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Australian Politics Forum
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl Political Parties >> The Greens >> Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1298888925 Message started by Maqqa on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:28pm

Title: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Maqqa on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:28pm

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/carbon-price-isnt-a-cure-all-greens-mp-adam-bandt/story-fn3dxity-1226013768611

GREENS MP Adam Bandt says the federal government is wrongly regarding a carbon tax as a cure-all for global warming.

Mr Bandt, the minor party's sole lower house MP, said a carbon price alone would not be enough to address climate change, arguing there needed to be a greater focus on renewable energy.

"A carbon price is not going to be a cure-all," the member for Melbourne told parliament tonight.

"I am less sanguine about the market than the members of the government who seem to believe it will be a cure-all."

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:30pm

Maqqa wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:28pm:

"Nobody in NSW politics, on either side, can figure out why Gillard chose the dying weeks of the state Labor government to announce a great big new tax designed to change the weather."

That's it - the Green/Labor view of the world summed up perfectly: a new tax to change the weather.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Maqqa on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:32pm

Of course it won't fix it.

Australia contributes 1.2% of total world carbon emissions

Looney Greenies will tell you Aust emits more PER CAPITA

Who cares!! Regardless of the per capita numbers - it's still ONLY 1.2%

If we shut Australia down not - we would only reduce carbon emissions by 1.2%

Chinese and Indians produce more carbon in their farts in a fortnight than what Australians emit in a year

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Maqqa on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:39pm

Does anyone know the answer

091855-11-02-28-bill-leak.jpg (65 KB | 46 )

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:40pm

This is a tax designed to placate the loonies (Greens Win, Equitist et al) who always look to the government to validate whatever they are preening about in public. As long as they are made to feel good about sticking it to the 'big polluters' (ie the generators of their electricity), they are happy. It satifies their most important political principle: to appear righteous. It's a post-religious displacement.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Equitist on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:51pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:40pm:

This is a tax designed to placate the loonies (Greens Win, Equitist et al) who always look to the government to validate whatever they are preening about in public. As long as they are made to feel good about sticking it to th 'big polluters' (ie the generators of their electricity), they are happy. It satifies their most important political principle: to appear righteous. It's a post-religious displacement.

Do try to keep both hands above the keyboard, Soren...

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:02pm

Equitist wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:51pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:40pm:

This is a tax designed to placate the loonies (Greens Win, Equitist et al) who always look to the government to validate whatever they are preening about in public. As long as they are made to feel good about sticking it to th 'big polluters' (ie the generators of their electricity), they are happy. It satifies their most important political principle: to appear righteous. It's a post-religious displacement.

Do try to keep both hands above the keyboard, Soren...

Witty and creative. How do you come up with original stuff like that, day in, day out?

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Equitist on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:14pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:02pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:51pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:40pm:

This is a tax designed to placate the loonies (Greens Win, Equitist et al) who always look to the government to validate whatever they are preening about in public. As long as they are made to feel good about sticking it to th 'big polluters' (ie the generators of their electricity), they are happy. It satifies their most important political principle: to appear righteous. It's a post-religious displacement.

Do try to keep both hands above the keyboard, Soren...

Witty and creative. How do you come up with original stuff like that, day in, day out?

ROFPMSL...you mean witty, creative and original like these!?

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:23pm:

viewpoint wrote on Feb 25^th, 2011 at 7:27am:

Did you gullible idiots really think I was going to keep my word?

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:26pm:

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:24pm:

Griff wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:13pm:

I saw Brown on the TV tonite and he reckons there just gonna tax the big polluters and that will save the ordinary people from the tax. Does he really think the industries won't pass on the price rises to the rest of us ? He's not very smart

Coal, exported, how is the carbon tax from this get past on to Australian Households?

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:28pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:15pm:

You know what, folks!?

The more I think about the bizarre developments of the past coupla days, the more it seems that: -

The Lib caucus have voted for Abbott's delusional 'plan' - to vow to fight (and repeal) the Gillard Govt's Carbon Price/Tax policy - in order to allow him to seal his own fate...

Action Man Abbo has gone into manic overdrive on this issue - as soon as he got a stronger-than-ever whiff of internal opposition over the racist antics of Morrison and himself in the wake of the Xmas Is boat tragedy and funerals...

Not only has he presumed to think and speak on behalf of the revolting people but he has obviously stopped listening to moderate pollies and seasoned political advisors...

