polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3^rd, 2018 at 7:20pm:

Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD).

Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values?

freediver wrote on Oct 6^th, 2018 at 7:22am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values?

Freeeedom.

For a bloke who "says" that Australia is already part of Islam, he needn't be concerned.

Core of Islamic Law or Shariah
The core of Islamic Law is preservation of:
1)    Religion
2)    Life
3)    Family
4)    Mind
5)    Wealth
6)    Some contemporary scholars suggest either justice or liberty to be the sixth category.


Number 6 a bit wishy washy Gandalf? - nah, couldn't be


BTW Gandalf, why is "Mind" number 4?

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Oct 6^th, 2018 at 10:00am:

freediver wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 7:22am: polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values? Freeeedom.

Karnal,


Would that be the   Freeeedom    not to be murdered or imprisoned when you 'disagree' ?



Quote:

Iraqi Women That Defy Islamic Conservatives Keep Getting Murdered by Seth Frantzman Jerusalem Post September 30, 2018

https://www.meforum.org/articles/2018/iraqis-channel-metoo-after-high-profile-women-mu





e.g. Turkey too.

Google;
everyone who disagrees with erdogan is a terrorist

erdogan, all dissent outlawed

erdogan, crushes alternative opinion

Yadda wrote on Oct 7^th, 2018 at 12:40pm:

Dirty Paki Khunt wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 10:00am: freediver wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 7:22am: polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values? Freeeedom. Karnal, Would that be the   Freeeedom    not to be murdered or imprisoned when you 'disagree' ? Quote: Iraqi Women That Defy Islamic Conservatives Keep Getting Murdered by Seth Frantzman Jerusalem Post September 30, 2018 https://www.meforum.org/articles/2018/iraqis-channel-metoo-after-high-profile-women-mu e.g. Turkey too. Google; everyone who disagrees with erdogan is a terrorist erdogan, all dissent outlawed erdogan, crushes alternative opinion

No, Y, it would be the Freeeedom to incarcerate those who are.tinted.

Inferior culture, innit.

Yadda wrote on Oct 7^th, 2018 at 12:40pm:

Karnal, Would that be the   Freeeedom    not to be murdered or imprisoned when you 'disagree' ?

Or placing in 'administrative detention' those with whom we don't agree???

Bias_2012 wrote on Oct 7^th, 2018 at 10:54am:

6)    Some contemporary scholars suggest either justice or liberty to be the sixth category.

I wonder why none of them suggest both?

freediver wrote on Oct 7^th, 2018 at 6:42pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Oct 7th, 2018 at 10:54am: 6)    Some contemporary scholars suggest either justice or liberty to be the sixth category. I wonder why none of them suggest both?

We can have both by placing them all in administrative detention, no?

Justice and liberty. Freeeedom, innit.

Auggie wrote on Oct 7^th, 2018 at 6:02pm:

Yadda wrote on Oct 7th, 2018 at 12:40pm: Karnal, Would that be the   Freeeedom    not to be murdered or imprisoned when you 'disagree' ? Or placing in 'administrative detention' those with whom we don't agree???

No.

It is because every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person.

Why so ?

Read on, for my argument and the latest example [of murderous 'Aussie' moslems, convicted]....




No Auggie,

It is not only,       that moslems [living in Australia] 'don't agree' with us [Australians],
AS TO WHY, every moslem in Australia needs to be placed in 'administrative detention'.



FURTHER;
Every moslem also, is a follower of ISLAM.

And the allegiance of the moslem, is to Allah and to ISLAM.

And that is why moslems will seek 'opportunities' to attack us [i.e. because moslems love ISLAM more than Australia or Australians].
[actually,    moslems have a deep hatred for Australia and for Australians]


And that,     is the principal reason why, imo, every moslem in Australia needs to be placed in 'administrative detention'.


Because,
1/ ISLAM is a murderous death cult, and,
2/ every moslem is a follower of ISLAM, and,
3/ ISLAM instructs its followers that they have an obligation to Allah and to ISLAM, to harass and to kill disbelievers, whenever they can.


As per.....


