Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry chief Kate Carnell backs real cuts to wages
Ewin Hannan

    The Australian
    November 05, 2014

MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements.      :-?

Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry chief Kate Carnell said annual pay rises of 1.5 per cent to 2 per cent should be the norm in bargaining where ­productivity has not increased.

Ms Carnell yesterday backed Tony Abbott signalling an across-the-board reduction in public service wages, and his warning no one should expect a better deal than the real-terms pay cut imposed on Defence personnel.      :(

“We actually all have to accept that the federal budget is under pressure, that the budgets of many Australian businesses are under pressure,’’ she told The Australian.

“If we want to keep people at work then we are going to have to accept wage rises that are not in line with CPI.’’ Asked if 1 per cent to 2 per cent increases were acceptable to business, she said that, while pay rises would vary by ­industry, “those sort of figures would be in line’’ with the profit­ability levels of most business since the global financial crisis.

“There’s a sort of disconnect in the public debate between this sort of view that CPI is sort of a right and just what you would expect even though business profitability hasn’t increased by CPI in many industries since the GFC,’’ she said.

Ms Carnell said Australian workers were some of the highest paid in the world which was “absolutely fine as long as they have the productivity to back that up’’.

“Where you have got a very large percentage of Australian businesses that haven’t seen improvements and, in fact, have seen reductions in profitability since the GFC, it makes it really hard for business to manage CPI year after year,’’ she said.

“What’s happened, as a result of that, in many cases is that businesses have reduced staff.’’

ACTU secretary Dave Oliver accused Ms Carnell of advocating a real wage cut for workers “across the country’’. Mr Oliver said her arguments were “claptrap’’, and that the productivity of workers and business profitability was up.

Defending the below-inflation pay rises awarded to Defence personnel, Mr Abbott said the budget position meant “there’s going to have to be very tight pay restraint across the public sector’’.      :(

The Defence Remuneration Tribunal on Monday approved a 1.5 per cent pay rise for military personnel each year for three years, a move branded “insulting” by defence advocates

“We’re going to see restraint across the whole of the public sector and I would be very surprised if anyone in the commonwealth public sector receives more than is received by our Defence Forces,’’ the Prime Minister said.      :(

Mr Oliver said it was a disgrace Defence personnel had incurred a real wage cut

The Community and Public Sector Union said government employees were “not going to sit back and accept losing most of their rights in return for pay offers that are sitting at less than 1 per cent a year’’.

“Unlike soldiers, public sector workers are allowed to fight back,’’ the union’s national secretary, ­Nadine Flood, said.

ACTU secretary Dave Oliver accused Ms Carnell of advocating a real wage cut for workers “across the country’’. Mr Oliver said her arguments were “claptrap’’, and that the productivity of workers and business profitability was up.      :(

the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ...

business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits?

Quote:

MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements. Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry chief Kate Carnell said annual pay rises of 1.5 per cent to 2 per cent should be the norm in bargaining where ­productivity has not increased.

So, does that mean customers have the right to expect businesses to hold their price increases to below inflation?

That isn't going to happen .. it's just a blatant money grab by greedy businesses.

Anyone who's affected by these below-inflation pay rises is going to have to cut back on spending. The first place to make cuts would be discretionary products or services sold by companies that are making these miserly pay offers.

Ok.....the 1% ers and parliamentarians first.

By the time that extra money trickles down, the lowly wage earners might not need to take a pay cut after all.

Quote:

MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements.

Productivity has improved year after year with none of the gains being passed on. Employees have a right to ask for a fair increase for the productivity increases already produced.

I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks?

If not she can STFU....

Quote:

Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry chief Kate Carnell said annual pay rises of 1.5 per cent to 2 per cent should be the norm in bargaining where ­productivity has not increased.

Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry chief Kate Carnell

Now here is a group which is an absolute waste of space and time. A group that has been wheeling out doom and gloom and begging for pay cuts decade after decade.

They may change their representatives but the tune they play never varies they have been playing the same song since their inception.

Listening to these guys is the equivalent to reading Bolt or Ackerman. You do not need to read the article to know what they said.

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 11:25am:

I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks? If not she can be quiet....

Managers believe that they deserve a huge bonus if they can contain wages. This will be written into their package in terms of a performance benchmark.

It is probable that having this article published will contribute to Kate's performance rating and her bonus.

“Unlike soldiers, public sector workers are allowed to fight back,’’ the union’s national secretary, ­Nadine Flood, said.      :)

Quote:

though business profitability hasn’t increased by CPI in many industries since the GFC,’’ she said.

I wonder where the increased cost to the consumer is coming from then ? In basic terms the CPI is the amount that these guys have increased their prices. The CPI is a measure of the increased cost of things. My view is that she is full of brown stuff and may benefit from the use of the suppository of all wisdom where it is meant to go.

