"Ending a ‘deadly addiction’

Mr. Guterres underlined action in three areas to end what he called “the deadly addiction to coal.”

He called for countries to cancel all coal projects in the pipeline, particularly the 37 members of the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) who are urged to do so by 2030.

The UN chief also appealed for ending international financing for coal and providing greater support to developing countries transitioning to renewable energy.

 “I also ask all multilateral and public banks — as well as investors in commercial banks or pension funds — to shift their investments now in the new economy of renewable energy”, he added. "

https://news.un.org/en/story/2021/03/1086132

Of course making solar panels and Wind turbine parts requires much energy. And that energy cannot come from wind turbines or solar.

And of course coking coal is needed for steel. There have been some experiments with hydrogen, but hydrogen can make the steel brittle. And steel is an alloy of iron and carbon.

Some how I cant see these millennials going without their electronics, or can they be so fickle nah dont think so.

As for climate change if enough wind turbines are produced to change the jet stream of the Earth then we will experience CLIMATE CHANGE on a frightening scale, but it will be too late.

And the IPCC and their brethren will be hanged on the nearest tree.

Quote:

Some how I cant see these millennials going without their electronics,

They don't make them out of coal Ajax.

freediver wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 9:05am:

Quote: Some how I cant see these millennials going without their electronics, They don't make them out of coal Ajax.

Electricity comes from coal............... :-*

And you do need that.

It comes from a lot of places. We already reached peak coal in 2013. Have you noticed any impact on millennials and their electronics?

freediver wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 10:35am:

It comes from a lot of places. We already reached peak coal in 2013. Have you noticed any impact on millennials and their electronics?

You mean like we reached peak oil in 2000..... :-*

You saying we're running out of the stuff.......????...LOL

Ajax wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 10:47am:

freediver wrote on Mar 7th, 2021 at 10:35am: It comes from a lot of places. We already reached peak coal in 2013. Have you noticed any impact on millennials and their electronics? You mean like we reached peak oil in 2000..... :-* You saying we're running out of the stuff.......????...LOL

No.

Coal will be replaced by Thorium -

https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1519823686/0#0

Bobby. wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 10:55am:

Coal will be replaced by Thorium - https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1519823686/0#0

Due to past experience around the world, it will be hard to sell to the people.

Ajax wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 10:57am:

Bobby. wrote on Mar 7th, 2021 at 10:55am: Coal will be replaced by Thorium - https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1519823686/0#0 Due to past experience around the world, it will be hard to sell to the people.

Molten salt reactors have been proven to work
way back in 1968.
However it has never been done on a large commercial scale.

freediver wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 9:05am:

Quote: Some how I cant see these millennials going without their electronics, They don't make them out of coal Ajax.

The microchips -Silicon - are made with fossil fuelled energy as renewables are not energy dense enough.

And battery storage? It has been estimated that oil would have to be $30,000 a barrel to be cost effective.

lee wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 11:50am:

freediver wrote on Mar 7th, 2021 at 9:05am: Quote: Some how I cant see these millennials going without their electronics, They don't make them out of coal Ajax. The microchips -Silicon - are made with fossil fuelled energy as renewables are not energy dense enough. And battery storage? It has been estimated that oil would have to be $30,000 a barrel to be cost effective.

Crap.

lee hates change, FD.

freediver wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 12:49pm:

Crap.

Very succinct. Try explaining petal.

Semiconductors aren't made with silicon?

It would need oil prices to be about 30,000 dollars per barrel to make battery storage a cheaper option?

That renewables don't have enough energy density compared to fossil fuels?

All of the above? If so references please.

"London Array wind farm to the south of England.This is the world’s largest offshore wind farm and according to its owners will generate “enough energy to power nearly half a million homes.” Its total capacity is 630 MW covering a total of 100 km2, and is expected to have a capacity factor of 39%. In other words the power density of the London Array will be 2.5 W/m2."

" As a result the highest power density achieved is around 20 W/m2 in desert solar PV farms, whereas solar farms in Germany generally achieve 5 W/m2."

"Power densities are comfortably above 100 W/m2 after accounting for mining etc. And conventional power plants often have power densites in excess of 1000 W/m2. A simple example of this higher power density is this small propane powered generator, providing in excess of 1000 W/m2. This is far in excess of the power density of any conceivable new method of generating renewable energy.  "

https://energycentral.com/c/ec/future-energy-why-power-density-matters

But perhaps you have different figures you can offer?

