Yet another convention thrown out the door, Abbott is going to make Rudd/Gillard Cabinet papers available to the witch trial.

http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html

Of course—this could be turned onto the Libs in the fullness of time, guess the monkey can’t look that far ahead, just wants to destroy and hurt his infinite betters.

They get more rancid by the day, this lot.

I have to wonder what it will take to wake people up?

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 21^st, 2014 at 9:05pm:

Yet another convention thrown out the door, Abbott is going to make Rudd/Gillard Cabinet papers available to the witch trial. http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html Of course—this could be turned onto the Libs in the fullness of time, guess the monkey can’t look that far ahead, just wants to destroy and hurt his infinite betters.

I thought transparency was paramount. While he's at it I would like the file on alleged justice Lionel Murphy unsealed so that we can see what the turd was up to.

Just proves the extent to which Onya Tone will go to score cheap points against an opponent.

Hawke is spot on. This attacks the very heart of the democratic system.

Abbott doesn't care what he trashes, as long as he get maximum exposure for his witch hunts.

salad in wrote on Feb 21^st, 2014 at 9:12pm:

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 21st, 2014 at 9:05pm: Yet another convention thrown out the door, Abbott is going to make Rudd/Gillard Cabinet papers available to the witch trial. http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html Of course—this could be turned onto the Libs in the fullness of time, guess the monkey can’t look that far ahead, just wants to destroy and hurt his infinite betters. I thought transparency was paramount. While he's at it I would like the file on alleged justice Lionel Murphy unsealed so that we can see what the turd was up to.

transparency doesn't mean you get to give away all the secrets  .....  :D :D :D

There are plenty of reasons why the Abbott government have so quickly become known to all as our worst ever government.


Quote:

Mr Hawke said it was ''almost beyond belief that the government could contemplate doing anything which breaches what is now a more than century-old tradition here, which has been respected by governments and parties of both persuasions''

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html#ixzz2txFzp5k6

This is what you get when you have a nasty PM with no respect for anything. Tony has smoothly transitioned from our worst ever opposition leader to the corresponding position in government.

I don't recall any other PM using the office for retribution and revenge.

salad in wrote on Feb 21^st, 2014 at 9:12pm:

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 21st, 2014 at 9:05pm: Yet another convention thrown out the door, Abbott is going to make Rudd/Gillard Cabinet papers available to the witch trial. http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html Of course—this could be turned onto the Libs in the fullness of time, guess the monkey can’t look that far ahead, just wants to destroy and hurt his infinite betters. I thought transparency was paramount. While he's at it I would like the file on alleged justice Lionel Murphy unsealed so that we can see what the turd was up to.

But we don't want any transparency with the secret borders policy, it's too important to keep transgressions into foreign waters and illegal treatment of refugees hidden.

Dnarever wrote on Feb 21^st, 2014 at 9:28pm:

salad in wrote on Feb 21st, 2014 at 9:12pm: St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 21st, 2014 at 9:05pm: Yet another convention thrown out the door, Abbott is going to make Rudd/Gillard Cabinet papers available to the witch trial. http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html Of course—this could be turned onto the Libs in the fullness of time, guess the monkey can’t look that far ahead, just wants to destroy and hurt his infinite betters. I thought transparency was paramount. While he's at it I would like the file on alleged justice Lionel Murphy unsealed so that we can see what the turd was up to. But we don't want any transparency with the secret borders policy, it's too important to keep transgressions into foreign waters and illegal treatment of refugees hidden.

But thats different, that keeps out all those nasty terrorists trying to come in by the back door to blow us up ...  :D :D :D :D

If he's going to be so disrespectful of conventions, he should be mindful of another - that the Senate does not block supply.

