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http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl Political Parties >> Australian Labor Party >> Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1297925883 Message started by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:58pm

Title: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:58pm

Christmas Island shire president says detaining orphan is 'stupid

Labors decision to send an eight-year-old boy back to detention after a heart-wrenching funeral for victims of the Christmas Island tragedy has been dubbed "stupid".

Sinan Khaligy broke down at his father's funeral in Sydney yesterday, after his family was wiped out in the shipwreck of an asylum boat.

The body of his mother has not been found, but Sinan was expected to be sent back to detention today.

Today asylum seeker advocates today lodged a complaint with the Human Rights Commission into the handling of the boy’s case.

In turn lawyers for relatives of the boy have reportedly called on the Immigration Department to suspend the transfer of the boy until the complaint is investigated.

Immigration Minister Chris Bowen stood firm on his decision to send 22 asylum seekers back, but said he would be released back into the community "very quickly".

Coalition counterpart Scott Morrison was today forced to defend himself against accusations he had urged the Liberal Party to exploit negative sentiment against muslims, describing it as gossip that did not reflect his views.

And Christmas Island shire president Gordon Thomson says the government's decision to return the orphaned boy to the remote Australian territory is stupid.

“The boy in particular is in a terrible way,'' Mr Thomson told ABC Radio.

“I understand that he goes to the gate every time a bus bringing a new group of refugee to Christmas Island turns up at the detention centre.

“He is waiting at the gate looking for his mother and his father.''

Mr Thomson said an aunt caring for the young boy in detention was not well herself and required daily medical treatment.

“They shouldn't be returned. It's counter-intuitive, it's silly, a stupid idea.''

That's a sentiment shared by the head of the government's health advisory panel on immigration detention.

Louise Newman says all the children involved in the December tragedy are “at an acute risk of mental disorder''.

“Having those children come to the mainland, meet with other families who could potentially be very appropriate and supportive people in their lives, then to face yet another separation back to Christmas Island, the site of their traumatic experience, is really quite bizarre,'' Prof Newman told ABC Radio.

But Immigration Minister Chris Bowen continued to defend the decision to fly the entire group back west today.

It is understood they all boarded a flight about 9am today.

In total 21 will be returned to Christmas Island while another individual will be taken to Perth.

“Very clearly he (the Iranian boy) needs to be released into the community and he will be,'' Mr Bowen told ABC Radio.

“I've just got a few more checks to make to make sure we have the appropriate care arrangements in place.''

The immigration minister said he envisaged that happening “very quickly''.

Earlier Mr Bowen said he would look at "all options" for the boy.

"The normal circumstance would be that he would be cared for by an appropriate church, charity, psychologically-trained carer, etcetera," Mr Bowen said yesterday.

Mr Bowen put the cost of a charter flight for family members, from Christmas Island to Sydney, at $300,000.

Sinan and 20 other survivors headed back to the detention centre as Opposition Leader Tony Abbott conceded the Coalition went "too far" in criticising taxpayer-funded flights for them to attend family funerals in Sydney.

Mr Abbott applauded his immigration spokesman Scott Morrison, who acknowledged he had been "insensitive and inappropriate" with his remarks.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/detaining-grieving-asylum-seeker-orphan-stupid/story-e6frf7jo-1226007407208

Gillard really loves Kids doesn't she. The witch!!! >:(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm

OMG!

What sort of government/monster does this to a child?

An orphan at that.

Jeezus

>:(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:00pm

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

BUMP

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:01pm

Maybe Labor could just sink the boats, like the Liberals did.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:02pm

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

OMG!

What sort of government/monster does this to a child?

An orphan at that.

Jeezus

>:(

cods also writes Jeezus like Jeezus.

Tsk tsk

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:03pm

Skippy, this is your governments policy, the Labor government you see no fault in... OK.

Abbott has not had his turn as PM, lets judge his actions then shall we.

Meanwhile, if your short attention span will permit, look at this child's face.

I swear to you, if I were PM, this child would be home in my bed as though he were my own child.

The way I put my own kids in my bed when they are not feeling well.

MONGRELS!!!

>:(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:05pm

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:03pm:

I think you're right though mellie... if Abbott was in government then they'd be no muslims in this country and hence at least no picture of a crying muslim child.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:05pm

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:03pm:

Skippy, this is your government policy, the Labor government you see no fault in... OK.

About has not had his turn as PM, lets judge his actions then shall we.

Meanwhile, if your short attention span will permit, look at this child's face.

I swear to you, if I were PM, this child would be home in my bed as though he were my own child.

The way I put my own kids in my bed when they are not feeling well.

MONGRELS!!!

>:(

But you want Abbott to form government, do you agree with Liberal policy?
Labor are not my party, I vote GREENs, and I do not believe in mandatory detention, do you?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:08pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:02pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

OMG!

What sort of government/monster does this to a child?

An orphan at that.

Jeezus

>:(

cods also writes Jeezus like Jeezus.

Tsk tsk

Show me a post where cods does this, I find this interesting actually.

Not sure if I picked it up off her, or her me...lol

Anyway, don't feel like discussing this topic I take it ?

You know what sickens me.... the fact that you have not condemned your Labor governments dealings with the orphan boy, yet will rant on about something some lib minister was rumoured to have said 4 months ago.

