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Member Run Boards >> Environment >> Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1385111670 Message started by # on Nov 22nd, 2013 at 7:14pm |
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Title: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 22nd, 2013 at 7:14pm November 20, 2013 Ross Gittins Gittins: Are we doing enough for the climate? As the rest of the world is getting more serious about combating climate change we’re going the other way. Ross Gittins reports. I don't have grandchildren but I'm hoping for some, someday, so this column is for them. I want you to know that although, in the mid-teens of this century, Australians elected a government that wasn't genuine in its commitment to combating the effects of climate change, and that even abolished the main instrument economists invented for that purpose, I never accepted this complacency. Partly because that government's predecessors had done such a poor job of introducing effective measures - and even a party known as the Greens played its cards all wrong - the nation lost its resolve and allowed its original bipartisan commitment to decisive action to be lost. The minority of people who doubted the scientists' advice that the globe was warming combined with libertarians - who, as a matter of principle, oppose almost all arguments for intervention by government - to persuade the Liberals to break with bipartisanship. Illustration: Kerrie Leishman If the Liberals under their new leader, Tony Abbott, had opposed action against climate change outright, Liberal voters who accepted the need for action would have been forced to choose between the party and their beliefs. Advertisement Instead, Abbott focused his opposition on the Labor government's main instrument for gradually bringing about a reduction in emissions of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gasses, an emissions trading scheme whose price would be fixed by the government for the first year or two. Abbott insisted the Coalition remained committed to Australia's international undertaking to reduce emissions by at least 5 per cent below 2000 levels by 2020, and by 15 per cent or 25 per cent provided other countries were taking comparable action. The big difference was that, rather than using Labor's ''carbon tax'' to achieve the target, the Coalition would rely on ''direct action'', such as offering monetary incentives to farmers and others to reduce emissions. This left Abbott free to run an almighty scare campaign about how Labor's ''great big new tax on everything'' would greatly increase the cost of living for ordinary Australian families and impose big costs on Australian businesses, which would impair their ability to compete. Abbott associated with outright climate-change deniers and said things that seemed to brand him as one of them, while always adding, sotto voce, that he accepted human-caused climate change and the need to do something about it. Apart from attracting voters away from Labor and its frightening carbon tax, the result of making climate change an issue of party dispute was to give Liberal supporters a licence to stop worrying about climate change - if the leaders of my party aren't worrying, why should I? - while providing a fig leaf for those Liberals who retained their concern. The business lobby groups' initial position had been: if it's inevitable we do something, let's get on with it and make future arrangements as certain as possible. But with their side of politics inviting them to put their short-term interests ahead of the economy's long-term health, most business people found it too tempting to resist. To be fair, some businesses stuck with their schemes to reduce their own emissions and some pressed on with repositioning their business for a world where the use of fossil fuels had become prohibitively expensive as well as socially disapproved of. You will find this hard to believe, but in the mid-teens, it was still common to think about ''the economy'' in isolation from the natural environment which sustained it. Economists, business people and politicians had gone for two centuries largely ignoring the damage economic activity did to the environment. The idea that, eventually, the environment would hit back and do great damage to the economy was one most people preferred not to think about. At the time, it was fashionable to bewail the lack of action to increase the economy's productivity. Few people joined dots to realise the climate was in the process of dealing a blow to our productivity, one that would significantly reduce the next generation's living standards. At the time, we rationalised our selfishness - our willingness to avoid a tiny drop in our standard of living at the expense of a big drop in our offspring's - by telling ourselves half-truths and untruths about the global nature of climate change. [continued ...] |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 22nd, 2013 at 7:14pm
[... continued]
We told ourselves there was nothing Australia could do by itself to affect climate change (true), that at the Copenhagen conference in 2009, countries had failed to reach a binding agreement on action to reduce emissions (true) and that the world's two biggest polluters, China and the US, were doing nothing much to reduce their emissions. We had no excuse for not knowing this was untrue because successive government reports told us the contrary. One we got just before the carbon tax was abolished, from the Climate Change Authority, said the two superpowers were stepping up their actions to reduce emissions. ''These measures could have a significant impact on global emissions reductions,'' it concluded. I recount this history to explain how my generation's dereliction occurred, not to defend or justify it. We knew what we should have done; we chose not to do it. I never fell for any of these spurious arguments. Did I ever doubt that climate change represented by far the greatest threat to Australia's future economic prosperity? Never. Should I have said this more often, rather than chasing a thousand economic will-o'-the-wisps? Yes. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by lee on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 12:22pm
If Tim Flannery is right in his "1,000 years", it isn't our grandchildren. In 1,000 years what are the odds of the world still surviving?
