Boeing is now paying dearly for their software cost cutting:

https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/iqjWHBFdfxIU/ix4KxotLAYHg/v0/600x-1.jpg



https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-06-28/boeing-s-737-max-software-outsourced-to-9-an-hour-engineers



technology
Boeing’s 737 Max Software Outsourced to $9-an-Hour Engineers

By Peter Robison

June 29, 2019, 6:46 AM GMT+10


Planemaker and suppliers used lower-paid temporary workers
Engineers feared the practice meant code wasn’t done right.

It remains the mystery at the heart of Boeing Co.’s 737 Max crisis: how a company renowned for meticulous design made seemingly basic software mistakes leading to a pair of deadly crashes. Longtime Boeing engineers say the effort was complicated by a push to outsource work to lower-paid contractors.

The Max software -- plagued by issues that could keep the planes grounded months longer after U.S. regulators this week revealed a new flaw -- was developed at a time Boeing was laying off experienced engineers and pressing suppliers to cut costs.

Increasingly, the iconic American planemaker and its subcontractors have relied on temporary workers making as little as $9 an hour to develop and test software, often from countries lacking a deep background in aerospace
- notably India.

The coders from HCL were typically designing to specifications set by Boeing. Still, “it was controversial because it was far less efficient than Boeing engineers just writing the code,” Rabin said. Frequently, he recalled, “it took many rounds going back and forth because the code was not done correctly.”

Boeing’s cultivation of Indian companies appeared to pay other dividends. In recent years, it has won several orders for Indian military and commercial aircraft, such as a $22 billion one in January 2017 to supply SpiceJet Ltd. That order included 100 737-Max 8 jets and represented Boeing’s largest order ever from an Indian airline, a coup in a country dominated by Airbus.

Based on resumes posted on social media, HCL engineers helped develop and test the Max’s flight-display software, while employees from another Indian company, Cyient Ltd., handled software for flight-test equipment

I see examples of this everywhere in industry today -
accountants running companies.
If you say anything you lose your job.

Now those accountants at Boeing have caused the destruction of their company.

I actually got to speak to the Head of QANTAS maintenance (at the time) and asked the Question: "Why did you move your maintenance offshore to Malaysia?"
They answered the usual "Because Australian labour is too expensive."
I didn't bother answering "That's because Australian consumerism and cost of living is the highest in the world."

Yep - charging consumers a fortune while paying for the cheapest labour.

Jasin wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 8:52am:

I actually got to speak to the Head of QANTAS maintenance (at the time) and asked the Question: "Why did you move your maintenance offshore to Malaysia?" They answered the usual "Because Australian labour is too expensive." I didn't bother answering "That's because Australian consumerism and cost of living is the highest in the world." Yep - charging consumers a fortune while paying for the cheapest labour.

Who is responsible?

http://www.ozpolitic.com/album/forum-attachments/mooning-gnome1_003.jpg

makes me glad I am not flying anywhere any time soon....


come on bobby  this could be good news for the environment     no planes people cancelling by the thousands....I mean isnt Boeing the leading plane manufacturer???.... :'( :'( :'(

cods wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 9:10am:

makes me glad I am not flying anywhere any time soon.... come on bobby  this could be good news for the environment     no planes people cancelling by the thousands....I mean isnt Boeing the leading plane manufacturer???.... :'( :'( :'(

Flying is a worry when they paid $9 per hour for the software.

Boeing has a long record of bastardry

Twenty or so years ago, three women who worked for Boeing became aware that sub-standard materials and labour were being 'passed'

The women took it to those who're supposed to ensure that doesn't happen.  They were told to shut up

Knowing lives were at stake, the women took it higher.  Again, told to keep quiet .. or

Still alarmed at the potential cost in human lives, the women kept pressing for something to be done about the situation

in the end, they were sacked

These were women with families and mortgages.  It was in their own interests to shut up and look for work to keep their own families and lives safe

but as fate would have it, those three women became heroes and they risked all to bring the Boeing situation to the attention of various US politicians, media, etc.

