This is a mp3 of an interview on 2UE between David Oldfield and British lord Christopher Monckton (14MB), worth listening to

http://media.mytalk.com.au/2ue/audio/270611monckton.mp3

A comprehensive debunking of Monckton

http://www.skepticalscience.com/Monckton_Myths.htm

http://www.stthomas.edu/engineering/jpabraham/

Dont you just love how the environmentalist nuts hate Monckton. It gives a reason to buy popcorn.

Stick it to them Monkton

Or how 'GetUp' go around trying to stop him from speaking by hassling the venues where he intends to speak.
And how the 'critics' state that Monckton has no scientific training and yet accept the greed inspired rants of Garnaut and Al Gore as 'progressive truth'

Finnish Cinema's Relevance To Climate Change

LAST WEEK 50-or-so "academics" signed a group letter demanding that Christopher Monckton be shunned and silenced.
Here are most of the signatories, with some notes and links about their specialties and credentials.
If a person is to be judged by his enemies, Monckton looks very good indeed.
http://bunyipitude.blogspot.com/2011/07/finnish-cinema-and-climate-change.html

Professor Bunyip does the research:

Winthrop Professor Stephan Lewandowsky, Australian Professorial Fellow, UWA
Alene Composta’s soulmate. Yep, this guy can spot a fraud when he sees one.


Prof John P. Abraham, Associate Professor, School of Engineering, University of St. Thomas
Neither in Australia nor Australian.. He is an American academic in Minnesota and suffers from a severe Monckton fixation. He writes to those whose research is challenged, asks what they think of Monckton and then posts their responses, which mostly amount to repeating their original claims. By Abraham’s standards this amounts to “refutation.” He and Monckton trade lawyers’ letters and threaten to sue each other. Abraham has a dog in this fight and it’s an ugly, self-interested one.


Natalie Latter, PhD Candidate, UWA
Student. Hoping the global warming schtick lasts long enough to get her career established. Her background is political science, not climate science.


Mike Blanchard, PhD Candidate, UWA
Another pol-sci type specialising in “governmentality”. Whatever that may be, figure it involves higher taxes and a lot of more of being told how to think and behave.

...
Sanna Peden, PhD Candidate, UWA
Specialist in the representation of the Salvation Army in Finnish cinema. And no, that is not joke.

....
Esmeralda Rocha, PhD Candidate, UWA.
Resident climate change expert at UWA’s School of Music.

....
Dr Clare Lloyd, Lecturer, Internet Studies, Curtin University
This environmental expert’s PhD: “I 'heart' mobile phone’: a discursive study of identity processes through mobile phone communication.”


Prof Roger N Jones, Professorial Research Fellow, Centre for Strategic Economic Studies, Victoria University
Climate pimp and proud vulgarian.


Dr Markus Donat, Research Fellow, Climate Change Research Centre, University of New South Wales
Trying to link catastrophic weather events to climate change. So far, more hole than donat
....



All linked stuff. Hilarious.

Monckton was what you might term a Clayton's Adviser. If you don't particularly want to hear the truth, you just appoint a graduate in Classical Studies and just call him a policy adviser.

leon_the_14 wrote on Jun 30^th, 2011 at 12:23am:

This is a mp3 of an interview on 2UE between David Oldfield and British lord Christopher Monckton (14MB), worth listening to http://media.mytalk.com.au/2ue/audio/270611monckton.mp3

Well, I thought it was funny!

Not the interviw, but the way this tread reads on the main page -
Re: Interview with Christ...

Of course, Monckton does fall a little short of being the re-incarnation of Christ!

In terms of the interview,  it is simply Monckton, doing what Monckton does, which is entertain to his audience.

muso wrote on Jul 5^th, 2011 at 8:17am:

Monckton was what you might term a Clayton's Adviser. If you don't particularly want to hear the truth, you just appoint a graduate in Classical Studies and just call him a policy adviser.