CPI 2.3%
Food 3.5%
Alcohol and Tobacco 7.3%
Health 4.7%
etc.
some down
Clothing -2%

How people tolerate the double standards is beyond me.  Lets all accept a cut in wages for the good of Aust and Aust businesses but hey its quite OK and understandable for Australian businesses to receive tax concessions and corporate welfare from this country when they relocate most their operation to Asia. I suppose we should sustain ourselves with a warm feeling inside that these "highly profitable successful companies" are australian.

Dnarever wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 11:24am:

Quote: MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements. Productivity has improved year after year with none of the gains being passed on. Employees have a right to ask for a fair increase for the productivity increases already produced.

Have you borrowed Armie's armchair. Productivity has been slipping for over a decade.

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 11:25am:

I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks? If not she can be quiet....

REALLY , these CEOs on half million dollar, plus salaries should stick to what they know best

Has this former Liberal Party politician known - or even once MET - a retail or hospitality worker, who struggles to pay a mortgage, rent, utility bills, GST - and FOOD for a wife and children,   
- on a pay rate of $16.87 per hour or $640.90 per 38 hour week (before tax) ?

Kate Carnell....

She bought her own pharmacy business in Red Hill in 1981. She owned and managed the pharmacy until 2000.[1]

She was the inaugural chair of the ACT Branch of the Australian Pharmacy Guild,[4] serving in the position between 1988 and 1994.[5] as well as National Vice-President of the guild between 1990 and 1994.

Among other positions she was: Chairman of the Canberra and Southern District Pharmacists Company Ltd (1982–1992), Vice-President of the Retail Industry and Training Council, ACT (1987–1991), Councillor at the Australian Institute of Pharmacy Management (1990–1991), Member of the ACT Board of Health (1990–1991), and a Member of the Pharmacy Restructuring Authority (1990–1991).

Note, not only the positions, but the over-lapping dates of same.

All while running her own business???

Would I be wrong in presuming that she did all this extra work 'Pro Bono'??

:D

crocodile wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 3:29pm:

Dnarever wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:24am: Quote: MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements. Productivity has improved year after year with none of the gains being passed on. Employees have a right to ask for a fair increase for the productivity increases already produced. Have you borrowed Armie's armchair. Productivity has been slipping for over a decade.

Not on the employee side it hasn't - the part that management are responsible for has been atrocious.

For as long as you Aussies are too cowardly to fill the streets in large numbers, on a regular basis, to strike and demonstrate, the corporate tyrants and their puppets in government will continue to squeeze more and more blood out of you.  ;) Everything is bargaining. If you don't bargain, you loose.  ;) 

But for many decades the tyrants have used their media and told you that "whinging" is UnAustralian.  ;D So you unlearned to bargain and to stand up for your rights. You learned to put your head down submissively and lick their asses. And you were proud of it, because you thought, this is Austraaaaalian.  ;D They just fooled you, while they got rich of you.  ;)

gone wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:29pm:

For as long as you Aussies are too cowardly to fill the streets in large numbers, on a regular basis, to strike and demonstrate, the corporate tyrants and their puppets in government will continue to squeeze more and more blood out of you.  ;) Everything is bargaining. If you don't bargain, you loose.  ;)  But for many decades the tyrants have used their media and told you that "whinging" is UnAustralian.  ;D So you unlearned to bargain and to stand up for your rights. You learned to put your head down submissively and lick their asses. And you were proud of it, because you thought, this is Austraaaaalian.  ;D They just fooled you, while they got rich of you.  ;)

So when that nice union representative approaches you and asks if you wish to join the union, don't say no without thinking.

Bam wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:34pm:

gone wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 6:29pm: For as long as you Aussies are too cowardly to fill the streets in large numbers, on a regular basis, to strike and demonstrate, the corporate tyrants and their puppets in government will continue to squeeze more and more blood out of you.  ;) Everything is bargaining. If you don't bargain, you loose.  ;)  But for many decades the tyrants have used their media and told you that "whinging" is UnAustralian.  ;D So you unlearned to bargain and to stand up for your rights. You learned to put your head down submissively and lick their asses. And you were proud of it, because you thought, this is Austraaaaalian.  ;D They just fooled you, while they got rich of you.  ;) So when that nice union representative approaches you and asks if you wish to join the union, don't say no without thinking.

Depends, my friend! If the company I work for pays into the union, I won't join it. As soon as the company starts paying into the union, they UNDERMINE it. It becomes an oxymoron.

Lobo wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:09pm:

Kate Carnell.... She bought her own pharmacy business in Red Hill in 1981. She owned and managed the pharmacy until 2000.[1] She was the inaugural chair of the ACT Branch of the Australian Pharmacy Guild,[4] serving in the position between 1988 and 1994.[5] as well as National Vice-President of the guild between 1990 and 1994. Among other positions she was: Chairman of the Canberra and Southern District Pharmacists Company Ltd (1982–1992), Vice-President of the Retail Industry and Training Council, ACT (1987–1991), Councillor at the Australian Institute of Pharmacy Management (1990–1991), Member of the ACT Board of Health (1990–1991), and a Member of the Pharmacy Restructuring Authority (1990–1991). Note, not only the positions, but the over-lapping dates of same. All while running her own business??? Would I be wrong in presuming that she did all this extra work 'Pro Bono'??

