Why petrol cars could be bad investments   :)

New Daily
Nov 27 2022

Petrol cars are getting a best-before date – and it could be sooner than you think.

Less than eight years from now, the sale of new petrol and diesel cars will be banned in at least nine countries.

Another 10 nations, including China and Japan, will join them by 2035.

By 2040, experts say new petrol cars will be significantly harder to find around the world as manufacturers face increasing pressure to stop production.

In the face of these depreciating assets, some financial institutions are withdrawing from the traditional car market to only offer electric and hybrid car loans.

Others offer significant discounts for loans on low- or no-emission cars.

Industry analysts say federal and state governments should also step in with financial assistance, as some European nations have done, to ensure Australia is not left as a dumping ground for vehicles other countries don’t want.

The call comes just days after the Senate approved a tax cut for electric vehicles – the first policy change in what proponents hope is a series to expedite the transport transition.

Swinburne University professor Hussein Dia says despite Australia’s slow uptake of electric vehicles, there is soaring interest in the technology and a growing acceptance petrol and diesel vehicles will soon be phased out.

“Many people recognise today that their investment in petrol vehicles (will depreciate),” he says.

“In 10 to 15 years time, even if someone wanted to buy a petrol vehicle, I don’t think they would be able to find a new one on the market because car manufacturers are under a lot of pressure to stop producing and selling petrol and diesel vehicles.

“China, India, the UK, France: there is a long list of countries that have policies in place to ban the production and sale of petrol vehicles by 2030 to 2040.”

More than 20 Australian lenders, including Westpac, Macquarie and RACQ, now offer lower rates for loans on electric vehicles, including discounts of more than one percentage point in some cases.

Bank Australia took the trend one step further this year, announcing it would no longer offer car loans for new petrol, diesel or hybrid vehicles by 2025.

The company’s impact management head, Jane Kern, says the bank created the policy after feedback from its customers and considerations of the vehicle market and its climate impact.

“We think supporting customers to buy electric vehicles makes a lot of sense, both financially, because of the running cost of electric vehicles, but also because of the future vehicle value,” she says.

Ms Kern adds reaction to the bank’s announcement has been largely positive and she hopes other financial institutions will follow its lead.

Dean and Lalaine Chase, from Portland in Victoria, recently took out a green loan to fund the purchase of a Tesla Model Y.

Mr Chase says the couple initially considered a diesel vehicle for his wife’s 100km commute to Mt Gambier, in South Australia, but they ultimately found an electric vehicle more financially appealing.

“We did the numbers on whether it was worthwhile and, because of the mileage we do, it is very much worth it,” he says.

“My wife is going to be doing about 40,000km a year and if you calculate that on the average diesel costs versus charging an EV at home, it’s a lot cheaper.”

But while electric vehicle purchases are working out for some Australians, others are finding it hard to overcome the up-front cost.

A survey of more than 5000 Australians by CoreData for Real Insurance found 42 per cent of Australians were actively considering an electric or hybrid vehicle for their next car but 45 per cent didn’t think they could afford one.

Melbourne University senior lecturer John Stone says the high price of electric vehicles in Australia – with few available for less than $50,000 – is holding back the market.

“If we are going to make the change, we are going to need to look at how we reduce costs in the same way that European countries have done in recent years,” he says.

So far, the ACT has led Australia’s transition to electric cars, posting the highest sales in the country at 9.5 per cent of new vehicles in 2022.

The territory also offers a range of incentives to electric car buyers, including discounts on registration and stamp duty, and zero-interest loans of up to $4092.

Good Car Company co-founder Anthony Broese van Groenou praises the policy, saying it mirrors similar incentives in Norway, where electric cars represent more than 80 per cent of new vehicles sold.

He says the federal government should introduce means-tested, low-interest loans for electric vehicles to help Australia catch up to the rest of the world and help low-income families with long, expensive commutes.

“Norway have financing mechanisms that help reduce that up-front cost and people win. We need that here as well.

“It wouldn’t need to come as a cost to taxpayers – it would use our ability to get money at a low rate and allow those who most need it to benefit from that.

“Parts to maintain those petrol vehicles are going to be de-prioritised as well and they’re going to become more expensive to run.”

No normal production car is ever a good investment.

They all cost 20 times what they are worth, they depreciate by 50% at least as soon as you drive it out of the sales yard, they cost a small fortune to feed and maintain and then are virtually worthless 5 or 6 years later.

Most of the people that I know who have always had a very nice car have never had anything else.