"Fighting [against disbelievers] is prescribed for you, and [if] ye dislike it.....Allah knoweth, and ye know not."
Koran 2.216


"O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him)."
Koran 9.123


"Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain:...."
Koran 9.111


"Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves....."
Koran 48.29



.



Yadda said....
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1517662538/0#0

Quote:

AN INDISPUTABLE PREAMBLE.... Every moslem          has sworn everlasting allegiance to Allah. Every moslem,         is a moslem. Every moslem,         is a follower of ISLAM.

.




Yadda said.....
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1522634108/1#1

Quote:

Every moslem is a dangerous, and unstable person. Why so ? Because every moslem, is a moslem.

.



IMAGE.....
https://www.jihadwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Islamic-bonnie-and-clyde.jpg

Self-Described ‘Islamic Bonnie and Clyde’ Guilty of Plot to Attack ‘Non-Believers,’






Quote:

By Christine Douglass-Williams on Oct 06, 2018 Australia: “Islamic Bonnie and Clyde” plotted New Year’s Eve jihad stabbing attack on non-Muslims A couple who described themselves as an “Islamic Bonnie and Clyde” have been found guilty in an Australian court of planning a New Year’s Eve terrorist stabbing attack on non-Muslims. Sameh Bayda and Alo-Bridget Namoa, both 21, were charged last year with the offences. Now the two will enter prison, where they will likely join forces with other jihadists. In February 2016, Sameh Bayda said to investigators that she wanted to do an “Islamic Bonnie and Clyde on the Kaffir.” Prosecutors alleged Bayda.....said each believed they had a “religious obligation to attack non-believers”.

https://www.jihadwatch.org/2018/10/australia-islamic-bonnie-and-clyde-plotted-new-years-eve-jihad-stabbing-attack-on-non-muslims



.




Quote:

mortimer says       Oct 6, 2018 at 9:03 am Australians are committing ‘mischief in the land’, namely, they refuse to adopt Islam and they arrest and attack jihadists at home and abroad. All Australians support the Australian army and the RAAF with their tax money. Those military forces kill Muslims (who happen to be terrorists), so ALL AUSTRALIANS ARE FAIR GAME in the minds of the JIHAD-WARRIORS. By their reasoning, they are cutting the head off of the KAFIR SNAKE … namely, the money source … the taxpayers. Mohammed did the same by drying up the revenues of the Meccans (economic sabotage). When all Australia is weary from JIHADISM, so the jihadist think, then they fall in line with Islam. If enough terrorism is perpetrated, then the will to fight back will disappear. This strategy works every time a corporation caves in and supports Sharia blasphemy law, instead of standing for freedom. We in the counterjihad need to incentivize corporations economically to support freedom of expression.

https://www.jihadwatch.org/2018/10/australia-islamic-bonnie-and-clyde-plotted-new-years-eve-jihad-stabbing-attack-on-non-muslims#comment-1994579

Yadda wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 12:01am:

No. It is because every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person. Why so ? Read on, for my argument and the latest example [of murderous 'Aussie' moslems, convicted]....

The same line of thinking as Hitler and the Jews.

Auggie wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 5:31pm:

Yadda wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 12:01am: No. It is because every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person. Why so ? Read on, for my argument and the latest example [of murderous 'Aussie' moslems, convicted].... The same line of thinking as Hitler and the Jews.

Would you like to develop that nonsensical thought/statement ?

Or is your argument, that both Hitler and the Jews too,       thought that 'every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person' ?

Yadda wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 5:36pm:

Auggie wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 5:31pm: Yadda wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 12:01am: No. It is because every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person. Why so ? Read on, for my argument and the latest example [of murderous 'Aussie' moslems, convicted].... The same line of thinking as Hitler and the Jews. Would you like to develop that nonsensical thought/statement ? Or is your argument, that both Hitler and the Jews too,       thought that 'every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person' ?

Yep, that's Forrest runnin' with an idea only he can conceive of.

Yadda wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 5:36pm:

Auggie wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 5:31pm: Yadda wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 12:01am: No. It is because every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person. Why so ? Read on, for my argument and the latest example [of murderous 'Aussie' moslems, convicted].... The same line of thinking as Hitler and the Jews. Would you like to develop that nonsensical thought/statement ? Or is your argument, that both Hitler and the Jews too,       thought that 'every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person' ?

