Indonesia steps up protests against Australia's border protection policies

Date
    February 15, 2014


Indonesia has added to its protests against the Abbott government's border protection policies, hauling Australia's ambassador into the foreign affairs ministry for a dressing down.      :(

Indonesian Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa said he had told ambassador Greg Moriarty in a meeting this week that Australia's use of lifeboats to return asylum seekers was an ''unacceptable'' escalation of its border protection policy, Indonesian news magazine Tempo reported on its website.

Fairfax Media has independently confirmed the meeting took place. The use of lifeboats has been a key development in Australia's boat turnback policy - a policy Indonesia has vehemently opposed.      :(

The purchase of about 12 of the sophisticated lifeboats is a way of neutralising the people smugglers' tactic of deliberately scuttling boats when Australian navy or Customs ships approach, leaving the Australians no choice but to rescue the asylum seekers from the water and take them to Christmas Island.


As the opposition leading up to the September election, the Coalition defended its turnback policy, saying it would only be returning Indonesian-flagged and -crewed boats that had departed from Indonesian ports.

Dr Natalegawa said the use of lifeboats represented a more serious violation of Australia's commitments to the refugee convention than its previous policies. He said Australian ships should take the asylum seekers onboard for processing.      

Customs and border protection chief Mike Pezzullo has acknowledged there is a ''public interest'' in releasing at least parts of a report into how Australian ships accidentally breached Indonesian territory.

But with Mr Pezzullo and Chief of the Defence Force David Hurley understood to be considering the report, the Customs chief refused to guarantee any of it would be released.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/indonesia-steps-up-protests-against-australias-border-protection-policies-20140214-32rdo.html#ixzz2tKuVFk6F

Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem.

Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia.

Swagman wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 9:47am:

Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia.

;) ;) ;) ;)

wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 8:05am:

Indonesia steps up protests against Australia's border protection policies Date     February 15, 2014 Indonesia has added to its protests against the Abbott government's border protection policies, hauling Australia's ambassador into the foreign affairs ministry for a dressing down.      :( Indonesian Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa said he had told ambassador Greg Moriarty in a meeting this week that Australia's use of lifeboats to return asylum seekers was an ''unacceptable'' escalation of its border protection policy, Indonesian news magazine Tempo reported on its website. Fairfax Media has independently confirmed the meeting took place. The use of lifeboats has been a key development in Australia's boat turnback policy - a policy Indonesia has vehemently opposed.      :( The purchase of about 12 of the sophisticated lifeboats is a way of neutralising the people smugglers' tactic of deliberately scuttling boats when Australian navy or Customs ships approach, leaving the Australians no choice but to rescue the asylum seekers from the water and take them to Christmas Island. As the opposition leading up to the September election, the Coalition defended its turnback policy, saying it would only be returning Indonesian-flagged and -crewed boats that had departed from Indonesian ports. Dr Natalegawa said the use of lifeboats represented a more serious violation of Australia's commitments to the refugee convention than its previous policies. He said Australian ships should take the asylum seekers onboard for processing.       Customs and border protection chief Mike Pezzullo has acknowledged there is a ''public interest'' in releasing at least parts of a report into how Australian ships accidentally breached Indonesian territory. But with Mr Pezzullo and Chief of the Defence Force David Hurley understood to be considering the report, the Customs chief refused to guarantee any of it would be released. Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/national/indonesia-steps-up-protests-against-australias-border-protection-policies-20140214-32rdo.html#ixzz2tKuVFk6F

Have we been asking Indonesia for years to do something (other than turn a blind eye and rake in the bribes) about illegal boat departures from its ports?
Yes.

Has Abbott been signalling for years that if elected he will stop them?
Yes


And what has Indonesia done to stop those hundreds and hundreds of illegal boats departing from its ports?
Nothing.



The indonesians have been either incredibly stupid or alarmingly mendacious all along.

Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it???

>:( >:( >:(

are they protesting about our media bequething the drug mule $2 million.  fair enough.

oh, the boats.....tell them to f^^k off.  who rebuilt all those villages  after the tsunami.

who trained their military   ;) ;)

philperth2010 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 12:15pm:

Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it??? >:( >:( >:(

What a load of tosh!