In my lifetime I'll never be purchasing an electric car.

Places like Mexico City gave the warning years ago. No diesel engines by 2025. When the wind drops, its a big bowl of toxic gas. They are poisoning people and destroying masonry surfaces. EVs are not without problems though. There is not much advantage while we burn coal to charge them. And then there is the battery problems, and the stupid lead acid 12v necessity.
I don't see ICE vehicles disappearing. Less of them for sure, but the military is not going electric, can you see Ukrainian vehicles on the front line looking for somewhere to charge?

I just bought a new car, its not an EV. Let someone else be the guinea pig.

AusGeoff wrote on Nov 27^th, 2022 at 11:54pm:

In my lifetime I'll never be purchasing an electric car.

I don't have anything against them but at the moment the economy or reliable distance is not there. Would be great for a second family car to use locally but they are priced out of that market. I doubt that I will own one but would not mind if it were to happen.

One of the big shortfalls in electric cars may be the resale market.

Who would risk the likelihood of having to replace batteries in one of these things?

Electric cars could easily be no investment.

See my thread on how dangerous the batteries are:

https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1656844406/0#0

any new car is a bad investment ...

John Smith wrote on Nov 29^th, 2022 at 2:08pm:

any new car is a bad investment ...

No car is an investment - it's a liability.

John Smith wrote on Nov 29^th, 2022 at 2:08pm:

any new car is a bad investment ...

Its not an investment in the first place. If you can't afford a new car, thats one thing, but if you can, buy it and sell it before the warranty runs out. That is how the modern automotive society works. Transport is like food, you consume it. Its not a house.

Dnarever wrote on Nov 29^th, 2022 at 12:32pm:

One of the big shortfalls in electric cars may be the resale market. Who would risk the likelihood of having to replace batteries in one of these things? Electric cars could easily be no investment.

Electric green scooters that have reached end of battery life.

Due to the batteries being so expensive to replace, electric scooters are abandoned because disposing of them any other way is dangerous and expensive.

https://mobile.twitter.com/Xx17965797N/status/1597310309139873792

AusGeoff wrote on Nov 27^th, 2022 at 11:54pm:

In my lifetime I'll never be purchasing an electric car.

Mebbe in the next life, then??

AusGeoff wrote on Nov 27^th, 2022 at 11:54pm:

In my lifetime I'll never be purchasing an electric car.

Yep but that's because you'll still be using what you use right now : your $2.50 pensioner pass.

Bobby. wrote on Nov 29^th, 2022 at 2:21pm:

John Smith wrote on Nov 29th, 2022 at 2:08pm: any new car is a bad investment ... No car is an investment - it's a liability.

Bobby....remember that Frodo has never been able to afford a new car and only ever buys bombs OVER 10 years old 😂🤣😆

Frank wrote on Nov 30^th, 2022 at 10:37am:

AusGeoff wrote on Nov 27th, 2022 at 11:54pm: In my lifetime I'll never be purchasing an electric car. Mebbe in the next life, then??

Yep and with Geoff - it's only a fake id away too 😂🤣😆

I have some personal 'Slaves' who peddle me around and push my car around if I feel like a drive.

issuevoter wrote on Nov 29^th, 2022 at 6:52pm:

John Smith wrote on Nov 29th, 2022 at 2:08pm: any new car is a bad investment ... Its not an investment in the first place. If you can't afford a new car, thats one thing, but if you can, buy it and sell it before the warranty runs out. That is how the modern automotive society works. Transport is like food, you consume it. Its not a house.

it is to some people

No car is a good investment. Cars are a depreciating asset.

DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What about classic cars… on club reg?
So many nice ones!
Car show n shine are popular than ever!

EVs have not been around long enough to justify buying one. As more stories come out, people are going to want some answers. Check the towing range.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nS0Fdayj8Y

Gordon wrote on Nov 30^th, 2022 at 6:46pm:

No car is a good investment. Cars are a depreciating asset. DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have a SS Torana that's worth 15x what i paid for it.

I have always wanted a Ford XC Cobra one of the 31 Bathurst specials went for over half a million.

Classic Australian muscle cars from the 1970s are getting outrageous money today.

The Wankel  Mazdas from that era are doing OK.

issuevoter wrote on Dec 7^th, 2022 at 5:07pm:

EVs have not been around long enough to justify buying one. As more stories come out, people are going to want some answers. Check the towing range. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nS0Fdayj8Y

For long trips these EVs are not practical… a friend came back from USA and was on a long trip in an EV … from destination A  to destination B was meant to be a 8 hour trip but had an added 3 hours on top of the trip with time consuming 3 hour car charging!