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 7:52pm lee wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 12:22pm:
Quote:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Rider on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 8:04pm # wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 7:52pm:
Clearly # you have never been introduced to reality. Your credibility is lower than Flim Flams. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 8:20pm |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by lee on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 9:52pm
I'm trying to get my head around that.
Venus is without water. On Earth CO2 is going to melt all the ice, so that it is in the sea. Somehow the sea is going to boil dry and leave us without water? |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 3:00am Rider wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 8:04pm:
...and you proudly parade as a AGW denialist in this thread. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 3:04am lee wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 9:52pm:
...and yet Venus is the hottest planet in the solar system - even hotter than mercury, even though mercury is the closest planet to the sun Oh by the way lee, the concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere of Venus is about 98%. (that's ~980,000 ppmv) HEY LEE, ya freak clown maggot, Has it clicked yet as to why venus is hotter than mercury? |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Rider on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:25am Chimp_Logic wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 3:00am:
oh Chump, irrelevant petulant child. I'd like to excuse you as simply a product of our wonderful public schooling system, but if truth be known you probably had the privilege of private schooling and university and a pampering rich mummy and daddy (who you now hate cause they are bourgeois capitalists) .... just goes to show doesn't it... ;D ;D ;D |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:42am
I can't apologise for what you imagine <rubs nose><looks down nose><sniffs it off whilst continuing to dog-ball eye imaginary society>
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:14am Rider wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:25am:
Are you referring to Universities as well you smelly deranged fascist freak? I wonder how many of them ARENT part of the public education system? Perhaps you went to the Bond University that set up on the gold coast some years ago you filthy maggotted weasel rodent carcass Rider the official silver medallist freak fascist of Ozpolitic. You must be very proud of your achievements in this forum with your pathetic 882 irrelevant and smelly posts you putrid slab of de-crystalised skunk urine paste |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:32am
Constantly challenge the centre: where is the war effort?
The appollo program, the abc just said, was spending up to 5% of gdp.... they also said he dreamed of mars! |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Andrei.Hicks on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:35am Chimp_Logic wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:14am:
Please stop constantly abusing. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:38am
The USA spends more on its military imperialist fascist system than the rest of the world's countries combined.
About 3/4 of all military hardware sales in the world are controlled by the USA. Its economy depends on war and insecurity But you know what they say het folks? The clam rots from within (or something like that - sounds about right anyway - it will do for now) |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:59am
Simply put, the threat has not been recognised as imminent. Survival is recognising what's gonna kill ya first(the attack) and attacking that attack i.e. solving the problem. A PROBLEM WELL DEFINED IS HALF SOLVED.
...is it murdoch is it regulation is it...? What is it?? We're all living in lala land but with 7 billion people sharing vastly different political fortunes it makes total sense to notbe able to coordinate a solution as we have all lived quite comfortably with the known misery of others for aeons :o |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 24th, 2013 at 10:56am Rider wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 8:04pm:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 24th, 2013 at 10:58am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 8:20pm: Still confined to the picture book, young troll? If you'd paid attention in school, you might have learned how to use words. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:05am lee wrote on Nov 23rd, 2013 at 9:52pm:
You pretend to have an enquiring mind, so enquire:[list bull-blackball] |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:07am # wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 10:58am:
It gets a reaction from you every single time. I must be doing something right. A child's first book is usually a picture book. The pictures are there for the reader, not the author. One must cater for their target audience. (Moreover, the picture/warning turned out to be 100% correct). |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:14am
Greggy hates the technological world around him built on consensus 8-)
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:14am ...it's always cooling according to the AGW denialist crack pot religion and its deranged priests |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:18am BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:14am:
Greggy doesn't hate anyone, or anything. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:19am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:18am:
I can see you ;D |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:21am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:18am:
source please |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:21am BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:19am:
Tony, is that you? |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:26am
Greggy had a dismissive daddykins awwww cry cry blame society and bugger the little kiddies aww that will make greggy sleep at night waaah waaah ;D
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 24th, 2013 at 12:29pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:07am:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 24th, 2013 at 7:05pm # wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 12:29pm:
Hes owning like all snobs do ::) |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:22pm # wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 12:29pm:
I'll check with my therapist on Wednesday, and get back to you then. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:46pm Chimp_Logic wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 11:21am:
Show me a post in this forum where I have ever used the word 'hate' in the proper context. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 24th, 2013 at 9:47pm
I have been extremely impressed with Mr Greggy's performance in this forum
He consistently emits a foul putrid stench and can be best described as a delusional deranged decaying rotten weasel scoundrel I like him very much |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:13am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:22pm:
Lessons in ownership,.. there i told ya ;D |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 11:45am greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 24th, 2013 at 8:46pm:
Does walking the walk necessarily entail talking the talk? |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 12:25pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 11:45am:
Show me where I've walked the walked or talked the talk. Just one post. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 12:31pm
One post is a foot step ;)
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:04pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 12:25pm:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:10pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:04pm:
Take it however you like. Show me a post in this forum where I have ever used the word 'hate' in the proper context. You can keep avoiding the question if you like, but it just makes you appear a bigger fool (if that's possible) every time that you do. The choice is yours. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:15pm
Hate is an attitude... a post is a footstep!