Boeing set out to break them completely.  They lost homes and families in their quest

then the truth about Boeing's cost cutting became headlines.  Not sure how it happened.  But it was after the women were dragged into court, possibly

end result was, the women were exonerated

too late for them personally.  Their fight had taken a heavy toll on their lives

but they won what then was believed to be a victory and Boeing had to apologise and maybe had to pay compensation to the women.  Of course, Boeing mouthed about 'lessons having been learned'

Words

and here they are at it again

caught at it, over and over

Americans online say the only reason Boeing's still in the business is because they have federal contracts

Thanks PZ547 - I remember seeing a doc about those women on TV.

As far as I'm concerned it's criminal behavior
& Boeing staff should have been sent to jail for life.

346 people died from the last 2 accidents caused by software faults.

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 8:02am:

I see examples of this everywhere in industry today - accountants running companies. If you say anything you lose your job. Now those accountants at Boeing have caused the destruction of their company.

You do realize that share holders greed is the most important thing in the Universe don't you ?

Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 9:40am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 8:02am: I see examples of this everywhere in industry today - accountants running companies. If you say anything you lose your job. Now those accountants at Boeing have caused the destruction of their company. You do realize that share holders greed is the most important thing in the Universe don't you ?

Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 9:40am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 8:02am: I see examples of this everywhere in industry today - accountants running companies. If you say anything you lose your job. Now those accountants at Boeing have caused the destruction of their company. You do realize that share holders greed is the most important thing in the Universe don't you ?

Very soon there won't be a Boeing company -
the company is dying from all their cost cutting
and sacrificing their customers on the altar of greed.

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 9:18am:

cods wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 9:10am: makes me glad I am not flying anywhere any time soon.... come on bobby  this could be good news for the environment     no planes people cancelling by the thousands....I mean isnt Boeing the leading plane manufacturer???.... :'( :'( :'( Flying is a worry when they paid $9 per hour for the software.

The Indians were in charge of and limited to writing the software that makes the toilet occupied light come on, which is kind of a funny job for an Indian.

Saw a Indian comedian on one of those Comedy TV shows few weeks back.
His entire theme of Act was based upon his bowels, turds, toilets, etc.

Yuck. ::)

Jasin wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 9:50am:

Saw a Indian comedian on one of those Comedy TV shows few weeks back. His entire theme of Act was based upon his bowels, turds, toilets, etc. Yuck. ::)

Here's a funny Indian

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeMGTPBG-dE

When I was in Kathmandu - the Indians were trying to sell me 12 year old girls for $A 5. That Indian is cashing in big time! $200 for 45 mins. I later found out that the correct 'local' price for the 'girls' was $A 10c. The Indian side of Nepalese life is very disgusting. Apparently I also found that the Indian Guru who would swing a big rock with his stretched foreskin charged more.  :P

Jasin wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:00am:

When I was in Kathmandu - the Indians were trying to sell me 12 year old girls for $A 5. That Indian is cashing in big time! $200 for 45 mins. I later found out that the correct 'local' price for the 'girls' was $A 10c. The Indian side of Nepalese life is very disgusting. Apparently I also found that the Indian Guru who would swing a big rock with his stretched foreskin charged more.  :P

they claim that love of money is the root of all evil

then one day, someone said 'no.  poverty is the root of all evil'

and that made sense

it still makes sense

and those people you just wrote about

God save them.  That's just sad

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 9:29am:

Thanks PZ547 - I remember seeing a doc about those women on TV. As far as I'm concerned it's criminal behavior & Boeing staff should have been sent to jail for life. 346 people died from the last 2 accidents caused by software faults.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVdbKHZdGcE

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:10am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 9:29am: Thanks PZ547 - I remember seeing a doc about those women on TV. As far as I'm concerned it's criminal behavior & Boeing staff should have been sent to jail for life. 346 people died from the last 2 accidents caused by software faults. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVdbKHZdGcE

Strange, isn't it Bob

microbiologists and ethical medical experts who've been outing the fact that millions (lots of millions) in the US, Oz, UK, you name it

were injected with 'polio vaccine' some decades ago

which the injectors KNEW contained carcinogenic materials


those doctors and others, microbiologists forced to devise biological agents, etc


THEY are 'dying unexpectedly'.  Or 'committing suicide'.  Or 'die in a plane/car crash' etc.