Now that your back, I eagerly await your report on what were the best parts of Europe, so I can add then to our list, for our upcoming trip?

perceptions_now wrote on Jul 5^th, 2011 at 11:44am:

muso wrote on Jul 5th, 2011 at 8:17am: Monckton was what you might term a Clayton's Adviser. If you don't particularly want to hear the truth, you just appoint a graduate in Classical Studies and just call him a policy adviser. Now that your back, I eagerly await your report on what were the best parts of Europe, so I can add then to our list, for our upcoming trip?

The Apennines Mountains in spring are absolutely beautiful and not commercialised in any ways.

leon_the_14 wrote on Jun 30^th, 2011 at 12:23am:

This is a mp3 of an interview on 2UE between David Oldfield and British lord Christopher Monckton (14MB), worth listening to http://media.mytalk.com.au/2ue/audio/270611monckton.mp3

2UE , Oldfield and Mockton - now there’s a trifecta for you.

No chance of me wasting 15 or 20 minutes of my life on this junk.

Here is Alan Jones interview with Lord Monkton 07/07/2011

http://www.2gb.com/index2.php?option=com_newsmanager&task=view&id=9350

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 7^th, 2011 at 12:39pm:

Here is Alan Jones interview with Lord Monkton 07/07/2011 http://www.2gb.com/index2.php?option=com_newsmanager&task=view&id=9350

Here is Adam Spencer's interview with Monckton

http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2011/07/monckton_interviewed_by_adam_s.php

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 7^th, 2011 at 12:39pm:

Lord Monkton

LOL, I love how the deniers latch onto his peerage and refer to it deferentially as if they think it lends him gravitas! ;D

astro_surf wrote on Jul 11^th, 2011 at 9:29pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 7th, 2011 at 12:39pm: Lord Monkton LOL, I love how the deniers latch onto his peerage and refer to it deferentially as if they think it lends him gravitas! ;D

So we should start calling you surf. I dont care either way, but it does seem to get under your skin, so maybe it is a good idea to keep the lord in front. Besides, if I left lord out, then you poor buggers wouldn't have your 2 matches strike to know to bag him.

Just watched the National Press Club debate between Dr Richard Denniss and Lord Christopher Monckton...

Quite interesting.....Dr Denniss spoke quite well (although not quite as confidently as Lord Monckton, which might be due to experience)...as did Lord Monckton...

Quite informative, especially on Lord Monckton's actual views on ACC.....Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think...

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 2:07pm:

Just watched the National Press Club debate between Dr Richard Denniss and Lord Christopher Monckton... Quite interesting.....Dr Denniss spoke quite well (although not quite as confidently as Lord Monckton, which might be due to experience)...as did Lord Monckton... Quite informative, especially on Lord Monckton's actual views on ACC.....Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think...

Do you have a link?

Quote:

.Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think...

I doubt it, Monckton is a master of obfuscation. I'm well aware of what he is capable of.

And in the news today, the House of Lords disowns Monckton and demands he cease and desist in claiming to be a member.


Quote:

Controversial climate change sceptic Christopher Monckton has been warned by the House of Lords not to misrepresent himself as a member of the upper house of the UK Parliament in the wake of an Australian radio stoush. Mr Monckton was chastised through an open letter published on the UK Parliament's website that requested he "desist from claiming to be a Member of the House of Lords". The letter cites a recent interview with the ABC's Adam Spencer, during which Mr Monckton told him: "I am a Member of the House" but "without the right to sit or vote". The radio interview became heated with Mr Monckton telling Mr Spencer to "shut up". The radio host at one stage hung up on his guest. The letter was written by Clerk of the Parliaments David Beamish, who said his predecessor had written to Mr Monckton twice last year with a similar request. Mr Beamish said while Mr Monckton, who is a Viscount, was a peer, that was not the same thing as being a member of the House of Lords. He said he had published the letter on the internet to ensure that anyone wanting to check Mr Monckton's credentials could do so. Mr Monckton today debated with the Australia Institute's executive director, economist Richard Denniss, at the National Press Club. Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/world/radio-stoush-triggers-parliamentary-anger-20110719-1hmo1.html#ixzz1SYRYYLNK

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 8:56pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 2:07pm: Just watched the National Press Club debate between Dr Richard Denniss and Lord Christopher Monckton... Quite interesting.....Dr Denniss spoke quite well (although not quite as confidently as Lord Monckton, which might be due to experience)...as did Lord Monckton... Quite informative, especially on Lord Monckton's actual views on ACC.....Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think... Do you have a link?