Any boats full of these queue jumpers which are returned from whence they came, in a safe seaworthy vessel instead of the dangerous wreck they were attempting their journey in, should be grateful to the Australian Government for stopping this suicidal trip which they paid many thousands of US dollars for.

If anybody is to blame should their be a tragedy, look at the Indonesian government which allows them to set sail; look at the previous Australian (Labor) government who did nothing to put an end to these boats, but allowed the situation to get worse year after year for six years!

philperth2010 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 12:15pm:

Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it??? >:( >:( >:(

And you are quivering in joyful expectation, fingers crossed just panting for images of dead country shoppers lapping in the tide against a beach with the wrecked oz lifeboat in shot.

You would lurrrrrve it, all your luvvie dreams answered and you get to wet your pants in anticipating forcing the government to announce open borders and offer invitations just like Rudd.

philperth2010 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 12:15pm:

Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it??? >:( >:( >:(

Indonesia will be responsible if that happens in Indonesian territory.
But it won't happen because these are virtually indestructible life boats, not floating wrecks the illegals set out on. These boats save lives.

Soren wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 12:48pm:

But it won't happen because these are virtually indestructible life boats

they said the same about the titanic

philperth2010 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 12:15pm:

Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it??? >:( >:( >:(

Those rocks off an Indonesian shoreline you mean.
How about the Indonesian crew taking some responsibility.
Who do you think is responsible.
Abbott is not responsible for the Costa Concordia or any other shipping accident in foreign waters.

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 3:36pm:

philperth2010 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 12:15pm: Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it??? >:( >:( >:( Those rocks off an Indonesian shoreline you mean. How about the Indonesian crew taking some responsibility. Who do you think is responsible. Abbott is not responsible for the Costa Concordia or any other shipping accident in foreign waters.

Maybe I can help here.  I've been promoting the 'common sense' explanation for the existence of those 'orange' life boats, which is:

Our mob lay doggie in wait, knowing a leaky boat full of refugees is heading our way.  That leaky boat hits Aussie waters and we pounce.

We ignore pleas for 'asylum,' and transfer all onto one of our you beaut orange life boats.  We attach a tow line, and tow that orange thing back through international waters, and into Indonesian waters, where we set them adrift.

So, if one of those orange boats founder and people die, I guess it ain't too hard to work out where ultimate responsibility lies.

With the illegal immigrants who decided to break our laws and enter the country without a valid visa? We are simply helping them out with a more seaworthy vessel after they sunk their own.

It looks like Abbotts attempts at refugee bashing for personal political gain has made us an international laughing stock and put us in the bad books with our Allies and neighbours.

Who knew that was going to happen?   ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Keatingisgod wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:05pm:

With the illegal immigrants who decided to break our laws and enter the country without a valid visa? We are simply helping them out with a more seaworthy vessel after they sunk their own.

Oh, really?  Where in my scenario was there any mention of 'seaworthy.'  Did you not notice that it is highly likely that as soon as any boat with refugees on board arrives within contact of an Aussie vessel, the people on board will claim asylum, thus invoking our UNHCR obligations.  There are two scenarios.

1.  Our lot are acting like pirates, and they are unlawfully boarding vessels in International waters, and forcing people into our orange boats.

2.  Our lot are waiting until the vessel gets into our waters, and the same thing happens.

In either case, that orange boat is towed back (by our mob) through international waters and let loose somewhere near Indonesia.

Swagman wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 9:47am:

Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia.

DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and
do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS.

The current travesty of a policy is an abomination.

Kat wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:20pm:

Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination.

People are easily manipulated by fear and hatred and Abbott has tapped into that to cover up what a crap job he is doing with the countries economy and rising unemployment.
Beat up on reffos and minority groups and you cant lose..it worked in pre war Europe and now its working in Australia.

Kat wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:20pm:

Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination.

Really are you sure


How many would be too many with this new and improved open door policy?


After this magic number has been reach how will the flood be stemmed or are we Australians just going to let them come until we are overrun?


