Post by John Smith on Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:10pm
cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:08am:
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http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl
General Discussion >> Federal Politics >> $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1374843119 Message started by Maqqa on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm |
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Title: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Maqqa on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm
http://au.news.yahoo.com/latest/a/-/latest/18164803/labor-razor-gang-faces-dilemma-as-coffers-8bn-worse-off-than-predicted-in-may-budget/
The Federal Government is facing a budget dilemma, with the ABC learning revenues are around $8 billion lower than the May budget predicted. The Government's razor gang met this morning to debate whether to implement painful budget cuts before the election or delay the return to surplus, currently scheduled for 2016-17. The budget is in a tough position with the mining tax underperforming and revenue from other taxes also lower than expected. Treasurer Chris Bowen today said Australia was also facing "dramatic reductions" in its terms of trade, but reaffirmed the intention to return to surplus on schedule. The Government has got decisions to make on any potential cuts, but insiders insist the easy cuts have all already been made. One Labor source questioned whether the Government should cause budget pain for the public at a time when Labor is just starting to perform better in the polls. The Government will release its fiscal update next week, and Treasury will release its own accounting, the pre-election fiscal outlook (PEFO), early in the election campaign. Earlier Friday, Opposition treasury spokesman Joe Hockey questioned the motives for the release of the Government's fiscal update so close to the PEFO. "Why is the Government releasing a comprehensive economic statement just a few days before the pre-election fiscal outlook? It is about trying to bully the Treasury into a fixed set of numbers," he said. Mr Hockey questioned the independence of Treasury by saying the Coalition would not rely on its figures to frame its policy costings because they could not be trusted. That was despite earlier in the year saying "the only numbers than we can rely on are the PEFO numbers released by the heads of department during the course of the election campaign". Mr Hockey now says every time the Government publishes budget figures they are "dead-set wrong". He says the Coalition will instead base its policy costings on figures from the Parliamentary Budget Office, state Coalition governments and independent advisers. The Treasurer has rejected Mr Hockey's assertions about Treasury's independence. "It is an insult not to me but to the Treasury and the Department of Finance, and I am sick and tired of the Opposition trashing the reputation of Australia's public servants," Mr Bowen said. Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has backed his treasury spokesman. "Joe was making the point that figures from this Government have never turned out to be true; never, never, never starting from their very first budget." |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm Maqqa wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm:
No sh!t Sherlock! Pity is, that you, the Liberals & Labor, NONE OF YOU HAVE AY IDEA OF THE CAUSE, LET ALONE WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE OVER THE LAST 40-50 YEARS, NOR WHAT YOU SHOULD DO OVER THE NEXT 40-50 YEARS!!! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by matty on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:09am
People need to realise that only the Coalition can effectively manage economy. Which party was it that repayed the $96 billion of debt they inherited, and left their successors with a surplus of $22 billion, which would then only be wasted on failed schemes like the BER and home insulation disaster?
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by adelcrow on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:54am
Im a big fan of a decade long recession with the accompanying mass unemployment and collapsing economy..
That would be a much better option than issuing govt bonds.. ;D Yep...Mr Abbotts Arts Degree means he's a bloody genius..."would you like fries with that?" ;D |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by cods on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am perceptions_now wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 11:27pm:
hey perc?.... has your life worked out exactly as you planned it 40/50 years ago?????.. I am not sure how anyone plans for "earthquakes".that may or may not happen in their lives.. but you must have done. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by cods on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:00am
these BLACK HOLES they keep finding.. who exactly do we blame then?..
I see where our treasurer is defending his public servants..LOL>. so who is to blame for this massive error.. Bowen?? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by cods on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:01am
I mean the budget was only in May???
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by John Smith on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12am
so Abbott will have no problem debating the issue with Rudd then?
He can share his opinions and the benefit of his knowledge. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Kat on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:15am Honestly, I NO LONGER LISTEN when conservatives talk about the economy. They either genuinely have no idea, or are deliberately lying. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by adelcrow on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:16am John Smith wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12am:
An economic genius like Tony Abbott shouldn't be afraid of debating a little nerd like Kevin O'Heaven.. Sssoooo..why is Abbott afraid of a debate on the economy? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 10:52am
What do we thing that dropping revenue will do to projected targets ??