Hitler believed that Jews were parasites and leaches, stealing from the German people. He believed that the Jews and the Jewish bolsheviks were out to get Germany, much like your Muslims.

At first, they contained the Jews, and sought to deport them, but when no one would take them, the final solution was developed - i.e. extermination.

Let me ask you: once the administrative detention becomes to expensive, then what?

Frank wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 6:12pm:

Yadda wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 5:36pm: Auggie wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 5:31pm: Yadda wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 12:01am: No. It is because every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person. Why so ? Read on, for my argument and the latest example [of murderous 'Aussie' moslems, convicted].... The same line of thinking as Hitler and the Jews. Would you like to develop that nonsensical thought/statement ? Or is your argument, that both Hitler and the Jews too,       thought that 'every moslem is a very dangerous, and unstable person' ? Yep, that's Forrest runnin' with an idea only he can conceive of.

Sure, sounds like Hitler!

Auggie wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 6:15pm:

He believed that the Jews and the Jewish bolsheviks were out to get Germany, much like your Muslims.

Muslims joined the nazis during the war

Bias_2012 wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 6:29pm:

Auggie wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 6:15pm: He believed that the Jews and the Jewish bolsheviks were out to get Germany, much like your Muslims. Muslims joined the nazis during the war

And your point?

Auggie wrote on Oct 8^th, 2018 at 6:55pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 6:29pm: Auggie wrote on Oct 8th, 2018 at 6:15pm: He believed that the Jews and the Jewish bolsheviks were out to get Germany, much like your Muslims. Muslims joined the nazis during the war And your point?

Ideological affinity, Forrest.

Two long words, I know, but there it is.

freediver wrote on Oct 6^th, 2018 at 7:22am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values?

Basically, all the things you do that involves ditching your most sacred values in order to pursue your bigoted and racist agenda - and then pretend its actually being done in the name of those values you are ditching.

Off the top of my head:
- find all sorts of excuses to apologise and/or subtly promote the banning of particular head dresses
- incessantly attack anyone who stands up for the rights of particular minorities - and completely ignore the fact that they are merely acting upon what you always insist you stand for
- pretend to bravely take a stand against the "politically correct nazi's" world view (a favourite of faux freedom lovers) - by engaging in a distinctly anti-intellectual and outright dishonest debate about (for example) Islamic history - involving cherry picking sources and outright lying about the facts
- valorise bigots and white supremacists who cynically wield the old "my freedoms are under attack!" furphy - and pretend its all in the name of protecting freedom. And then do the exact opposite when anyone from particular minorities do the same
- demonise particular outspoken members of minorities, to the extent of remaining silent and subtly enable blatantly racist attacks against them, and calls to strip away their human rights.
- hold up your ignorance of actual intellectual debates as some kind of badge of honour, as if its somehow "sticking it to" the politically correct "so called" experts. Proudly declaring, for example, that you don't need to understand anything written by an actual scholar of Islamic history to understand "common sense" and "the bleeding obvious", and deriding any historian who contradicts your bigoted views - even one who is leading in his field, and virtually undisputed amongst scholars - with mocking terms like "esteemed gentlemen"

Stuff like that...

Western nations urged Saudi Arabia to invest in the endorsement of Wahhabism during the Cold War era to prevent the Soviet Union from gaining influence in the Muslim world, Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman said in a recent interview. He also admitted the kingdom “lost track” of it.


Paying clowns pence per post was a minor part of that investment

The Saudi-backed spread of Wahhabism — the most strict and violent branch of Islam — started because Western nations asked Saudi Arabia to help counter the Soviet Union, bin Salman said in an interview to Washington Post.

Riyadh invested in mosques and madrasas overseas to prevent the USSR from gaining influence in Muslim countries, he said on March 22 in an interview on March 22 that was reportedly initially kept off record.


However, today most support for Wahhabis comes not from Saudi Government per se, but from Saudi-based "foundations."

Comments below (scroll down) the article are interesting too

LINK

How do the Saudis promote their religious views?


By investing heavily in building mosques, madrasas, schools, and Sunni cultural centers across the Muslim world.

