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General Discussion >> General Board >> Religion: force for good or evil? http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1480880518 Message started by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am |
Title: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am
I was raised a heathen.
I send my son to a private Anglican school. Not for the religion, but because it provides a solid education. Personally, I am an agnostic. And I have no problem with spiritual people - those that march to the beat of their own drum that is, and don't follow a religion. I have an American friend who was raised a Mormon. He still believes in God, but he doesn't do religion. He doesn't bash religion either - he says there are lots of people living clean lives in Utah as a result of their faith. Fair point. But I just can't swallow religion. Ridiculous things written in ridiculous old books by ridiculous old men. I don't think God has endorsed Donald Trump, and I sure as poo don't think some sky pixie is looking after me. But if there is a real God, he would have let my atheist grandfather into heaven. Of that I am sure. In your view, is religion a force for good or evil? I urr on the side of evil. If there is a God, I suspect She's mighty pissed off at what's been done in her name. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:28am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
But is it a 'fair point'? How many of them would be living 'clean lives' without 'The Lorrrrd'? Look at Maid Marla - clean living, no potty-mouth, respectful of her elders and betters, politically neutral, a real charmer ... and not a religious bone to her youthful body. Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
Take it easy on the 'old men' bit. Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
Heavy stuff. 'Is religion a force for good or evil?' is a vexed question. It's like getting 10 psychiatrists together to give an analysis of a patient - with them not only giving different answers, but in every case getting it wrong. (It was a very interesting and revealing documentary series from the UK that was very quickly cut short because it was embarrassing the psychiatric profession). |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by issuevoter on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:34am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
Religion does not mean God, it means way of life. For example: I am religious about my Bloody Mary on Sunday morning. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by bogarde73 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:48am
I am sure there are three answers and I'm sure that one of them will be insisted upon by it's proponents as the only one that should be held and the only one that should be taught to the young.
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:41am
It all depends on how one approaches it.
For some religion is a crucial part in their lives, they look to God to help them get by. For others it is a security blanket that they use to try and hide their fears and insecurities. Some use it as a mask to hide behind and Some use it to excuse abhorrent behavior. I am a believer, but I also believe that God does not truly want us to devote our lives to an intangible, but to live well, just and honestly, treat people fairly and with love. It is said, All things in moderation this includes religion. Sure believe, and be honest in your belief, but do not be obsessive. Above all, we must remember that ALL holy books be it the Bible, Koran or Tora were all written by MEN. Men who are imperfect and prone to misunderstanding, and above all, caught in a time and place where things differ greatly from today. These books have some truth in them (God influence) but are also open to interpretation. We should live our lives as our morals dictate, that little voice in our heads (Gods) that reminds us. "That's not right." If we follow this simple rule, the world would be a better, nicer place. Peace to all and Merry Xmas |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:56am Valkie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:41am:
tsk ::) Dear o dear ... How does this stack up to a 'god' that creates a planet in which life for gazillions of creatures over billions of years - and which have pain-sensitive receptors and an ability to feel gut-wrenching terror - survive by hunting down other life-forms for the purpose of terrorising, killing and eating them, or being their victims? A planet in which all the creatures are vegetarians : okay, no moral problem there, but a planet that is red in tooth and claw' and for eons has had the air rent with the screams of terror, pain, and death by gazillions of life forms - is no god of mine, but a rank arsehole in anybody's terms. If god was on trial in a People's Court for crimes against humanity and the mistreatment of animals over the past gazillion years, he'd need a damned good defence counsel to be saved from a slow death instead of a quick one. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:02am Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:56am:
It is your right to believe or not as you wish. Religion, as long as it causes no one any harm, is a good thing for many many people. If you had read and understood the teachings, which I will not bother explaining, (pearls before swine). and no Im not calling you a swine. But mankind was given free will, as a result we suffer the consequences of this free will. Pain, suffering etc. Merry Christmas |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by NorthOfNorth on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:03am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
Ironically you may have answered your own question... Ask yourself (and post back) What is it about the religious school that you believe provides your son a solid education over that which can be provided by a secular one? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:22am Valkie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:02am:
;D ;D ;D (Thanks for the after-thought!) .. and of course not. It never entered my mind that you were calling me a swine who didn't know his pearls from his plastic fakes. Valkie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:02am:
"groan* I wish you hadn't said that. Needless the say the 'Free Will' mantra is god's 'Get out of Jail Free' card for 4.5 billion years of Hell on Earth. Valkie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:02am:
Thank you, Valkie, and a sincere "Merry Christmas" to you too. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:26am Religion: force for good or evil? issuevoter said, Quote:
Is 'our' religion good or evil ? To answer that, we merely need to ask another question; What is inside our own heart ? !!!!!!! Yadda said.... http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1304541795/126#126 Quote:
. Proverbs 14:34 Righteousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people. Psalms 51:7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow. 8 Make me to hear joy and gladness; that the bones which thou hast broken may rejoice. 9 Hide thy face from my sins, and blot out all mine iniquities. 10 Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. 11 Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me. 12 Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:29am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
Education for the masses came from the Church Social welfare was begun and still heavily supported by the Church Our system of law and democracy is found on the Bible Slavery was ended by the church (over the opposition of many) Child prostitution was ended by the church (over the opposition of many) Freedom is a Christian principle. Take a look around all the rich and free countries around the world. They have one thing in common - a Christian heritage. And the reason you sent your kid to an Anglican private school is because.... where are the secular private schools? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Bojack Horseman on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:31am
I think neither, the problem isn't religion, its the people following it. Some are fantastic loving people, and some aren't.
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:44am Yadda wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:26am:
Yadda said.... http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1304541795/123#123 Quote:
We choose. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:51am longweekend58 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:29am:
(Lady Nicole - see my reply elsewhere to these extravagant and highly delusional assertions by Longy. I'm not calling his post 'Junk Mail' of course, any more than Valkie thinks I'm a swine who doesn't know his pearls ... ::) ) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by issuevoter on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:56am
No one can explain what they mean by God, so they fall back on such bogus concepts as Faith. Trying to sell your particular religion, is a sure sign that you need verification from others, and are looking for safety in numbers. Both of which you try to sell for the good of the unconverted.
