Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under


http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html


Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made.

Employees before All Others.

____ wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:34am:

Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made. Employees before All Others.

and if there is NO MONEY? 

wasnt 1st fleet one of those trucking companies charged with altering the trucks so they could exceed the speed limit.?


where is the Tax man when all this is going on?

I hate seeing those that do the hard yards ripped off.. bad enough losing your job.

Wasn't it the employees driving those trucks without telling authorities what was going on. No sympathy here. Putting lives at risk and knowing what they were doing.

cods wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:49am:

____ wrote on May 3rd, 2012 at 8:34am: Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made. Employees before All Others. and if there is NO MONEY?  wasnt 1st fleet one of those trucking companies charged with altering the trucks so they could exceed the speed limit.? where is the Tax man when all this is going on? I hate seeing those that do the hard yards ripped off.. bad enough losing your job.

There is always some money left in assets. When sold off, the cash should pay out the employees.


Investors invest knowing the risks.

Employees on the other hand are just employed to do a job, not to take risks.

If they are employed to take risks then pay packets should include a risk dividend, above the normal wage/salary.

progressiveslol wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:53am:

Wasn't it the employees driving those trucks without telling authorities what was going on. No sympathy here. Putting lives at risk and knowing what they were doing.

Innocent until proven guilty applies.


Did the office employees know prog?

____ wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:34am:

Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made. Employees before All Others.

You have no cred Green boy. Consider this:


Quote:

WAYNE Swan has rejected calls for a large boost to permanent migration as he pledged his Budget would create 500,000 new jobs and drive unemployment to 4.5 per cent. [...] http://www.news.com.au/money/federal-budget/treasurer-wayne-swan-says-budget-measures-will-create-500000-new-jobs-cut-unemployment-to-45-per-cent/story-fn84fgcm-1226048198492

And if Wayne's plan A doesn't eventuate the displaced workers could get a job in the windmill industry.

____ wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:34am:

Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made. Employees before All Others.

Yes. I have seen time and again companies go under and the bank and other creditors jump in and grab their share leaving nothing to pay the employees with. The employees should be first in line because they are actual ppl who actually need the money.

SOB

It was my assumption employees were first. Employees can also aPply to the geers Program for Payment

The position regarding employees is, according to ASIC, as follows:

Quote:

Employees have the right, if there are funds left over after payment of the fees and expenses of the liquidator, to be paid their outstanding entitlements in priority to other unsecured creditors. Priority employee entitlements are grouped into classes and paid in the following order: 1. outstanding wages and superannuation 2. outstanding leave of absence (including annual leave and sick leave, where applicable, and long service leave), and 3. retrenchment pay. Each class is paid in full before the next class is paid. If there are insufficient funds to pay a class in full, the available funds are paid on a pro rata basis (and the next class or classes will be paid nothing). The priority claims of directors and their spouses or relatives for the period they are a director, spouse or relative of a director are limited to a maximum of $2000 for outstanding wages and superannuation, and $1500 for outstanding leave entitlements. Directors and their spouses or relatives are not entitled to any priority retrenchment pay for the period they are a director, spouse or relative of a director. Employees may also be entitled to make a claim against the General Employee Entitlements and Redundancy Scheme

But if the drivers are contracted to the company, the news is not so good:

Quote:

Contractors are not employees. They are ordinary unsecured creditors of the company.

http://www.asic.gov.au/asic/pdflib.nsf/LookupByFileName/Liquidation_guide_for_employees.pdf/$file/Liquidation_guide_for_employees.pdf

I seem to recall hearing that, until Whitlam changed the rules, the Tax Office used to rank above all creditors and would get paid in full before there was any distribution of funds to other creditors, including employees.  Anyone here know the details?

Verge wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 9:49am:

It was my assumption employees were first. Employees can also aPply to the geers Program for Payment

You are correct. Which is why Greens posts is totally wrong - which seems to be the standard. I think the ATO actually has first dibs but typically wages and entitlements ae paid out first although I think long-service comes after some top-ranked creditors.

Going under always sucks but it is often far worse for the business owner who not only loses a job but usually everything they possess as well as being bankrupt. its bad for EVERYONE.

cods wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:49am:

____ wrote on May 3rd, 2012 at 8:34am: Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made. Employees before All Others. and if there is NO MONEY?  wasnt 1st fleet one of those trucking companies charged with altering the trucks so they could exceed the speed limit.? where is the Tax man when all this is going on? I hate seeing those that do the hard yards ripped off.. bad enough losing your job.