Indian intelligence says that in India alone, from 2011 to 2013, some 25,000 Saudi clerics arrived bearing more than $250 million to build mosques and universities and hold seminars. "We are talking about thousands and thousands of activist organizations and preachers who are in the Saudi sphere of influence," said Usama Hasan, a researcher in Islamic studies.

These institutions and clerics preach the specifically Saudi version of Sunni Islam, the extreme fundamentalist strain known as Wahhabism or Salafism.

What is Wahhabism?

Founded in the 18th century by Muslims seeking a return to Koranic literalism, Wahhabism is one of the strictest sects of Islam.

The founder, Sheikh Muhammad ibn Abdul-Wahhab, sought the protection of an emir, Muhammad ibn Saud, and the two joined forces to spread the doctrine throughout the Arabian Peninsula. The cleric's daughter married the emir's son, which means the entire House of Saud is directly descended from Wahhab.

The purist sect requires adherents to abstain from alcohol and drugs. The sexes are segregated, with women fully covered in public.

Even other Muslims who stray from these medieval practices — such as Shiites and moderate Sunni sects — are considered infidels. Prescribed punishments for crimes — among them apostasy and blasphemy — include flogging, stoning, and beheading.



LINK

Oh but hang on …..

The Saudi 'royals' are Dönmeh jews !

The House Of Saud: It’s Jewish Origin And Installation By The British Crown



fancy that !


2002 IRAQI INTEL REPORTED WAHHABIS ARE OF JEWISH ORIGIN


and the following should not be missed by anyone anywhere:

The report relies heavily on the Memoirs of Mr. Hempher, which describe in detail how a British spy to the Middle East, in the middle of the eighteenth century, made contact with Adbul Wahhab, to create a subversive version of Islam, the notorious sect of Wahhabism, which became the founding cult of the Saudi regime. 

The movement was temporarily suppressed by the Ottomam armies in the middle of the nineteenth century.  But with the assistance of the British, the Wahhabis and their Saudi sponsors returned to power and founded their own state in 1932. 

Since then, the Saudis have collaborated closely with the Americans, to whom they owe their tremendous oil wealth, in funding various Islamic fundamentalist organizations and other American covert operations, particularly the “jihad” in Afghanistan. 

But the Saudis simulatenously use the immense wealth at their dispossal to disseminate this disruptive brand of Islam to various parts of the world, categorized by some of the largest propaganda campaign in history.



and so much more

particularly The Memoirs of Mr Hempher


which is removed religiously, regularly, obsessively

by the Promote Ignorance Within the Suckers organisation


The Post for Pennies clowns don't know, don't care

they just need those pennies for today's packet of 2 Minute Noodles eh --- nutrition 2018 in The Lucky Country, land of Chemtrail droughts enabling the Chinese AND -- guess WHO?  Yeah, the SAUDIS, to buy up all they can of Australia's limited viable land


Wishy washy Western liberal values


at least some in the West still value some Western values


LINK

Australia, Ethiopia, Brazil

that's where we're ranked

selling arable land

The joke is that Australia has very limited arable land

but it's gone

Sold

Oz was sold

And who bought Australia's irreplaceable arable land?

China and Middle East, primarily


Saudis bought and are still buying farms in Eyre Peninsula

paying top money

Do we factor in those 'honorable members'/politicians who've been messing around with Australia's limited water?

Well I do

So there we have it

Australia as the beggar, selling itself alongside Ethiopia and Brazil

The farm can never be bought back

Then factor in the billions expended by the Saudis on The Promotion of the Spread of Islam (virulent Wahhabism) in the West

Few years ago, the Chasers or someone held a joke poll of Americans on the street.  The Americans were asked to point out Australia on the world map

Funniest was when Americans agreed that mainland Australia was, yes it was, North Korea.  And they agreed that Tasmania was South Korea