The number of people who fall for this stuff, is a perfect example of why there is no hope for humanity. Add to that the population explosion, over exploitation of resources, and environmental degradation and you will need more than prayer to save your sorry ass. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:24am issuevoter wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:56am:
I totally agree. As I was walking down the street thinking about nothing in particular the other day, this hit me straight between the eyes like a one-punch fatality. It seems that for the next 4 billion years of sustainable life on Earth, the human brain will always have a part of it where the neural connections and synapses are unable to directly communicate with the brain's Centre of Commonsense and Reasoning - the cerebral cortex. It's a wanky little section of the brain that sees otherwise well-educated, intelligent, and reasonable people who work in the field of science and medicine - going about their day with big black beards, towels wrapped around their heads, hijabs, red dots on the forehead, and sundry other public confessions of insanity.i |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:29am Valkie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:41am:
Valkie, a reasonable post. I do wonder however whether Jesus would have condoned your reference to women as "sluts"? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:30am
Religion developed as a way to control the masses. From witch doctors, to voodoo priests, to catholicism and Islam, it was all about controlling the masses and giving authority to someone who was to weak to take that authority by force (as was the way leaders were chosen in the old days).
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:35am John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:30am:
It is still about controlling the masses. Longy's church managed to sucker $500,000 in donations from the laity from which they could skim a goodly amount off the top for their own institutional sustainability whilst at the same time receiving annual 'grants' from the government to the tune of millions. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:38am Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:35am:
yes and no ... for some religions, like Islam, yes. Definitely, but for others, like Scientology, it's all about money. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:42am John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:38am:
Oh yes. I think we're finally singing from the same Hymn book, John. 8-) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:44am Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:42am:
about time you finally figured out what the right tune was ..... |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:45am NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:03am:
I marched myself on tours through several public schools. Then I took a look at two private schools. By comparison, the public schools were like zoos. I take it from your question that this is due to the chapel my son attends on a fort nightly basis? You may be right, but that's not my view. My view is as follows: Private schools are run more like businesses. Teachers are paid more in private schools, so you get a better cut of teacher. Private schools need to maintain enrolments. Parents don't fork out big bucks to schools that don't perform. This means that teachers who don't cut the mustard will be sacked - something that simply doesn't happen in government schools. And because private schools need to entice parents to pay, things like NAPLAN tests are taken seriously. So are Year 12 results. So, because user pays, a lot of government fat, burecracy, and ineptitude is scuttled. Private schools are employed by parents to do a job - educate. I fork out $14,000 per year. I expect my pound of flesh. The school works for me. That's the deal. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:48am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:45am:
rubbish ..... every study ever done shows there is little to no difference in the level of education kids experience between public and private education. The ONLY real advantage one gains from private schools is the circle of friends their kids surround themselves with. Societies business leaders generally send their kids to private schools, and as those kids grow up they take over their families businesses .... it makes for good contacts later in life when you need a job. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:56am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:45am:
Brilliant. My niece had 8 years in a public school before moving to teach in a non-religious private school. Chalk and cheese. Not the vaguest similarity between the two. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:58am John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:48am:
That's all true, but there's much MUCH more to that. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:05am Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:58am:
yes, your kids are also more likely to get molested at private schools, especially those run by a church |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Culture Warrior on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:10am John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:30am:
Reducing it to power ignores the reasons and ideas that 'the powers that be' implemented. This is the hangover of Foucault, who reduced everything to power, but put in little effort to explain the ideas in amongst those powers. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:14am John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:05am:
I think you might be right there. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by NorthOfNorth on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:26am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:45am:
It should be your view (or at least you should hold to another view) given that you: [olist] have no problem with spiritual people - those that march to the beat of their own drum that is, and don't follow a religion. just can't swallow religion. Ridiculous things written in ridiculous old books by ridiculous old men. [/olist] Or is it that you think your son must suffer what you claim is insufferable? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Raven on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:38am
To quote an old friend
A good man will always try to do good and an evil man will always aspire to evil. But to make a good man do evil things, all that takes religion. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:56am NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:26am:
I've never actually spoken to my son about his religion or lack thereof. His father is trying to raise him to be a good Lutheran - I don't want to split the boy apart. But I'm teaching him to think for himself. It's the best antidote to religion you can get. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by NorthOfNorth on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:05am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:56am:
So you send him to a religious school because of his relationship with father then covertly teach him to reject the principle upon which the school is founded ? Don't you think that's dishonest (not to mention hypocritical) ? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:19am NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:05am:
Wow you put a lot of words in my mouth. I do not send him to a private religious school because of his relationship with his father. I send him there because it gives him the best education my money can buy. Please don't ask me to explain that to you a third time. Teaching him to think for himself, question everything, and explore issues from all angles is neither dishonest or covert, unless free thinkers worry you? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by NorthOfNorth on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:30am Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:19am:
You mentioned his father (in reference to religion). That possibly implied (by way of Freudian slip) that religion may have been part your decision to send him there. I'm more than OK with free thinking... I don't hold religious beliefs myself but I would say that I'm culturally of Irish/European Catholic descent and - by inheritance - sensibility. But I would say that to send someone to an institution whose philosophy and beliefs I could not tolerate would, for me, be an act of hypocrisy... As hypocritical as sending them to an Islamic school. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:38am NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:30am:
Or as hypocritical as Muslims migrating to secular Christian-based countries to gain better outcomes for themselves? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:55am
There are two religions that have caused more problems, more hatred, more death and more torment than anything since the dawn of time.