Given the folly of opposing the NBN, Flood Levy and Carbon price, they're wise to cast him adrift and give him more than enough carbon and optic fibres to finish himself off...

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:30pm:

Maqqa wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:28pm:

::)

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:20pm

Yeah, like that. Quotes. (it's those little markings: " ". They are called quotes. Strikes you as novel?)

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by cods on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:21pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:40pm:

its strange how this topic kind of goes hot and then cold then hot again..

I find that all very interesting to be honest in the early 2008 its was all a matter of PANIC if we dont do it now.. we will all fry by the year 2013..

it was push push even had good old Al Gore here getting paid god only knows what even though the world was about to end..he still put his hand out for the money and the BIG plane trip.lol.

then it was really on ruddy wanted to make a really big name for himself.. Copenhagen at all costs he was going to ram his ETS through before he went so he could storm in to the council waving his piece of paper....a bit like Neville Chamberlain. with his signed peace deal with Hitler..Peace in our Time...well we know what happened there dont we..

but back to Copenhagen..well a little hickup Abbott stymied Turnbull and the war was over rudd was left to go to Denmark with nothing but Wong.but he thought a BIG entourage a plane load would make up for all that though even though he forgot to ask the one person that was the real expert on global warming..never mind I am sure she didnt notice..huhum.

well he flopped badly over there in fact the whole show flopped badly not only did it snow them all in..lol..when he did get invited into a meeting of minds he was sat on the end between who knows and who cares!!!!...lol..photo shoots dont think there was any it was a farce a complete humiliating farce..

so it kind of died a silent death.

but know its a biggest moral challenge all over again... well for noiw.. wheres Penny btw?

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Cmon Aussie on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:21pm

Maqqa wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:39pm:

Does anyone know the answer

So, Juliar Gillard is insisting that global warming/climate change, call it what you will as long as you get to put a tax on it, is about to destroy our planet. Well, get this....

In 1975, we were warned of a looming new ice age. One solution put forward was to coat the North Pole with soot to absorb solar energy thus preventing the “ice age”.. hmmm, were the Greens around then? If Juliar was around then you can bet she would have TAXED the crap out of that too! The warmest year in the 20th century was 1934, which was followed by five of the coldest years in the century. 1998 was the 2nd warmest but temperatures have flattened since then. The IPCC report graph produced in 1991 showed a warm period from 900AD to 1300 AD followed by the Little Ice Age from 1300 to 1850. In 2001, shock horror!!, a new graph produced by the IPCC showed a flat line from 1000 to 1850 with a dramatic spike up after that.. totally ignoring the warm period and the little ice age. The IPCC scientist behind the bogus claim that Himalayan glaciers will have melted by 2035 admitted it was included purely to 'put political pressure on world leaders'.

The above is absolute, indisputable and documented FACT!!!

No thinking person is claiming that climate change is not occurring, it’s been occurring in one form or another for billions of years but guess what?... THE PLANET IS STILL HERE!!!!

Wakey, wakey people..IT’S A MONEY GRABBING, TAX RAISING SCAM!!!!!!

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Greens_Win on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:27pm

Quote "The above is absolute, indisputable and documented FACT!!!"

Then can you supply a link

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Greens_Win on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:30pm

2010: Power plant CO2 emissions up 5.6% and hottest year on record. Coincidence?

According to a recently released report by The Environmental Integrity Project, carbon dioxide emissions from power plants in the U.S. rose by 5.56% in 2010 over the previous year — the biggest annual increase since 1995.

Using data gathered by the EPA, Environmental Integrity released this study that names the top 10 offenders. Florida’s power plants rank second, right after Texas, having emitted 130,324,532 tons of CO2 in 2010, an increase from the 119,960,137 tons emitted in 2009.

Not surprising is the fact that 2010 was also the warmest year on record (having tied with 2005) and that nine of the 10 warmest years on record have occurred since 2000. CO2 is a greenhouse gas which has been linked to global warming, so is it just a coincidence that the hottest year on record occurred when our carbon emissions rose?

http://blogs.creativeloafing.com/dailyloaf/2011/02/24/2010-power-plant-co2-emissions-up-5-6-and-hottest-year-on-record-coincidence/

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:31pm

Gillard said it - she didn't expect the Greens to be in the saddle when she said no to carbon tax. But after the election, we have a parliament where the Greens are dictating the agenda to the Labor party. This is why Christine Milne, Brown's deputy, knows more about the shape of the coming carbon tax than Gillard or Combet.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:34pm

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:30pm:

Source: Creative Loafing. Some unemployable environmental studies graduate blogging from his room in his parent's house.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Greens_Win on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:36pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:31pm:

This is due to the Polluting Party deciding to negate it's responsibility to their voters. By just nagging and offering nothing, you have allowed The Greens to attain a platform.