Any reason why any of that would be relevant to the opinion she expressed ?

Dnarever wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:12pm:

crocodile wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 3:29pm: Dnarever wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:24am: Quote: MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements. Productivity has improved year after year with none of the gains being passed on. Employees have a right to ask for a fair increase for the productivity increases already produced. Have you borrowed Armie's armchair. Productivity has been slipping for over a decade. Not on the employee side it hasn't - the part that management are responsible for has been atrocious.

Horseshit.

Lobo wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:09pm:

Kate Carnell.... She bought her own pharmacy business in Red Hill in 1981. She owned and managed the pharmacy until 2000.[1] She was the inaugural chair of the ACT Branch of the Australian Pharmacy Guild,[4] serving in the position between 1988 and 1994.[5] as well as National Vice-President of the guild between 1990 and 1994. Among other positions she was: Chairman of the Canberra and Southern District Pharmacists Company Ltd (1982–1992), Vice-President of the Retail Industry and Training Council, ACT (1987–1991), Councillor at the Australian Institute of Pharmacy Management (1990–1991), Member of the ACT Board of Health (1990–1991), and a Member of the Pharmacy Restructuring Authority (1990–1991). Note, not only the positions, but the over-lapping dates of same. All while running her own business??? Would I be wrong in presuming that she did all this extra work 'Pro Bono'??

Any reason why any of that would be relevant to the opinion she expressed ?

My view is that most of these would have been paid positions.

crocodile wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 7:07pm:

Dnarever wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 6:12pm: crocodile wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 3:29pm: Dnarever wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:24am: Quote: MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements. Productivity has improved year after year with none of the gains being passed on. Employees have a right to ask for a fair increase for the productivity increases already produced. Have you borrowed Armie's armchair. Productivity has been slipping for over a decade. Not on the employee side it hasn't - the part that management are responsible for has been atrocious. Horseshit.

Why has it been slipping?

crocodile wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 7:07pm:

Dnarever wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 6:12pm: crocodile wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 3:29pm: Dnarever wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:24am: Quote: MOST workers need to accept real wage cuts, business says, warning jobs will be lost if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements. Productivity has improved year after year with none of the gains being passed on. Employees have a right to ask for a fair increase for the productivity increases already produced. Have you borrowed Armie's armchair. Productivity has been slipping for over a decade. Not on the employee side it hasn't - the part that management are responsible for has been atrocious. Horseshit.

Yep, even horseshit is more productive than most management and higher up...

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 11:25am:

I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks? If not she can be quiet....

Australia's top executives are starting to see their large salary bases decline, as investors cast more scrutiny over remuneration packages.

But while fixed pay has decreased, cash bonuses have risen, with the bosses of Australia's leading companies still taking home almost 70 times the national average salary.

Research by the Australian Council of Superannuation Investors and proxy advisory company Ownership Matters shows the average fixed salary for an ASX 100 executive fell 2.6 per cent to $1.9 million in the 2012 financial year. Including bonuses, Australia's top bosses took home an average of $4.7 million ...

The 10-year trend, however, is much more stark, with executive fixed pay increasing almost three times as fast as inflation since 2002, and nearly 70 per cent faster than average wages growth


http://www.smh.com.au/business/ceos-take-home-70-times-average-salary-20130919-2u2kl.html#ixzz3IBjR1OOP

Classic neocon self–enrichment and buggering and beggaring the nation stuff.

gone wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:29pm:

For as long as you Aussies are too cowardly to fill the streets in large numbers, on a regular basis, to strike and demonstrate, the corporate tyrants and their puppets in government will continue to squeeze more and more blood out of you.  ;) Everything is bargaining. If you don't bargain, you loose.  ;)  But for many decades the tyrants have used their media and told you that "whinging" is UnAustralian.  ;D So you unlearned to bargain and to stand up for your rights. You learned to put your head down submissively and lick their asses. And you were proud of it, because you thought, this is Austraaaaalian.  ;D They just fooled you, while they got rich of you.  ;)

Haven't you heard of rthe game that used to run around Sydney - it's called 'Spot the Aussie' - in amongst all the immigrant groups who have ZERO idea what this country is about.

Where are these 'Australians' these days?  All subsumed an inundated by crowds of people with no idea other than a hardscrabble existence.....

Perfect fodder to give the vote to and fill with stupid ideas about issues like Unionism and wage structures - things they have no idea of....

I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster.


John Smith wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 8:22am:

the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits?

Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers,

When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today.

Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not.

buzzanddidj wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 8:32pm:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:25am: I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks? If not she can be quiet.... Australia's top executives are starting to see their large salary bases decline, as investors cast more scrutiny over remuneration packages. But while fixed pay has decreased, cash bonuses have risen, with the bosses of Australia's leading companies still taking home almost 70 times the national average salary. Research by the Australian Council of Superannuation Investors and proxy advisory company Ownership Matters shows the average fixed salary for an ASX 100 executive fell 2.6 per cent to $1.9 million in the 2012 financial year. Including bonuses, Australia's top bosses took home an average of $4.7 million ... The 10-year trend, however, is much more stark, with executive fixed pay increasing almost three times as fast as inflation since 2002, and nearly 70 per cent faster than average wages growth http://www.smh.com.au/business/ceos-take-home-70-times-average-salary-20130919-2u2kl.html#ixzz3IBjR1OOP

Its fascinating, 100 years ago, before minimum wage, before over regulations, wages for workers were increasing as fast as business profits, compare that to todays mess?

Seems to me free market capitalism worked better than today mixed economy.

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 4:55am:

I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not.

Not quite. Zero productivity growth means that wages track inflation closely. Wages fall behind inflation when productivity drops below zero.

Quote:

Its fascinating, 100 years ago, before minimum wage, before over regulations, wages for workers were increasing as fast as business profits, compare that to todays mess? Seems to me free market capitalism worked better than today mixed economy.

They started from a low base. There is no doubt that GDP per capita and gini coefficient are far superior than what they were a century ago.

crocodile wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 6:44am:

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not. Not quite. Zero productivity growth means that wages track inflation closely. Wages fall behind inflation when productivity drops below zero.

Wrong - how do i know? i pay wages.

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 7:05am:

crocodile wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 6:44am: Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not. Not quite. Zero productivity growth means that wages track inflation closely. Wages fall behind inflation when productivity drops below zero. Wrong - how do i know? i pay wages.

Productivity measurements encompass the entire economy. Individual circumstances make no difference. Except to the individual.

crocodile wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 6:48am:

Quote: Its fascinating, 100 years ago, before minimum wage, before over regulations, wages for workers were increasing as fast as business profits, compare that to todays mess? Seems to me free market capitalism worked better than today mixed economy. They started from a low base. There is no doubt that GDP per capita and gini coefficient are far superior than what they were a century ago.

Interesting point capitalism state rate better in the Gini index than socialist states.

I have no idea about Australia because i cant find the data, but The US had a higher rating on the Gini index than it has now, and that goes with most of Europe, Wealth seems to have been spread remarkably equality compared to todays standerds.

And yes GDP per capita has dramatically increased since the 1900, however i fail to see how this has help wages to stagnate.

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 4:55am:

I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers,

When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises


When talking about CPI based wage increases being negotiated we are primarily talking about Woolworths Bunnings and co.

Most small business pay around bottom rates and are subject to the minimum wage case decision they would seldom have a union come in to negotiate an EBA.

Most Need To Accept Wage Cuts Business Says


Business have been saying this for at least the last 30 years - good times bad times and anywhere in between they cry poor and ask for no wage increases. This is not an honest claim and it never has been.

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 7:05am:

crocodile wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 6:44am: Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not. Not quite. Zero productivity growth means that wages track inflation closely. Wages fall behind inflation when productivity drops below zero. Wrong - how do i know? i pay wages.

;D ;D ;D

that's like saying 'I know how electricity works because I watch TV' ....

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 4:55am:

I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. .

CPI measurement increases as a response to business increasing prices for the same product. i.e business is collecting more and the community is expected to pay more for the same product.

In order to keep up with real money value pay rates need to reflect this change in order for the employer to be effectively paying his /her employees at the same rate as previously and at best this change lags by 12 months. The employees wages are always 12 months behind in the best case scenario, the employer has the advantage of keeping the employees wage for that period before passing it on.

This is not productivity related.

Increases above CPI would need to be justified in terms of productivity increases.

In many cases substantial productivity increases have already been given with no associated wage justice.

I think you are discussing the difference between capitalism and corporate piracy....it is obvious that the mantra about flow-down etc is false.

Dnarever wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 8:03am:

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. . CPI measurement increases as a response to business increasing prices for the same product. i.e business is collecting more and the community is expected to pay more for the same product. We have a federal reserve bank purposely expanding the money supply to achieve 2 to 3% inflation. Business can increase prices as much as they want but it won't add to inflation unless demand doesn't drop or the good friends at the RBA print more money. In order to keep up with real money value pay rates need to reflect this change in order for the employer to be effectively paying his /her employees at the same rate as previously and at best this change lags by 12 months. The employees wages are always 12 months behind in the best case scenario, the employer has the advantage of keeping the employees wage for that period before passing it on. Works both ways. Employers have to wait and see how demand is going before adjusting their supply side. This is not productivity related. Increases above CPI would need to be justified in terms of productivity increases. In many cases substantial productivity increases have already been given with no associated wage justice. Productivity has been slipping away for over a decade.