It's all well and good to go to an extreme soft cock approach to tough decisions, but like the greens you will never have to do anything about it. We don't want friggen millions of reffos coming here ang living on welfare; our welfare bill is nearly $30 billion now and growing, who the bugger is going top pay for all of this?


We had them killing themselve in the hundreds, how about we just get them to come in through the front door, like they are supposed to and in the numbers they are supposed to.


And please don't go all batsh1t about tourist overstaying their visas, because i don't give a bugger about some backpacker overstaying a week or two because they like the beer and pies here.

Kat wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:20pm:

Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination.

...and hence Australians want the boats stopped. Which would solve both sides' problem.

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:48pm:

Kat wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:20pm: Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination. Really are you sure How many would be too many with this new and improved open door policy? After this magic number has been reach how will the flood be stemmed or are we Australians just going to let them come until we are overrun? It's all well and good to go to an extreme soft cock approach to tough decisions, but like the greens you will never have to do anything about it. We don't want friggen millions of reffos coming here ang living on welfare; our welfare bill is nearly $30 billion now and growing, who the bugger is going top pay for all of this? We had them killing themselve in the hundreds, how about we just get them to come in through the front door, like they are supposed to and in the numbers they are supposed to. And please don't go all batsh1t about tourist overstaying their visas, because i don't give a bugger about some backpacker overstaying a week or two because they like the beer and pies here.

Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out?

Aussie wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:52pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:48pm: Kat wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:20pm: Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination. Really are you sure How many would be too many with this new and improved open door policy? After this magic number has been reach how will the flood be stemmed or are we Australians just going to let them come until we are overrun? It's all well and good to go to an extreme soft cock approach to tough decisions, but like the greens you will never have to do anything about it. We don't want friggen millions of reffos coming here ang living on welfare; our welfare bill is nearly $30 billion now and growing, who the bugger is going top pay for all of this? We had them killing themselve in the hundreds, how about we just get them to come in through the front door, like they are supposed to and in the numbers they are supposed to. And please don't go all batsh1t about tourist overstaying their visas, because i don't give a bugger about some backpacker overstaying a week or two because they like the beer and pies here. Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out?

Well it cant have anything to do with drownings because most of the people Abbott has turned around were safely within spitting distance of Christmas Island  :D

Aussie wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:52pm:

Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out?

I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you?

I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder.


If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:59pm:

Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year

I think You'll find along with cuts in refugee aid Abbott is also cutting the numbers we accept.
All that is happening is that countries like the USA, Canada and UK are taking up our slack while we revert back to the White Australia policies that turned us into a redneck backwater and international laughing stock.

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:59pm:

Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year

Near as I can tell, it is Abbott promoting Operation Sovereign Borders so that refugees on Achmed's boats don't drown.

Did I get that wrong?

:)

Aussie wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 5:05pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:59pm: Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year Near as I can tell, it is Abbott promoting Operation Sovereign Borders so that refugees on Achmed's boats don't drown. Did I get that wrong? :)

Yes, you got it wrong.

Keatingisgod wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 5:32pm:

Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 5:05pm: BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:59pm: Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year Near as I can tell, it is Abbott promoting Operation Sovereign Borders so that refugees on Achmed's boats don't drown. Did I get that wrong? :) Yes, you got it wrong.

Oh....please explain.  I am certain I have seen Abbott saying many times that Operation Sovereign Borders was all about stopping people drowning at sea in one of Achmed's boats.  Really, was I wrong about that cods?  This was not about stopping Achmed's people smuggling 'model?'

Quote:

This was not about stopping Achmed's people smuggling 'model?'

That's a different assertion to your previous assertion. Would you like some more goal posts to shift?

Keatingisgod wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 6:09pm:

Quote: This was not about stopping Achmed's people smuggling 'model?' That's a different assertion to your previous assertion. Would you like some more goal posts to shift?

Bye bye.

I accept your surrender.

Kat wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:20pm:

Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination.

We are meeting our obligations by resettling 13 thousand refugees a year.

We just don't want illegal immigrants pretending to be refugees. There is no obligation to accept illegal immigrants who pretend to be refugees.

Kat wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:20pm:

Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination.