Dnarever wrote on Feb 21^st, 2014 at 9:25pm:

There are plenty of reasons why the Abbott government have so quickly become known to all as our worst ever government. Quote: Mr Hawke said it was ''almost beyond belief that the government could contemplate doing anything which breaches what is now a more than century-old tradition here, which has been respected by governments and parties of both persuasions'' Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/battle-brews-over-release-of-cabinet-papers-to-royal-commission-on-home-insulation-scheme-20140221-337r0.html#ixzz2txFzp5k6 This is what you get when you have a nasty PM with no respect for anything. Tony has smoothly transitioned from our worst ever opposition leader to the corresponding position in government. I don't recall any other PM using the office for retribution and revenge.

We never had an ape as PM before.

If our worst ever PM's - Rudd & Gillard - have nothing to hide, then they have nothing to fear from this...

Lots of Progs frothing at the mouth it seems.

John Smith wrote on Feb 21^st, 2014 at 9:21pm:

transparency doesn't mean you get to give away all the secrets  .....  :D :D :D

The secrets of roof insulation v the secrets of border security; how to decide which is more important. I just hope that our secret formula for making roof insulation material doesn't fall into the wrong hands.

As long as Abbott hands out every cabinet document from the Howard years as well....but I bet ya he doesn't  ;D

Its just all a part of Abbotts attempt to create a one party dictatorship in this country 

No problem

Labor will eventually returned (2016 hopefully) & then I can see all cabinet documents on "Operation Sovereign Borders" being released to the Hague, along with as another poster pointed out all those to do with Iraq.
It will be sweet schadenfreude as we watch 95% of the last 2 Liberal Governments be indited for crimes against humanity & warrants for their arrest issued, forcing them into exile.

The question will be then does the government freeze their assets & cancel their entitlements?

Good enough for Slobodan Milošević good enough for this lot of would be dictators

Let's hold another Royal Commission into the AWB scandal - a real one with proper terms of reference - and crack open Howard's cabinet papers.

salad in wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 8:11am:

John Smith wrote on Feb 21st, 2014 at 9:21pm: transparency doesn't mean you get to give away all the secrets  .....  :D :D :D The secrets of roof insulation v the secrets of border security; how to decide which is more important. I just hope that our secret formula for making roof insulation material doesn't fall into the wrong hands.

you don't decide .... thats the whole point .... you seriously aren't going to be dumb enough to support this?

I don't care what you think of Rudd or Gillard, you don't throw away a century old convention just for political gain. These conventions have been developed over the years for a reason.

Don't fool yourself that it's about truth or honesty, it's not, this is purely politically driven.

If you want transparency in an enquiry then they need all documents.

Sorry but why kick up a fuss unless there's something to hide???

I have no problem with opening them up.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 8:31am:

If you want transparency in an enquiry then they need all documents. Sorry but why kick up a fuss unless there's something to hide??? I have no problem with opening them up.

I agree...all cabinet documents should always be immediately available to the public after every cabinet meeting.
There should be no secrets from this or any previous government.

The stimulus package enacted by the Rudd Government was widely regarded as a success to keep Australia out of recession and stimulate the economy during a global downturn in growth......This is Abbotts attempt to undermine the stimulus program and the former Labor Government.....If the ALP do not learn from this and enact their own pay back when they are next in office I will be surprised.....The ALP should sack every former Coalition MP from every post they have been given by the Abbott Government as a matter of principle and the reasons for the Iraq war and the AWB scandal should be a good starting point for the ALP to enact operation pay back!!!

:) :) :)

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 8:27am:

No problem Labor will eventually returned (2016 hopefully) & then I can see all cabinet documents on "Operation Sovereign Borders" being released to the Hague, along with as another poster pointed out all those to do with Iraq. It will be sweet schadenfreude as we watch 95% of the last 2 Liberal Governments be indited for crimes against humanity & warrants for their arrest issued, forcing them into exile. The question will be then does the government freeze their assets & cancel their entitlements? Good enough for Slobodan Milošević good enough for this lot of would be dictators