John Smith wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 8:22am:

the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ...

Yep and the maggots reckon the GFC didn't affect Australia but now they want to use it as an excuse not to increase people's wages. Theses big business maggots are making obscene profits yet baulk at pissant wage increases.

buzzanddidj wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 5:45pm:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:25am: I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks? If not she can be quiet.... REALLY , these CEOs on half million dollar, plus salaries should stick to what they know best Has this former Liberal Party politician known - or even once MET - a retail or hospitality worker, who struggles to pay a mortgage, rent, utility bills, GST - and FOOD for a wife and children,    - on a pay rate of $16.87 per hour or $640.90 per 38 hour week (before tax) ?

Does she care? I dont think so.  This is all about profit for them. What you have to go through to make them their profits is neither here nor there. 

gone wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 6:38pm:

Bam wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 6:34pm: gone wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 6:29pm: For as long as you Aussies are too cowardly to fill the streets in large numbers, on a regular basis, to strike and demonstrate, the corporate tyrants and their puppets in government will continue to squeeze more and more blood out of you.  ;) Everything is bargaining. If you don't bargain, you loose.  ;)  But for many decades the tyrants have used their media and told you that "whinging" is UnAustralian.  ;D So you unlearned to bargain and to stand up for your rights. You learned to put your head down submissively and lick their asses. And you were proud of it, because you thought, this is Austraaaaalian.  ;D They just fooled you, while they got rich of you.  ;) So when that nice union representative approaches you and asks if you wish to join the union, don't say no without thinking. Depends, my friend! If the company I work for pays into the union, I won't join it. As soon as the company starts paying into the union, they UNDERMINE it. It becomes an oxymoron.

The first job I got in school holidays in a factory (going back some time now) the management decided who the union delegate would be. I dont know if the union knew about it.   

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5^th, 2014 at 10:46pm:

gone wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 6:29pm: For as long as you Aussies are too cowardly to fill the streets in large numbers, on a regular basis, to strike and demonstrate, the corporate tyrants and their puppets in government will continue to squeeze more and more blood out of you.  ;) Everything is bargaining. If you don't bargain, you loose.  ;)  But for many decades the tyrants have used their media and told you that "whinging" is UnAustralian.  ;D So you unlearned to bargain and to stand up for your rights. You learned to put your head down submissively and lick their asses. And you were proud of it, because you thought, this is Austraaaaalian.  ;D They just fooled you, while they got rich of you.  ;) Haven't you heard of rthe game that used to run around Sydney - it's called 'Spot the Aussie' - in amongst all the immigrant groups who have ZERO idea what this country is about. Where are these 'Australians' these days?  All subsumed an inundated by crowds of people with no idea other than a hardscrabble existence..... Perfect fodder to give the vote to and fill with stupid ideas about issues like Unionism and wage structures - things they have no idea of....

Way to go Grappler. Its hard enough trying to get up a unified front to do something about the class war being waged by business since abbort got in without you trying to divide a wedge between us.  You're deluding yourself if you think "Aussies" are any better at defending their workplace rights then anyone else. Ive seen enough cowardly and down right ignorant "aussies in the workplace to know that's a myth. 

We don't really need higher wages. We really need to cut a lot of taxes and get rid of a lot of restrictions to small and medium businesses. So the cost of living comes down. That way the working people will be better off.

And the property bubble needs to burst. Excessive property cost is one of the major factors that drive up the cost of the end product, as every business needs property to operate.

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 4:55am:

I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not.

When I was talking to Ahovking about 12 months ago about how lowering trade barriers and signing free trade agreements was eroding aust wages and standard of living, he said that was BS. And now he tells us that he strongly believes that we have to cut wages.  Cutting wages to compete with slave labour O'seas is a mugs game. The only possible end is healthy profits for Ahovking and slave wages for everyone else all round.  And dont forget  Ahovking, contributes nothing to this economy. He employs o'seas but sells to the aust market to take advantage of our higher wages knowing that by the time aust wages reach parity he will have diversified or retired leaving our families to struggle with the miserable effects of constantly declining wages.  And all the time this guy who contributes nothing to our economy and takes every opportunity to talk down aust wages is getting tax concessions and welfare from this government, why??? Because he thinks he's entitled.  The age of entitlement.  Time we took a stand against these bludging bast@rds. 

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 4:59am:

buzzanddidj wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:32pm: Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 11:25am: I take it she's accepting an equivalent drop in salary and perks? If not she can be quiet.... Australia's top executives are starting to see their large salary bases decline, as investors cast more scrutiny over remuneration packages. But while fixed pay has decreased, cash bonuses have risen, with the bosses of Australia's leading companies still taking home almost 70 times the national average salary. Research by the Australian Council of Superannuation Investors and proxy advisory company Ownership Matters shows the average fixed salary for an ASX 100 executive fell 2.6 per cent to $1.9 million in the 2012 financial year. Including bonuses, Australia's top bosses took home an average of $4.7 million ... The 10-year trend, however, is much more stark, with executive fixed pay increasing almost three times as fast as inflation since 2002, and nearly 70 per cent faster than average wages growth http://www.smh.com.au/business/ceos-take-home-70-times-average-salary-20130919-2u2kl.html#ixzz3IBjR1OOP Its fascinating, 100 years ago, before minimum wage, before over regulations, wages for workers were increasing as fast as business profits, compare that to todays mess? Seems to me free market capitalism worked better than today mixed economy.