One could say that with the 13,000 refugees we accept annually means we are already meeting our international obligations.
And one could also say that allowing foreign criminal people smugglers to operate with impunity is grossly stupid and has nothing to do with international 'obligations'.
Smuggling people is a crime.

adelcrow wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 5:05pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:59pm: Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year I think You'll find along with cuts in refugee aid Abbott is also cutting the numbers we accept.

This is your conspiracy theory imagination at play only eh.
The government has not flagged any intention to do this whatsoever.

adelcrow wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 5:05pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:59pm: Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year I think You'll find along with cuts in refugee aid Abbott is also cutting the numbers we accept. All that is happening is that countries like the USA, Canada and UK are taking up our slack while we revert back to the White Australia policies that turned us into a redneck backwater and international laughing stock.

That redneck backwater and international laughing stock, that's just adelaide

UnSubRocky wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 4:51pm:

Kat wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:20pm: Swagman wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 9:47am: Australia got rid of the useless Labor Govt that caused the illegal boat problem. Australians want the illegal boats stopped.  Stuff Indonesia. DECENT Australians want Australia to face-up to its international obligations and do the right thing by these ASYLUM SEEKERS. The current travesty of a policy is an abomination. ...and hence Australians want the boats stopped. Which would solve both sides' problem.

I am not sure exactly what  it is... about changing a system that wasnt broke.. so that over 50.000 welfare recipients and over 1000 adults and children drowned...all in the space of 6 years.....

what on earth makes that DECENT????? >:( >:(

what makes making people smugglers wealthy... DECENT......what makes children getting bashed to death on rocks.. DECENT... >:( >:(

The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election.

We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves.

If the Indonesians and the progressives are unhappy then I'm in heaven. Them being unhappy is always a great indication.

Sparky wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 9:57am:

If the Indonesians and the progressives are unhappy then I'm in heaven. Them being unhappy is always a great indication.

What have you got against Indonesians, Sparky?

It has to be noted that Indonesia's taking to lecturing Australia on its obligations under the Refugee Convention is pretty rich given Indonesia is not a signatory.

("In the past when they have turned back the boats, or pulled the refugee boats back to Indonesia, that alone is a violation against their international commitment under the Refugee Convention." - Indonesia's foreign affairs minister Marty Natalegawa).

Would Indonesia prefer that Australia withdraw from the agreement?

Or is it an early indication that Indonesia will sign on itself?

By signing up itself, Indonesia could then fulfil its (religious) obligations to its Muslim brothers who seek asylum who are in transit or in detention within Indonesia escaping persecution.

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 9:24am:

The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election.

Bad form Abbott not keeping a dud Labor policy eh.

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 9:24am:

The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves.

Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus.

Karnal wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 10:48am:

Sparky wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:57am: If the Indonesians and the progressives are unhappy then I'm in heaven. Them being unhappy is always a great indication. What have you got against Indonesians, Sparky?

When I say Indonesians I mean their government. Just because of the general disrespect they show Australia.

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 9:24am:

The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves.

hopefully deathridesahorse will leave because of the internet problem and all the trade unionists who killed manufacturing can go.
and since we are a pariah state , all the do gooders will leave.

me and campbell newman, gina and twiggy forrest should then have the place to ourselves to do some tunnelling.

sounds like bliss

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 11:13am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:24am: The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. Bad form Abbott not keeping a dud Labor policy eh.

tonys a big spending compassionate, jesuit trained, social democrat.  he's left of barack obama.  the guy has no place calling himself a conservative. 
put morrison in charge  ;)

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 11:13am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:24am: The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. Bad form Abbott not keeping a dud Labor policy eh.

Labor never rose the quota to 20,000 - it was an election promise.

Abbott would have been smart to raise the quota. Sure, no one notices numbers in this debate, and the rise would be yesterday’s news within 24 hours, but Abbott could have claimed the high moral ground and brought the churches into the tent.

At present, they’re damning the Libs to hell.

If Abbott can shake the racist Howard-era boat policy stigma, he can begin to reform himself. He’s already trying to soften his image with his take on Aboriginal issues. If Abbott wanted to be the conviction politician Rupert Murdoch thinks he is, he could do a David Cameron and take the edge off blunt policies like Nauru/Manus Island and his veiled Indonesian taunts.