Ajax wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 8:27am:

Some how I cant see these millennials going without their electronics, or can they be so fickle nah dont think so. As for climate change if enough wind turbines are produced to change the jet stream of the Earth then we will experience CLIMATE CHANGE on a frightening scale, but it will be too late. And the IPCC and their brethren will be hanged on the nearest tree.

What about the high rise buildings being built everywhere and what about the forests being ripped down and what about billions of trees being planted, a few million windy mills is not going to have much of an impact on the jet stream of earth in comparison.

lee wrote on Mar 7^th, 2021 at 1:39pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 7th, 2021 at 12:49pm: lee wrote on Mar 7th, 2021 at 11:50am: The microchips -Silicon - are made with fossil fuelled energy as renewables are not energy dense enough. And battery storage? It has been estimated that oil would have to be $30,000 a barrel to be cost effective. Crap. Very succinct. Try explaining petal.

You are so accustomed to lying that you did not even realise how rediculous this one sounds.

freediver wrote on Mar 10^th, 2021 at 9:27pm:

You are so accustomed to lying that you did not even realise how rediculous this one sounds.

You could of course provide your version of the truth and rebut. With references of course. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

BTW - The South Australian battery, listed as 129MWh cost $90 million.

129MWh is equivalent to about 80 barrels of oil.

https://www.unitjuggler.com/convert-energy-from-MWh-to-boe.html?val=129

One barrel of oil is worth about $US 68 or Aud $88.10

https://oilprice.com/

80 barrels times $88.10 = Aud$ 7752.8

lee wrote on Mar 11^th, 2021 at 5:04pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 10th, 2021 at 9:27pm: You are so accustomed to lying that you did not even realise how rediculous this one sounds. You could of course provide your version of the truth and rebut. With references of course. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Common sense should suffice.


Quote:

And battery storage? It has been estimated that oil would have to be $30,000 a barrel to be cost effective.

Why not use dams to store water or even pump water uphill
at dams when power is cheap at night?
That works as a far more powerful battery to store energy.

Bobby. wrote on Mar 13^th, 2021 at 8:09am:

Why not use dams to store water or even pump water uphill at dams when power is cheap at night? That works as a far more powerful battery to store energy.

They already do. Splityard creek for example has been operational since 1984.

freediver wrote on Mar 13^th, 2021 at 8:19am:

Bobby. wrote on Mar 13th, 2021 at 8:09am: Why not use dams to store water or even pump water uphill at dams when power is cheap at night? That works as a far more powerful battery to store energy. They already do. Splityard creek for example has been operational since 1984.

Fair enough and the Snowy system is being upgraded
to store more water to act as a large battery.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Splityard_Creek_Dam
The Splityard Creek Dam is a rock and earth-fill embankment dam with an un-gated spillway across the Pryde Creek that is located in the South East region of Queensland, Australia. The sole purpose of the dam is for the generation of hydroelectricity.[1] The impounded reservoir is called the Splityard Creek Reservoir.

lee wrote on Mar 11^th, 2021 at 6:03pm:

BTW - The South Australian battery, listed as 129MWh cost $90 million. 129MWh is equivalent to about 80 barrels of oil. https://www.unitjuggler.com/convert-energy-from-MWh-to-boe.html?val=129 One barrel of oil is worth about $US 68 or Aud $88.10 https://oilprice.com/ 80 barrels times $88.10 = Aud$ 7752.8

When Fossil fuels were discovered they were heralded as


Quote:

"CHEAP ENERGY for RICH and POOR alike"

for comparison see post by Lee, above.

Well the oligarchy dont like that statement and think we should be paying through the nose for energy, cant afford it tuff luck.

The Elite run this world and no one is entitled to cheap energy in their books, especially the plebs.

freediver wrote on Mar 13^th, 2021 at 7:58am:

Common sense should suffice.

Congratulations. You have just shown why common sense isn't common. ;)

But perhaps you wanted Australian examples?


freediver wrote on Mar 13^th, 2021 at 7:58am:

Quote: And battery storage? It has been estimated that oil would have to be $30,000 a barrel to be cost effective.

Yep. and I showed where a barrel of oil is nowhere near that price. 80 barrels would cover the SA battery. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Who made that estimate?

freediver wrote on Mar 13^th, 2021 at 2:16pm:

Who made that estimate?

I made the estimate of 80 barrels. I showed you the workings. If you don't agree with them give us your workings to show I am wrong. ;)

At what cost would you expect parity?