Unions and people's determination to fight capitalist greed gave us higher wages and improved living standards. Your made up story of capitalism increasing wages by its own volition doesn't convince anyone.  You're constant call for cuts to aust wages and elimination of the minimum wage (while collecting welfare, tax concessions and paying lower tax rates then PAYE tax payers) while paying slave wages o'seas is proof about where your system will take us unless we fi9ght back and soon. 

Dnarever wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 7:51am:

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises When talking about CPI based wage increases being negotiated we are primarily talking about Woolworths Bunnings and co. Most small business pay around bottom rates and are subject to the minimum wage case decision they would seldom have a union come in to negotiate an EBA. Most Need To Accept Wage Cuts Business Says Business have been saying this for at least the last 30 years - good times bad times and anywhere in between they cry poor and ask for no wage increases. This is not an honest claim and it never has been.

Most small business can only afford minimum wage, as the higher you push them the more business you will bankrupt, ive been forced to move overseas because i cant afford minimum wage and my parents twice have been force to sell off their business because they couldn't afford minimum wage,

People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business, but most business aren't huge money makers, Is it better living off "slave wages" while learning new skill which will enable you to secure a higher paying job later on or stuck on welfare?

As minimum wages increase, as government intervention increase, as business regulation increase the worst wage stagnation gets, the worst off workers become, the worst our society becomes.....

Business want to employ, the more workers you have the more you can produce, however higher the wages the fewer workers you can afford, the less you can produce and the less you can afford for higher wages.

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 12:25pm:

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not. When I was talking to Ahovking about 12 months ago about how lowering trade barriers and signing free trade agreements was eroding aust wages and standard of living, he said that was BS. And now he tells us that he strongly believes that we have to cut wages.  Cutting wages to compete with slave labour O'seas is a mugs game. The only possible end is healthy profits for Ahovking and slave wages for everyone else all round.  And dont forget  Ahovking, contributes nothing to this economy. He employs o'seas but sells to the aust market to take advantage of our higher wages knowing that by the time aust wages reach parity he will have diversified or retired leaving our families to struggle with the miserable effects of constantly declining wages.  And all the time this guy who contributes nothing to our economy and takes every opportunity to talk down aust wages is getting tax concessions and welfare from this government, why??? Because he thinks he's entitled.  The age of entitlement.  Time we took a stand against these bludging bast@rds.

Tell me again why i am unable to contributes anything to Australia? maybe because i cant afford Australian wages, taxs and regulations, i do contributes to the entertainment and stranded of living of Australians, 10-20 years ago, i could afford to hire Australians, but increased wages and regulations has single handy made employing Australians impossible for me and many other business, maybe when my business grows large, i can move jobs back but at the moment i'm forced out of Australia, but make no mistake i am contributing to Australia, i have seen people laugh and have been prised by customers for my products.

Plus like all capitalists and 99.9% of all business owners we agree corporate welfare need to end, however tax concessions are needed for small and middle size business to help pay for wages and etc, but for large business, they dont need tax concessions honestly.

What needs to be address isn't wages, but inflations thats making wages and business profits worth less and exploding cost of standards of living. 


gone wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 12:14pm:

We don't really need higher wages. We really need to cut a lot of taxes and get rid of a lot of restrictions to small and medium businesses. So the cost of living comes down. That way the working people will be better off. And the property bubble needs to burst. Excessive property cost is one of the major factors that drive up the cost of the end product, as every business needs property to operate.

This

Don't want to pay minimum wages.  And they wonder why people join unions.  Go figure.      :(