Abbott could reach out to the centre by making some very small, if not symbolic, concessions. Raising the refugee quota would give his tough border action some heart. Abbott needs desperately to show there’s something nice about him.

Let’s face it, Abbott’s not making any friends with farmers, business, unions, and after the budget is leaked, everyone else. None of the impending long-term economic woes are Abbott’s fault, but the boat issue is entirely his own making. No one would have noticed refugees if Abbott, Alan and the Tele didn’t stage a joint opera for 5 years over 60,000 boat people.

But they did, and Abbott is now reaping the rewards. The navy are now getting results, which is starting - ever so slightly - to make Abbott look less like a flat foot. If the Navy succeed in preventing boats entering without any deaths, popular opinion may well come around to the idea that there was always some sense in turning back boats.

But Abbott won’t be forgiven if he doesn’t give the luvvies something. They never forgave Howard, and in the end, their criticisms came home to roost. A large "not happy John"  minoririty in 2003 became a landslide in Kevin 07. Ultimately, Workchoices did it, but the electorate still smelt something fishy over Children Overboard, the Pacific Solution, and of course, the Iraq War. Howard’s demise would not have been so jubulant without the sins of his Tampa past.

The same will happen to Abbott if he doesn’t claim the centre. With economic dark clouds on the horizon, he is shaping up to be one unpopular leader if he doesn’t develop a conscience.

This is, after all, why he’s in politics. Abbott’s not a dry, he’s a social conservative. Abbott doesn’t have the faintest care for economic issues. His bent is his own take on social justice and reclaiming the country from the sinister forces of the left. Abbott’s soul is in the church, but he is rapidly alienating this group. When the cuts come (and the charity sector loses valuable contracts), he’ll push them even further away.

If Abbott’s smart, he’ll soften up. If his natural instincts for biffo aren’t buffeted , he will be a two term PM - at best.

Not bad, but this is not what the Libs are settling in for.

BigOl64 wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 8:51am:

adelcrow wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 5:05pm: BigOl64 wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:59pm: Aussie wrote on Feb 15th, 2014 at 4:52pm: Is that about people drowning after getting on unseaworthy boats, or keeping the 'brown people' out? I don't give a fat bugger if they are 'brown', well not as much as you seem to; what's that matter scared of non-whites are you? I do give a bugger about leftards constantly whinging about reffos drowning, but as usual those morons having no real solutions, other than to whinge louder. If they know they will never get here by boat, then even the biggest moron will not even bother and stand in line like the actual reffos we take every year I think You'll find along with cuts in refugee aid Abbott is also cutting the numbers we accept. All that is happening is that countries like the USA, Canada and UK are taking up our slack while we revert back to the White Australia policies that turned us into a redneck backwater and international laughing stock. That redneck backwater and international laughing stock, that's just adelaide

Wow..all you seem to have these days is personal abuse of fellow forum members.
Cmon....wheres the bigol64 who used to have witty and insightful comments to back up his arguments?

Soren wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 1:18pm:

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:24am: The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves. Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus.

This is just what is happening.