THEY are the good guys.  And they've been deaded

but the top brass in Boeing sleep like babies and collect their bonuses, retire in a cloud of glory and champagne

even though they knowingly condemned hundreds of innocent, trusting passengers to fiery deaths in Boeings

we need some justice

and I'd happily see them hanging high at a crossroads.  And the rest of the murderers and potential murderers …. they should be forced at gunpoint to stand right at the front to see them hanged, see them pizz their pants and their eyes pop out and their sphincter release and their tongues protrude

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:13am:

Strange, isn't it Bob microbiologists and ethical medical experts who've been outing the fact that millions (lots of millions) in the US, Oz, UK, you name it were injected with 'polio vaccine' some decades ago which the injectors KNEW contained carcinogenic materials those doctors and others, microbiologists forced to devise biological agents, etc THEY are 'dying unexpectedly'.  Or 'committing suicide'.  Or 'die in a plane/car crash' etc. THEY are the good guys.  And they've been deaded

A huge number of people need to be hanged.

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:15am:

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:13am: Strange, isn't it Bob microbiologists and ethical medical experts who've been outing the fact that millions (lots of millions) in the US, Oz, UK, you name it were injected with 'polio vaccine' some decades ago which the injectors KNEW contained carcinogenic materials those doctors and others, microbiologists forced to devise biological agents, etc THEY are 'dying unexpectedly'.  Or 'committing suicide'.  Or 'die in a plane/car crash' etc. THEY are the good guys.  And they've been deaded A huge number of people need to be hanged.

and after they're hanged

death masks should be made in all the horrible detail

and accurate copies of those death masks

should be hung all throughout Boeing offices and airport concourses

under spotlights

with plaques detailing WHY they were hanged

which should serve as a warning to anyone still in the dark about Boeing and it's casual, almost humorous attitudes to the loss of human lives

who have PAID in advance to be killed by Boeing

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:20am:

and after they're hanged death masks should be made in all the horrible detail and accurate copies of those death masks should be hung all throughout Boeing offices and airport concourses under spotlights with plaques detailing WHY they were hanged which should serve as a warning to anyone still in the dark about Boeing and it's casual, almost humorous attitudes to the loss of human lives who have PAID in advance to be killed by Boeing

And it should be all broadcast live on prime time TV.

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:22am:

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:20am: and after they're hanged death masks should be made in all the horrible detail and accurate copies of those death masks should be hung all throughout Boeing offices and airport concourses under spotlights with plaques detailing WHY they were hanged which should serve as a warning to anyone still in the dark about Boeing and it's casual, almost humorous attitudes to the loss of human lives who have PAID in advance to be killed by Boeing And it should be all broadcast live on prime time TV.

REality tv

Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold? 

Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first?

Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off?

Fun for all the family


Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:25am:

Reality tv Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold?  Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first? Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off? Fun for all the family Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing

And free beer for anyone who turns up to watch.

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:25am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:22am: PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:20am: and after they're hanged death masks should be made in all the horrible detail and accurate copies of those death masks should be hung all throughout Boeing offices and airport concourses under spotlights with plaques detailing WHY they were hanged which should serve as a warning to anyone still in the dark about Boeing and it's casual, almost humorous attitudes to the loss of human lives who have PAID in advance to be killed by Boeing And it should be all broadcast live on prime time TV. REality tv Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold?  Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first? Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off? Fun for all the family Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing

I'd tender to do the production and broadcast.

I'd have them all wired up with heart rate monitors so we can see how scared they are.

