Lets hope the brain dead LNP does not try and sabotage this desperately needed project !

https://www.smh.com.au/national/victoria/testing-begins-for-first-offshore-wind-farm-in-australia-20191110-p53970.html


Quote:

Testing begins for first offshore wind farm in Australia Scientific testing begins this month for Australia’s first proposed offshore wind farm, near Gippsland, which could provide enough power for more than 1.2 million homes. The testing comes as the union movement launches a campaign to lobby the state and federal governments to smooth the way for the project to proceed. The Star of the South wind farm is expected to provide up to 2000 megawatts of power − about 18 per cent of the state’s power demand − and is set to cost between $8 billion and $10 billion. Within weeks, the company will begin detailed studies of the wind and wave conditions at the 496-square-kilometre area off the south coast of Gippsland. It will also conduct environmental studies on marine and bird life. If considered feasible, the wind farm is slated to provide “full power” by 2027. Unions hope the wind farm will provide secure jobs for electricity workers in the Latrobe Valley, where the economy has relied heavily on coal-fired power generation. The Latrobe Valley was hit hard by the closure of the Hazelwood power plant in 2017, and remaining coal-fired power plants are scheduled to begin closing in coming decades. The broader region is bracing for more job losses with the state government phasing out native timber logging by 2030, sparking a furious response from the Construction Forestry Maritime Mining and Energy Union. Previous estimates indicated the Star of the South wind farm could include 250 turbines but that is yet to be determined. Its proposed site is between 10 kilometres and 25 kilometres from Port Albert......

Building a wind farm at a cost of $4 - 5 per watt seems expensive, given that the current price is about $2 per watt. What will the Availability Factor of this wind farm? Typically it's 0.33 for a conventional wind farm.

minarchist wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 10:28am:

Building a wind farm at a cost of $4 - 5 per watt seems expensive, given that the current price is about $2 per watt. What will the Availability Factor of this wind farm? Typically it's 0.33 for a conventional wind farm.

It's more expensive to build them out in the ocean but on the flip-side there is more constant source of wind. Either way you are not setting fire to costly polluting coal  ;)

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 10:33am:

minarchist wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 10:28am: Building a wind farm at a cost of $4 - 5 per watt seems expensive, given that the current price is about $2 per watt. What will the Availability Factor of this wind farm? Typically it's 0.33 for a conventional wind farm. It's more expensive to build them out in the ocean but on the flip-side there is more constant source of wind. Either way you are not setting fire to costly polluting coal  ;)

Putting these bird choppers offshore also makes them more expensive and difficult to service.

How much coal do they have to burn to produce the steel used in these bird choppers?

How much fossil fuel has to be burnt to mine the products needed to manufacture these bird choppers?

Wind turbines will use approximately 6-12 times the amount of steel and 10 times the total resources compared to thermal power plants. Also, the blades can't be recycled.

I wonder if they sent the memo to Bob Brown?

"He says it is in the wrong place, will ruin the view and kill endangered birds like the Tasmanian wedge-tail eagle and the white-breasted sea eagle that live on the island, and potentially migratory birds like the swift parrot and the orange-bellied parrot that travel between Tasmania and the mainland."

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-07-25/bob-browns-opposition-to-wind-farm-labelled-hypocrisy/11345200

The island is Robbin Island, those eagles may not be affected by this.

"Unions hope the wind farm will provide secure jobs for electricity workers in the Latrobe Valley, where the economy has relied heavily on coal-fired power generation."

Well coal loaders need not apply, nor the high pressure vessel blokes.

What about hectares of land taken up by solar panels?

ChrisP wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 4:11pm:

What about hectares of land taken up by solar panels?

What about them? we have plenty of land and sun.

The more wind turbines the better.

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 4:49pm:

The more wind turbines the better.

You do know that more wind turbines slows wind speed?

lee wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 4:51pm:

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 4:49pm: The more wind turbines the better. You do know that more wind turbines slows wind speed?

The wind shadow, mother nature V a few blades in the ocean, the bird slaughter stacks up as a better argument.

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 5:11pm:

The wind shadow, mother nature V a few blades in the ocean, the bird slaughter stacks up as a better argument.

Not a "wind shadow", they remove wind energy.

"Every turbine removes energy from the winds, so that many turbines operating over large scales should reduce wind speeds of the atmospheric flow. With many turbines, this effect should extend beyond the immediate wake behind each turbine and result in a general reduction of wind speeds. This wind speed reduction is critical, as it lowers the amount of energy that each turbine can extract from the winds. "

https://phys.org/news/2016-11-large-scale-energy-turbine-efficiencies.html

lee wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 5:23pm:

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 5:11pm: The wind shadow, mother nature V a few blades in the ocean, the bird slaughter stacks up as a better argument. Not a "wind shadow", they remove wind energy. "Every turbine removes energy from the winds, so that many turbines operating over large scales should reduce wind speeds of the atmospheric flow. With many turbines, this effect should extend beyond the immediate wake behind each turbine and result in a general reduction of wind speeds. This wind speed reduction is critical, as it lowers the amount of energy that each turbine can extract from the winds. " https://phys.org/news/2016-11-large-scale-energy-turbine-efficiencies.html

They don't put wind turbines behind other wind turbines.