Karnal wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 4:06pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 11:13am: St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:24am: The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. Bad form Abbott not keeping a dud Labor policy eh. Labor never rose the quota to 20,000 - it was an election promise. Abbott would have been smart to raise the quota. Sure, no one notices numbers in this debate, and the rise would be yesterday’s news within 24 hours, but Abbott could have claimed the high moral ground and brought the churches into the tent. At present, they’re damning the Libs to hell. If Abbott can shake the racist Howard-era boat policy stigma, he can begin to reform himself. He’s already trying to soften his image with his take on Aboriginal issues. If Abbott wanted to be the conviction politician Rupert Murdoch thinks he is, he could do a David Cameron and take the edge off blunt policies like Nauru/Manus Island and his veiled Indonesian taunts. Abbott could reach out to the centre by making some very small, if not symbolic, concessions. Raising the refugee quota would give his tough border action some heart. Abbott needs desperately to show there’s something nice about him. Let’s face it, Abbott’s not making any friends with farmers, business, unions, and after the budget is leaked, everyone else. None of the impending long-term economic woes are Abbott’s fault, but the boat issue is entirely his own making. No one would have noticed refugees if Abbott, Alan and the Tele didn’t stage a joint opera for 5 years over 60,000 boat people. But they did, and Abbott is now reaping the rewards. The navy are now getting results, which is starting - ever so slightly - to make Abbott look less like a flat foot. If the Navy succeed in preventing boats entering without any deaths, popular opinion may well come around to the idea that there was always some sense in turning back boats. But Abbott won’t be forgiven if he doesn’t give the luvvies something. They never forgave Howard, and in the end, their criticisms came home to roost. A large "not happy John"  minoririty in 2003 became a landslide in Kevin 07. Ultimately, Workchoices did it, but the electorate still smelt something fishy over Children Overboard, the Pacific Solution, and of course, the Iraq War. Howard’s demise would not have been so jubulant without the sins of his Tampa past. The same will happen to Abbott if he doesn’t claim the centre. With economic dark clouds on the horizon, he is shaping up to be one unpopular leader if he doesn’t develop a conscience. This is, after all, why he’s in politics. Abbott’s not a dry, he’s a social conservative. Abbott doesn’t have the faintest care for economic issues. His bent is his own take on social justice and reclaiming the country from the sinister forces of the left. Abbott’s soul is in the church, but he is rapidly alienating this group. When the cuts come (and the charity sector loses valuable contracts), he’ll push them even further away. If Abbott’s smart, he’ll soften up. If his natural instincts for biffo aren’t buffeted , he will be a two term PM - at best. Not bad, but this is not what the Libs are settling in for.

Thank you, Michelle Grattan/Paul Bongiorno/Fran Kelly.

You are your own parody, PB.

Sparky wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 1:27pm:

Karnal wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 10:48am: Sparky wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:57am: If the Indonesians and the progressives are unhappy then I'm in heaven. Them being unhappy is always a great indication. What have you got against Indonesians, Sparky? When I say Indonesians I mean their government. Just because of the general disrespect they show Australia.

It is us that is sneaking people in their back door and improperly crossing into their territory at a government level, looks like the respect problem is very much the other way around.

philperth2010 wrote on Feb 15^th, 2014 at 12:15pm:

Who will be responsible if one of these orange life boats smashes onto some rocks with woman and children aboard.....I know some of you will say the asylum seekers are responsible for their own choices but they had already been rescued imprisoned by the navy and forced back to a country that is not a signatory to the refugee convention.....Abbott and Morrison are completely responsible for anything that occurs after the Navy intercepts asylum seeker vessels.....Once you take it you own it??? >:( >:( >:(

Just like the policy under the labor/greens government that sent many illegals to their death at sea?

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 9:24am:

The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves.

No wonder you failed in business, you fail to under stand the most simple principles of economics.

I didn’t fail in business. I ran my own businesses 1985–2010. Then had to retire due arthritis becoming unbearable—in the HBS I was walking 6 days a week on cement floors.

I also studied economics for a year as part of my Batchelor of Business (Marketing.)

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 9:24am:

The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves.

Putting Australia's interest first - unbearable for leftoids.

Soren wrote on Feb 17^th, 2014 at 7:58pm:

St George of the Garden wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:24am: The cut in refugee intake from 20K to 13K was made by the simian shortly after the election. We are becoming a pariah state, bit by bit. Just because bogans are afraid of “different” people—brown skinned ones mainly. We are also becoming a third world nation with no manufacturing and no decent internet so long term it will solve the boat problem—nobody will want to come here, instead people will be leaving, in droves. Putting Australia's interest first - unbearable for leftoids.

But not bad for the Huns.

Which quota did you come in on, old chap?

The old boy quota, or... ?

Karnal wrote on Feb 17^th, 2014 at 8:05pm:

Which quota did you come in on, old chap?

The 'Please, come and help us. We have a load of Paki B vggers here, sabotaging this great country at every turn with incessant hostile jibberish. We need people who can contribute and support this country, not sneer at it and ridicule its people at every opportunity'.


That quota.

Smear? Good heavens, old chap, I won’t hear a bit of it. You prefer to dab, no?