Choices, choices for the denizens of the Lucky Country.  To work for slave wages for their Chinese and Saudi overlords on foreign farms on what once was Australian soil

or run off to Tasmania to live in the bush

LINK

polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 9^th, 2018 at 12:21pm:

freediver wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 7:22am: polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values? Basically, all the things you do that involves ditching your most sacred values in order to pursue your bigoted and racist agenda - and then pretend its actually being done in the name of those values you are ditching. Off the top of my head: - find all sorts of excuses to apologise and/or subtly promote the banning of particular head dresses - incessantly attack anyone who stands up for the rights of particular minorities - and completely ignore the fact that they are merely acting upon what you always insist you stand for - pretend to bravely take a stand against the "politically correct nazi's" world view (a favourite of faux freedom lovers) - by engaging in a distinctly anti-intellectual and outright dishonest debate about (for example) Islamic history - involving cherry picking sources and outright lying about the facts - valorise bigots and white supremacists who cynically wield the old "my freedoms are under attack!" furphy - and pretend its all in the name of protecting freedom. And then do the exact opposite when anyone from particular minorities do the same - demonise particular outspoken members of minorities, to the extent of remaining silent and subtly enable blatantly racist attacks against them, and calls to strip away their human rights. - hold up your ignorance of actual intellectual debates as some kind of badge of honour, as if its somehow "sticking it to" the politically correct "so called" experts. Proudly declaring, for example, that you don't need to understand anything written by an actual scholar of Islamic history to understand "common sense" and "the bleeding obvious", and deriding any historian who contradicts your bigoted views - even one who is leading in his field, and virtually undisputed amongst scholars - with mocking terms like "esteemed gentlemen" Stuff like that...

Oh, it doesn't matter how many times you explain wishy-washy Western values to FD, he always comes back with a new thread to ask you again.

I guess FD's just curious, eh?

Quote:

pursue your bigoted and racist agenda

6:125 So whoever allah wants to guide - he expands his breast to [contain] Islam; and whoever He wants to misguide - he makes his breast tight and constricted as though he were climbing into the sky. Thus does allah place defilement upon those who do not believe.

10.100 : No soul can believe,except by the will of allah, and he will place doubt (or obscurity) on those who will not understand

13.027 : The Unbelievers say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from his lord?" Say: "Truly allah leaveth, to stray, whom he will; But he guideth to himself those who turn to him in penitence,

13:33-34 allah leads disbelievers astry while he torments them in this life. Then afterh they die, he makes them suffer even more pain in the doom of the Hereafter.

14.004 : We sent not a messenger except (to teach) in the language of his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now allah leaves straying those whom he pleases and guides whom he pleases: and he is exalted in power, full of wisdom.

14:27 allah keeps firm those who believe, with the firm word, in worldly life and in the Hereafter. And allah sends astray the wrongdoers. And allah does what He wills.

17.046 : And we put coverings over their hearts (and minds) lest they should understand the qur'an, and deafness into their ears: when thou dost commemorate thy lord and him alone in the qur'an, they turn on their backs, fleeing (from the truth).

16.093 : If allah so willed, he could make you all one people: But he leaves straying whom he pleases, and he guides whom he pleases: but ye shall certainly be called to account for all your actions. 

17:97 And whoever allah guides - he is the [rightly] guided; and whoever he sends astray - you will never find for them protectors besides him, and We will gather them on the Day of Resurrection [fallen] on their faces - blind, dumb and deaf. Their refuge is hell; every time it subsides We increase them in blazing fire. 

18.057 : And who doth more wrong than one who is reminded of the signs of his lord, but turns away from them, forgetting the (deeds) which his hands have sent forth? Verily we have set veils over their hearts lest they should understand this, and over their ears, deafness, if thou callest them to guidance, even then will they never accept guidance.

19.083 : Seest thou not that We have set the Evil Ones on against the unbelievers, to incite them with fury?

27.004 : As to those who believe not in the hereafter, we have made their deeds pleasing in their eyes; and so they wander about in distraction.

32;13 If we had so willed, we could certainly have brought every soul its true guidance: but the word from me will come true, "I will fill hell with jinns and men all together."

Now I know I'm an islamophobe, but I could swear that allah is telling us that he is a racist and bigot.

