing. Is that a symptom of GLOBAL warming?

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:27pm:

Wild fire seasons are lengthening and the fires getting bigger

Since 197. Not the extended time frame. You do know fires will get bigger if they don't do regular burns to limit the fuel load? Remember when you said the hot weather was the fuel? ;)

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:27pm:

Southern Australia is warming and drying out.

Climate changes. Somehow you have to disprove the null hypothesis. Remember what DRAH said -
TheFunPolice wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 9:06pm:

...you actually have to disprove in science:

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:36pm

Bobby. wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:32pm:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:27pm:

Links?

At least I give evidence & links.

Links to Dubyne videos? :D :D :D

All this has been documented in Environment. Latest is the Larsen C icesheet—melted by warm air and water to lose 4m thickness of ice.

Can you answer the questions?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:39pm

Wildfire season lengthening world wide:

Quote:

Over a 35-year period, the length of forest fire seasons worldwide increased by 18.7 percent due to more rain-free days and hotter temperatures, according to research. The study examined weather data from 1979 through 2013 to determine how a changing climate impacts forest ecosystems.

Over a 35-year period, the length of forest fire seasons worldwide increased by 18.7 percent due to more rain-free days and hotter temperatures, according to South Dakota State University professor Mark Cochrane, a senior scientist at the Geospatial Sciences Center of Excellence. The wildfire expert is part of a team of researchers led by W. Matt Jolly of the U.S. Forest Service Fire Science Laboratory that examined weather data from 1979 through 2013 to determine how a changing climate impacts forest ecosystems.

"For things to burn, they have to have the proper conditions," he explained. Four independent environmental factors increase the likelihood of wildfires -- hotter temperatures, decreased relative humidity, more rain-free days and higher wind speeds.

The researchers combined fire danger indexes from the United States, Canada and Australia with three global climate databases to create what Cochrane calls "an ensemble model." They looked at the length of time and areas where conditions were conducive to fires.

Their findings are published in Nature Communications.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/07/150720133631.htm

So, Booby, looks like wildfire seasons are lengthening globally.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:39pm

Meanwhile JM links to -

Huffington Post, LA Times, The Garudian.

But he will tell you he only posts from Science magazines.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:40pm

Booby, disappearing land and sea based ice, lengthening fire season etc—how can you explain that?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:43pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:40pm:

Bobby, disappearing land and sea based ice, lengthening fire season etc—how can you explain that?

Can you explain:

Temperature Data Faked NOAA, NASA and HadCRU Caught Red Handed (418)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:43pm

And sea levels rising, rising ever faster as Greenland and Antarctica melt.

If we were in an ice age sea level would be dropping, wouldn’t they?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:45pm

A shitfight over homogenisation, nothing more.

Poles—melting
Sea levels—rising
Wildfire seasons—lengthening due warmer temperatures.

How can that be, Booby, if we are in an ice age?

Please explain.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:45pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:43pm:

And sea levels rising, rising ever faster as Greenland and Antarctica melt.

If we were in an ice age sea level would be dropping, wouldn’t they?

It is not what the tide gauge data shows. Why is that?

The sea level rise must be lumpy. Only rising where the tide gauges aren't. ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:46pm

Booby?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:47pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:43pm:

And sea levels rising, rising ever faster as Greenland and Antarctica melt.

If we were in an ice age sea level would be dropping, wouldn’t they?

Antarctica is not melting -
parts are getting more ice.

The sea levels will drop as the little ice age progresses.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:48pm

No, Antarctica is melting, net ice loss.

Sea level rise recently accelerated.

Explain all that please.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:49pm

The mechanism of AGW has been clearly demonstrated. There is no real scientific doubt that the world is heating up.

A little ice age would remove a bit of the warming but not all, .5°C cooling is all that would happen.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:50pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:48pm:

No, Antarctica is melting, net ice loss.

Sea level rise recently accelerated.

Explain all that please.

That's not true.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:51pm

It is true.

Antarctica is now experiencing net ice loss. Sea level rise has accelerated and will again.

The Thwaites glacier is retreating and if it “lets go” will add substantially to sea level rise again.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:52pm

So, how can we possibly be in an ice age?

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 10:59pm

Obviously you cannot explain it.

I can.

We live on a warming world. CO2, CH4 and N2O (plus some others) absorb IR photons leaving the surface of our world, being excited by this, spinning etc more quickly. Soon after, the GHG molecule re-emits the IR but it is as likely to re-emit it downwards as upwards. Any IR photons re-emitted upwards may be absorbed by another GHG molecule etc. Net result: less IR escapes to space so warming the world

This has been confirmed by spectroscopy.

The world is warming, getting to dangerous levels before too long too!

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by JaSinner on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 11:02pm

My mate is working in Antarctica atm.
Everything shows 'from them' that Antarctica is experiencing its warmest period on record with the lowest accumulation of surrounding ice.
Record areas of 'Dry land' (no ice or snow cover) have developed. Lots of crevicing everywhere.