No, not yet...it usually takes a day or two for the website to update..
When the vid appears, I will link it though..

.


Bolt has a look-see...


Monckton’s commanding performance at the National Press Club today made the vast majority of journalists there seem:

- warmist group thinkers in a pack attack.

- under-researched

- ignorant of basic criticisms of warmist deceits, with one journalist even referring to carbon dioxide as “pollution” and another accusing Monckton falsely of denying “climate change”.

What was shown would have confirmed the suspicions of many about the bias of the media in reporting global warming.


http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/monckton_rebuked/



Monckton comments on the climate muppets carry on about his 'title'...

“The House of Lords Act 1999 debarred all but 92 of the 650 Hereditary Peers, including my father, from sitting or voting, and purported to – but did not – remove membership of the Upper House. Letters Patent granting peerages, and consequently membership, are the personal gift of the Monarch. Only a specific law can annul a grant. The 1999 Act was a general law. The then Government, realizing this defect, took three maladroit steps: it wrote asking expelled Peers to return their Letters Patent (though that does not annul them); in 2009 it withdrew the passes admitting expelled Peers to the House (and implying they were members); and it told the enquiry clerks to deny they were members: but a written Parliamentary Answer by the Lord President of the Council admits that general legislation cannot annul Letters Patent, so I am The Viscount Monckton of Brenchley (as my passport shows), a member of the Upper House but without the right to sit or vote, and I have never pretended otherwise.”


Heh, the Monckton 'title' is certainly handy to stir up the climate muppets.. ;D





.

astro_surf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 10:42pm:

Quote: .Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think... I doubt it, Monckton is a master of obfuscation. I'm well aware of what he is capable of. And in the news today, the House of Lords disowns Monckton and demands he cease and desist in claiming to be a member. [quote]Controversial climate change sceptic Christopher Monckton has been warned by the House of Lords not to misrepresent himself as a member of the upper house of the UK Parliament in the wake of an Australian radio stoush. Mr Monckton was chastised through an open letter published on the UK Parliament's website that requested he "desist from claiming to be a Member of the House of Lords". The letter cites a recent interview with the ABC's Adam Spencer, during which Mr Monckton told him: "I am a Member of the House" but "without the right to sit or vote". The radio interview became heated with Mr Monckton telling Mr Spencer to "shut up". The radio host at one stage hung up on his guest. The letter was written by Clerk of the Parliaments David Beamish, who said his predecessor had written to Mr Monckton twice last year with a similar request. Mr Beamish said while Mr Monckton, who is a Viscount, was a peer, that was not the same thing as being a member of the House of Lords. He said he had published the letter on the internet to ensure that anyone wanting to check Mr Monckton's credentials could do so. Mr Monckton today debated with the Australia Institute's executive director, economist Richard Denniss, at the National Press Club. Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/world/radio-stoush-triggers-parliamentary-anger-20110719-1hmo1.html#ixzz1SYRYYLNK

[/quote]

I think you'd be a little surprised astro....
He does believe in climate change (as do I, since it's been happening for 4.5 Billion years) however, he ALSO believes that adding Co2 will increase the temperatures...

But he doesn't think the climate sensitivity is any where near as bad as  as the IPCC and the Australian Government claims..
His concept is that temp increases won't be much more than 1 degree Celcius per century....as it's been since 1750....as opposed to the IPCC's figure of 3.3 celcius or our Gov's figure of 5.5 celcius....
And he doesn't think the Liberal's Direct Action Plan is any better than the Carbon Tax..

.

Bunyipitude asks some questions...


"FORTY EIGHT hours have passed since Wendy Carlisle of  Background Briefing put to air her assault on Viscount Monckton -- two days in which a transcript of the sixty-minute slander has failed to appear.

The ABC must struggle through on a paltry billion-or-so dollars per year, but surely it could have processed and posted the script by now. Unless, of course, it would prefer to make a line-by-line examination of its handiwork rather difficult.

