1. Cloud seeding.....................YES this is manmade climate change

The United Nations World Meteorological Organisation conducting Weather & Climate change programmes around the world.

https://i.ibb.co/G9Sxftk/WCMP.jpg

https://public.wmo.int/en/resources/bulletin/seeding-change-weather-modification-globally


Quote:

Operational programmes to modify the weather – including to disperse fog, enhance rain and snowfall, and suppress hail – are taking place in more than 50 countries worldwide. Since the discovery in the late 1940s that crystals of silver iodide can form ice crystals in some water vapor, scientists have been working to understand how to alter the way water forms and moves within a cloud.  Despite decades of research, deep skepticism still surrounds cloud seeding due, in part, to the challenge of verifying the efficacy of the technique – establishing cause and effect – given the complexity and variability of weather systems. Warm or cold, polluted or clean, over a mountain or a field, a cloud’s characteristics are key to the success or failure of cloud seeding efforts. New tools are enabling meteorologists to study and understand clouds and their modification with greater precision than ever, while new technologies such as nanotechnology are expanding the possibilities for the field.  Bolstered by an international drive for research and funding to secure water resources, scientists are cautiously working to modernize rainmaking for the 21st century.

Its been happening for decades.

Hail has been increasing in size since the 1950's.

https://i.ibb.co/484pLJF/CSPAT.jpg

https://pdfpiw.uspto.gov/.piw?Docid=02527230

https://weathermodificationhistory.com/newspapers/

2. Firing electro magnetic waves into the ionosphere.................YES this is also manmade climate change

HAARP PATENT SAYS IT CAN DO THE FOLLOWING

https://i.ibb.co/ySw44x4/HAARP1.jpg
https://i.ibb.co/djHjbH2/HAARP4.jpg

https://www.haarp.net/

So all this crazy weather around the world

Is its because of

a. 1 & 2 above

b. Because the Earth has warmed since the little ice age

c. Because of mans CO2 emissions

I am sure we have not helped    thats for sure... look at the rain forest clearing alone. :(...but having said that..

I do not believe mankind has the power to turn this planet into a blackened shell with no life whatever....

we are just not that powerful....

can we stop the wind?   no we cant..

can we produce rainfall ?no we cant

can we turn the tides?  no we cant

we havent the POWER.......

can we do harm?   you betch ya.

can we do better.?   I sure as hell hope so..

will it stop CLIMATE CHANGE whatever we do?

  nope I am pretty sure it wont....WHY... because we dont have that sort of POWER

man is not meant to have that power.....

this planet has been through amazing climate changes over its 300 hundred million years of life give or take...


and its survived.... lets stop the PANIC....just clean up our act...never let our rivers run dry again....little things like that!...

Ajax wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 8:03am:

So all this crazy weather around the world Is its because of a. 1 & 2 above b. Because the Earth has warmed since the little ice age c. Because of mans CO2 emissions

Imo, it's

(a) 1 and 2 above

and a tiny percentage attributable to

(b) a small amount of natural warming since the little ice age


I stand ready to be corrected re: (b) but only by Ajax who knows more about this subject than anyone on OzPol

Quote:

Operational programmes to modify the weather – including to disperse fog, enhance rain and snowfall, and suppress hail – are taking place in more than 50 countries worldwide.

If these things are actually taking place, have they been of any use?

As I see it they are trying to help our climate be *normal* (if one can use that word).

I don't think they are doing anything that they consider harmful to the planet.

So what exactly is all the fuss about?

(given that I believe, the *climate* is governed by cyclical changes of the universe)

When someone can prove that the Eskimos caused the end of the ice age, that the aboriginals caused our inland sea to dry up, that Cro-Magnon men chopped down all the trees and caused the end of the coniferous era etc. etc., I will keep believing that man is puny and the *weather* and time are a zillion times more powerful than the efforts of puny man.

I see the green left ideology as part and parcel of the useful idiot curriculum.

moses wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 2:38pm:

Quote: Operational programmes to modify the weather – including to disperse fog, enhance rain and snowfall, and suppress hail – are taking place in more than 50 countries worldwide. If these things are actually taking place, have they been of any use? As I see it they are trying to help our climate be *normal* (if one can use that word). I don't think they are doing anything that they consider harmful to the planet. So what exactly is all the fuss about? (given that I believe, the *climate* is governed by cyclical changes of the universe) When someone can prove that the Eskimos caused the end of the ice age, that the aboriginals caused our inland sea to dry up, that Cro-Magnon men chopped down all the trees and caused the end of the coniferous era etc. etc., I will keep believing that man is puny and the *weather* and time are a zillion times more powerful than the efforts of puny man. I see the green left ideology as part and parcel of the useful idiot curriculum.

is it denial on your part

or simply willful ignorance?