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:29am:

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:25am: Reality tv Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold?  Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first? Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off? Fun for all the family Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing And free beer for anyone who turns up to watch.

and banana milkshakes  ;D

just like the good old days in the Wild West when people who didn't honour the bargain swung at the end of a rope and everyone said later what a great day that was

After WW3, we'll revert to those tried and true methods of ridding ourselves of human cockroaches

so if you're there and I'm not, Bob, have a milkshake and sandwich for me

Gordon wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:33am:

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:25am: Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:22am: PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:20am: and after they're hanged death masks should be made in all the horrible detail and accurate copies of those death masks should be hung all throughout Boeing offices and airport concourses under spotlights with plaques detailing WHY they were hanged which should serve as a warning to anyone still in the dark about Boeing and it's casual, almost humorous attitudes to the loss of human lives who have PAID in advance to be killed by Boeing And it should be all broadcast live on prime time TV. REality tv Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold?  Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first? Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off? Fun for all the family Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing I'd tender to do the production and broadcast. I'd have them all wired up with heart rate monitors so we can see how scared they are.

Oh, great IDEA !

Now we're cooking

Another major embarrassment for Boeing here:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/business/boeing-737-messages.html

Boeing Employees Mocked F.A.A. and 'Clowns' Who Designed 737 Max


Quote:

“Would you put your family on a Max simulator trained aircraft? I wouldn’t,” one employee said to a colleague in another exchange from 2018, before the first crash. “No,” the colleague responded. In another set of messages, employees questioned the design of the Max and even denigrated their own colleagues. “This airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys,” an employee wrote in an exchange from 2017. The release of the communications — both emails and instant messages — is the latest embarrassing episode for Boeing in a crisis that has cost the company billions of dollars and wreaked havoc on the aviation industry across the globe.

Heads definitely need to roll.

Carl D wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 11:04am:

Another major embarrassment for Boeing here: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/business/boeing-737-messages.html Boeing Employees Mocked F.A.A. and 'Clowns' Who Designed 737 Max Quote: “Would you put your family on a Max simulator trained aircraft? I wouldn’t,” one employee said to a colleague in another exchange from 2018, before the first crash. “No,” the colleague responded. In another set of messages, employees questioned the design of the Max and even denigrated their own colleagues. “This airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys,” an employee wrote in an exchange from 2017. The release of the communications — both emails and instant messages — is the latest embarrassing episode for Boeing in a crisis that has cost the company billions of dollars and wreaked havoc on the aviation industry across the globe. Heads definitely need to roll.

If you pay peanuts you get monkeys.

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 10:29am:

PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:25am: Reality tv Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold?  Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first? Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off? Fun for all the family Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing And free beer for anyone who turns up to watch.

Look out Bobby, I think you are on his hit list! ;D

Setanta wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 7:10pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:29am: PZ547 wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 10:25am: Reality tv Phone-in now …. which of these scum will weep on the scaffold?  Bet at the TAB …. which one will crap itself first? Which one will fail to die and need to be hanged again until his head rips off? Fun for all the family Booby prizes are seats in a Boeing And free beer for anyone who turns up to watch. Look out Bobby, I think you are on his hit list! ;D

I saw that.  ;D

Bobby. wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 11:12am:

Carl D wrote on Jan 19th, 2020 at 11:04am: Another major embarrassment for Boeing here: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/business/boeing-737-messages.html Boeing Employees Mocked F.A.A. and 'Clowns' Who Designed 737 Max Quote: “Would you put your family on a Max simulator trained aircraft? I wouldn’t,” one employee said to a colleague in another exchange from 2018, before the first crash. “No,” the colleague responded. In another set of messages, employees questioned the design of the Max and even denigrated their own colleagues. “This airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys,” an employee wrote in an exchange from 2017. The release of the communications — both emails and instant messages — is the latest embarrassing episode for Boeing in a crisis that has cost the company billions of dollars and wreaked havoc on the aviation industry across the globe. Heads definitely need to roll. If you pay peanuts you get monkeys.

---

$9 is almost 30% the rate for an average competent Indian developer. If they were paying this amount then I would think them culpable for the results they got.

Dnarever wrote on Jan 19^th, 2020 at 7:20pm:

$9 is almost 30% the rate for an average competent Indian developer. If they were paying this amount then I would think them culpable for the results they got.

Boeing didn't care.