And what do we think the budget impact will be from Abbotts over $100 Billion of unfunded spending before considering his unfunded plan to build multiple cities in the far north is considered all occurring with a dwindling income base? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by cods on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:02am Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 10:52am:
dna are you not shocked we or someone had no idea this is whats happening????... think about it.. now the deficit is $28bn..the drop in revenue has been staring us in the face for a long long time.. it hasnt just happened.. and I dont believe our public servants have had their heads buried in the sand either.. someone has been fudging.... let me see who would be low enough to do that????????????????????? is there an election coming??? I havent heard |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by cods on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:08am adelcrow wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:16am:
why on earth would anyone want to debate a psycho.. the man couldnt lie straight in bed... look at the crap ad he is doing...telling everyone we are heaps better off than everyone else...hahahah.. he forgets we haven t had any hardship like Europe..he forgets export tripled..he forgets we were basically untouched by the GFC..thanks to China. its a riot...he doesnt mention the magnificent DEBT he has racked up for us... and the mess of the BOAT PEOPLE... did he tell us how much he has promised PNG... of course not..why because he doesnt know.. its all been cobbled together... no Tony stay away from him... he can lie and look straight in the camera whilst he does it.. a conman./. one of the best I grant you. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:13am adelcrow wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:16am:
Would it be because he is depending on misleading people and telling lies about the state of our economy and he really can not defend what he has been getting away with? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by corporate_whitey on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:33am
Its hi time the moral majority had a say in the running of this country instead of the liberal and libertarian right wing organized crime networks... 8-)
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:43pm cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
Unlike most natural earthquakes, where we mere mortals remain unaware of the quake, until they actually happen or at least very close to the event, this particular Global Economic earthquake has had indicators for about 40-50 years. Certainly "those in the know", those with access to all the relevant Demographic, Energy Supply/Pricing & Climate factors have either known or should have known quite some time ago. They ("those in the know OR thought they did") thought - 1) Like Longy, it had not happened before, so it never would! 2) "Something", like the cavalry riding to the rescue, would come along to save this from becoming a reality? 3) Then there were those who deliberately turned the other way, preferring short term rewards for themselves and a select few, at great cost to the long term future of the bulk of the Local & Global Public! Whatever our view/s on what worked in the past & there were appropriate times for both Keynesian & Austrian Economic fixes, the reality of the current Global GFC is that neither Keynesian & Austrian Economic fixes will work, as they did previously and nor will the current "money printing" of the likes of Japan & the USA! In my judgement, the standard Liberal across the board AUS-terity cuts (Austrian fix), which would have worked on most occasions over the last 200 years or so, is now the worst o all options, BUT neither will the Labor Keynesian approach work, although it would stretch the final demise out for a little longer, until Debt finally overwhelms the system. This time we really will need to change the whole system and everyone will either contribute their fair share or they will all share in a greater amount of Economic pain! There are now, no easy options, 40-50 years of inappropriate activity by those on both the Left & Right o Politics & those at the top of the tree, have ensured that only difficult options now remain! Good luck! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:47pm perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:43pm:
Oh & as I have said previously, PRODUCTIVITY must now become number 1. But Productivity must come come in a measured & sensible way, not simply to the benefit of some & at the expense of others! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by corporate_whitey on Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:01pm
ALL PRODUCTIVITY AND ECONOMICS DECISIONS MUST BE MADE SUBJECT TO THE MORAL LAW AND DECENCY TEST... 8-)
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by John Smith on Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:10pm cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:08am:
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by buzzanddidj on Jul 27th, 2013 at 1:12pm matty wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:09am:
If you checked the FACTS - and spent a little less time ejaculating onto copies of "The Australian" - you would realise BOH were major components of the most successful GFC stimulus program applied anywhere in the WORLD ... and listen to your elder statesman, on DEBT longweekend58 wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 9:03am:
MY definition ? I just presented the FACTS The BIG ticks of APPROVAL come from ... Standard & Poor's Moody's Fitch's The Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) EuroMoney (Finance Minister of the Year Honours) The International Monetary Fund (IMF) The Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA) The Australian Bureau of Statistics ( ... by stealth) The Butcher The Baker The Candlestick Maker ... and NOW - a few days back - the former member for Bennelong The ONLY talking down of the ecomomy and the Federal Treasurer is coming from the Opposition, NEWS Ltd - and Sydney shock-jocks I know who I trust |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:48pm cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:59am:
you will also not that Prozac_now never comes up with any solutions - just criticism. He hates debt and hates spending cuts. he seems to want it both ways while blaming everyone for everything. clearly his medication is not working, |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:50pm Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 10:52am:
abbott abbott abbott it's all you ever talk about and is the reason he will be the next PM - because labor is so stupid all they do is talk about abbott abbott abbott.... |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:28pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:48pm:
You assume too much, as usual! A solution, for everything, there is NOT! As usual, you statements do not reflect the truth! I have no problem with Debt, Spending Cuts or Economic Stimulation measures, in the appropriate circumstances, of which there have been many, over the years, BUT NONE OF THEM WILL WORK NOW, FOR THE SHORT TO MEDIUM TERM, as the entire system has been destabilised over the last 40-50 years! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Maqqa on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:31pm
It's interesting when bad things happen - perception will blame the LibLab
But perception offers no alternative party that will win the required 70+ seats to form government When pressed further - it is clear perception is a Labor voter |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by froggie on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:48pm John Smith wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12am:
I'm tipping that Abbott will find an excuse NOT to go 1 on 1 with Rudd in a debate on the economy, even after the election is called. :) |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:55pm perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:28pm:
so in short, you are saying that you have no answers or solutions. WHICH WAS EXACTLY WHAT I SAID, oh depressed one. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:56pm Lobo wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:48pm:
im tipping that if abbott extends his current 4point lead to 6 or more then he can do what he wants and Rudd can simply cry and whine (and of course swear) about it all he likes. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by red baron on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:11pm
You see there is this cycle, what happens is, the Liberals put the economy in a good position, everything rosy in the garden then Labor comes along and says this garden is sh.t!