After all he chooses who he will let believe then he persecutes those he made disbelieve.

moses wrote on Oct 9^th, 2018 at 3:01pm:

Quote: pursue your bigoted and racist agenda 6:125 So whoever allah wants to guide - he expands his breast to [contain] Islam; and whoever He wants to misguide - he makes his breast tight and constricted as though he were climbing into the sky. Thus does allah place defilement upon those who do not believe. 10.100 : No soul can believe,except by the will of allah, and he will place doubt (or obscurity) on those who will not understand 13.027 : The Unbelievers say: "Why is not a sign sent down to him from his lord?" Say: "Truly allah leaveth, to stray, whom he will; But he guideth to himself those who turn to him in penitence, 13:33-34 allah leads disbelievers astry while he torments them in this life. Then afterh they die, he makes them suffer even more pain in the doom of the Hereafter. 14.004 : We sent not a messenger except (to teach) in the language of his (own) people, in order to make (things) clear to them. Now allah leaves straying those whom he pleases and guides whom he pleases: and he is exalted in power, full of wisdom. 14:27 allah keeps firm those who believe, with the firm word, in worldly life and in the Hereafter. And allah sends astray the wrongdoers. And allah does what He wills. 17.046 : And we put coverings over their hearts (and minds) lest they should understand the qur'an, and deafness into their ears: when thou dost commemorate thy lord and him alone in the qur'an, they turn on their backs, fleeing (from the truth). 16.093 : If allah so willed, he could make you all one people: But he leaves straying whom he pleases, and he guides whom he pleases: but ye shall certainly be called to account for all your actions.  17:97 And whoever allah guides - he is the [rightly] guided; and whoever he sends astray - you will never find for them protectors besides him, and We will gather them on the Day of Resurrection [fallen] on their faces - blind, dumb and deaf. Their refuge is hell; every time it subsides We increase them in blazing fire.  18.057 : And who doth more wrong than one who is reminded of the signs of his lord, but turns away from them, forgetting the (deeds) which his hands have sent forth? Verily we have set veils over their hearts lest they should understand this, and over their ears, deafness, if thou callest them to guidance, even then will they never accept guidance. 19.083 : Seest thou not that We have set the Evil Ones on against the unbelievers, to incite them with fury? 27.004 : As to those who believe not in the hereafter, we have made their deeds pleasing in their eyes; and so they wander about in distraction. 32;13 If we had so willed, we could certainly have brought every soul its true guidance: but the word from me will come true, "I will fill hell with jinns and men all together." Now I know I'm an islamophobe, but I could swear that allah is telling us that he is a racist and bigot. After all he chooses who he will let believe then he persecutes those he made disbelieve.

Good point.

polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 9^th, 2018 at 12:21pm:

freediver wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 7:22am: polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values? Basically, all the things you do that involves ditching your most sacred values in order to pursue your bigoted and racist agenda - and then pretend its actually being done in the name of those values you are ditching. Off the top of my head: - find all sorts of excuses to apologise and/or subtly promote the banning of particular head dresses - incessantly attack anyone who stands up for the rights of particular minorities - and completely ignore the fact that they are merely acting upon what you always insist you stand for - pretend to bravely take a stand against the "politically correct nazi's" world view (a favourite of faux freedom lovers) - by engaging in a distinctly anti-intellectual and outright dishonest debate about (for example) Islamic history - involving cherry picking sources and outright lying about the facts - valorise bigots and white supremacists who cynically wield the old "my freedoms are under attack!" furphy - and pretend its all in the name of protecting freedom. And then do the exact opposite when anyone from particular minorities do the same - demonise particular outspoken members of minorities, to the extent of remaining silent and subtly enable blatantly racist attacks against them, and calls to strip away their human rights. - hold up your ignorance of actual intellectual debates as some kind of badge of honour, as if its somehow "sticking it to" the politically correct "so called" experts. Proudly declaring, for example, that you don't need to understand anything written by an actual scholar of Islamic history to understand "common sense" and "the bleeding obvious", and deriding any historian who contradicts your bigoted views - even one who is leading in his field, and virtually undisputed amongst scholars - with mocking terms like "esteemed gentlemen" Stuff like that...

M'kay?

;D ;D ;D

freediver wrote on Oct 7^th, 2018 at 6:42pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Oct 7th, 2018 at 10:54am: 6)    Some contemporary scholars suggest either justice or liberty to be the sixth category. I wonder why none of them suggest both?