The worship of MONEY The worship of POWER and the worst is when both combine, as in politics where money and power are worshiped and lusted after all day and every day. There is no perfect church, no perfect religion, but mankind is not an animal. We have self awareness and as such recognize that we are more than just a collection of chemicals and materials. I have no problem with people who do not believe and have never and will never try to convert them. Its their choice and I have no right to interfere, this is whee many religions come unstuck. The prohibit this and prohibit that and they always say that theirs is the best and only god. Its been like this since the dawn of mans self awareness. But, some of us believe, and some never will, that's the truth and only matter. I will not be dissuaded from my belief, you will not become a believer. We should just respect each other as individuals and leave it at that. UNLESS I try to force you, punish you or cause you harm simply because you don't believe or don't believe in my God. Then its a totally different matter, this is when the religion is no longer acceptable. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Culture Warrior on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:04pm Valkie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:55am:
I'd say the biggest killer of the modern era (since the French Revolution) has been the idea of equality. Millions killed, jailed, exiled. French Revolution, all socialist revolutions - Soviet Union, Cambodia, China, Cuba, South America, Vietnam ... |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:10pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:04pm:
I like that. Very good. Equality of outcomes. Every child goes home with a prize. There are no winners or losers, only participants. No need for tears-before-bedtime. In my day only the brightest got into university, but today the universities are stiff with students - some of whom don't even speak English. It's a farce. A lot of them leave university to take up driving a taxi. ;D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Culture Warrior on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:14pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:10pm:
It's a point often overlooked; because, those who currently write history are the biggest supporters of equality. Ask why everyone knows how evil the Nazis were, but knows nothing about the millions killed in the socialist revolutions. It's because it's socialists who have been writing history since the 1960s. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:24pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:10am:
it doesn't ignore anything, rather it simply deals with the reality of it. Something you seem to struggle with |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:32pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:14pm:
The Equality virus infected certain schools in which exams were conducted with students sitting in groups of five or six, and working out between them the answers to questions. At each table, the bright kid (or kids) who knew the answers, meant that all the kids at the same table were credited with a pass mark. It was Social-Marxism by consensus. It's probably still going on in certain trendy private schools. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 1:17pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:32pm:
where do you get this crap from? You realise that your dreams aren't real, right? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Culture Warrior on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:00pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:24pm:
It tells people nothing. Think about it: those in power are bad because they have power. What kind of logic is this? Power is a part of all structures and relationships, so it's a useless point without saying why the people in power are bad. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:03pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:00pm:
No one said those in power are bad ... some are, some aren't , but that's irrelevant anyway. Those in power (within the church) only have power because they have found a way through the use of religion to manipulate people . |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Mr Hammer on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:06pm
Governments love religion because it keeps people on the straight and narrow. Atheists realise it doesn't matter what you do, you won't be judged in the afterlife. It makes one more free thinking. Personally I'm a non believer but if religion is kept personal and doesn't have issues and don't care. When it becomes a problem I'd rather it gone.
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Mr Hammer on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:07pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:03pm:
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Culture Warrior on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:10pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:03pm:
Okay, so now they're bad because they manipulate. Kind of like university lecturers, politicians, opinion makers, columnists, socialists, greenies, and "progressives" who manipulate by omitting alternative perspectives. Gothcha. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Gnads on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:48pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:48am:
Correct Smithy. Many non religious people send their children to private run and or religious schools ... not for the better education ... because they don't get any better education but because they think this puts their kids on the ladder of social climbing wannabes ..... funny thing is there are just as many drop outs or students doing drugs, being sexually active, bullying etc etc and in fact I'd say some of the biggest ratbag boys & promiscuous females went to private Catholic Schools. As far as the quality of teachers & the pay they receive .... they don't get paid anymore .... that's totally agin the private business mantra. Their motto is pay less work more hours. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by NorthOfNorth on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:55pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:04pm:
But then again, from that same ideology, many more millions elevated above their ancestral caste and out of poverty... |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 3:51pm Raven wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:38am:
There is [among many men and women who 'believe'], a common misconception about our creator, the God of the Bible. And that misconception is that God, our creator, intends to forgive every man and woman, ...'coz we are only human'. THAT, is not his purpose. His purpose for mankind has been plainly stated, ....again, and again, and again. Matthew 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things. Matthew 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit. Matthew 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. . Isaiah 48:10 Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction. Daniel 12:10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. Revelation 21:7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. . Raven wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 10:38am:
No Raven. Just an inherent HATRED for truth. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by aquascoot on Dec 5th, 2016 at 3:57pm
the most important thing in life is to have some "purpose in life", some "passion", some "north star".
Then you can easily align all your thoughts words and actions with this purpose. If they help you towards the north star, they are in. if they dont, they are out. Too many people are just in a fog, they are in an emotional soup where they are either just trying to pleasure themselves or to cope...both are leading to a personal disaster. Having a set purpose gets rid of the 3 main "fatigues " which destroy peoples happiness and beat them down. 1 decision making fatigue... going round in circles if you dont have a purpose 2 persona fatigue...managing an impression , seeking validation, people pleasing, supplicating 3 outcome fatigue...getting all butt-hirt when things dont go your way. If you have a direction in life, (if you know it very well), you wont waste time on these "handbrakes". So for some people, an "off the shelf" religious belief will give them direction. They will be happier, achieve more and it will help them move up. Its not neccessary for all people but a lot of people in the Durrrr state of taker mentality and mediocrity would do well to pick a religion, any religion and try to have a bigger view of the world then their own "pleasure" and "coping" |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:07pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 12:04pm:
Comment..... Yadda said.... http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1458861531/0#0 Quote:
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:14pm Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:10pm:
except you're the only one going on about them being bad. :D :D :D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:15pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 2:03pm:
"....have found a way through the use of religion to manipulate people." Or through the use of 'philosophy' and political argument. ......i.e. deceivers, using words, to deceive others. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:20pm Yadda wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:15pm:
no, I'll stick to religion . |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:24pm aquascoot wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 3:57pm:
Good post aquascoot. I've found my "purpose in life". ;) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:28pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:20pm:
John_Smith, You [and those like you] live in, and experience, such a small 'universe', imo. And that is your choice. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:57pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:35am:
When you resort to simply making up crap, what do you think you look like? COmplete tosser? loser? liar? simpleton? It takes a special kind of retard to criticise people who raise a half million dollars for World Vision, Kids with Cancer and Cambodian kids. And let me guess... your total outlay for the poor and hurting is... $0? hypocrite. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:58pm NorthOfNorth wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 11:30am:
Big difference between chapel once-a-fortnight Anglican light, and Islam. They're miles apart. There should be no Islamic schools allowed in Australia. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:59pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:45am:
My point is that while you rail against religion, the best schools in the land are run by the Church and the worst by the secular government. You might even ask why and then maybe you will answer your own questions. And why didnt you choose a SECULAR private school? We both know the reason for that. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:00pm John Smith wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 9:48am:
And yet you cannot find links to credible studies that confirm this. The fact that a significant majority of those that qualify for university entry are privately educated hasnt clued you in. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by NorthOfNorth on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:04pm longweekend58 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:59pm:
Moreover, it seems grossly unfair in its arrogance towards those educators, to presume that the quality of the education they provide is not maintained and enhanced as a direct result of their faith. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:04pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:58pm:
x2 |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Gordon on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:04pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:58pm:
In principle I'm ok with Islamic schools, but then I read stuff like this and take the same opinion as you. Educated at Islamic schools, Bee says she was taught not to mix with other Australian children. “It was very religious. It did not feel like I lived in Australia at all," she remembers. "Every child there was also Arab or from a Muslim background. The day started with praying, it ended with praying. We had Islamic classes as well. It was very religious based, I guess. Even the teachers spoke Arabic to us. They wore the scarf. It just really didn't feel like it was in Australia at all." http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/escaping-child-marriage-in-western-sydney/8023798 |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:05pm
It's funny/sad that the loudest voices on a thread about Church and Christian Schools are mainly people who have no connection with either - ever. Most of the 'claims' made here are manifest nonsense but happily accepted by the remaining buffoons because they dont know it is nonsense and it supports their own preconceptions.