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 10:46pm:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 12:25pm: Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. John Smith wrote on Nov 5th, 2014 at 8:22am: the push to bring our wages to 3rd world standards is really in high gear now that the monkey is PM ... business needs to accept that this isn't China and our wages need to match our costs of living ... when was the last time business accepted a cut in profits? Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements, but small/middle business like mine, just cant, and would ether push the rest of us overseas or bankruptcy, most business are struggling as bad as workers today. Majority of business dont get corporate welfare and tax concessions often isnt that much, the left needs to stop views all business as one big business, because its not. When I was talking to Ahovking about 12 months ago about how lowering trade barriers and signing free trade agreements was eroding aust wages and standard of living, he said that was BS. And now he tells us that he strongly believes that we have to cut wages.  Cutting wages to compete with slave labour O'seas is a mugs game. The only possible end is healthy profits for Ahovking and slave wages for everyone else all round.  And dont forget  Ahovking, contributes nothing to this economy. He employs o'seas but sells to the aust market to take advantage of our higher wages knowing that by the time aust wages reach parity he will have diversified or retired leaving our families to struggle with the miserable effects of constantly declining wages.  And all the time this guy who contributes nothing to our economy and takes every opportunity to talk down aust wages is getting tax concessions and welfare from this government, why??? Because he thinks he's entitled.  The age of entitlement.  Time we took a stand against these bludging bast@rds.  Tell me again why i am unable to contributes anything to Australia? maybe because i cant afford Australian wages, taxs and regulations, i do contributes to the entertainment and stranded of living of Australians, 10-20 years ago, i could afford to hire Australians, but increased wages and regulations has single handy made employing Australians impossible for me and many other business, maybe when my business grows large, i can move jobs back but at the moment i'm forced out of Australia, but make no mistake i am contributing to Australia, i have seen people laugh and have been prised by customers for my products. Plus like all capitalists and 99.9% of all business owners we agree corporate welfare need to end, however tax concessions are needed for small and middle size business to help pay for wages and etc, but for large business, they dont need tax concessions honestly. What needs to be address isn't wages, but inflations thats making wages and business profits worth less and exploding cost of standards of living.  gone wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 12:14pm: We don't really need higher wages. We really need to cut a lot of taxes and get rid of a lot of restrictions to small and medium businesses. So the cost of living comes down. That way the working people will be better off. And the property bubble needs to burst. Excessive property cost is one of the major factors that drive up the cost of the end product, as every business needs property to operate. This

Because like every small business you're a victim of the royal societies who own all the largest corporations and banks. They control all reserve banks and they buy all major political parties in the world, so they get the policies they want. And their policies are to destroy all small businesses. You pay a lot more for business property nowadays ('thanks' to the property bubble, designed by the reserve banks who lend money they create out of thin air).

Because of GST, because of millions of restrictions to small businesses and because you don't get tax breaks, you can't hide your money in tax heavens like the big ones do. You can't buy the most cunning lawyers in the world and you're not member of a secret society like the Masons, Knights Templars etc., so you're not in the gang. You have neither the politicians nor the judges in your pocket. But don't worry. After the worldwide people's revolution the common people will start up from the ground again, without or minimal government control. 

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 10:22pm:

Dnarever wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 7:51am: Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises When talking about CPI based wage increases being negotiated we are primarily talking about Woolworths Bunnings and co. Most small business pay around bottom rates and are subject to the minimum wage case decision they would seldom have a union come in to negotiate an EBA. Most Need To Accept Wage Cuts Business Says Business have been saying this for at least the last 30 years - good times bad times and anywhere in between they cry poor and ask for no wage increases. This is not an honest claim and it never has been. Most small business can only afford minimum wage, as the higher you push them the more business you will bankrupt, ive been forced to move overseas because i cant afford minimum wage and my parents twice have been force to sell off their business because they couldn't afford minimum wage, People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business, but most business aren't huge money makers, Is it better living off "slave wages" while learning new skill which will enable you to secure a higher paying job later on or stuck on welfare? As minimum wages increase, as government intervention increase, as business regulation increase the worst wage stagnation gets, the worst off workers become, the worst our society becomes..... Business want to employ, the more workers you have the more you can produce, however higher the wages the fewer workers you can afford, the less you can produce and the less you can afford for higher wages.

People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business


And they are right, minimum wages are low level and really lousy, typical wage case minimum wage increases are very small. Any business which goes under as a result were doomed anyway not that it really happens.

crocodile wrote on Nov 6^th, 2014 at 9:57am:

Dnarever wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 8:03am: Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. . CPI measurement increases as a response to business increasing prices for the same product. i.e business is collecting more and the community is expected to pay more for the same product. We have a federal reserve bank purposely expanding the money supply to achieve 2 to 3% inflation. Business can increase prices as much as they want but it won't add to inflation unless demand doesn't drop or the good friends at the RBA print more money. In order to keep up with real money value pay rates need to reflect this change in order for the employer to be effectively paying his /her employees at the same rate as previously and at best this change lags by 12 months. The employees wages are always 12 months behind in the best case scenario, the employer has the advantage of keeping the employees wage for that period before passing it on. Works both ways. Employers have to wait and see how demand is going before adjusting their supply side. This is not productivity related. Increases above CPI would need to be justified in terms of productivity increases. In many cases substantial productivity increases have already been given with no associated wage justice. Productivity has been slipping away for over a decade.

We have a federal reserve bank purposely expanding the money supply to achieve 2 to 3% inflation. Business can increase prices as much as they want but it won't add to inflation unless demand doesn't drop or the good friends at the RBA print more money.

The CPI is a measure of changing prices in the market ?

Works both ways. Employers have to wait and see how demand is going before adjusting their supply side.

The CPI is a measure of the costs in the market place - these things have already been determined.

