Sappho wrote on May 5^th, 2011 at 3:45am:

I have learned that there are many atheists out there who are not content living without belief in theism. Rather, they obsess over theism and why they don't accept it as valid or evidenced. They like to engage theists in debate about theism with the purposes of denigrating same. They are also extremely intolerant... so much so that they are causing me to think about my attitudes and whether they are extreme... such as my desire to see all forms of religion removed from state schools.

What does this mean? Would you ban prayers in schools?

Don't answer Sappho - he is pretending NOT to understand that you are questioning your belief in the removal of religion from schools, hitherto held but now perhaps less firmly so.
You answer and you might never extract yourself from the sucking maw of FD's - what do you call it? Ah, yes -  mind. It happened to me just recently but I think I may have been miraculously exctracted. You might not be so lucky.

freediver wrote on May 5^th, 2011 at 6:46pm:

Sappho wrote on May 5th, 2011 at 3:45am: I have learned that there are many atheists out there who are not content living without belief in theism. Rather, they obsess over theism and why they don't accept it as valid or evidenced. They like to engage theists in debate about theism with the purposes of denigrating same. They are also extremely intolerant... so much so that they are causing me to think about my attitudes and whether they are extreme... such as my desire to see all forms of religion removed from state schools. What does this mean? Would you ban prayers in schools?

What you really mean is... Would you ban prayers in state schools? And the answer is yes.

If a person wants for their children to have a religious and traditional education, send them to a religious school. If you can only afford a state school, get your kids involved with a religious congregation. State schools are not the place to introduce religious studies.

And as for Xmas and Easter in school... they are about Santa and the Easter bunny respectively... just good ol' fashioned, imaginative childhood fun that begins and ends in childhood.

PS: couldn't help my self Soren.  ;)

So what should the punishment be for a student that says a prayer in school?

Purgatory!?

freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 7:58pm:

So what should the punishment be for a student that says a prayer in school?

Four Hail Mary's and six Our Fathers.

freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 7:58pm:

So what should the punishment be for a student that says a prayer in school?

Six months with you, FD.

freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 7:58pm:

So what should the punishment be for a student that says a prayer in school?

A. Public ridicule.

B. Perhaps get DoCS involved.

C. A good Dickensian type thrashing.

D. A simple "wake up to yourself, you bloody idiot".

E. Two versus of Kumbaya followed by a bit of frantic running around in circles whilst waving your arms in the air and speaking in tongues.

Personally, I'd go for D. Perhaps A.

Life_goes_on wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 9:19pm:

freediver wrote on May 6th, 2011 at 7:58pm: So what should the punishment be for a student that says a prayer in school? A. Public ridicule. B. Perhaps get DoCS involved. C. A good Dickensian type thrashing. D. A simple "wake up to yourself, you bloody idiot". E. Two versus of Kumbaya followed by a bit of frantic running around in circles whilst waving your arms in the air and speaking in tongues. Personally, I'd go for D. Perhaps A.

All this extended to Muslim students who wish to be excused from class for a prayer?

Of course. None of the multiculti accommodation and bowing down of heads we have come to expect from the hammer & sickle brigade.

Quote:

All this extended to Muslim students who wish to be excused from class for a prayer?

Of course. I'm very EEO. I don't care if they're Christian, Muslim, Hindu or Wiccan. If they're a kid and come over all religious then they deserve to be told to wake up to themselves.

freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 7:58pm:

So what should the punishment be for a student that says a prayer in school?

Dude... you want punishments? How perfectly biblical of you.

It's enough, if it is seen, to stop it and remind the child that school is not the place... to wait until a more appropriate time and space to resume the prayer.

It would also be wise to ask what they are praying for, as it may have something to do with school life... such as bullying or bad school results for example... in which case you take the focus off the prayer and onto the issue which caused the prayer.

Quote:

Dude... you want punishments? How perfectly biblical of you.

So you want to ban things without punishment? Isn't that a bit naive? Is it only 'biblical' people who think bans are ineffective without punishment?


Quote:

It's enough, if it is seen, to stop it and remind the child that school is not the place...

Here I was thinking (hoping?) you had probably just misrepresented yourself and did not want the ban to be so broad.

So what if the student just ignores you and keeps praying? What if the student starts praying aloud for you to be forgiven for you errors? How effective is that?

Where else should praying be banned?

What about meditation?

freediver wrote on May 7^th, 2011 at 9:27am:

So what if the student just ignores you and keeps praying? What if the student starts praying aloud for you to be forgiven for you errors? How effective is that?

Sounds like the matter needs to be addressed with the parents and not the child. The school would need to suggest that a religious school would better suit them and their child... or if no school which suits their religious convictions exists... for home schooling within their religious community to be the best option. (for the last option to work, the parents would need to be linked in with their religious community and their are agencies out there who focus on community development)


Quote:

Where else should praying be banned?

In all state institutions... so as to honour the separation of state and religion.


Quote:

What about meditation?

Mediation is not necessarily religious... (I meditate because it has the proven ability of increasing contentedness... but there is nothing godly in my meditations) although it would pose a problem if being done in class time... since the focus should be on the lessons presented.

Quote:

The school would need to suggest

And this would be more effective than the initial ineffective suggestion? What if the parents told them to get buggered?


Quote:

for home schooling within their religious community

You want to encourage home schooling?


Quote:

In all state institutions... so as to honour the separation of state and religion.

So people should not be allwoed to pray on university campus? What about in public service offices and buildings?


Quote:

Mediation is not necessarily religious... (I meditate because it has the proven ability of increasing contentedness... but there is nothing godly in my meditations) although it would pose a problem if being done in class time... since the focus should be on the lessons presented.

What if the meditation is religious?

I wonder why there is no Atheist Schools?
If there was one, would they get the same Government handouts as the Religious and Private schools?

This Topic was moved here from Atheism by freediver.