Readers might like to drop ABC supremo Mark Scott a polite note and..."

http://bunyipitude.blogspot.com/2011/07/missing-link.html






.

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 10:54pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 8:56pm: gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 2:07pm: Just watched the National Press Club debate between Dr Richard Denniss and Lord Christopher Monckton... Quite interesting.....Dr Denniss spoke quite well (although not quite as confidently as Lord Monckton, which might be due to experience)...as did Lord Monckton... Quite informative, especially on Lord Monckton's actual views on ACC.....Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think... Do you have a link? No, not yet...it usually takes a day or two for the website to update.. When the vid appears, I will link it though..

Thanks I look forward to watching the debate :)

.



The Climate muppets should look up the word "Hereditary" then they will understand.. ;)







.

Flying Binghi wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:05pm:

. Bunyipitude asks some questions... "FORTY EIGHT hours have passed since Wendy Carlisle of  Background Briefing put to air her assault on Viscount Monckton -.

That's hilarious because it was Wendy who was physically assaulted by Monckton thuggish and violent supporters:

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/backgroundbriefing/stories/2011/3268730.htm

I strongly recommend listening to this one too, Smithy  >:(

Flying Binghi wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:10pm:

. [color=#0000ff]The Climate muppets should look up the word "Hereditary" then they will understand...

Climate muppets:

http://www.parliament.uk/documents/lords-information-office/2011/letter-to-viscount-monckton-20110715.pdf

::) ::) ::)

I suppose the deniers believe he has cured HIV, Malaria and MS too!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lm-tKEpJs7I

That's one hell of an expert you guys have got on your side!  :D :D :D

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:08pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 10:54pm: Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 8:56pm: gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 2:07pm: Just watched the National Press Club debate between Dr Richard Denniss and Lord Christopher Monckton... Quite interesting.....Dr Denniss spoke quite well (although not quite as confidently as Lord Monckton, which might be due to experience)...as did Lord Monckton... Quite informative, especially on Lord Monckton's actual views on ACC.....Not what a lot of people on here suspect I think... Do you have a link? No, not yet...it usually takes a day or two for the website to update.. When the vid appears, I will link it though.. Thanks I look forward to watching the debate :)

Found a copy on Youtube smithy...It runs an hour though...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=207lg-1GWAE

And just for giggles, count the number of times Dr Denniss mentions 'conspiracy'...

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:26pm:

And just for giggles, count the number of times Dr Denniss mentions 'conspiracy'...

He's debating with someone who has repeatedly asserted that AGW is a One World Government conspiracy, yes these are your denier bedfellows Gizmo, you can't hand wave away the conspiracy theory that  exists by necessity at the heart of any denier mindset.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAkiDhS0XIA

This is your expert.  ::)

.



astro_surf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:16pm:

Flying Binghi wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 11:10pm: . The Climate muppets should look up the word "Hereditary" then they will understand... Climate muppets: http://www.parliament.uk/documents/lords-information-office/2011/letter-to-viscount-monckton-20110715.pdf

[color=#0000ff]Again, via Monckton

“The House of Lords Act 1999 debarred all but 92 of the 650 Hereditary Peers, including my father, from sitting or voting, and purported to – but did not – remove membership of the Upper House. Letters Patent granting peerages, and consequently membership, are the personal gift of the Monarch. Only a specific law can annul a grant. The 1999 Act was a general law. The then Government, realizing this defect, took three maladroit steps: it wrote asking expelled Peers to return their Letters Patent (though that does not annul them); in 2009 it withdrew the passes admitting expelled Peers to the House (and implying they were members); and it told the enquiry clerks to deny they were members: but a written Parliamentary Answer by the Lord President of the Council admits that general legislation cannot annul Letters Patent, so I am The Viscount Monckton of Brenchley (as my passport shows), a member of the Upper House but without the right to sit or vote, and I have never pretended otherwise.”


Heh, the Monckton 'title' is certainly handy to stir up the climate muppets.. ;D








.

astro_surf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:50pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 11:26pm: And just for giggles, count the number of times Dr Denniss mentions 'conspiracy'... He's debating with someone who has repeatedly asserted that AGW is a One World Government conspiracy, yes these are your denier bedfellows Gizmo, you can't hand wave away the conspiracy theory that  exists by necessity at the heart of any denier mindset. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAkiDhS0XIA This is your expert.  ::)

But Lord Monckton never mentioned it (the conspiracy) during the entire debate....Only Dr Denniss did...