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:18pm BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:15pm:
Show me a post in this forum where I project an attitude of "hate". |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:57pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:10pm:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:58pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:57pm:
And you'll keep avoiding the question, of course. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:01pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 12:25pm:
greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:58pm:
Which of us is avoiding the question? |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:12pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:01pm:
You, of course. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:23pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 1:18pm:
A post is a footstep! |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:24pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:12pm:
On the evidence presented, your assertion is false. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:26pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:24pm:
au contraire |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:29pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:26pm:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:34pm
Lets all walk in hate andbuggerise the kids yayyyyyyyyyyyy!
https://www.google.com.au/search?q=9-11&client=tablet-android-asus-rev&hl=en-US&source=android-browser-type&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=49KSUuX0KqfuiAe_6ICoCQ&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAA&biw=1024&bih=600#biv=i%7C5%3Bd%7ClArslADJpb3c6M%3A |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:34pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:29pm:
Show me a post in this forum where I have ever used the word 'hate' in the proper context. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:36pm
Hate is attitude... a post is a footstep!
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:05pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:34pm:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:22pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:05pm:
I asked my question first, and you are doing everything you can to avoid it. Nothing new from you. You are rapidly becoming the biggest laughing stock on this forum. Do continue though. I'm finding it highly amusing. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:25pm BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 2:36pm:
Still avoiding the question, just like your mate: http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1385111670/39#39 It seems AGW has fried both of your brains. Better luck next time lads. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:53pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:25pm:
No one cares if you die a hater ;) |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:06pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 3:22pm:
# wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 11:45am:
Show me your question to me, prior to that. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:11pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:06pm:
Certainly. http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1385111670/30#30 There you go. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:13pm Don't forget to pick up your balls on the way out. Cheers. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:14pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:11pm:
So you acknowledge that there is no such question. Defeated again, young wanker. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:16pm
::) um moderator??? ::) ::) ::)
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:18pm You left one behind: Better luck next time, old boy. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Deathridesahorse on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:21pm
Greggery isintomaiming the defenceless...
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:19pm BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 4:21pm:
1 # wrote on Nov 2nd, 2013 at 10:30am:
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:23pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:19pm:
Good idea. It's past your bedtime anyway. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by # on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:26pm greggerypeccary wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:23pm:
I've cut you some slack because muso seems to have some peculiar affection for you, but there are limits to how much trolling I'll permit. Consider this a warning. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by greggerypeccary on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:31pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:26pm:
Be careful you don't get reported, old chum. " ... young wanker." http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1385111670/58#58 Consider that a warning. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:58pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:26pm:
...you seem to have been busy lately issuing warnings. Remember if Mr Greggy goes, I go |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by muso on Nov 25th, 2013 at 8:04pm # wrote on Nov 25th, 2013 at 7:26pm:
Don't worry about me. |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Lionel Edriess on Nov 25th, 2013 at 8:09pm
Seems to me it's attitudes rather than words.
re Chimp Logic. Can't be humour. re Herbert. Can't be logical. re Datalife, Phemanderac. Can't be reasoning, or lack of objectivity. re Brian Ross, True Colours, Hot Breath, etc Can't be lucidity. re .............. lots Gotta be attitude. (Whispers.) "Did you hear something?" ::) |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Chimp_Logic on Nov 25th, 2013 at 8:11pm
re Lionel Edriess
cant be honesty |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by Lionel Edriess on Nov 25th, 2013 at 8:14pm
Who are you calling a cant?
;) |
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Title: Re: Dear grandchildren, I can only say sorry Post by muso on Nov 25th, 2013 at 8:28pm
Chimp,
Could you please desist with the clown maggot stuff? Thank you. |
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