It is not Labor's fault Greens have so much influence, it is the Polluting Party's fault.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Greens_Win on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:40pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:34pm:

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:30pm:

Source: Creative Loafing. Some unemployable environmental studies graduate blogging from his room in his parent's house.

Well supporters of the Polluting Party seem to have a phobia of science ... with a blog link I thought your lot would at least read it.

http://planetsave.com/2011/02/18/record-melting-in-greenland-during-2010/

2010 was an exceptional year for Greenland’s ice cap. Melting started early and stretched later in the year than usual. Little snow fell to replenish the losses. By the end of the season, much of southern Greenland had set a new record, with melting that lasted 50 days longer than average.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:50pm

Not to mention exceptional snowfalls across the northern hemisphere. But of course it is always AGW, hot or cold, unless it's 'nice' weather across the whole planet.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Greens_Win on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:52pm

How extreme weather could create a global food crisis
KARACHI (updated on: 2011-02-05 15:41:30 PST):

United States National Oceanic & Atmospheric Administration reported that 2010 tied 2005 for the hottest year on record – and was the wettest year on record. This is no coincidence.

As Kevin Trenberth, head of climate analysis of National Centre for Atmospheric Research, explained:

There is a systematic influence on all of these weather events nowadays because there is more water vapour lurking around in atmosphere than there used to be, say, 30 years ago. It's about a 4% extra amount, provides plenty of moisture for these storms and it is unfortunate that public is not associating this with the fact that this is one manifestation of climate change. And prospects are that these kinds of things will only get worse in the future.

Globally, 2010 saw 19 nations – a record number – set temperature records including Pakistan, which hit 53.5C, the hottest temperature ever reliably measured in Asia's history. From mid-December to mid-

January of this year, National Centre for Atmospheric research NCAR reported that parts of north-eastern Canada were 21C above average, "which are very large values to be sustained for an entire month." In mid-December, Greenland experienced the most extreme high-pressure system of its kind ever recorded anywhere on the planet. Last year saw the greatest ice melt on record for Greenland.

Moscow heat wave this summer was so severe that Russian Meteorological Centre reported: "There was nothing similar to this on the territory of Russia during the last 1,000 years in regard to the heat." The country banned grain exports through this year's growing season.

Pakistan was inundated by a deluge that seemed beyond imagination – until an area the size of Germany & France combined was inundated by “biblical” floods in Australia.

In Carnarvon, more than a year's rain fell in just 24 hours.

Australian Bureau of Meteorology in its annual report for 2010 pointed out: Very warm sea surface temperatures contributed to record rainfall and very high humidity across eastern Australia during winter and spring. Most recent decade (2001-10) was also warmest decade on record for sea surface temperatures following the pattern observed over land.

In January, more than 300mm fell in just a few hours in many regions of Brazil, causing their deadliest natural disaster in history. Again, a key contributor was second warmest sea surface temperatures on record for the moisture source region.

Individually, these climate-driven extreme events were disasters, but collectively they contributed to a global food crisis. Un food & Agriculture Organization's food price index, "a basket tracking wholesale cost of wheat, corn, rice, oilseeds, dairy products, sugar and meats" had jumped to a record high.

Lester Brown, a leading authority on food insecurity says when real food instability comes – if, for instance, the US or Chinese breadbasket gets hit by type of heat wave Russia just did – big grain producers will ban exports, to make sure their people are fed. In this scenario, if you don't have your own food supplies or an important export item to barter – particularly oil – your country is going to have big, big problems feeding its people.

World is entering an era of climate and food insecurity. The view that weather extremes are more frequent and intense due to global warming coincides with current state of scientific knowledge as set out in Fourth IPCC Assessment Report.