I can understand him ( Dr Denniss) bringing it up during his opening remarks, because there are people who think that a conspiracy exists.....
But why mention it again and again, in response to unrelated questions???

It just made him seem a little like a broken record...In the first half of the debate, it was almost like he only had a one paragraph speech memorised and he just kept looping back to those points...
Conspiracy
Tony Abbott can't find any economists
and
It's like car/home insurance...

He did loosen up later and actual engage with the topic...but it took a while...

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 20^th, 2011 at 12:12pm:

astro_surf wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 11:50pm: gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 11:26pm: And just for giggles, count the number of times Dr Denniss mentions 'conspiracy'... He's debating with someone who has repeatedly asserted that AGW is a One World Government conspiracy, yes these are your denier bedfellows Gizmo, you can't hand wave away the conspiracy theory that  exists by necessity at the heart of any denier mindset. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAkiDhS0XIA This is your expert.  ::) But Lord Monckton never mentioned it (the conspiracy) during the entire debate....Only Dr Denniss did... I can understand him ( Dr Denniss) bringing it up during his opening remarks, because there are people who think that a conspiracy exists..... But why mention it again and again, in response to unrelated questions??? It just made him seem a little like a broken record...In the first half of the debate, it was almost like he only had a one paragraph speech memorised and he just kept looping back to those points... Conspiracy Tony Abbott can't find any economists and It's like car/home insurance... He did loosen up later and actual engage with the topic...but it took a while...

For the love of god, gizmo, we disagree on this issue, that's plain. I think you've drawn the wrong conclusions due to your politics, you probably think the same about me. But you, out of all the so-called deniers on this forum, seem to be able to discern between a good argument and a bad argument, a nutjob and someone who is making a pertinent point. Do yourself a favour, disown this clown, one day you will regret ever throwing your lot in with someone like Monckton.

Don't throw away your principles because a nutjob who is good at rabble rousing happen to be espousing something you happen to agree with.

.


Heh... poor ol astro_surf is in a panic by the looks of it.. :)






.

If you don't have to stick to the facts and you're free to lie, you can win just about any argument (or think you've won it).

muso wrote on Jul 21^st, 2011 at 12:01pm:

If you don't have to stick to the facts and you're free to lie, you can win just about any argument (or think you've won it).

http://logicien.fr/media/k2/items/cache/e31ace2a15a7c70645ad83df9ecd43b0_L.jpg

muso wrote on Jul 21^st, 2011 at 12:01pm:

If you don't have to stick to the facts and you're free to lie, you can win just about any argument (or think you've won it).

I love examples like this - people don't buy my argument, therefore they are fooled by the other guy.

Face facts Mr Musician:  there are incomparably greater number of kooks and mongs cheering your side than there are against it. Monckton et al are successful to a large extent because of the frauds, rent seekers, Stalinists, opportunists, preening nobodies, totalitarians, doctors' wives and the like speaking out for AGW.

AGW is irrevocably ruined by too many and too loud bad arguments deployed in support of it.

Soren wrote on Jul 21^st, 2011 at 10:00pm:

muso wrote on Jul 21st, 2011 at 12:01pm: If you don't have to stick to the facts and you're free to lie, you can win just about any argument (or think you've won it). I love examples like this - people don't buy my argument, therefore they are fooled by the other guy. Face facts Mr Musician:  there are incomparably greater number of kooks and mongs cheering your side than there are against it. Monckton et al are successful to a large extent because of the frauds, rent seekers, Stalinists, opportunists, preening nobodies, totalitarians, doctors' wives and the like speaking out for AGW. AGW is irrevocably ruined by too many and too loud bad arguments deployed in support of it.