You’re one of those positive, smear-free immigrants - with so much gratitude and love for his hosts.


Soren wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 1:18pm:

Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus.

Karnal wrote on Feb 17^th, 2014 at 8:36pm:

Smear? Good heavens, old chap, I won’t hear a bit of it. You prefer to dab, no? You’re one of those positive, smear-free immigrants - with so much gratitude and love for his hosts. Soren wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 1:18pm: Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus.

You are passing the ball (making bizarre connections) to people only you see, PB.

Soren wrote on Feb 17^th, 2014 at 8:50pm:

Karnal wrote on Feb 17th, 2014 at 8:36pm: Smear? Good heavens, old chap, I won’t hear a bit of it. You prefer to dab, no? You’re one of those positive, smear-free immigrants - with so much gratitude and love for his hosts. Soren wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 1:18pm: Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus. You are passing the ball (making bizarre connections) to people only you see, PB.

There’s nothing wrong with cleaning out one’s colostomy bag in the public toilet, old chap. We don’t hold you as any less of person because of it, and yes, I would fight for your right to do so.

Dnarever wrote on Feb 16^th, 2014 at 8:33pm:

Sparky wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 1:27pm: Karnal wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 10:48am: Sparky wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 9:57am: If the Indonesians and the progressives are unhappy then I'm in heaven. Them being unhappy is always a great indication. What have you got against Indonesians, Sparky? When I say Indonesians I mean their government. Just because of the general disrespect they show Australia. It is us that is sneaking people in their back door and improperly crossing into their territory at a government level, looks like the respect problem is very much the other way around.

Sneaking?
The Indon's aren't even looking in the right direction as they are all too busy faced north.
No sneaking is required.
And returning their people on their boats that recently left their ports with their passengers is hardly improper.
I think it's more in the realm of being neighbourly.
It's like when your neighbours dog jumps the fence into your yard.
Do you shoo the dog away from your yard, or do you return the mangy mutt back where it came from.
I think the Abbott government is practicing a good neighbour policy.
Can the neighbour then complain that you are returning his dog that keeps jumping from his yard into yours over the fence.
Can he claim that he is not responsible as his yard is only a transit lounge for wayward dogs?
Can he claim that he has enough issues going on in his yard to be bothered about the dog jumping the fence.
He can try, but I suspect he would get ignored as his problems remain his problems despite him claiming otherwise.

Karnal wrote on Feb 17^th, 2014 at 8:59pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 17th, 2014 at 8:50pm: Karnal wrote on Feb 17th, 2014 at 8:36pm: Smear? Good heavens, old chap, I won’t hear a bit of it. You prefer to dab, no? You’re one of those positive, smear-free immigrants - with so much gratitude and love for his hosts. Soren wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 1:18pm: Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus. You are passing the ball (making bizarre connections) to people only you see, PB. There’s nothing wrong with cleaning out one’s colostomy bag in the public toilet, old chap. We don’t hold you as any less of person because of it, and yes, I would fight for your right to do so.

Your a good man Karnal, and none would say otherwise.
Your always looking out for people. :)

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 17^th, 2014 at 9:13pm:

Karnal wrote on Feb 17th, 2014 at 8:59pm: Soren wrote on Feb 17th, 2014 at 8:50pm: Karnal wrote on Feb 17th, 2014 at 8:36pm: Smear? Good heavens, old chap, I won’t hear a bit of it. You prefer to dab, no? You’re one of those positive, smear-free immigrants - with so much gratitude and love for his hosts. Soren wrote on Feb 16th, 2014 at 1:18pm: Love to see the lefties suffering emotional incontinence. That alone has made electing Abbott worthwhile. The rest is bonus. You are passing the ball (making bizarre connections) to people only you see, PB. There’s nothing wrong with cleaning out one’s colostomy bag in the public toilet, old chap. We don’t hold you as any less of person because of it, and yes, I would fight for your right to do so. Your a good man Karnal, and none would say otherwise. Your always looking out for people. :)

Thanks, CL. I do find these new Australians need assistance with things we take for granted.

When he’s finished, I’ll show him how to flush.