To muslims the two would conflict ... Sharia (justice) requires a "policing" action, so therefore freedom (liberty) is out of the question

polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 9^th, 2018 at 12:21pm:

freediver wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 7:22am: polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values? Basically, all the things you do that involves ditching your most sacred values in order to pursue your bigoted and racist agenda - and then pretend its actually being done in the name of those values you are ditching. Off the top of my head: - find all sorts of excuses to apologise and/or subtly promote the banning of particular head dresses - incessantly attack anyone who stands up for the rights of particular minorities - and completely ignore the fact that they are merely acting upon what you always insist you stand for - pretend to bravely take a stand against the "politically correct nazi's" world view (a favourite of faux freedom lovers) - by engaging in a distinctly anti-intellectual and outright dishonest debate about (for example) Islamic history - involving cherry picking sources and outright lying about the facts - valorise bigots and white supremacists who cynically wield the old "my freedoms are under attack!" furphy - and pretend its all in the name of protecting freedom. And then do the exact opposite when anyone from particular minorities do the same - demonise particular outspoken members of minorities, to the extent of remaining silent and subtly enable blatantly racist attacks against them, and calls to strip away their human rights. - hold up your ignorance of actual intellectual debates as some kind of badge of honour, as if its somehow "sticking it to" the politically correct "so called" experts. Proudly declaring, for example, that you don't need to understand anything written by an actual scholar of Islamic history to understand "common sense" and "the bleeding obvious", and deriding any historian who contradicts your bigoted views - even one who is leading in his field, and virtually undisputed amongst scholars - with mocking terms like "esteemed gentlemen" Stuff like that...

They are not values Gandalf. Do you know what the word means?

freediver wrote on Oct 13^th, 2018 at 8:21am:

polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 9th, 2018 at 12:21pm: freediver wrote on Oct 6th, 2018 at 7:22am: polite_gandalf wrote on Oct 3rd, 2018 at 7:20pm: Frankly, its not the Yaddas that concern me. At least he is honest and upfront about his bigotry. Its the slippery and dishonest enablers that are the real concern. The ones that cynically hide behind the veil of freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values (fake values that aren't in any way 'western' that is, for the benefit of FD). Gandalf, what are these wishy washy western liberal values? Basically, all the things you do that involves ditching your most sacred values in order to pursue your bigoted and racist agenda - and then pretend its actually being done in the name of those values you are ditching. Off the top of my head: - find all sorts of excuses to apologise and/or subtly promote the banning of particular head dresses - incessantly attack anyone who stands up for the rights of particular minorities - and completely ignore the fact that they are merely acting upon what you always insist you stand for - pretend to bravely take a stand against the "politically correct nazi's" world view (a favourite of faux freedom lovers) - by engaging in a distinctly anti-intellectual and outright dishonest debate about (for example) Islamic history - involving cherry picking sources and outright lying about the facts - valorise bigots and white supremacists who cynically wield the old "my freedoms are under attack!" furphy - and pretend its all in the name of protecting freedom. And then do the exact opposite when anyone from particular minorities do the same - demonise particular outspoken members of minorities, to the extent of remaining silent and subtly enable blatantly racist attacks against them, and calls to strip away their human rights. - hold up your ignorance of actual intellectual debates as some kind of badge of honour, as if its somehow "sticking it to" the politically correct "so called" experts. Proudly declaring, for example, that you don't need to understand anything written by an actual scholar of Islamic history to understand "common sense" and "the bleeding obvious", and deriding any historian who contradicts your bigoted views - even one who is leading in his field, and virtually undisputed amongst scholars - with mocking terms like "esteemed gentlemen" Stuff like that... They are not values Gandalf. Do you know what the word means?

Good to have you back, FD. Are you up for answering questions yet, or should we wait until you warm up a bit?

freediver wrote on Oct 13^th, 2018 at 8:21am:

They are not values Gandalf. Do you know what the word means?

freeeedom is a value. Its a corruption of actual freedom.

Thats the value you corrupt - as I just explained in a fair amount of detail.

So when you say "freeeedom and wishy washy western liberal values" you mean freedom and freedom? I must have missed that explanation.

Sorry FD, when did I say that?

It's what I quoted in the OP.