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 4:49pm:

ChrisP wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 4:11pm: What about hectares of land taken up by solar panels? What about them? we have plenty of land and sun. The more wind turbines the better.

Wind turbines and paddocks of solar panels are entirely different. One needs wind, the other needs sun.  ;D

So when the wind stops and it rains and the sun goes behind a cloud ... and you want to watch something on TV. What happens? Turn on the what?

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 5:30pm:

They don't put wind turbines behind other wind turbines.

Frogshit.

https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/wind-turbine-optical-illusion-nevada-royce-bair-1.jpg

https://www.boredpanda.com/14-wind-turbines-aligned-in-a-row-in-nevada/

Apart from which wind forced around a wind turbine loses directionality and therefore force as the wind strikes at slightly different angles.

lee wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 6:32pm:

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 5:30pm: They don't put wind turbines behind other wind turbines. Frogshit. https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/wind-turbine-optical-illusion-nevada-royce-bair-1.jpg https://www.boredpanda.com/14-wind-turbines-aligned-in-a-row-in-nevada/ Apart from which wind forced around a wind turbine loses directionality and therefore force as the wind strikes at slightly different angles.

They are strategically placed using wind velocity for their viability.

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 6:48pm:

They are strategically placed using wind velocity for their viability.

One behind the other. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Edit: Star of the South wind farm layout

http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/assets/img/the-project-hero.jpg

http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/the-project

ChrisP wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 5:53pm:

Wind turbines and paddocks of solar panels are entirely different. One needs wind, the other needs sun.  ;D So when the wind stops and it rains and the sun goes behind a cloud ... and you want to watch something on TV. What happens? Turn on the what?

We need a clean source like Nuclear or Hydro.

Pumped Hydro is bullshit it consumes more energy than it produces.

lee wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 2:58pm:

I wonder if they sent the memo to Bob Brown? "He says it is in the wrong place, will ruin the view and kill endangered birds like the Tasmanian wedge-tail eagle and the white-breasted sea eagle that live on the island, and potentially migratory birds like the swift parrot and the orange-bellied parrot that travel between Tasmania and the mainland." https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-07-25/bob-browns-opposition-to-wind-farm-labelled-hypocrisy/11345200 The island is Robbin Island, those eagles may not be affected by this.

Even Bob Brown doesn't like these bird choppers.

If they put them offshore they don't have to clean up all the dead birds under them.

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 7:10pm:

lee wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 2:58pm: I wonder if they sent the memo to Bob Brown? "He says it is in the wrong place, will ruin the view and kill endangered birds like the Tasmanian wedge-tail eagle and the white-breasted sea eagle that live on the island, and potentially migratory birds like the swift parrot and the orange-bellied parrot that travel between Tasmania and the mainland." https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-07-25/bob-browns-opposition-to-wind-farm-labelled-hypocrisy/11345200 The island is Robbin Island, those eagles may not be affected by this. Even Bob Brown doesn't like these bird choppers. If they put them offshore they don't have to clean up all the dead birds under them.

Poor Bob is still wondering why sucking male's cock doesn't get him pregnant.

Baronvonrort wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 1:07pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 10:33am: minarchist wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 10:28am: Building a wind farm at a cost of $4 - 5 per watt seems expensive, given that the current price is about $2 per watt. What will the Availability Factor of this wind farm? Typically it's 0.33 for a conventional wind farm. It's more expensive to build them out in the ocean but on the flip-side there is more constant source of wind. Either way you are not setting fire to costly polluting coal  ;) Putting these bird choppers offshore also makes them more expensive and difficult to service. How much coal do they have to burn to produce the steel used in these bird choppers? How much fossil fuel has to be burnt to mine the products needed to manufacture these bird choppers?

But how come you don't care about all of the other species that have become extinct because of climate change and pollution etc ?? Funny about that ;)

lee wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 7:03pm:

Johnnie wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 6:48pm: They are strategically placed using wind velocity for their viability. One behind the other. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Edit: Star of the South wind farm layout http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/assets/img/the-project-hero.jpg http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/the-project

As opposed to not seeing anything in Delhi because of stinken emissions :(

https://www.kent.co.in/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Delhi-Pollution.png

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 10:24pm:

But how come you don't care about all of the other species that have become extinct because of climate change and pollution etc ?? Funny about that

Perhaps you can name them or give a number.

In Australia -

"Following is a list of Australian animal extinctions from the arrival of the first European colonists in 1788, until the present. There are 24 birds (though just 1 from the mainland), 7 frogs, and 27 mammal species or subspecies strongly believed to have become extinct in Australia since European settlement. "

Or perhaps you have another number. ;)

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 10:28pm:

lee wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 7:03pm: Johnnie wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 6:48pm: They are strategically placed using wind velocity for their viability. One behind the other. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Edit: Star of the South wind farm layout http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/assets/img/the-project-hero.jpg http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/the-project As opposed to not seeing anything in Delhi because of stinken emissions :( https://www.kent.co.in/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Delhi-Pollution.png

Let's see last I looked Delhi was in India NOT Australia. The proposed wind farm is in Australia NOT Delhi.