US top climatologist, Dr James Hansen, head of Nasa's Goddard Institute of Space Studies, said: Given the association of extreme weather and climate events with rising global temperature, expectation of new record high temperatures in 2012 also suggests that frequency and magnitude of extreme events could reach a high level in 2012. Extreme events include not only high temperatures, but also indirect effects of a warming atmosphere including impact of higher temperature on extreme rainfall and droughts. Greater water vapour content of a warmer atmosphere allows larger rainfall anomalies and provides fuel for stronger storms driven by latent heat.

Barring a major volcano, half the years this decade are likely to be warmer than 2010. That means wetter and more extreme weather. And that means more food insecurity. Russia's grain-export-ending heat wave and drought could be a once every decade event – or even more frequent. And that will collide with extreme events around the world. In 2010, the world received its first global warning, bombarded by multiple events that are considered extreme today, but what will eventually be viewed as the norm – if humanity fails to act.

http://www.brecorder.com/news/latest/18529:how-extreme-weather-could-create-a-global-food-crisis.html

Is that enough of the planet for you?

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:54pm

Well, it looks like it's time for a tax to change the weather.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by dsmithy70 on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:57pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:50pm:

Not to mention exceptional snowfalls across the northern hemisphere. But of course it is always AGW, hot or cold, unless it's 'nice' weather across the whole planet.

Do you guys just ignore the parts of quotes, articles, etc you don't like?
(rhetorical question)
AGW theory clearly expresses an increase in extreme weather events.
EXTREME WEATHER EVENTS
Not just droughts or snowfalls or hurricanes/cyclones, EXTREME WEATHER EVENTS
Would a record snowfall fall into that catorgory?
Would the record melting of the ice cap during the short summer months fall into that catorogy?
How about a record drought then record rainfall?

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Greens_Win on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:01pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:54pm:

Well, it looks like it's time for a tax to change the weather.

As Adam Bandt has said, a tax alone will not fix it.

We require interconnected policies like

-lifting the renewable energy target to 100%
-a feed in tariff
-energy efficiencies

A Carbon Price is just the beginning to shift Australia to a position of security.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:21pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:57pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:50pm:

Not to mention exceptional snowfalls across the northern hemisphere. But of course it is always AGW, hot or cold, unless it's 'nice' weather across the whole planet.

That all-weather position is a new development. For a long time it was all Global Warming. When that proved to be obviously incorrect, the name was changed to climate change. That covers everything. CO2 being a greenhouse gas can now also cause global 'colding' and everything in between.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by dsmithy70 on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:56pm

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:21pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:57pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:50pm:

Not to mention exceptional snowfalls across the northern hemisphere. But of course it is always AGW, hot or cold, unless it's 'nice' weather across the whole planet.

I get the feeling your stirring the peasants up for a bit of fun.
That or you really do tune out to what you don't wish to hear.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Cmon Aussie on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:58pm

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:27pm:

Quote "The above is absolute, indisputable and documented FACT!!!"

Then can you supply a link

Here is the site you require. http://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/publications_and_data_supporting_material.shtml. You will note that every report the IPCC has produced is here except for...yep you guessed it...the 2001 report is now misteriously missing from their site. Just like the Greens and Labor..pretend you didn't say it!! ;D Need I say more? Probably not except Greenie...please read every report on that site...you need the education..obviously.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by dsmithy70 on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 11:07pm

Cmon Aussie wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:58pm:

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:27pm:

Quote "The above is absolute, indisputable and documented FACT!!!"

Then can you supply a link

Why would you include a report that contians mistakes?
BTW the corruption and conspiracy theory you are alluding to has been proven false, yes I know the inquiry was rigged to, just as I believe the AWB one was.
I believe one of the best analogies I've heard is if you went to 10 doctors and 9 said you had cancer and 1 didn't would you ignore 9 and bet your life on the 1 telling you want you want to hear?

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Prevailing on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 11:18pm

Man Made Climate change is made up crap by mad scientists. :)8-)

8-)

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 11:21pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:56pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 10:21pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:57pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:50pm:

Not to mention exceptional snowfalls across the northern hemisphere. But of course it is always AGW, hot or cold, unless it's 'nice' weather across the whole planet.

I get the feeling your stirring the peasants up for a bit of fun.
That or you really do tune out to what you don't wish to hear.

Au contraire. Just pointing out what Nietzsche already said very well:
"The most perfidious way of harming a cause consists of defending it deliberately with faulty arguments."