Then we have diesel trucks doing interstate long hauls deliveries… how inconvenient or impracticable would going electric be?

Dnarever wrote on Nov 29^th, 2022 at 12:30pm:

AusGeoff wrote on Nov 27th, 2022 at 11:54pm: In my lifetime I'll never be purchasing an electric car. I don't have anything against them but at the moment the economy or reliable distance is not there. Would be great for a second family car to use locally but they are priced out of that market. I doubt that I will own one but would not mind if it were to happen.

One of my friends bought an electric Hyundai/Kia.
he has a big commute and USED put $100 into his car very regularly.

I think his EV will be paying itself off from week 2.

I did some study on hybrids, PHEVs and full EVs.
There are quite significant differences in these technologies. I could well see one of those to suit most Aussies.

Watching Barrett-Jackson USA auction on 7Mate… these classic vehicles are selling for huge moolah!

Beautiful ‘69 chev comaro z/28 just sold $51,000us unreg
So it seems… classic cars will always be up there in value!

We got a couple old cars …  ;D

And a 1972 chev pick up just sold for $100,000us  :o
That’s like $150,000 au

Sophia wrote on Dec 11^th, 2022 at 3:54pm:

Watching Barrett-Jackson USA auction on 7Mate… these classic vehicles are selling for huge moolah! Beautiful ‘69 chev comaro z/28 just sold $51,000us unreg So it seems… classic cars will always be up there in value! We got a couple old cars …  ;D

I know too many people who restored an old car or motorbike
and ended up selling it for less than it cost them - they lost money.
It also cost them more money than buying a new car or bike.

Bobby. wrote on Dec 11^th, 2022 at 4:09pm:

Sophia wrote on Dec 11th, 2022 at 3:54pm: Watching Barrett-Jackson USA auction on 7Mate… these classic vehicles are selling for huge moolah! Beautiful ‘69 chev comaro z/28 just sold $51,000us unreg So it seems… classic cars will always be up there in value! We got a couple old cars …  ;D I know too many people who restored an old car or motorbike and ended up selling it for less than it cost them - they lost money. It also cost them more money than buying a new car or bike.

How long ago was that?
I notice there are fluctuating times when these classic cars hit a low and then they seem to spike in price!
It’s like the stock market in a way…. Which one to choose and how long to hang on.
And sell in boom… not gloom.

I thought of vinyl LP records…. Some many moons ago when CDs came in… records were worth sfa.
.50c to $1 …. $2 if you were lucky.
I decided to keep all mine… plus bought as many popular known ones as possible from garage sales and trash n treasure markets.
I’m glad to say… I have a few that are worth a bonza now!
A Beatles box collection I bought for $70 is now worth between $400 - $700
As mine are in mint condition… I reckon more top end price.

Funny thing… years ago my kids thought we had all old junk… now they say to us… dont throw anything away… it’s collectable!  ;D

Sophia wrote on Dec 11^th, 2022 at 6:35pm:

Bobby. wrote on Dec 11th, 2022 at 4:09pm: Sophia wrote on Dec 11th, 2022 at 3:54pm: Watching Barrett-Jackson USA auction on 7Mate… these classic vehicles are selling for huge moolah! Beautiful ‘69 chev comaro z/28 just sold $51,000us unreg So it seems… classic cars will always be up there in value! We got a couple old cars …  ;D I know too many people who restored an old car or motorbike and ended up selling it for less than it cost them - they lost money. It also cost them more money than buying a new car or bike. How long ago was that? I notice there are fluctuating times when these classic cars hit a low and then they seem to spike in price! It’s like the stock market in a way…. Which one to choose and how long to hang on. And sell in boom… not gloom. I thought of vinyl LP records…. Some many moons ago when CDs came in… records were worth sfa. .50c to $1 …. $2 if you were lucky. I decided to keep all mine… plus bought as many popular known ones as possible from garage sales and trash n treasure markets. I’m glad to say… I have a few that are worth a bonza now! A Beatles box collection I bought for $70 is now worth between $400 - $700 As mine are in mint condition… I reckon more top end price. Funny thing… years ago my kids thought we had all old junk… now they say to us… dont throw anything away… it’s collectable!  ;D

It's a bit like horse racing -
people will always tell you about the horse they backed which won.    :-[