Its not a good look for most of you to parade your ignorance and narrow-minded thinking as some kind of virtue. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by miketrees on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:07pm The fact that a significant majority of those that qualify for university entry are privately educated hasnt clued you in. I cant be arsed finding it but there is a study somewhere that shows once in UNI the private school leavers do not do as well as the publicly educated students. Probably because they are like hothouse flowers put out in the cold |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:11pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:04pm:
- 4. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm longweekend58 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:00pm:
This could simply mean nothing more than that the children of parents who can afford to pay the fees demanded, are mostly professionals who passed on a better set of genes to their kids - and has nothing to do with the quality of education they received at a private school. I myself went to a very expensive private school but ended up nothing more than a factory worker. Go figure. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm Aussie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:11pm:
+ 5 |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:16pm miketrees wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:07pm:
;D Good one. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:18pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm:
Best thing you and Nicole Page 2016 can do for the entire Forum is get a Room and work it out. The sycophancy is just spewish. Blah! |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Ajax on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:20pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
I think religion is force for good, ten commandments is a good morality check for the whole world. I am not religious but I believe in God, the only times I go to church are Christmas and Easter, I try to uphold love your neighbour as yourself but as we all know sometimes it is a hard thing to do. Both my kids went to a catholic school and they turned out all right, I have no complaints, generally they can tell what is right and what is wrong. Without religion and all the donots, I think we would live in a jungle, in other words who can eat who. The way things are going religion is on the skids, in a hundred years religion will be practiced by a minority in the west anyway. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Gordon on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:22pm Aussie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:11pm:
Explain this then. Educated at Islamic schools, Bee says she was taught not to mix with other Australian children. “It was very religious. It did not feel like I lived in Australia at all," she remembers. "Every child there was also Arab or from a Muslim background. The day started with praying, it ended with praying. We had Islamic classes as well. It was very religious based, I guess. Even the teachers spoke Arabic to us. They wore the scarf. It just really didn't feel like it was in Australia at all." http://www.abc.net.au/triplej/programs/hack/escaping-child-marriage-in-western-s... |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:30pm Gordon wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:04pm:
With all that face planting towards Mecca, I suppose they don't get time for irrelevant subjects like maths and Science. And that heathen tongue - English. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:34pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm:
Yeah but there were reasons for that, beyond your control. Your private school education shines through the word mastery of your posts. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:46pm
Again
Religion is harmless until it starts to punish its followers and others for not believing in that religions god and practices. Then it becomes a problem to be sorted out. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:52pm miketrees wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:07pm:
You might want to find proof of that bit of fiction. Repeated studies show better education and life outcomes for private school kids. Like it or not, it remains true. Or do you not understand why so many familes go without to put their kids thru private schools and so many public school parents wish they could? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:54pm Aussie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:18pm:
Why don't you go harass a mod? It's been what? Two days now? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:55pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm:
you can put lipstick on a pig but it remains a pig. Your life failure is quite obvious and leaches out in the embarrassing rubbish of your posts. You are the kind of idiot that private school couldnt fix. They should have sent you to the army where at least you would have learned SOMETHING if only that you are a private in a world of officers. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:56pm miketrees wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:07pm:
I've read that somewhere before too Mike. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by longweekend58 on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:08pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:56pm:
Its the internet. You can read how Michelle Obama is a man and Barack is a reptile. Personally, I would prefer a properly done assessment of that before I gave it any credence. And it doesnt sound credible already. The idiot poster seems to think that every private school student plays polo and spends weekends a the family's weekend place on the Gold coast. The reality is the vast majority of private school kids go to low-fee schools that the parents work very hard to afford and the kids themselves are no different sociologically that public school kids - just better educated and better prepared. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:27pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:54pm:
Two days since what? Your continued abuse? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:33pm Aussie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:27pm:
Man up. It's an adult debate board. Stop being so precious |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:51pm Quote:
Indeed it is a debate Board.....one with Rules which I am constrained by and abide with. The instant I get a 'green card' to freely abuse people like you do, I'll just do exactly that....abuse you back, and I have far better ammo than you will ever have 'Nicole Page 2016.' :) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:57pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:34pm:
Nonsense. :-* |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:57pm Aussie wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 6:51pm:
Go whinge to the mods like the fake lawyer, cab driving pedant you are little man. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:21pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
This is like asking whether ideology is good, or politics, or schooling. Whether a teacher does good work depends on what he teaches. Check out Aussie's Jacycees thread and tell me whether you think that is a force for good. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:28pm Yadda wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 4:28pm:
if that helps you to explain away anyone who disagrees with your world view, then you go for it old boy. I'm sure it'll help you to sleep better. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:32pm freediver wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:21pm:
Oh, she did FD, and came up with this bewdie! Quote:
;D ;D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:32pm longweekend58 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:00pm:
you simply haven't looked for any dopey. An analysis by Monash University education academic David Zyngier has revealed that many state schools with a high Index of Community Socio-Educational Advantage (ICSEA) ranking – including Princess Hill Secondary and University High School – on average perform as well as private schools with a similar ranking. This group of middle-class public schools clocked up an average VCE study score of 34 out of 50 in 2015, compared with 33 in similar private schools. http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/private-versus-public-schools-which-has-the-academic-edge-20160328-gns82d.html Not according to the research. Professor Connelly and his team found that sending children to Catholic or other independent primary schools has "no significant effect" on any of these outcomes. http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/private-v-public-schooling-20150416-1mm8bn.html :D :D :D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by John Smith on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:34pm longweekend58 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:05pm:
making crap up again are you longy? ;D ;D ;D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lady Nicole on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:34pm freediver wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:21pm:
It's a force for good, for sure. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:55pm longweekend58 wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:55pm:
Wow. You really became emotional and spent a bit of time composing that, didn't you? Thanks for the compliment. A bloke getting emotional about me is just so smacking ghey. Do your parents know? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:24pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 7:34pm:
And yet there was Aussie, chanting the mantra, while his mind was other things. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:29pm Quote:
Mindlessly on the mantra. Mind on the Ladies. It's quite funny. Later, I started a massive schit fight at State level in Jaycees 'cause they accepted sponsorship from tobacco companies to finance their State Convention while at the same time, trying stop Members smoking at Jaycee meetings. Came first too, I might add. ;D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Black Orchid on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:33pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:13pm:
x 10 |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:36pm Black Orchid wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:33pm:
x -20. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by miketrees on Dec 5th, 2016 at 8:54pm Studies of university outcomes A number of studies have also analysed the university outcomes of students from public and private schools. The most recent of these found that attendance at private schools does not provide any advantage in terms of academic performance at university [Li & Dockery 2014]. It found that students from public schools performed just as well as students from Catholic and Independent schools in their first year of study at the university. It stated that the findings indicate that higher SES schools artificially inflate their students’ university entry scores (for example, by intensive coaching for external exams) and thus improve their access to university. However, they do not perform as well when they have to work more independently at university. Education Research Brief A Review of Academic Studies of Public and Private School Outcomes in Australia Trevor Cobbold April 2015 SAVE OUR SCHOOLS http://www.saveourschools.com.au This may have been the article I was thinking of. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Raven on Dec 6th, 2016 at 1:13pm Yadda wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 3:51pm:
Which truth Yadda? There are so many different variations, KJV, NIV. One of the oldest biblical manuscripts, the so called Sinai Bible has thousands of differences compared to KJV. Which truth are you talking about? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 6th, 2016 at 11:17pm Mistress Nicole wrote on Dec 5th, 2016 at 5:41am:
I wonder, do you believe this as far as Muslims are concerned? Should they be given the same leeway as Christians? Should Hindus? What about Buddhists? "Nicole", I suspect you wouldn't give Muslims as much freedom as you do Christians, despite the majority of Muslims being peaceful. ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 7th, 2016 at 6:57pm
And what about Nazis? The majority of them did not gas Jews. They just want decent trains, like the rest of us.
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 7th, 2016 at 7:18pm
If Muslims could make the Sydney trains run on time I would say open the gates to more of them.
But Hell will freeze over before that happens. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 7th, 2016 at 7:34pm Raven wrote on Dec 6th, 2016 at 1:13pm:
Raven, Raven, Raven, No one can prove the veracity of what is written in scripture. At least, it would be very difficult for any man to do so, imo. But there is a lot of hard evidence, that the Old Testament document that we have today, has been faithfully preserved over time. How so ? Google; the Dead Sea Scrolls give substantial confirmation that the Old Testament has been accurately preserved over time. Regarding the concepts, ideas, ideals, and thoughts, that scripture is able to convey to a man, ....and what veracity each man places upon that knowledge, .....well that is for each man to give weight to, or not, as they choose. . Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter. Psalms 25:14 The secret of the LORD is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:35pm freediver wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 6:57pm:
The majority supported the "Final Solution". Care to point to me where the majority of Muslims support ISIS? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:51pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:35pm:
How do you know that Brian? Why do you hate Nazis so much? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:55pm freediver wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:51pm:
How does he know, what? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 8th, 2016 at 4:37am Brian Ross wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:35pm:
Source? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Lord Herbert on Dec 8th, 2016 at 4:44am Aussie wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:55pm:
That the majority supported the Final Solution even though it wasn't thought of until the war had already started. Did they conduct a poll of the German people while Poland, Belgium, Holland and Norway were being invaded? Brian is saying that's what happened. Some sort of plebiscite or referendum asking the people if they support gassing Jews and sundry others. "Tick the box YES or NO. Thank you for your cooperation. Have a Nice Day". |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 8th, 2016 at 9:10am Yadda wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 7:34pm:
e.g. Quote:
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 8th, 2016 at 10:16am
I stated earlier in this thread that.
The Bible, Koran, Tora and any other book written by man is tainted by man. Ideas, cultural and time in history will influence any and all text and its understanding. Political machinations, greed, lust for power and just plain stupidity has changed and altered much of the texts and teachings that were originally written. And even then, the books were written, not by those who were actually there, but by men who through word of mouth and passed down stories. However, the overall intent of these teachings is and always will be relevant, assuming one has the capacity to sort the wheat from the chaff, and the good books can be used as a life guide. Only idiots and those without the capacity for understanding take these books literally, we no longer live in the 2nd, 10th or 16th century, and many of the things written have been and still are misinterpreted to this day. But an overview of these teachings reveal that some things are ever unchanging. Evil is evil. God is just. mankind should be good to mankind And we are inferior to God. If we lived simply and loved all and everyone, this life would be true heaven on earth. But Greed, lust, lust for power and the belief that one is better than another is the evil on this planet. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 8th, 2016 at 6:54pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 4:44am:
Brian tries desperately to divert any discussion of Islam or Muslims away from the elephant in the room - Islam. Hence his constant bleating that Muslims are no different to anyone else, implying that the fact that they believe in Islam does not alter their views or actions. Of course, he knows this to be a lie so will not actually say it, so we get this absurd tiptoeing around the issue, with Brian running away when he can no longer avoid it. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 8th, 2016 at 6:58pm freediver wrote on Dec 7th, 2016 at 9:51pm:
Who said I hated them, FD? Dislike would be a better word. I dislike them because of their worshipping of the Cult of the Personality, their racism and bigotry and their desire to dominate others. Hatred is too strong a word. Tell me, why do you hate Muslims so much? Mmmm? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 8th, 2016 at 6:59pm Lord Herbert wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 4:37am:
History books. How many spoke out or organised against it, Herbie? Mmmm? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:02pm freediver wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 6:54pm:
You really have no idea what Islam is or isn't, FD. I don't attempt anything, what I do is make comparisons between the religion of Islam and other religious denominations and their histories, to show the similarities which existed. There is essentially no difference between how Islam has come to dominate the Muslim world and how Christianity has come to dominate the Christian world. ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:22pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 6:58pm:
Brian, Before anyone answers that, why don't you tell us all, ...what is a moslem ? e.g. What relationship does a moslem have to Mohammed ? Does a moslem [every moslem] have reverence for Mohammed, and have reverence for the good deeds of Mohammed ? And if yes, then tell us; What is it, about Mohammed and his life, that the moslem finds so praiseworthy ? Does a moslem reverence the Koran ? Does a moslem believe that the contents of the Koran are the direct words of Allah, and that the contents of the Koran are inerrant ? Does a moslem believe that the Koran should be the guide for how every moslem should conduct his life [e.g. being a guide to the moslem, in his relationships towards those who are not moslems] ? Brian, You ask; "Tell me, why do you hate Muslims so much?" Tell me, Brian, what is especially praiseworthy [to you], about a person who is a follower of ISLAM ? Brian, Q. Why would i want to be a friend or defender, of a person who is a defender and follower of a philosophy, which praises people who are essentially all wanna-be homicidal maniacs ? . Yadda said.... http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1431117115/1#1 Quote:
. CRIMINAL INTENT, IN THE MOSLEM HEART http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1252898491/0#0 Quote:
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:24pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 6:59pm:
How many Australian Muslims have spoken out against ISIS? Probably less than the number who have died fighting for the enemy. And that is in the context of a liberal society that otherwise recognises ISIS for what it is - pretty much the opposite situation to that of a German who might want to speak out against Hitler while he was in power. BTW, what history books? You are making poo up again Brian. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Secret Wars on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:38pm freediver wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:24pm:
I think the Brian Ross doctrine of if not many speak out against it then the majority must support it is about to bite Brian badly. Not as much as his inability to criticise or condemn Islam, that was a beauty of a reveal. :) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 8th, 2016 at 8:09pm Secret Wars wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:38pm:
If you really pester him he will saying something on the negative side of neutral about Islam, but will carefully couch it with equal criticism of Christianity, in case someone mistakes him for a bigot. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 8th, 2016 at 8:28pm |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 8th, 2016 at 9:56pm freediver wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 7:24pm:
Don't you mean, "How many Australian Muslims have been reported as having spoken out against ISIS?" Afterall, you are reliant on what the media tells you and the media in Australia, with one or two exceptions, is highly Islamophobic because that is what Rupert Murdoch is. When did you last go out and ask Muslims their own opinion, FD? Mmmm? ::) Quote:
Any good book about the history of the rise of Naziism, FD. You know, the history books that you don't bother reading? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 8th, 2016 at 9:58pm
Bill Cosby, the rapist? Oh, god, you really do enjoy looking like a fool, don't you, Valkie? ::) ::)
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 8th, 2016 at 10:08pm
So we can't rely on the evidence that can be produced, but we can rely on what Brian reassures us is in all the textbooks, even if he can't produce it?
When have you ever asked a Muslim a difficult question Brian? When we last had this discussion it turned out you were fond of asking Muslims to give you meaningless platitudes. You even found out what Malaysian Muslims really think by an inexplicable osmotic process, which allowed you to reassure us that the people who actually conducted surveys of what they think got it wrong. Do you recall trying to pass off the Pew institute as a right wing propaganda vehicle? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 8th, 2016 at 10:12pm freediver wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 10:08pm:
Gawd FD....really. You ought be the last to point that bone at anyone. How many was it that Mo massacred in that fable upon which you love to found one of your Muslim bashing memes? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 8th, 2016 at 10:18pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 9:56pm:
Absurd! Brian, QUESTION; What is the point of asking the opinion of a group of people, whom you know are bare faced liars ? A group of people who follow a philosophy, which, as an article of faith, justifies lying to those who do not belong to their religious group ? !!!! e.g. Spokesmen for ISLAM will tell anyone who will listen; THAT IT IS WRONG, AND THAT IT IS TOTALLY AGAINST ISLAMIC LAW, TO KILL INNOCENT PEOPLE. Here we have another moslem in the UK explaining, who the innocent people are. ---------- > Please watch this YT... A UK moslem community leader, speaking in the wake of the London 7/7 bombing; Quote:
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 8th, 2016 at 11:07pm
They all knew!
Quote:
Quote:
https://www.scrapbookpages.com/Buchenwald/Exhibits.html [/quote] Quote:
Quote:
https://www.scrapbookpages.com/DachauScrapbook/DachauLiberation/aftermath03.html[/quote] https://www.scrapbookpages.com/sitemap.html |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 8th, 2016 at 11:30pm freediver wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 10:08pm:
Setlanta appears to have answered your question for me, FD. Quote:
FD, when have you EVER asked Muslims their opinion about ANYTHING? Ever? Would you even listen to what they had to say or be like Yadda and assume they were all, automatically, liars? Mmmm? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 9th, 2016 at 12:19am Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 9:58pm:
Shooting the messenger? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 9th, 2016 at 12:21am Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 11:30pm:
Did you read them? Edit: They didn't know Brian. Muslims do know, it's on mass media, internet, wherever you look. Something German citz did not have available to them. Would you agree? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Raven on Dec 9th, 2016 at 1:40am
Religion is what we had before we understood mental illness.
"Samuel a bush talked to me, a flaming bush talked to me" "Brilliant what did the bush say? Let's all live our lives by what the bush said" |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 9th, 2016 at 1:46am Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 11:30pm:
Brian, You present yourself on this forum, as though you are an 'educated' man. QUESTION; Why are you behaving like you are a mo ron ? Dictionary mo ron = = a stupid person. Why are you behaving as though you believe that all moslems are NOT lying to non-moslems ? And why are you behaving as though all moslems are NOT misrepresenting the character of ISLAM, to non-moslems ? Brian, QUESTION; Do you really believe, that a person who is devout enough to insist that he is a moslem, has absolutely no knowledge of what the doctrines and tenets of ISLAM are ? Brian, Mainstream ISLAMIC doctrines teach moslems to have hidden contempt and to have a concealed utter hatred for all persons who are not moslems. Brian, Perhaps you believe that moronic behaviour is contagious, and that we too, are going to believe, what you want us to believe, because you want us to believe it ? THE TRUTH Moslems, are not 'nice' people. Why so ? ------- > Moslems willingly follow a philosophy which preaches hostility, deceit and a justification of murderous violence, towards those persons who reject ISLAM. ....FOR THE SLOW LEARNERS....WATCH THE WHOLE OF THIS SHORT YT VIDEO ----------- > Quote:
Watch a group of moslem children, being coached by moslem adults, to hate Australia, and Australians, ......HERE, WITHIN AUSTRALIA. !!!! ------------- > Muslims brainwash children in Australia -------- > goto 43 sec http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krk5piUzp1E http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krk5piUzp1E . Google; stealth jihad, definition IMAGE... Sheikh Yassir al-Burhami Quote:
Sheikh Yassir al-Burhami - an ISLAMIC scholar and Egyptian Salafi leader http://www.raymondibrahim.com/from-the-arab-world/how-circumstance-dictates-islamic-behavior/ and..... Quote:
. AGAIN..... Denying that fact [that mainstream ISLAM sanctions and encourages utter hatred of all non-moslems], won't make it untrue. EXAMINE THE PURPOSEFUL, CRUEL AND EVIL MOSLEM HATRED AND INTENT, TOWARDS ALL NON-MOSELMS. ------------ > Quote:
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Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 9th, 2016 at 2:40am
Probably because of views like yours, Yadda. They're enough to make most sane men baulk.