They then convince the people that they will make the garden into a spectacular garden. The people can only see the vision, so they vote Labor in. Then within a couple of years the weeds have grown out of control, the roses in the garden are dying, being strangled to death by the vines. Labor shrugs and says we just have to get more gardeners in, bring in more roses from overseas. But alas the garden or what was once a garden becomes an over ridden desolate place, Until...one day the Liberals come along once more and say we can manage then garden, eliminate the weeds, put things to rights, Then the people hungry and disillusioned finally put them back into power, Then the diligent gardeners return to restore order out of chaos. :) :) :) :) :) :) And that is the story of Labor and the garden. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by rabbitoh07 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:19pm matty wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 12:09am:
You mean the party that repayed the $96 billion of debt they inherited - $40billion of which was debt John Howard racked up as Treasurer. The Party that then went on to be the most wasteful this country has ever seen: Australia's most needlessly wasteful spending took place under the John Howard-led Coalition government rather than under the Whitlam, Rudd or Gillard Labor governments, an international study has found... The International Monetary Fund examined 200 years of government financial records across 55 leading economies. It identifies only two periods of Australian "fiscal profligacy" in recent years, both during John Howard's term in office - in 2003 at the start of the mining boom and during his final years in office between 2005 and 2007. http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hey-big-spender-howard-the-king-of-the-loose-purse-strings-20130110-2cj32.html#ixzz2aDwSXbSH The Party that pissed the profits of the mining boom up against the wall with illegal wars, middle-class welfare and baby bonuses - but failed to provide necessary services and infrastructure. No NBN. No NDIS. No carbon pricing. Nothing. Just waste. You think this is better than the Party that left Australia with one of the lowest levels of debt in the developed world after the greatest global economic downturn since the Great Depression. ANd BTW: what exactly was wrong with the BEF and the home insulation programmes? Both were very successful. Have you been believing what Alan Jones tells you again!! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:21pm Maqqa wrote on Jul 26th, 2013 at 10:51pm:
Hocey could just treat treasury like Peter Costello did. he listened to them but didn't swallow what they said as necessarily reliable of accurate. Swan however, believed everything they said and has produced 6 budgets in a row that missed their projections by a mile. It wasn't just the deficits they produced, it was the way in which every single element of the budgets failed massively. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by rabbitoh07 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:21pm red baron wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:11pm:
It was sh.t. 11 years of waste. Illegal war. Baby bonuses. Middle-call welfare. No NBN No NDIS Most wasteful government ever: Hey, big spender: Howard the king of the loose purse strings Australia's most needlessly wasteful spending took place under the John Howard-led Coalition government rather than under the Whitlam, Rudd or Gillard Labor governments, an international study has found. The International Monetary Fund examined 200 years of government financial records across 55 leading economies. It identifies only two periods of Australian "fiscal profligacy" in recent years, both during John Howard's term in office - in 2003 at the start of the mining boom and during his final years in office between 2005 and 2007. http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/hey-big-spender-howard-the-king-of-the-loose-purse-strings-20130110-2cj32.html#ixzz2aDxz4kwI |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:24pm rabbitoh07 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:19pm:
$9B actually. and anyhow, Howard inherited $250B from keating which he paid off. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by froggie on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:27pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:56pm:
Doesn't sound confident, at all.... :) |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by woof woof on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:36pm
You will all remember my comments on falling revenues higher UP rates and payment liabillites to the gov and me saying the country is ecomically fkd, many on here queued up to abus eme and tell me how good we have it.
Well kids the wheel nuts fell off the billy cart about 3 years ago and now the steering has failed and we ARE going off a cliff, hang on its gunna be a bumpy ride. You heard it straight from the horses mouth (me) years ago, but nooo none of you believed me. I say it again we are in a heap of financial trouble. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by woof woof on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:43pm
I have to laugh at Buzzitsaroguepollandidi,
Just because ewe are at 30% debt to GDP and are at a lower % than most others doesn't mean we are doing well. We are just not as fkd as they are, but we're fkd none the less. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:52pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:24pm:
Quote:
Quote:
Matty turns $14 B into $22 B and LW turns $96B into $250 B The Liberal surplus has consistently got bigger with every historical re write and the Labor Debt has also grown retrospectively??? You can see why these guys blindly support the dishonest Abbott. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:54pm woof woof wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:43pm:
Especially considering that the world economy has no impact on Australia and that doing better than everyone else is about as good as you can expect. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:02pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 2:50pm:
You have no answer in other words - well actually you just don't like the answer. I fixed your complaint so can you now have a go at it. You see what I am saying is very relevant to the topic. You see we have a negative budget position because of dwindling income with an outcome less than expected, It is not difficult to see what over $100 B of unfunded spending will do to this bottom line in the current situation. The reason that this is valid to the topic is fairly obvious as the complaint is inferring Labors poor economic credentials and it is easily shown that the alternative is dramatically worse. Deflecting by saying Abbott abbott abbott is stupid when we have had years of you guys saying Jukiar Juliar Juliar , Crud Crud Crud / Dud Dud Dud etc, carbon tax carbon tax carbon tax. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by rabbitoh07 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:12pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:24pm:
Wow!!! You do denial so well!! You could deny for Australia!!! When John Howard was Treasurer, net Government debt rose at a steady pace, hitting 7.5% of GDP when Fraser lost the 1983 election. In 1996 dollar terms, 7.5% of GDP is around $40 billion which is in fact the real level of net government debt “inherited” by the Hawke Government when it won the 1983 election. http://www.marketeconomics.com.au/2024-labor-or-liberal-government-debt |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:25pm cods wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 11:08am:
bump |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:27pm Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:25pm:
Good work spincycle - bumping other peoples spin is a new trick. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by chicken_lipsforme on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:37pm adelcrow wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:16am:
He's not afraid of having a debate with KRudd. But you cant expect Abbott to waste his time doing so before KRudd has even announced the date of the election. Debates are always held after an election has been announced. Never before. Why has the government gone into election mode before it's been announced? What happened to 'a time for governing, and a time for electioneering'. Abbott has better things to do than fit into KRudd's schedule, he's too busy holding Rudd to account for his crap policies for starters. Why does Labor keep putting the cart before the horse. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:45pm chicken_lipsforme wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:37pm:
Quote:
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/election-2013/abbott-and-howard-feted-at-libs-victorian-campaign-launch/story-fn9qr68y-1226671846177 Hoist by your own petard |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by chicken_lipsforme on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:48pm rabbitoh07 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:19pm:
The home insulation program was so very successful the government canned it after over 100 house fires and four deaths. That's how much of a success it was. The BER was a success also. Every school needs an undersized unusable canteen whilst their science labs and other buildings are falling down around there ears. All those builders that retired after selling the government a $600k hall also can see the value in the program. The governments lack of consultation existed back then, and it continues today. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by red baron on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:50pm
rabbit oh 7....The NBN..shouldn't it be finished or nearly? Getting a bit embarrassing that.
Anyhow, by the time it is finished the technology will be out of date; which was always going to be the case. Wireless technology is taking seven league strides and old copper wire is the stuff of Jurrasic Park. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by chicken_lipsforme on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:51pm Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:45pm:
What a lovely story, Abbotts running his own race and not working to KRudd's schedule. Either way, no election datee, no debatee as the chinaman said. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:29pm Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 4:52pm:
Matty turns $14 B into $22 B and LW turns $96B into $250 B The Liberal surplus has consistently got bigger with every historical re write and the Labor Debt has also grown retrospectively??? You can see why these guys blindly support the dishonest Abbott.[/quote] it's easy DNA... when you and your other fools show me the evidence that Howard let $40B in debt in 1983, I will show you how Keating left $250B in debt that John Howard paid off. fair deal? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:31pm Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:02pm:
are you dumb or just drunk? For the same reason it is unfair and stupid to blame Abbott for everything (because he is not in power), it is fair to blame Rudd and Gillard - because they ARE in power. seriously. think before you post. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:34pm rabbitoh07 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:12pm:
not even close to proof. that's a kouk BLOG site. you know.. the former Gillard staffer??? treasury accounts however, have this figure at $9B. When I look at my mortgage statements from years gone by, I don't readjust them according to GDP, inflation or the position of the stars. the dollars are what I borrowed and the dollars are what I repay. Kouk is a moron and you are a bigger one for believing him. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:45pm
not even close to proof. that's a kouk BLOG site. you know.. the former Gillard staffer???
treasury accounts however, have this figure at $9B. When I look at my mortgage statements from years gone by, I don't readjust them according to GDP, inflation or the position of the stars. the dollars are what I borrowed and the dollars are what I repay. Kouk is a moron and you are a bigger one for believing him.[/quote] Plus interest !! But you continually ignore this when quoting the 9B left from Howard. We've been through this before and you twisted and turned every which way to try and deny that interest was still accruing on the 9B you even contradicted yourself twice in the same thread. When you saw you where losing this argument you did the usual , called me an idiot and didn't return to the thread and even now you still continue to tell the same lie. Keep burying your head in the sand LW. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:47pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:55pm:
As usual, your statement is incorrect! You said that, I never comes up with any solutions. What I said is that, there is not necessarily a solution for everything & in this instance there is no solution, which would restore the "status quo", in either the short or medium term and certainly not without a great deal of shared pain for all! Btw, which of the following options, per my following post, do you think primarily fit you OR is it simply all of them? They ("those in the know OR thought they did") thought - 1) Like Longy, it had not happened before, so it never would! 2) "Something", like the cavalry riding to the rescue, would come along to save this from becoming a reality? 3) Then there were those who deliberately turned the other way, preferring short term rewards for themselves and a select few, at great cost to the long term future of the bulk of the Local & Global Public! http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1374843119/16#16 |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:54pm scope wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:45pm:
Plus interest !! But you continually ignore this when quoting the 9B left from Howard. We've been through this before and you twisted and turned every which way to try and deny that interest was still accruing on the 9B you even contradicted yourself twice in the same thread. When you saw you where losing this argument you did the usual , called me an idiot and didn't return to the thread and even now you still continue to tell the same lie. Keep burying your head in the sand LW. [/quote] 'plus interest' is an argument that applies to both labor and liberal debt. You cant have one and ignore the other. if Howard had not paid off the debt and it was still $96B in 2007 do you think you would still be trying on this well-worn and discredited argument? Do you think the interest on Howards $9B over 24 years would somehow exceed that of Keatings $87B over 11 years??? if you want to add interest to the argument then fine. also add inflation adjustment if you want. but do it from 1983 thru to 2005 when the debt was finally paid off and see which side of politics has the lions share of debt. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:56pm Maqqa wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 3:31pm:
As usual Maqqa, you are incorrect! On voting record I said many times, I have voted Liberal, Labor & candle stick maker, depending on the circumstances. As for recommending an alternative, Why would I offer any Political Party, in the current circumstances, as NONE ARE CAPABLE OF FIXING THAT WHICH TOOK LABOR & THE LIBERALS SOME 40-50 YEARS OF STUPIDITY & GREED! And yes, I largely blame the Lib/Labs, their short-termism, their dis-regard of reality & their cow-tailing to vested interests! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:58pm perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
you certainly are a weirdo, Prozac_now. I say you have never provided solutions and your protesting reply includes... NOT ONE SOLUTION. has it ever occurred to you that you could skewer my comments by simply providing those self-same solutions? you talk and talk ad nauseum, criticising anyone and everyone for their economic policies and promises and yet not once, do you ever offer an alternative. That's lame enough on its own but when you say that you HAVE but never post them... you look like a weirdo. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:10pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:54pm:
'plus interest' is an argument that applies to both labor and liberal debt. You cant have one and ignore the other. if Howard had not paid off the debt and it was still $96B in 2007 do you think you would still be trying on this well-worn and discredited argument? Do you think the interest on Howards $9B over 24 years would somehow exceed that of Keatings $87B over 11 years??? if you want to add interest to the argument then fine. also add inflation adjustment if you want. but do it from 1983 thru to 2005 when the debt was finally paid off and see which side of politics has the lions share of debt.[/quote] We have been over this already or have you forgotten? I have never claimed that there was no interest on Labors debt, that is just you trying to twist this so you don't have to admit that there was interest accrued on Howards $9b. It's not about who had the most debt it's about YOU continually lying and claiming only $9B of the $96B of Debt was Howards debt and refusing to coincide that by the time all debt was re payed Howards $9B was in fact much more. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:13pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:58pm:
Did you ever learn how to read Longy, I said - "What I said is that, there is not necessarily a solution for everything & in this instance there is no solution, which would restore the "status quo", in either the short or medium term and certainly not without a great deal of shared pain for all!" You really do have some serious lack of capacities, in a number of areas! |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by John Smith on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:12pm perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:13pm:
mostly all the areas associated with the brain |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by buzzanddidj on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:55pm chicken_lipsforme wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 5:48pm:
DESPITE the anti-Government BULLSH!T spun by the right-wing media - and right-wing of politics - the Home Insulation Program WAS a documented success 1/ It was responsible for completing the laying of domestic insulation over large tracts of the nation that previously WEREN'T Not just reducing heating and cooling costs to low-income families and upwards - but having a DOCUMENTED, positive impact on carbon emissions 2/ It was responsible for introducing the FIRST EVER set of safety standards and licencing to an industry that was previously un-regulated The outcome was - with a FOURTEEN fold increase in installations - a DOUBLING of related house-fires, work-place incidents - and one can only project ( ... as comparable figures were not published) a severe DROP in related work-place fatalities The project was dropped due to MEDIA NEGATIVITY 100 house fires and 4 deaths on a project of this dimension is, statistically, a "good figure" But NO politician is going to say that to someone who has lost their home - or to a parent, that has lost a child NO-ONE would DESPITE the anti-Government BULLSH!T spun by the right-wing media - and right-wing of politics - the BER was independently audited as giving "value for money" in 98% of cases ( ... the bulk of the remaining 2%, was attributed to mismanagement by the crumbling NSW Government) If you think an overall cost of $600K for a building comes in the shape of a cheque to the contractor - you have much to learn on the "nuts & bolts" of government projects The BULK of it goes on cross billing between other government departments - eager to get a slice of the BER budget ( ... an example being the Attorney-Generals Dept. - covering all legal and liabilities of these projects) REGARDLESS, these cross billing dollars are returned to the public purse DESPITE the BER being STILL a "work in progress" - the negative campaigns ( ... The Australian newspaper's being the BIGGEST and most SELECTIVE in example) - have faded into oblivion, with a sense of "MISSION ACCOMPLISHED" BOTH projects are widely acknowledged - by any source with global economics CREDIBILITY - to have succeeded ENORMOUSLY in fulfilling their primary function In keeping unemployment at HALF the rate of comparable economies And ensuring Australia as the ONLY member of the OECD group of trading nations that did NOT go into recession over the GFC A state of being, that MOST are still crippled with - to this day |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Kat on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:08pm
Sadly, Buzz, I fear you're just pyssing into the wind.