Productivity has been slipping away for over a decade.


Not due to employees.

Dnarever wrote on Nov 7^th, 2014 at 3:12pm:

Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 10:22pm: Dnarever wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 7:51am: Pantheon wrote on Nov 6th, 2014 at 4:55am: I strongly agree that if unions and employees continue to expect inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements it would result in total disaster. Majority of business are struggling and by pushing for inflation-linked pay rises without productivity improvements to pay for the increase in wages, all your doing is simply bankrupting the people who employ workers, When i talk about business struggling i'm not talking about woolies, bunnies, Kmart, big business can handle inflation-linked pay rises When talking about CPI based wage increases being negotiated we are primarily talking about Woolworths Bunnings and co. Most small business pay around bottom rates and are subject to the minimum wage case decision they would seldom have a union come in to negotiate an EBA. Most Need To Accept Wage Cuts Business Says Business have been saying this for at least the last 30 years - good times bad times and anywhere in between they cry poor and ask for no wage increases. This is not an honest claim and it never has been. Most small business can only afford minimum wage, as the higher you push them the more business you will bankrupt, ive been forced to move overseas because i cant afford minimum wage and my parents twice have been force to sell off their business because they couldn't afford minimum wage, People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business, but most business aren't huge money makers, Is it better living off "slave wages" while learning new skill which will enable you to secure a higher paying job later on or stuck on welfare? As minimum wages increase, as government intervention increase, as business regulation increase the worst wage stagnation gets, the worst off workers become, the worst our society becomes..... Business want to employ, the more workers you have the more you can produce, however higher the wages the fewer workers you can afford, the less you can produce and the less you can afford for higher wages. People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business And they are right, minimum wages are low level and really lousy, typical wage case minimum wage increases are very small. Any business which goes under as a result were doomed anyway not that it really happens.

Quote:

People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business

Same goes for penalty rates...

:)

Business receiving energy supply at half todays costs do not need to slash workers wages, they need to ask the LNP why they so opposed to both the worker and the business receiving energy supply at half price.

---

wrote on Nov 7^th, 2014 at 6:21am:

Don't want to pay minimum wages.  And they wonder why people join unions.  Go figure.      :(

Union member ship is declining and so is their power and influence, why? because most business now does are paying more than minimum wage, and as the economy continue to move away from manufacturing to services, wages become larger and larger.

For many workers, wages aren't the problem, the problem is rising cost of living.


gone wrote on Nov 7^th, 2014 at 2:27pm:

Because like every small business you're a victim of the royal societies who own all the largest corporations and banks. They control all reserve banks and they buy all major political parties in the world, so they get the policies they want. And their policies are to destroy all small businesses. You pay a lot more for business property nowadays ('thanks' to the property bubble, designed by the reserve banks who lend money they create out of thin air). Because of GST, because of millions of restrictions to small businesses and because you don't get tax breaks, you can't hide your money in tax heavens like the big ones do. You can't buy the most cunning lawyers in the world and you're not member of a secret society like the Masons, Knights Templars etc., so you're not in the gang. You have neither the politicians nor the judges in your pocket. But don't worry. After the worldwide people's revolution the common people will start up from the ground again, without or minimal government control.

I fully agree, as far as i see it, Small business need as much protect as workers, these policys to "help" the poor and the low wage earners only seem to benefit the largest corporations and banks and not improving the living standards of the poor and the low wage earners.


Dnarever wrote on Nov 7^th, 2014 at 3:12pm:

People say if you cant afford to pay minimum wage then you shouldn't be in business And they are right, minimum wages are low level and really lousy, typical wage case minimum wage increases are very small. Any business which goes under as a result were doomed anyway not that it really happens.

Minimum Wages only seem low level and really lousy because of inflation and rising cost of living, it only addresses the symptom and not the cause, as we have seen, Minimum Wages has not help improve the living stranded of the worker or has it improved employment or show any long term benefits,  why? because it only addresses the symptom and not the cause.

My business isn't focus on profits, we want to benefit the life's of our customers, this is why my profit margin is so small, in fact it is very close to profit margins of government owner businesses, are you saying, i should rise prices and become greedy and make it all about profits?

Dnarever wrote on Nov 7^th, 2014 at 3:14pm:

We have a federal reserve bank purposely expanding the money supply to achieve 2 to 3% inflation. Business can increase prices as much as they want but it won't add to inflation unless demand doesn't drop or the good friends at the RBA print more money. The CPI is a measure of changing prices in the market ? Inflation is a decline in the value of money. This is reflected in rising prices. The action of the RBA in controlling the size of the money supply is quite deliberate in its aims to achieve the 2 - 3% target Works both ways. Employers have to wait and see how demand is going before adjusting their supply side. The CPI is a measure of the costs in the market place - these things have already been determined. They're are determined after a statistical measure. They aren't instantaneous. Productivity has been slipping away for over a decade. Not due to employees. Employees aren't a sizeable influence on productivity.