I'm not interested in loud bad arguments in the popular arena. I prefer rigorous science to nonsense.

astro_surf wrote on Jul 19^th, 2011 at 11:50pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Jul 19th, 2011 at 11:26pm: And just for giggles, count the number of times Dr Denniss mentions 'conspiracy'... He's debating with someone who has repeatedly asserted that AGW is a One World Government conspiracy, yes these are your denier bedfellows Gizmo, you can't hand wave away the conspiracy theory that  exists by necessity at the heart of any denier mindset. This is your expert.  ::)

Apart from that, he has lifted graphs of global temperatures from a text (Curry and Clow), reversed the time scales and then claimed that they showed cooling, not warming.

He's certainly no Master of Science. He's a Master of (unashamed) Jiggerypokery.

http://hot-topic.co.nz/monckton-the-case-of-the-missing-curry/

muso wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2011 at 8:18am:

Soren wrote on Jul 21st, 2011 at 10:00pm: muso wrote on Jul 21st, 2011 at 12:01pm: If you don't have to stick to the facts and you're free to lie, you can win just about any argument (or think you've won it). I love examples like this - people don't buy my argument, therefore they are fooled by the other guy. Face facts Mr Musician:  there are incomparably greater number of kooks and mongs cheering your side than there are against it. Monckton et al are successful to a large extent because of the frauds, rent seekers, Stalinists, opportunists, preening nobodies, totalitarians, doctors' wives and the like speaking out for AGW. AGW is irrevocably ruined by too many and too loud bad arguments deployed in support of it. I'm not interested in loud bad arguments in the popular arena. I prefer rigorous science to nonsense.

You may not be interested in the loud and bad arguments for AGW but they are interested in you (as Trotsky might have put it).
Or as Nietzsche said, there is no better way to discredit a good idea than to argue for it from false premises/badly.
This is what's happened to the whole climate debate. The science is the least of it. It is a public and global policy debate. That's where all the rent-seekers, pseudo-commissars, ferals and naifs have been doing their worst. That's why a Monckton can have a huge impact. He essentially ridicules all the d!ckheads who deploy bad public policy arguments like Gore, Flannery and Rudd/Gillard/Swan/Brown with the Australian 'carbon tax'.

'AGW' is a whole lot more than the mere science of atmospheric and oceanic CO2.

Soren wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2011 at 10:20am:

You may not be interested in the loud and bad arguments for AGW but they are interested in you (as Trotsky might have put it). Or as Nietzsche said, there is no better way to discredit a good idea than to argue for it from false premises/badly. This is what's happened to the whole climate debate. The science is the least of it. It is a public and global policy debate. That's where all the rent-seekers, pseudo-commissars, ferals and naifs have been doing their worst. That's why a Monckton can have a huge impact. He essentially ridicules all the d!ckheads who deploy bad public policy arguments like Gore, Flannery and Rudd/Gillard/Swan/Brown with the Australian 'carbon tax'. 'AGW' is a whole lot more than the mere science of atmospheric and oceanic CO2.

Monckton is a clown and a proven liar.  He doesn't have any credibility in ridiculing others.

Having said that, I don't buy holus bolus every compromised decision made by every government in the world on the subject of carbon mitigation.

What I do support is increased investment in renewable energy and realistic carbon mitigation schemes.

I've said before ad nauseum that we should be concentrating on a tax on exported coal. Canada has done that, and there is no reason why  we can't do the same, and in so doing, reap some of the benefit from overseas corporations which  'rape' our natural resources with very little beneft going back to Australia.

The carbon tax itself  will be a hard sell, and It will probably end up being a suicidal move. We need to have some kind of leverage that favours renewable energy that is not likely to be removed when government changes hands - and that's a big ask. It's a serious point - maybe a good discussion point for a new thread.

The way that European countries attempted to manage the requirements of the Kyoto Protocoal was a disgrace.  Some people and corporations certainly profited from it, but the environment did not.

I don't tend to blindly follow the policies of one party over another, and I am happy to point out the mistakes made by politicians of all persuasions.

It's extremely frustrating to see how little progress we have made in renewable energy, and to see that we still have government incentives (tax holidays) to encourage large corporations to burn more coal and oil, while such incentives  don't exist for renewables.

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Environment/Pix/columnists/2009/12/10/1260453997366/The-3rd-Viscount-Monckton-001.jpg

hello