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 9th, 2016 at 7:07am Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 9:58pm:
So again. No answer to the truth, so attack people personally. Pathetic peasant, apologist. Why do you continually protect the likes of this primitive, brutal, violent , sick , twisted, pedophile loving , CULT?? What is in it for you? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 9th, 2016 at 8:19am Setanta wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 2:40am:
Setanta, You too ? You think that the words that i speak about the real intentions of moslems, ...are all false, and are simply a slander against all moslems and many 'good' moslems ? You think that when spokesmen for the moslem community in Australia give Australians reassurances about their peaceful intentions, and assure us of their desire to live peacefully in Australia, ....that we can all breath a sigh of relief ? Is that what you really, really believe ? Setanta, People like this [and what they themselves are saying], are a figment of my imagination ??? ----------- > What Normal Muslims Think - And Europe Fails to Understand -------- > goto 41 sec https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIK8bfeLXSw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIK8bfeLXSw . "WAR IS DECEIT" - Mohammed --------- > Google; isis urges uk jihadis to cut beards, shun mosques isis advises don't look like muslim pretend to be christian: isis handbook tells muslims Quote:
. "....take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends.... ......he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them." Koran 5.51 "O ye who believe! Take not my enemies and yours as friends (or protectors),- offering them (your) love,..." Koran 60.1 Google; we smile to the face "while our hearts curse them" . Quote:
Google; taqiyya - the muslim doctrine of deceit |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Raven on Dec 9th, 2016 at 12:27pm Valkie wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 8:28pm: 8% are radicalised? Why aren't we dead yet? That's about 100,000,000 people. If that percentage was in Australia that's about the same as the active personnel of the Australian Army. It's a wonder we infidels are still breathing. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:24pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 8th, 2016 at 11:30pm:
His evidence says they did not know Brian. So on the one hand we have Nazis, who did not know about the final solution, who for some reason you hate. On the other, we have Muslims who know about Muhammed's genocide and who fully support it, who you feel compelled to constantly defend. Brian do you think Muslims should get a free pass on supporting genocide because they built a religion around it? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:37pm Setanta wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 12:21am:
To a certain extent, yes, you're correct, Setlanta. However, everybody knew that Jews were being rounded up and shipped off in cattle trucks and the cattle trucks came back empty. Only a fool would believe that the Jews were going to a green and pleasant land, when it was obvious that something foul was afoot in the death camps. ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:39pm freediver wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:24pm:
You keep using that adjective, FD. I have never expressed hatred towards Nazis. Dislike, yes but never hatred. So, please, stop misrepresenting my views, particularly now I have made you well aware of what they are WRT to Nazis. Quote:
Do you think all Muslims supported Genocide? Really? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:50pm
Have you ever met one who doesn't? This is another one of those questions you steadfastly avoid asking Muslims in case you don't like the answer.
Quote:
Cattle trucks eh? Was this in the textbook also? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Aussie on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:59pm freediver wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:50pm:
FD, Ima not gonna read all of went on in this Thread. I'll start here. Are you a holocaust denier? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 9th, 2016 at 10:07pm Raven wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 12:27pm:
Imagine an Australia with not one single moslem, living among us, here in Australia. Quote:
ISLAMIC culture ? The 'ISLAMIC culture' which Sadiq Khan says, moslems should be free to promote and foster in the West, .....is the very same ISLAMIC culture which encouraged Farhad Khalil Mohammad Jabar, to murder Australian Curtis Cheng]. i.e. Farhad Khalil Mohammad Jabar committed that atrocity against an un-armed Australian because Farhad Khalil Mohammad Jabar was 'rightly offended' by Australian culture. Farhad Khalil Mohammad Jabar....was offended, by the Australian culture, ....which rejected the imperatives of ISLAMIC culture! . IMAGE... Farhad Khalil Mohammad Jabar outside Parramatta police headquarters . JUST REMEMBER THAT; These moslems did not do anything wrong, and they did not do anything illegal - by ISLAMIC law. --------- > MOSLEM 'YOUTH' IN AUSTRALIA FOLLOWING MOHAMMED'S EXAMPLE ---------- > http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-04-09/police-say-two-girls-gang-raped-at-fairfield/5377134?section=nsw 2014-04-09 Quote:
. Now, imagine, .....if not one single moslem, lived among us, here in Australia! JUST IMAGINE THAT........ . IMAGINE..... No Man Haron Monis in Australia, no Lindt Cafe atrocity, no policemen getting stabbed by a 'troubled' moslem 'youth', no Parramata shooting, and no murder of Australian Curtis Cheng, etc, etc. We would not have moslem crime gangs manufacturing and selling 'ice' on our streets, and we would not have moslem crime gangs trying to assassinate their 'competition' on our streets, using illicit Glock pistols. JUST IMAGINE THAT........ |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 9th, 2016 at 10:10pm freediver wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:50pm:
Quote:
[url=http://www.theholocaustexplained.org/ks3/the-camps/daily-life/journeys/#.WEqdMHrXCBs]Source[/url] Quote:
[...] Quote:
[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_train]Source[/url] Quote:
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/sep/09/holocaust-jewish-transports-concentration-camps]Source] You are welcome to do a Google search yourself FD. You may find it illuminating to acquaint yourself with the reality. ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 9th, 2016 at 10:10pm DON'T GIVE MOSLEMS AND THEIR APOLOGISTS A 'FREE KICK', BY ENGAGING IN LAWLESSNESS, OR BY ENGAGING VIOLENT AND ILLEGAL ACTS. Be smart. Be righteous. Yadda said..... http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1409991405/8#8 Quote:
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 9th, 2016 at 10:44pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 9:37pm:
I'm not getting involved to the level some do but I'll always point out something I know to be false, Germans did not know what was being done in their name, hence decades of shame when it was exposed. I know a few Muslims and they are good people, their religion is another matter. Actually I take the same view with all religion, not a fan at all. People I take as they come.<-leave that one alone Greg and Bobby! ;D |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 10th, 2016 at 1:07am
For you Yadda. I hope you find the meaning you seek.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbKQ7nXx0o8 |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Yadda on Dec 10th, 2016 at 9:00pm Setanta wrote on Dec 10th, 2016 at 1:07am:
Thanks Setanta. Q. Was John Lennon one of your 'idols' in this life ? And if he was, then, why would you choose to idolise him ? John Lennon = = A self-indulgent hedonist who sang about teenage self-indulgent passion, about peace and about pacifism. But above all, he was self-indulgent hedonist, who meddled with psychotropic drugs. No ? Q. What did John Lennon achieve ? A. The adoration of a lot of soft-in-the-head wanna-be self-indulgent hedonists ??? Harsh ? Q. Again, what is it, that you believe that John Lennon achieved in life ? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Setanta on Dec 10th, 2016 at 9:09pm Yadda wrote on Dec 10th, 2016 at 9:00pm:
I don't have heroes or idols. There are people that I admire for what they accomplished. When I have been asked this question my answer is someone like Douglas Bader, someone that takes adversity and rips it a new one. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 11th, 2016 at 7:49am Raven wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 12:27pm:
Ill tell you why. Its very simple. They are cowards and deceitful people. Once they have enough of them, then the tide will turn. Look at the examples in France, Germany, Sweden and even England. Once they have the numbers they start getting more and more demanding. They start to be more and more radicalized. They start being more and more violent. This is how this cult works. Just like Aids, it puts forward an appearance that it is benign, and once it has enough, it attacks its host. And just like the disease it is it eventually destroys the host. Leaving a shell of festering decay, just like every single Muslim run country on the planet. Every one living in fear and loathing of the leaders who are continually fighting for power. It is a blight, a disease, a plague on mankind. One that needs to be eliminated before it destroys our culture and planet. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Sir Bobby on Dec 11th, 2016 at 8:02am
THE TRUE FACE OF THE ROMAN CATHOLIC INQUISITION --
ROTTEN SPIRITUAL FRUIT FROM THE ABYSS OF HELL Since history books have been largely rewritten, few people know specific details of this murderous campaign that lasted over 1,200 years, killing 75 million people. But, once you understand the unprecedented horrors of the Inquisition, you will never look at Roman Catholicism the same way again. The Roman Catholic Inquisition was one of the greatest disasters ever to befall mankind. In the name of Jesus Christ, Catholic priests mounted an enormous effort to kill all "heretics" in Europe and Britain. Heretics is defined whichever way Rome wanted it defined; it ranged from people who disagreed with official policy, to Hermetic Philosophers [Black Magick Practitioners], to Jews, to Witches, and to the Protestant reformers. http://www.cuttingedge.org/News/n1676.cfm |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 11th, 2016 at 8:31am Brian Ross wrote on Dec 9th, 2016 at 10:10pm:
[url=http://www.theholocaustexplained.org/ks3/the-camps/daily-life/journeys/#.WEqdMHrXCBs]Source[/url] Quote:
[...] Quote:
[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_train]Source[/url] Quote:
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/sep/09/holocaust-jewish-transports-concentration-camps]Source] You are welcome to do a Google search yourself FD. You may find it illuminating to acquaint yourself with the reality. ::) [/quote] See, that wasn't so hard Brian. Now, where is the bit about "they all knew"? |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 11th, 2016 at 1:28pm freediver wrote on Dec 11th, 2016 at 8:31am:
[...] Quote:
[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_train]Source[/url] Quote:
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/sep/09/holocaust-jewish-transports-concentration-camps]Source] You are welcome to do a Google search yourself FD. You may find it illuminating to acquaint yourself with the reality. ::) [/quote] See, that wasn't so hard Brian. Now, where is the bit about "they all knew"?[/quote] Is that an apology, FD? Afterall, you appear to be admitting that you got it wrong on the broad stream use of cattle trucks to transport the Jews to the death camps... ::) As to how much was known by Germans, do a Google Search, FD. You might find it illuminating. ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 11th, 2016 at 1:32pm
Completely off the subject.............WELL DONE LEFTARDS, YOU'VE DONE IT AGAIN.
|
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 11th, 2016 at 1:34pm Valkie wrote on Dec 11th, 2016 at 1:32pm:
What? No contribution acknowledged from the Rightards who took us off the subject in the first place? You really do wear an eye-patch, don't you, Valkie? ::) ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Valkie on Dec 11th, 2016 at 2:02pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 11th, 2016 at 1:34pm:
Don't need an eye patch, I see how leftards work, and its not good. Now either get back on the subject or get lost. |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by Brian Ross on Dec 11th, 2016 at 2:19pm Valkie wrote on Dec 11th, 2016 at 2:02pm:
The thread goes where it goes, Valkie. You have no authority over me or anybody else. Is FD a "leftard" BTW? ::) |
Title: Re: Religion: force for good or evil? Post by freediver on Dec 11th, 2016 at 6:55pm Brian Ross wrote on Dec 11th, 2016 at 1:28pm:
[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_train]Source[/url] Quote:
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/sep/09/holocaust-jewish-transports-concentration-camps]Source] You are welcome to do a Google search yourself FD. You may find it illuminating to acquaint yourself with the reality. ::) [/quote] See, that wasn't so hard Brian. Now, where is the bit about "they all knew"?[/quote] Is that an apology, FD? Afterall, you appear to be admitting that you got it wrong on the broad stream use of cattle trucks to transport the Jews to the death camps... ::) As to how much was known by Germans, do a Google Search, FD. You might find it illuminating. ::)[/quote] You said they all knew, in a vain attempt to distinguish them from Muslims who somehow don't know what Muhammed got up to. Then when asked to back this up, you said it was in all the textbooks but you couldn't possibly present it here. But then when it comes to a detail like mistaking cattle trains for trucks, you will go to no end to back yourself up. Why is it you are willing to lie about Germans to support your hatred of them, but Muslims get a free pass on supporting genocide. Is it just because Islam is a religion and Nazism isn't? |
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