This mob don't want to know the facts. And if you refuse to accept facts, no matter how often or by who they're presented, but instead stubbornly cling to a belief that's demonstrably wrong, how can you be considered intelligent enough to cast a valid, in- formed, rational vote? I don't think you can... |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:20pm
buzz
Quote:
whose socialist manifesto did you read that from ? it'ld have been cheaper for us to give them the dole than invent false jobs. buildings do not teach kids, teachers do. what happenned to the laptops the stupid govt gave all the kids ? Aussie missed the false GFC scenario as we had a surplus not a massive debt. thanks to the right wingers who were in charge. also thanks to our mining, that the left has now crippled. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Kat on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:31pm
Says Sprint, proving my point...
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by buzzanddidj on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:37pm Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:20pm:
whose socialist manifesto did you read that from ? buzzanddidj wrote on May 20th, 2013 at 3:53pm:
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:40pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 6:29pm:
I never said that Howard left $40B in 1983. The number claimed has varied between about $9 B and up to around $14B in 83 $ obviously in terms of the value today it would be comparatively a lot bigger. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:43pm Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:20pm:
and I did not use big fonts or garish colours. europe economy is failed. I see little basis behind their reports OECD and IMF are worse than useless. china drove up iron ore/copper prices. We did well. We had a surplus, that is a good thing. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 28th, 2013 at 2:53pm scope wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:10pm:
We have been over this already or have you forgotten? I have never claimed that there was no interest on Labors debt, that is just you trying to twist this so you don't have to admit that there was interest accrued on Howards $9b. It's not about who had the most debt it's about YOU continually lying and claiming only $9B of the $96B of Debt was Howards debt and refusing to coincide that by the time all debt was re payed Howards $9B was in fact much more. [/quote] that argument only makes sense if you make the assumption thatr the very last debt to be paid off was Howards $9B and keatings $87B was paid first. By any half-reasonable argument, the interest on Howards debt made it around $18B by 1996. it is astonishing watching you labor bozos criticise $9B of debt accrued during the worst post-ware recession in our history while literally applauding $290B in debt now. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 28th, 2013 at 2:57pm buzzanddidj wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 8:55pm:
while totally ignoring that Australia went into the GFC as the only country not in debt, the only country with a budget in surplus, the highest growth and one of the most secure banking systems on the planet - none of which Rudd put in place. A Toyota Corolla could win the F1 Grand prix if given a ten lap head start. it doesn't make it a champion car. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 28th, 2013 at 3:00pm Dnarever wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 9:40pm:
why is that relevant? the money was borrowing in 1983, not today. But even if you want to adjust it in real terms, Keatings $96B dwarfs is and Rudds near $300B dwarfs that again. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 28th, 2013 at 3:28pm perceptions_now wrote on Jul 27th, 2013 at 7:13pm:
How's your education going Longy? Have you learned about the 3R's yet? You know - Reading, Riting & Rithmetic? Well, at least, you got a chance with the Riting, after all you are on the Rite side of politics? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 28th, 2013 at 3:40pm perceptions_now wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 3:28pm:
all you ever is 'gah! we are all going to die' and then say there are no solutions. Of what value do you think you are to anyone? You are the same bozo saying we would run out of oil in 1985 and even worse... still say so. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 28th, 2013 at 7:00pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 2:53pm:
that argument only makes sense if you make the assumption thatr the very last debt to be paid off was Howards $9B and keatings $87B was paid first. By any half-reasonable argument, the interest on Howards debt made it around $18B by 1996. it is astonishing watching you labor bozos criticise $9B of debt accrued during the worst post-ware recession in our history while literally applauding $290B in debt now.[/quote] You really like to try the twists and turns don't you, but finally an admission from LW that Howards $9B debt increased over time until it was paid down. Now to your other pointless arguments, I am not criticizing Howads debt, you really struggle with comprehension don't you. Please show me who on this forum has applauded Labors debt I,m betting you can't. Nobody wants debt but there are those who realize that debt is a major factor in any business and indeed any gov. The Liberal party had a similar policy to borrowing to Labor the difference was about $20m I believe but you continue to berate Labor over the currant debt when your beloved Liberals would have done exactly the same. Your claim that Howards debt would have been around $18B in 1996 is plausible but not knowing when this part of the debt was paid in full we will never know the exact figure. It is possible that the figure of $40B that has been proposed is also realistic. Why because by your own admission in 1996 Howards debt may have been $18B so a doubling in 13 years. All debt was re payed by 2005 so another 9 years and Howards debt may well be over the $30B mark. But after all this and many years of arguing we finally have an admission that Howards debt was greater than the $9B LW likes to claim and has defended vigorously for many years So now I expect that we will never see this claim ever ever again from LW. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by longweekend58 on Jul 28th, 2013 at 7:28pm scope wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 7:00pm:
You really like to try the twists and turns don't you, but finally an admission from LW that Howards $9B debt increased over time until it was paid down. Now to your other pointless arguments, I am not criticizing Howads debt, you really struggle with comprehension don't you. Please show me who on this forum has applauded Labors debt I,m betting you can't. Nobody wants debt but there are those who realize that debt is a major factor in any business and indeed any gov. The Liberal party had a similar policy to borrowing to Labor the difference was about $20m I believe but you continue to berate Labor over the currant debt when your beloved Liberals would have done exactly the same. Your claim that Howards debt would have been around $18B in 1996 is plausible but not knowing when this part of the debt was paid in full we will never know the exact figure. It is possible that the figure of $40B that has been proposed is also realistic. Why because by your own admission in 1996 Howards debt may have been $18B so a doubling in 13 years. All debt was re payed by 2005 so another 9 years and Howards debt may well be over the $30B mark. But after all this and many years of arguing we finally have an admission that Howards debt was greater than the $9B LW likes to claim and has defended vigorously for many years So now I expect that we will never see this claim ever ever again from LW. [/quote] buzz, skippy, john smith, alevine dsmith70 etc. they all tell us how the debt was a good thing. and howards debt WAS $9B. the fact that following govts failed to pay it down and accumulated interest is hardly howards fault. and the assertion that somehow $9B becomes $40B yet keatings $87B becomes LESS is idiotic but quite in keating with your 'labor good, liberal bad' mantra. and what are you going to say in 20 years time when we are still paying down rudds $200B debt? by then your argument will have changed. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:01pm [/quote] buzz, skippy, john smith, alevine dsmith70 etc. they all tell us how the debt was a good thing. and howards debt WAS $9B. the fact that following govts failed to pay it down and accumulated interest is hardly howards fault. and the assertion that somehow $9B becomes $40B yet keatings $87B becomes LESS is idiotic but quite in keating with your 'labor good, liberal bad' mantra. and what are you going to say in 20 years time when we are still paying down rudds $200B debt? by then your argument will have changed.[/quote] This is like arguing with a child. Your English comprehension is appalling you said "applauded Labors debt" then when asked who had done this you came up with these names " buzz, skippy, john smith, alevine dsmith70 etc." Thats a lie LW these people have never to my knowledge applauded any debt, what they have said is that the debt is managable that is totally different to applauding go away and learn some English. In 1996 the total gov debt was $96B this comprised both Howards and Keatings debt. So your claim that I am being idiotic and your claim that Keatings debt was $87B is wrong also. By your own admission Howards debt was maybe around $18B in 1996 so how could $96b minus $18B equal $87B Seriously go back to school Maths and English would be a good starting point for you. You seem to be the one with the Liberal good Labor bad mantra, You don't know who I vote for. Just because I show your claims to be bul-sh-t doesn't mean I am a Labor voter. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:18pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 3:00pm:
Some would say that if you want to compare debt from different era's then you should standardise the monetary currency to a particular time period or compare it as a percentage to GDP or such so that you end up comparing apples to apples is all I was trying to get at. Say we were to look at the financial position in 1974 you would get a debt amount which looks attractive in todays terms but with reference to things like a petrol price of 14.9 cents / litre you may get an understanding of the differing $ value. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by woof woof on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:34pm
How much debt should we go into? and if you labor supporters say that the current debt is not a problem, why was Swann sweating on running a surplus??
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:42pm woof woof wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:34pm:
Simply politics, when you have Howard and Costello telling blatant lies like this one "Labors $96B debt" People had become accustomed to hearing "we have a surplus again ain't we good" it's all bull, nobody likes debt but we have to have it at times. it's a fact of life we need a certain amount of debt to live our lives. The trick is getting the debt to a manageable level so you are comfortable re paying that debt. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by woof woof on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:51pm
so how much debt do we go into?
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:20pm woof woof wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 8:51pm:
Good question the most simplistic answer is "what we can afford to pay back" As long as whatever the debt is it has to be manageable that is why Australia currently has a brilliant credit rating , our debt at the moment is manageable It is impossible to put a figure on it, we have to use a standard so debt to GDP is used. at the moment it is around 20.7 last year ( 2011/2012) it was higher at 22.9 so we have reduced debt by a large amount in a short period of time. So what happens if our GDP increases over the next few years then it does allow us to service our debt much quicker and more easily , on the downside it also allows Gov's to borrow more. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:22pm
you might find this interesting.
Australia recorded a Government Debt to GDP of 20.70 percent of the country's Gross Domestic Product in 2012. Government Debt To GDP in Australia is reported by the AOFM, Australia. Australia Government Debt To GDP averaged 19.92 Percent from 1989 until 2012, reaching an all time high of 31.70 Percent in December of 1994 and a record low of 9.70 Percent in December of 2007. Generally, Government debt as a percent of GDP is used by investors to measure a country ability to make future payments on its debt, thus affecting the country borrowing costs and government bond yields. http://www.tradingeconomics.com/australia/government-debt-to-gdp |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:30pm
Obviously the less debt the better and the quicker to a surplus the better also.
We currently have 2 options for government one which has been working towards a surplus and thwarted by dwindling income while cutting back on middle class welfare etc and the other guys who are bringing well over $100B of unfunded spending to the table. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:39pm scope wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:22pm:
that is interesting scope, thanks |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:41pm Dnarever wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:30pm:
the govt we have now have put us into a huge debt. they have givn very serious vows to return to surplus a few times in the past. All falsely. I disbelieve them. they have failed too often in the past for me and told too many lies for me |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:49pm Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:41pm:
The problem I have with this type of thinking is that IF we had a Liberal Gov at the time they would have been forced into the same amount of debt, they even had a policy release to match Rudds GFC stimulus spending, the amounts where almost the same so we would still have the same amount of debt under the LIbs. I don't believe the vow to return to surplus was false at the time I believe it was possible but sometimes poo happens and the forecast's are wrong for whatever reason so then they have to revise the projections. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by woof woof on Jul 28th, 2013 at 10:30pm
My concern with the method of accounting by the gov in measuring debt by a % of GDP, is that GDP is not income it is the size of the economy.