I'd also like to see the documents leading up to the Iraq invasion and the asbestos industry cover up.
I'm also interested to see how Abbott planned on skimming over this mountain of lies he's building as well as an investigation into his Sydney Uni days and having Pauline Hanson sent to prison on false charges..When Labor gets back into power they are gonna be very busy "doing an abbott" to the Liberal Party  :D

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 8:27am:

No problem Labor will eventually returned (2016 hopefully) & then I can see all cabinet documents on "Operation Sovereign Borders" being released to the Hague, along with as another poster pointed out all those to do with Iraq. It will be sweet schadenfreude as we watch 95% of the last 2 Liberal Governments be indited for crimes against humanity & warrants for their arrest issued, forcing them into exile. The question will be then does the government freeze their assets & cancel their entitlements? Good enough for Slobodan Milošević good enough for this lot of would be dictators

;D ;D ;D   Does it hurt when you jerk it ?

;D ;D ;D

Thank you once again for an insightful thought provoking addition to the discussion.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 8:31am:

If you want transparency in an enquiry then they need all documents. Sorry but why kick up a fuss unless there's something to hide??? I have no problem with opening them up.

Geez, you never think anything through, do you?

Destroy cabinet confidentiality (that is what apeman is doing and it is aimed at his ministers as much or more than at Rudd/Garrett/Gillard) and ministers will not feel free to speak up in dissent at cabinet meetings—the most vapid, stupid motions will get approved.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 8:31am:

If you want transparency in an enquiry then they need all documents.

Rubbish. Firstly, it is a breach of cabinet confidentiality, and secondly, documents aren't needed with the wide-ranging powers that the witch hunt Royal Commission grants.


Quote:

Sorry but why kick up a fuss unless there's something to hide???

There's nothing to hide. A Royal Commission has wide-ranging powers of disclosure already.

Cabinet confidentiality exists for a reason.

Now imagine it's 2017, and the new Shorten government is seeking cabinet documents to give to one of several Royal Commissions that he is setting up - the handling of asylum seekers under the Abbott/Turnbull government, the AWB scandal, the invasion of Iraq and Abbott's perjury that led to the jailing of Pauline Hanson on false allegations.

Now think about it. Think carefully. Would you think that is okay?


Quote:

I have no problem with opening them up.

Only because you cannot see the implications and have no idea why cabinet confidentiality is important.

Think about this: PRECEDENT.

I say go for it...I am interested in what happened during the Howard years as well as whats going on right now in phony tonys cabinet.

Lets get it ALL out in the open  :D

When this is turned on the current government and their supporters complain I'll be here to say "I told you so!".

Release all the documents you want - this is a precedent which will come back to bite them!

Before you don your cassocks and pronounce yourselves holier than thou, it may be time to pause and consider what documents might be handed to a Royal Commission.
There are some documents -  Cabinet discussion papers, Cabinet Minutes - which are properly the subject of confidentiality. Far too long imo.
And there are documents, as may very well be the case here, which have been improperly stamped Cabinet in Confidence, such as letters from Baldy to Krudd, and without which a Royal Commission would not be able to deliver a judgement.
Time will tell.

adelcrow wrote on Feb 22^nd, 2014 at 11:35am:

I say go for it...I am interested in what happened during the Howard years as well as whats going on right now in phony tonys cabinet. Lets get it ALL out in the open  :D

If there is a High Court challenge and it is struck down then all the cards or on the table.....All politicians will then know anything said in cabinet can he used against them!!!

:) :) :)

If anyone had any doubt that this Royal Commission is nothing but a political witch-hunt, then that doubt would have been blown away by this.

The linked article makes all the relevant points, and you can bet your last rupee that if Abbott gets away with this, there will be naked revenge attacks on LNP Cabinet documents.

Politics is a dirty game but there are/were a few Rules which both sides abided by.  Abbott just trashed one of the most important ones, and it will take a moral backbone probably beyond the ALP not to hit back at the first available opportunity.

And we will all suffer for it.