Ajax has been providing more than sufficient evidence to the dire harmfulness of geoengineering

and he's provided copious links for those who wish to learn more


yet here you are ….

But what exactly is he trying to tell us?

Some people are experimenting to try and improve our weather?

How are they going are they achieving something or nothing?

As I say I don't believe that man is capable of having any effect on our weather, these exact matters Ajax is quoting, what have they achieved or failed in?

moses wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 2:55pm:

But what exactly is he trying to tell us? Some people are experimenting to try and improve our weather? How are they going are they achieving something or nothing? As I say I don't believe that man is capable of having any effect on our weather, these exact matters Ajax is quoting, what have they achieved or failed in?

You are correct about Ajax's posts in this thread and I apologise

Please allow me to recommend the following link and the links at the conclusion of the article

LINK


once again, my apologies

Ajax wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 8:02am:

Cloud seeding.....................YES this is manmade climate change

Where is lee? He's usually all over these climate change threads.......
Oh my mistake. This one isn't about coal  ;)

Ajax do you know the difference between weather and climate?

No apologies needed PZ, I just couldn't see any thing concrete about real climate change caused by man.

I speed-read your site what I picked up is they are also telling us about long term proposals with some actual actions.

Specifically, electrical power companies have for many decades openly sprayed silver iodide from ground-based generators in order to make it snow. The runoff from this artificially nucleated snowpack then fills up their mountain reservoirs and is subsequently used to generate hydroelectric power. How much does the Pacific Gas and Electric Corporation love you?

I'm very questioning that man could produce snow storms of just the right size, in precise locations, to fill lakes for their water supply for hydroelectricity.

I'm not convinced this isn't just one more conspiracy theory.

The_Barnacle wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 3:21pm:

Where is lee? He's usually all over these climate change threads.......

Poor petal. he is so lost without me. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

The_Barnacle wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 3:21pm:

Ajax wrote on Jan 22nd, 2020 at 8:02am: Cloud seeding.....................YES this is manmade climate change Where is lee? He's usually all over these climate change threads....... Oh my mistake. This one isn't about coal  ;) Ajax do you know the difference between weather and climate?

Do you know about wind patterns called the Coriolis effect and the effects on ocean currents....?

If they are playing with our weather then ultimately in the long run they are playing with our climate.

moses wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 3:29pm:

No apologies needed PZ, I just couldn't see any thing concrete about real climate change caused by man. I speed-read your site what I picked up is they are also telling us about long term proposals with some actual actions. Specifically, electrical power companies have for many decades openly sprayed silver iodide from ground-based generators in order to make it snow. The runoff from this artificially nucleated snowpack then fills up their mountain reservoirs and is subsequently used to generate hydroelectric power. How much does the Pacific Gas and Electric Corporation love you? I'm very questioning that man could produce snow storms of just the right size, in precise locations, to fill lakes for their water supply for hydroelectricity. I'm not convinced this isn't just one more conspiracy theory.

Moses you seem to care about the unintentional side effects of burning fossil fuel manmade climate change yet,

You seem oblivious to the side effects of deliberate climate change by man, they even admit that they are doing it.

My point is that they themselves do not know the consequences of these experiments, only that they think its worth exploring, probably economists masquerading as scientists (not unlike AGW) who's bottom line could be to sell rain to drought stricken countries.

If one form of manmade climate change scares you what makes you think another form is ok......???

Please write to these people asking for

1. What type of tests they are doing around the world

2. When

3. Where

4. We want to see the whole history of such tests.

A logical person could be inclined to ask well how do we know that these weather events are because of the little bit of man made CO2 going up into the atmosphere.

How do we know that they aren't caused by these experiments in 50 countries around the world.

As far as I have been able to find out there are over 12 HAARP installations in just Australia.

Some food for thought......

The very same people that are scaring us about Anthropogenic Global Warming are the very same people that are conducting weather modification  experiments around the world.