The govs ability to repay debt is dependant on its tax take and its liabilities, if the liabilities exceed the tax take then the budget will be in deficit, meaning we owe more money. You can't repay debt with GDP so no matter what % the debt is to GDP debt repayment is solely dependant on tax-liabilities. And labor can't produce a surplus to save themselves??? |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Sprintcyclist on Jul 28th, 2013 at 10:35pm scope wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:49pm:
gosh it is nice to have someone discuss things reasonably. thanks scope. i give the alp the benfit of the doubt that they full well intended a surplus. Experts said it was improbable. the alp were badly wrong. they failed. Others estimated correctly. i did. It was not hard. A semigood management will get estimates about right. they will foresee events and cater to possibilities. the alp did not do this. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by perceptions_now on Jul 28th, 2013 at 11:13pm longweekend58 wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 3:40pm:
As usual Longy, YOU ARE INCORRECT! I have never said, we are all going to die, IT IS YOU WHO JUST SAID THAT! Also, I never said, we were going to run out of oil in 1985, BUT yes, we certainly will run out at some stage, AS OIL IS MOST DEINITELY A FINITE RESOURCE, don't you know! And, as for solutions, apparently you still, continue to fail the 4R's - Reading wRiting aRithmetic & compRehension So, I say again - "What I said is that, there is not necessarily a solution for everything & in this instance there is no solution, which would restore the "status quo", in either the short or medium term and certainly not without a great deal of shared pain for all!" |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 29th, 2013 at 12:09am woof woof wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 10:30pm:
Maybe it's not the best way , is there any better way? but that is what all countries use. Labor have produced surplus's Keating was the first treasurer to ever achieve a surplus. he did so on at least two occasions. The liberals had never achieved a surplus until Costello ( I may stand corrected on this but I believe it to be true) But achieving a surplus is not the be all to end all, it's how a surplus is achieved is what counts. I,m Trying to leave party politics aside here and not start a "ours is better than yours argument" The reality is that Costello had better times than most treasurers, and he held a huge amount of asset sales that other treasurers didn't do as much of. So it's easy to gain a surplus but at what cost, what do you do after you sell everything? Another reality is that for a Gov to run a surplus they are in fact taxing too much , really the books at the end of the year should balance , that is expenditure is equal to income but I think this is just a pipe dream. I agree a surplus is better than debt but there is also a problem with getting very large surplus's consistently. I think it was Costello who said that he had to rein in Howard on spending other wise he would have spent all the surplus on politicking an that's not a good thing. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by scope on Jul 29th, 2013 at 12:23am Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 10:35pm:
I agree they should not have made the promise, but at the time of the first promise things were looking good and many economists agreed that it was possible remember we are talking about a very small surplus of around $1B I think it was. just a few months later it was apparent that it would never happen. What labor have done well is to reduce the debt we have from the higher debt we had in 2011/2012. When you consider that they have cut spending to achieve this and have introduced new policies, this in today's economic climate that is really remarkable. Which is one reason why Swan (like him or hate him) received his best treasurer award. Was he a good treasurer ? I don't think he was particularly good but at the same time he didn't stuff things up as most claimed he would. He was mostly benign as a treasurer he coasted along not interfering and he let the economy take it's course. That was probably the smartest thing he did. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Spot of Borg on Jul 29th, 2013 at 5:56am Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:41pm:
So what? Some money has to be spent on infrastructure etc - seriously - there is no need for austerity @ this time. SOB |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by buzzanddidj on Jul 29th, 2013 at 8:18am Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:41pm:
REPOST ... Even John Howard is capable of coming clean with the TRUTH - occasionally - and giving credit, where credit is DUE Quote:
Australia’s GFC stimulus debt is the second lowest in the OECD. Gross debt stands at 28.9% of GDP. This compares to Japan at 224%, Greece at 193.2%, Portugal at 133.1%, Italy at 129.6%, Ireland at 127.7%, United States at 113%, France at 108.2%, UK at 110.4%, Canada at 85.5%, Spain at 100.2% Germany at 86.2%.i |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by bobbythebat1 on Jul 29th, 2013 at 10:10am Quote:
The fact is that it's always increasing - that's bad because it means we are living beyond our means. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by Dnarever on Jul 29th, 2013 at 10:01pm Sprintcyclist wrote on Jul 28th, 2013 at 9:41pm:
You make the narrative fit your pre conceived preference. The Current government have been one of the more honest we have had recently. The world conditions and gearing of the economy made a huge impact on the debt level and if that is the primary concern of yours then the level of the Liberals stated unfunded spending would leave brown stools in your pants. If you are truly concerned about debt then the group promising over $100 B of additional debt would be a stand out poor choice. |
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Title: Re: $19B deficit?....add another $8B to it pls Post by woof woof on Jul 30th, 2013 at 10:58am
Will the fed gov ever live within its means again regardless of who is in power?
I don't think it can??? |
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