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by bridonta on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 11:55pm

now with angers from public .. those loonies Green are trying to put all the blames on the Juliar .. poor woman ..

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Kenny on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:33pm

To Greens_Win
just keep dreaming, you tree huggers are going to ruin the whole country with your myths.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by adelcrow on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:14pm

A carbon tax is just the beginning and a much better option than Tony Abbott's policy of pouring billions of taxpayers dollars into the coffers of our biggest polluters.
The Coalitions policy will cost individual taxpayers whether they move to low carbon options or they stick with the big polluters.
A carbon tax gives you a choice, cut your use of carbon intensive goods and services and pay bugger all whereas Tony Abbotts stupid plan is a nonsense.
Only a rusted on Lib voter would support the coalitions embarrasing alternative to a carbon tax and the Greens/ Labor eventual market based solutions.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Soren on Mar 3^rd, 2011 at 9:55pm

Greens_Lose

The Irish election results are in. The ruling Fianna Fail/Greens coalition lost spectacularly: Fine Gael won 76 seats; the Labour Party, 37; Fianna Fail, 20; Independents, 15; Sinn Fein, 14, and Others, 4. The Green Party won no seats.

The Greens had 6 seats and two ministries in the government. After pulling out of the coalition (ie spitting the dummy), they have no representation anywhere in parliament.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by qikvtec on Mar 3^rd, 2011 at 10:04pm

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:30pm:

I wonder if that's production ramping up again after the worst global financial crisis since The Great Depression.

I'd bet anything you own, which probably isn't much, the same data next year will see the same result.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by qikvtec on Mar 3^rd, 2011 at 10:08pm

____ wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:36pm:

Soren wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 9:31pm:

They'll meet the same fate as their Irish counterparts. Next the Senate spills the Greens will be hanging out with the democrats in political obscurity. The ALP will be there too pretty soon if Gillard doesn't lift her game.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Prevailing on Mar 3^rd, 2011 at 10:28pm

Soren wrote on Mar 3^rd, 2011 at 9:55pm:

The message is clear to subversives - don't screw with our culture and try to enslave us with your ideologies because we will make you pay for it. Ireland is waking up from the shell shock of treason and subversion, just wait till they get angry about it.:)

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by bridonta on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 12:26pm

all i can see .. if the prices on energy and especially on food kept on rising .. those lab and Green will see the full impacts ..

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by frenchyjen70 on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 12:32pm

Of course a carbon dioxide tax wont fix any global warming, and thats if you believe in global warming.
If any a carbon dioxide tax will discourage addressing any global warming which will exacerbate the myth of global warming.

With the top 5 countries (USA, Japan, Russia, China & India) emitting 60% and not imposing any carbon dioxide tax and Australia a poultry 1.3% then is anyone that dumb to believe that Australia can do anything about the supposed global warming?
And those that dont believe that petrol and livestock costs will increase under GiLIARds carbon dioxide tax the consider this, of australias 1.3% the main compnenets for that are transport (petrol) which is 11% and livestock.
So to even remotely have a chance to reduce Australias 1.3% then we must stop all transport, and kill all livestock.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by gizmo_2655 on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:12pm

"There's other ways of giving people a break which is equal and equivalent," Senator Brown told ABC Television.

"Our job is to make sure the average punter, the average Australian, the battler, is protected while we go to the polluters and say, 'You have to pay for the damage you're causing to Australia's security, to its environment, more importantly to its future economic well-being."

Then WHY is Bob Brown backing a Carbon Tax????

It seems to go against his idea of what the Greens job actually IS...

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:16pm

I'm very worried for the middle to lower income families on one wage who can't support the conveyor belt of tax increases and cost of living pressures which life in Australia is delivering.

I am very concerned for these people.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Deathridesahorse on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:22pm

Maqqa wrote on Feb 28^th, 2011 at 8:32pm:

YOU SCARE PEOPLE WITH THE POWER OF YOUR ARGUMENTS, I HOPE YOU KNOW! ;D ;D

PLEASE PROMISE TO USE YOUR POWERS CAREFULLY ..... ::)

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Deathridesahorse on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:25pm

frenchyjen70 wrote on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 12:32pm:

TONY ABBOTT HIMSELF WILL NOT ARGUE AGAINST THE NEED TO REDUCE CARBON EMISSIONS: EXACTLY HOW MANY TIMES DO THE TRYHARDS NEED TO BE REMINDED OF THIS? :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:26pm

Someone call the hospital please.