All under the pretence that its a way to save us from more CO2 in the atmosphere and rising temperature.

The HAARP system apparently can increase or decrease elements of the atmosphere like

1. CO2

2. O2

3.  N

4. etc etc Do you want them playing with these things because they find it interesting...?

Maybe they want two markets in the near future,

1. CO2 commodities market

2. Rainwater commodities market

3. and anything else their warped minds can come up with to make money even if it spells the end of us all.

The very same people..........................!

Quote:

Is it manmade climate change.....?

Fairly sure that it wasn't 2 wombats and a lizard ?

I'll vote yes it was us, lots of good reasons to go that way.

Dnarever wrote on Jan 22^nd, 2020 at 5:24pm:

Quote: Is it manmade climate change.....? Fairly sure that it wasn't 2 wombats and a lizard ? I'll vote yes it was us, lots of good reasons to go that way.

With reference to the OP 1 & 2

So which one is it.............?

a .Weather modification experiments being conducted simultaneously in 50 countries around the globe by the same people that are preaching the CO2 apocalypse.

OR

c. Mans emissions of CO2.

d. All the above


Quote:

a. 1 & 2 above b. Because the Earth has warmed since the little ice age c. Because of mans CO2 emissions

" One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy.  This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy any more.  We redistribute .. de facto .. the world's wealth via climate-policy "

Ottmar Edenhofer, UN IPPC co-chair of the working group on mitigation of climate-change from 2008 - 2015

PZ547 wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2020 at 7:40am:

" One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy.  This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy any more.  We redistribute .. de facto .. the world's wealth via climate-policy " Ottmar Edenhofer, UN IPPC co-chair of the working group on mitigation of climate-change from 2008 - 2015

What amazes me the sheeple still believe.

You can shoot down the science.

You can show them what the top echelon really think.

But the sheeple still blow their horns loader than ever.

Ajax wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2020 at 7:49am:

PZ547 wrote on Jan 23rd, 2020 at 7:40am: " One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy.  This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy any more.  We redistribute .. de facto .. the world's wealth via climate-policy " Ottmar Edenhofer, UN IPPC co-chair of the working group on mitigation of climate-change from 2008 - 2015 What amazes me the sheeple still believe. You can shoot down the science. You can show them what the top echelon really think. But the sheeple still blow their horns loader than ever.

For a laugh, check the UK news

Charles who Would Be King took a private jet to Davos.  Song and dance photos of him shaking hands with Greta

Charles wants a TAX imposed to tackle climate change

and all of them flew to Davos in private jets for that little shindig. They're still there, quaffing the finest and eating sparrows in aspic

yep, they could have skyped the whole thing

but didn't

The rage is palpable in the Comments sections

Trillions .. literally trillions they want

to 'reduce that 'deadly gas' from rising half a % in the next century, down from a huge full one percent

People aren't having it

they know it's BS

and Charles is getting the big thumbs down in several thousand Comments

Despite the charade, it's good to know people aren't buying it and they're aggressively not buying it

Tid bit I picked up around the traps: Charles has organic turnips from his own gardens flown to him wherever he happens to be staying.  Blatant hypocrisy  OR  he knows as well as the rest of us that climate change is a nonsense

PZ547 wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2020 at 7:59am:

Ajax wrote on Jan 23rd, 2020 at 7:49am: PZ547 wrote on Jan 23rd, 2020 at 7:40am: " One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy.  This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy any more.  We redistribute .. de facto .. the world's wealth via climate-policy " Ottmar Edenhofer, UN IPPC co-chair of the working group on mitigation of climate-change from 2008 - 2015 What amazes me the sheeple still believe. You can shoot down the science. You can show them what the top echelon really think. But the sheeple still blow their horns loader than ever. For a laugh, check the UK news Charles who Would Be King took a private jet to Davos.  Song and dance photos of him shaking hands with Greta Charles wants a TAX imposed to tackle climate change and all of them flew to Davos in private jets for that little shindig. They're still there, quaffing the finest and eating sparrows in aspic yep, they could have skyped the whole thing but didn't The rage is palpable in the Comments sections Trillions .. literally trillions they want to 'reduce that 'deadly gas' from rising half a % in the next century, down from a huge full one percent People aren't having it they know it's BS and Charles is getting the big thumbs down in several thousand Comments Despite the charade, it's good to know people aren't buying it and they're aggressively not buying it Tid bit I picked up around the traps: Charles has organic turnips from his own gardens flown to him wherever he happens to be staying.  Blatant hypocrisy  OR  he knows as well as the rest of us that climate change is a nonsense

yes it is head scratching stuff isnt it?....please can one of the scientists work out how much CO2 is produced by these talkfests?.. thats seem to go on all the time...