Exactly how the proposed windfarm would ease pollution in Delhi is unclear. But perhaps you can enlighten us all.

But India does have a pollution problem.

"Millions die as most Indians still cook with wood and dung"

https://www.thethirdpole.net/en/2014/07/16/millions-die-as-most-indians-still-cook-with-wood-and-dung/

"India could make a major dent in air pollution by curbing emissions from dirty household fuels such as wood, dung, coal and kerosene, shows a new analysis led by researchers at the University of California, Berkeley and the India Institute of Technology.

Eliminating emissions from these sources — without any changes to industrial or vehicle emissions — would bring the average outdoor air pollution levels below the country’s air quality standard, the study shows. Mitigating the use of household fuels could also reduce air pollution-related deaths in the country by approximately 13%, which is equivalent to saving about 270,000 lives a year."

https://news.berkeley.edu/2019/04/18/india-could-meet-air-quality-standards-by-cutting-household-fuel-use/

So stopping the use of dung fires etc would curb most of the pollution problems. Not vehicles. ;)

When the only thing you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. ;)

lee wrote on Nov 13^th, 2019 at 11:02pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 10:28pm: lee wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 7:03pm: Johnnie wrote on Nov 13th, 2019 at 6:48pm: They are strategically placed using wind velocity for their viability. One behind the other. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Edit: Star of the South wind farm layout http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/assets/img/the-project-hero.jpg http://www.starofthesouth.com.au/the-project As opposed to not seeing anything in Delhi because of stinken emissions :( https://www.kent.co.in/blog/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Delhi-Pollution.png Let's see last I looked Delhi was in India NOT Australia. The proposed wind farm is in Australia NOT Delhi. Exactly how the proposed windfarm would ease pollution in Delhi is unclear. But perhaps you can enlighten us all. But India does have a pollution problem. "Millions die as most Indians still cook with wood and dung" https://www.thethirdpole.net/en/2014/07/16/millions-die-as-most-indians-still-cook-with-wood-and-dung/ "India could make a major dent in air pollution by curbing emissions from dirty household fuels such as wood, dung, coal and kerosene, shows a new analysis led by researchers at the University of California, Berkeley and the India Institute of Technology. Eliminating emissions from these sources — without any changes to industrial or vehicle emissions — would bring the average outdoor air pollution levels below the country’s air quality standard, the study shows. Mitigating the use of household fuels could also reduce air pollution-related deaths in the country by approximately 13%, which is equivalent to saving about 270,000 lives a year." https://news.berkeley.edu/2019/04/18/india-could-meet-air-quality-standards-by-cutting-household-fuel-use/ So stopping the use of dung fires etc would curb most of the pollution problems. Not vehicles. ;) When the only thing you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. ;)

of course none of those dirty stinken vehicles contribute anything to the problem :D LOL

Don't forget china as well. Are they setting fire to sh.t too ?? :D LOL

https://fortune.com/2015/12/01/chinas-toxic-smog/


Quote:

Beijing’s air on Tuesday morning had 20 times more the level of tiny cancer-causing pollutants than is considered healthy by the World Health Organization. Even chain-smoking taxi drivers complained about the toxic air. “Very serious,” said one. A smog cloud the size of California that blanketed much of northern China since Sunday was expected to linger for a couple days. The smog is the latest evidence that despite China’s government’s calls for radical solutions—last year Premier Li Keqiang said the country would “declare war” on smog—the scale of the problem suggests there will be no quick fix. The problem is that China’s economy is overly reliant on producing steel, which takes large amounts of coal to produce, and coal-fired electricity, which supplies about two-thirds of China’s energy use compared to 40% in the U.S.. The government has said that the country’s greenhouse gas emissions will only peak in another 15 years, in 2030.

https://content.fortune.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/gettyimages-499359454.jpg

Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 14^th, 2019 at 9:48am:

of course none of those dirty stinken vehicles contribute anything to the problem

Poor petal. fails to understand the written word again.


Sir lastnail wrote on Nov 14^th, 2019 at 9:48am:

Don't forget china as well. Are they setting fire to sh.t too ??

Of course they are. Villages use whatever is available to cook. You expected transmission lines out there as well?

"Glaciers in the Himalayas and on the Tibetan Plateau are rapidly melting. Black carbon soot from power plants and fires that falls on the snow and ice there is one reason why, and now scientists say they know where it’s coming from.
Chinese glaciers are melting at accelerating rates.

Scientists had long assumed that India and China—two of the world's leading sources of black carbon pollution—were responsible for what fell on the glaciers in Tibet and the Himalayas.“Modeling and atmospheric circulation suggested that black carbon might be from surrounding regions,” says Shichang Kang in an email. He studies glaciers at the Chinese Academy of Science and led the research project.

Instead, he found that a lot of the black carbon is local. While power plants in China and fires in India do contribute black carbon, in the remote interior of the Tibetan Plateau it appears to come mostly from burning yak dung and other immediate sources."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/samlemonick/2016/08/25/yak-dung-is-helping-melt-tibetan-glaciers/#3c2e9c175891