Deathridesahorse has got out again.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by vegitamite on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:28pm

many expect to be spoon fed and do not believe they have any responsibility to seek information for themselves. I question the ability of people to learn anything, if they take three word slogans as the main source of information.

just wanted to take the debate off what does the carbon price take away from me back to what does a carbon price do for me.

ashghebranious.wordpress.com/.../

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by mozzaok on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:47pm

When I hear the absolute drivel coming from the assorted nuts section that makes up the denialist lobby, I have to wonder how sad a bunch of gits they actually are.

If the argument of Australia's size is their primary measure of worth, then we should probably not bother with lots of things.

There argument appears to be that anything we cannot achieve independently of other nations, should be abandoned.
The concept of being a part of a wider global community insults their insular, ultra nationalist prejudices.

There are not actually that many of these nuts out in the broader community, so maybe we can make a little reservation for them somewhere, and wall them in, and they can pretend that the rest of the world doesn't exist, a bit like catholics do in heaven.

Normal people on the other hand, can recognise the worth of doing the right thing, because it is the right thing.
They can also appreciate the value of being a part of the broader international community, and taking responsibility for trying to carry our share of the load in the challenges that lie ahead due to the onset of climate change.
They can also understand how countries that have far lower living standards, and far lower per capita emissions, would rightly question why they should be asked to comply with Carbon targets, when richer, established economies ignore them?

The politically correct thing is to give these denialists the benefit of the doubt, as having been won over by some spurious argument that conned them into taking the downright bunkum and lies seriously, but I just cannot do that anymore, because the clowns just keep repeating the same garbage over and over, and refuse to listen to anything not authored by the loony lord, or the ever pliant plimer, loathesome lads one and all.
So, I give up being tolerant of the obstinate idiocy, they are either morons, or arseholes, and usually both, and their moronic arseholery has gone too far, come the revolution, they will definitely be the first to go.
I will build a big magnifying glass and they can explain how the earth is cooling as they wait for the sun to rise.

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:53pm

Mozza unless other countries infinitely more significant than Australia act, then this is all pissing in the wind and tying one hand behind Australian businesses back for no reason.

You'd have competitors able to manufacture overseas at will at a cheaper cost than Australian businesses.

You'd have Australian families facing increased cost of living for no reason.

Yet meanwhile in the USA we are paying 50% of the cost you do for petrol and driving around in big cars. Mine is 5L and my wife's is 4.5L alone.

Go figure.

Tell me again what a great thing it is for Australia.....

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by gizmo_2655 on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:00pm

wrote on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:28pm:

Vegie....'what does a carbon tax take away from you'???....MONEY (more expensive everything)....and does a 'carbon tax GIVE you'??? Higher bills ( for everything) and NO change to Co2 levels...

See....easy to understand..

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by vegitamite on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:22pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:02pm:

Oh and your link gives a '404 page not found' response...

Sorry gizmo ;

http://ashghebranious.wordpress.com/2011/03/04/carbon-pricing-wots-it-all-about-alfie/

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Deathridesahorse on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:29pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:26pm:

Someone call the hospital please.

Deathridesahorse has got out again.

Bye Bye Tony Abbott!

He couldn't throw a punch against the NBN and now his leadership is being questioned!

You, even a fathead like you, could deny that his obfuscationist image is not what the Liberal Party needs in the history books!

:'( :'( :'( :'( :'( Sorry, dood!

Don't forget the greedy attitude that led to all those boodybags will ya!

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Deathridesahorse on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:32pm

wrote on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:28pm:

This is what metrosexaulity is all about!

Too many ignorant people out there not realising that nature dictates what is sustainable or not.

Terrorism, and war, is a natural event! Greedy pigs get bombed etc...

It's all totally organic! :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :D :D :o

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Deathridesahorse on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:36pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 2:53pm:

You need cheap fuel in America or people couldn't afford to live so far from their place of work or even waste heaps in traffic!

Admit it: the terrorists have your economy by the balls!

How 'bout those bodybags you greedy pig?????? ::)

Title: Re: Greens admit Carbon Tax won't fix it
Post by Deathridesahorse on Mar 4^th, 2011 at 3:38pm

I don't think Andrei likes the truth!

He prefers a fantasy world where no one dies! :D :D :D ;D :o :o :-? :-[