as you say it could all be done on skype...

but no it has to be in a country of beauty that has all the amenities the gretas are used to...

never in darkest Bangladesh where the smell alone would stop the traffic.....now that would make sense to me... :D :D


ahhh crazy world  so many fall for all this... WORDFESTING.....n fact they get quite aggressive if anyone disagrees with them...and as for pointing out  one or two..........ummmmm! never mind!

PZ547 wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2020 at 7:59am:

Ajax wrote on Jan 23rd, 2020 at 7:49am: PZ547 wrote on Jan 23rd, 2020 at 7:40am: " One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy.  This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy any more.  We redistribute .. de facto .. the world's wealth via climate-policy " Ottmar Edenhofer, UN IPPC co-chair of the working group on mitigation of climate-change from 2008 - 2015 What amazes me the sheeple still believe. You can shoot down the science. You can show them what the top echelon really think. But the sheeple still blow their horns loader than ever. For a laugh, check the UK news Charles who Would Be King took a private jet to Davos.  Song and dance photos of him shaking hands with Greta Charles wants a TAX imposed to tackle climate change and all of them flew to Davos in private jets for that little shindig. They're still there, quaffing the finest and eating sparrows in aspic yep, they could have skyped the whole thing but didn't The rage is palpable in the Comments sections Trillions .. literally trillions they want to 'reduce that 'deadly gas' from rising half a % in the next century, down from a huge full one percent People aren't having it they know it's BS and Charles is getting the big thumbs down in several thousand Comments Despite the charade, it's good to know people aren't buying it and they're aggressively not buying it Tid bit I picked up around the traps: Charles has organic turnips from his own gardens flown to him wherever he happens to be staying.  Blatant hypocrisy  OR  he knows as well as the rest of us that climate change is a nonsense

Yep only plebs will pay and suffer, people like Charlie and Gore will just keep on keeping on.

Lets hope the majority are switched on.

BUT

The next generation AGW foot soldiers are being brainwashed from primary school and in universities if you produce on paper that says AGW is not real you will fail.

The United Nations is controlling the youth of tomorrow in most nations and when these guys are eligible to vote they will vote the way they have been programmed to vote.

Bottom line for us all is financial slavery.


Quote:

Christine Stewart, then Canadian Minister of the Environment, speaking before editors and reporters of the Calgary Herald in 1998, said, “No matter if the science of global warming is all phony…climate change [provides] the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world.” https://www.forbes.com/sites/larrybell/2012/05/29/global-warming-alarmism-when-science-is-fiction/#525970467012

Lets not forget climate gate.

https://www.lavoisier.com.au/articles/greenhouse-science/climate-change/climategate-emails.pdf

Quote:

At a news conference last week in Brussels, Christiana Figueres, executive secretary of U.N.'s Framework Convention on Climate Change, admitted that the goal of environmental activists is not to save the world from ecological calamity but to destroy capitalism. "This is the first time in the history of mankind that we are setting ourselves the task of intentionally, within a defined period of time, to change the economic development model that has been reigning for at least 150 years, since the Industrial Revolution," she said. https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/climate-change-scare-tool-to-destroy-capitalism/

Quote:

“It is clear that current lifestyles and consumption patterns of the affluent middle-class … involving high meat intake, consumption of large amounts of frozen and convenience foods, ownership of motor vehicles, small electric appliances, home and work place air- conditioning, and suburban housing are not sustainable .…  A shift is necessary toward lifestyles less geared to environmental damaging consumption patterns.” Maurice Strong who spearheaded the 1991 Rio Earth Summit wrote in the U.N.’s Conference on Environmental Development (UNCED) report "Isn't the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn't it our responsiblity to bring that about?" - Maurice Strong, founder of the UN Environment Programme "If we don't change, our species will not survive... Frankly, we may get to the point where the only way of saving the world will be for industrial civilization to collapse." -Maurice Strong quoted in the September 1, 1997 edition of National Review magazine