Now going by this graph -
It seems the evolutionary era of Hominids/Sapiens developing was during a 'below average/normal' period, similar to one millions of years ago.
So if that's a fact, then the Planet Warming up towards where it 'should be' may indeed be a natural occurrence.
During much of the Prehistoric ages - the Equator was a constant 30C and the Poles 10C.
That kinda sounds pretty neat to me.
Except even in Temperate climates towards the poles - we experience days of 48C.

Humanity is a part of nature, so maybe we are doing exactly what we are meant to be doing - mistakes n' all.

vf8b5l.jpg (37 KB | 32 )

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 11:05pm

Yes, Antarctica is showing signs of ridding itself of a lot of ice on and around it.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Sir Bobby on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 4:54pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 11:05pm:

Yes, Antarctica is showing signs of ridding itself of a lot of ice on and around it.

Grendel wrote on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 10:11am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 20^th, 2017 at 11:42pm:

I think you will find East Antarctica is not gaining much and West Antarctica is starting to lose more and more ice.

Read the link in my previous post.

I think You will find Bobby is right and experts have conceded that point.
YOU though never concede anything you read only alarmist crap and keep regurgitating it constantly.

Quote:

On Sept. 19, 2014, the five-day average of Antarctic sea ice extent exceeded 20 million square kilometers for the first time since 1979, according to the National Snow and Ice Data Center.

The new Antarctic sea ice record reflects the diversity and complexity of Earth’s environments, said NASA researchers. Claire Parkinson, a senior scientist at NASA’s Goddard Space Flight Center,

[quote]A new NASA study says that an increase in Antarctic snow accumulation that began 10,000 years ago is currently adding enough ice to the continent to outweigh the increased losses from its thinning glaciers.

The research challenges the conclusions of other studies, including the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’s (IPCC) 2013 report, which says that Antarctica is overall losing land ice.

According to the new analysis of satellite data, the Antarctic ice sheet showed a net gain of 112 billion tons of ice a year from 1992 to 2001. That net gain slowed to 82 billion tons of ice per year between 2003 and 2008.

Quote:

Zwally’s team calculated that the mass gain from the thickening of East Antarctica remained steady from 1992 to 2008 at 200 billion tons per year, while the ice losses from the coastal regions of West Antarctica and the Antarctic Peninsula increased by 65 billion tons per year.

[/quote]

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 8:02pm

Quote:

Sea ice continues to decline, and the extent of snow cover across the Arctic regions of North America and Eurasia each June has halved as compared to observations before 2000.

The findings come from the Snow, Water, Ice, and Permafrost in the Arctic report, a comprehensive assessment compiled every few years by the Arctic Monitoring and Assessment Programme, the scientific body that reports to the governments that make up the Arctic Council, a forum for issues affecting the region. The last assessment came out in 2011.

https://www.nature.com/news/huge-arctic-report-ups-estimates-of-sea-level-rise-1.21911

We live in a warming world, Booby, not an ice age. There may not be an ice age until the next major one in 80,000 years, that is how much we have warmed the world.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 10:57pm

And they won't tell anyone where that temperature data comes from? Oh dear.

And then models all the way down from there.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 11:18pm

The polar temperatures don't seem to jibe

Source: Climate4you

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 11:35pm

Arctic seems to be warming there. Not sure what you think the graph shows, to be honest.

Hmmm and that graph comes from, gasp!, a blog!

Considering how thin the sea ice is there now and how small the extent of sea ice is now compared to even a few decades earlier the temperature there has to be rising.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:02pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 11:35pm:

Not sure what you think the graph shows, to be honest.

Wow. can't read a graph. I alays knew you were technically challenged.

To enlighten you.
The MSU - sensor aboard satellite
UAH - University of Huntsville satellite temperature data

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 11:35pm:

Hmmm and that graph comes from, gasp!, a blog!

You mean something akin to SKS? ;)

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 21^st, 2017 at 11:35pm:

Considering how thin the sea ice is there now and how small the extent of sea ice is now compared to even a few decades earlier the temperature there has to be rising.

So you disagree with satellite temperatures but embrace satellite sea level rise. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

maybe you would like to review figure 2 at -

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/wcc.277/pdf

which goes out to 2014.

The graph from NSIDC is very clear ;) -

http://nsidc.org/soac/temperature.html

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:22pm

Yup.

Arctic is warming and sea ice is shrinking. Thanks for showing that.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:38pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:22pm:

Yup.

Arctic is warming and sea ice is shrinking. Thanks for showing that.

Wow. talk about thick. Nothing there to do with sea ice.

And the smoothing shows about 0.5C change. Nothing like the 3.0C your picture says exists.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:39pm

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:46pm

Well, you keep on thinking that.

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by lee on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 1:23pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 12:46pm:

Well, you keep on thinking that.

Good comeback. no reference to climate science or "climate science"^TM. ;)

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by The Mechanic on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 8:47pm

oh... lets not talk about this..

shhhh...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFHc7AZCeGU

Title: Re: MIT Researchers Slam Global Warming Data
Post by Jovial Monk on Jul 22^nd, 2017 at 10:33pm

Who cares?

It is indisputable that the globe is warming.