No, that was Scotts of South Australia

and the Tax Man is first in line

Guildford wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 10:49am:

and the Tax Man is first in line

Crown debt priority was abolished in Australia many years ago (it may have been 1973 or 1974, but I'm not sure). The Australian Taxation Office is now just another unsecured creditor.

Frances wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 11:08am:

Guildford wrote on May 3rd, 2012 at 10:49am: and the Tax Man is first in line Crown debt priority was abolished in Australia many years ago (it may have been 1973 or 1974, but I'm not sure). The Australian Taxation Office is now just another unsecured creditor.

Actually, it was a high court case in 2009 that changed the priority. I've been checking.


“Insolvency practitioners, secured creditors and employees may rest assured that the tax office is not able to jump the queue for the repayment of tax in priority to other debts such as superannuation, employee entitlements and liquidation costs when a company is placed in Liquidation.”

http://www.hallchadwick.com.au/media-releases/bruton-holdings-pty-ltd-high-court-decision-gives-relief-to-liquidators-employees-and-creditors

Guildford wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 11:20am:

http://www.hallchadwick.com.au/media-releases/bruton-holdings-pty-ltd-high-court-decision-gives-relief-to-liquidators-employees-and-creditors

Very interesting.

Crown debt once took priority over other debts and the ATO had to be paid in full before other creditors received a cent, but this rule was abolished years ago.

The ATO has long had the power to garnishee debts which someone owes to a company. If a company owes tax to the ATO and someone owes money to the company, the ATO can require that debtor to pay the money to the ATO, rather than to the company, by serving a section 260-5 notice on the debtor.

What happened in the Bruton case was that the ATO served a section 260-5 notice on a debtor, but did so after the company had gone into liquidation. It appeared that the ATO was exploiting a potential loophole in order to bring back crown debt priority from the dead.

The Federal Court upheld the ATO's decision but, on appeal, the High Court overturned the Federal Court's decision.

____ wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 8:53am:

cods wrote on May 3rd, 2012 at 8:49am: ____ wrote on May 3rd, 2012 at 8:34am: Truckies terminated as 1st Fleet goes under http://www.smh.com.au/victoria/truckies-terminated-as-1st-fleet-goes-under-20120503-1y018.html Time for law changes so employees are first in line when payment to creditors are made. Employees before All Others. and if there is NO MONEY?  wasnt 1st fleet one of those trucking companies charged with altering the trucks so they could exceed the speed limit.? where is the Tax man when all this is going on? I hate seeing those that do the hard yards ripped off.. bad enough losing your job. There is always some money left in assets. When sold off, the cash should pay out the employees. Investors invest knowing the risks. Employees on the other hand are just employed to do a job, not to take risks. If they are employed to take risks then pay packets should include a risk dividend, above the normal wage/salary.

you will find I think the TAXMAN comes first..not forgetting the receivers... maybe its time some business took out insurance against this happening..I dont know anymore.. its happening all around us like a pack of cards coming down..

and  this is where the banks sew up these loans.. they make the contract they will always be first cab off the rank..and guess who is totally unaware of all this going on??????????

Frances wrote on May 3^rd, 2012 at 12:37pm:

Guildford wrote on May 3rd, 2012 at 11:20am: http://www.hallchadwick.com.au/media-releases/bruton-holdings-pty-ltd-high-court-decision-gives-relief-to-liquidators-employees-and-creditors Very interesting. Crown debt once took priority over other debts and the ATO had to be paid in full before other creditors received a cent, but this rule was abolished years ago. The ATO has long had the power to garnishee debts which someone owes to a company. If a company owes tax to the ATO and someone owes money to the company, the ATO can require that debtor to pay the money to the ATO, rather than to the company, by serving a section 260-5 notice on the debtor. What happened in the Bruton case was that the ATO served a section 260-5 notice on a debtor, but did so after the company had gone into liquidation. It appeared that the ATO was exploiting a potential loophole in order to bring back crown debt priority from the dead. The Federal Court upheld the ATO's decision but, on appeal, the High Court overturned the Federal Court's decision.

oh I didnt know that..so ignorant of the law..

seems to me the poor bugger that has nothing to do with anything except he has worked his butt off.. is way down the track...whats is it.. 10cents in the dollar...yeah bye bye long service..bye bye redundancy.. lousy.