You don't care about this kid at all do you Skip >:(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:08pm

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:11pm

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:05pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:03pm:

But you want Abbott to form government, do you agree with Liberal policy?
Labor are not my party, I vote GREENs, and I do not believe in mandatory detention, do you?

BUMP
But you want Abbott to form government, do you agree with Liberal policy?
Labor are not my party, I vote GREENs, and I do not believe in mandatory detention, do you? MELLIE DO YOU????????????????

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:20pm

If our border policies were as they should be, they wouldn't be here to begin with, they wouldn't be trying to jump the queue as it wouldn't be worth their while, so would arrive legally like others who have to wait their turn.

Gotta love Greens, went from hugging trees to refugees virtually over night!

Hypocrites!

8-)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:22pm

Tell me Skippy, were your Greens preferences worth this?

And why is it you refuse to say a bad word against this Labor governments atrocities?

I'm going to frame this portrait, and send it to Bob Brown as a gift.

Something to remind him of the deal he struck with labor....the preference deals he claimed to be against prior to being offered a seat in the senate.

Was it worth it?

Ask the little 8 year old boy who is now an orphan if it was worth it to him.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Equitist on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:48pm

I agree that children (in particular) shouldn't be kept in detention - and that orphans should be placed with suitable permanent caregivers (preferably relatives) ASAP...

That said, I am not convinced by the confected outrage over the Govt's handling of the child in question - when it comes from those who supported the fervent demonisation and vilification of the same child's family over the past few days...

This grandstanding is predominantly about political point-scoring - not genuine concern for the scapegoated child's welfare!

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by WESLEY.PIPES on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:51pm

Well, I doubt the kid is a terrorist, or has a shady past, so they're just gonna release him anyway....why not spare him the trouble?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by cods on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 6:56pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 5:02pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

OMG!

What sort of government/monster does this to a child?

An orphan at that.

Jeezus

>:(

cods also writes Jeezus like Jeezus.

Tsk tsk

NEVER WRITTEN IT IN MY LIFE.... PROOF LIAR..

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by cods on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 6:58pm

please mellie dont post that picture up anymore..its cruel you are not doing either side any favours I think just about everyone feels bad for wahts happened.maybe not the brainwashed.. but most at anyrate.

I really think this has gone its course.. we cant help that child to feel better we just cant.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:10pm

They needed to see it cods... as confronting as it is.

It hit the message home.

Something had to.

:-/

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:12pm

Cods, good news, public outrage has resulted in this boy being removed from Christmas island ....he's going to be OK now.

:)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:28pm

http://www.smh.com.au/national/christmas-island-orphan-to-be-released-20110217-1ay2l.html?from=smh_sb

In this instance, I am pleased he's being relocated to Sydney with what's left of his family.

Children aren't criminals....this and shouldn't be locked up like animals.

I would like it to be sooner, they should do it in under a week, but at least there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by philperth2010 on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:40pm

It was an upsetting scene watching Sinan Khaligy break down at the funeral.....It is very heart warming to see so many concerned about his welfare….It is good to see the government listened to the people and will let Sinan live with relatives!!!

Compassion is the basis of all morality.
Arthur Schopenhauer (1788 - 1860)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by cods on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 9:31pm

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:28pm:

well good news for commonsense and decency.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by philperth2010 on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 9:52pm

cods wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 9:31pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:28pm:

well good news for commonsense and decency.

A great many people think they are thinking when they are really rearranging their prejudices.
William James (1842 - 1910)

>:(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by dsmithy70 on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 10:17pm

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:28pm:

Maybe you can find where he lives in Sydney and send his carers the bill for his airfare.
Have you no courage of your convictions?
We have a thread at the bottom of the page with 500 posts and I reckon at least 100 of those are yours Mellie arguing in every possible way against showing any compassion towards "Boat People" "illegals" as you call them, never refugee it would invoke thoughts of maybe helping instead of scorning.
Compassion will only encourage them is the undertone.
As Morrison changes his stance so do you, miss timing eh, unfortunate error of a truely compassionate person.
You are a bait to divert Morrisons "Unfortunate Error" into a positive for the Liberals, unfortunately the media in it's never ending search for a head line seem to have fallen for it as well.
Actually with the performance of the senior media team for the shadow ministry this week, they and hence you are following the media not as it should be.
LEFT FIELD ALERT
After a what can only be described as a stellar performance over the last ,what, 9 months not a step wrong, telling the story not making it within 7 days we have had 2 MASSIVE blunders by the leader and then a senior possible front bencher 4 if you count Hockey speaking out and Robb basicly calling him out for the shadow treasurery.
Perhaps the faceless men of the liberal party in Melbourne have decided to give their pick a long run into the next election.
Look out Tone the end maybe closer than you think.

You do have the courage of your convictions......you have the courage to post such a balled face lie for all of us to see and expect it to just slide.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 10:31pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 10:17pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:28pm:

You see them as all being one in the same, you objectify them, categorically define them as aliens, (fair enough), however, when it comes to children, for me this is where things change.

I don't care what race they are, to me they are innocent children, and really, I think he's suffered enough for his relatives actions.

I'm angry with his parents having rendered him an orphan, angry with our government for having failed to implement the appropriate policy, though I cant be angry at the child, and nor should any of you.

The best possible outcome is for this child is to stay in Australia, having no immediate family to go home to, they are all here it seems, so what can you do?

The child is clearly traumatised, our miserable flaccid border policy's are what stuffed him up, we have to fix him.

The change has to start with government policy, but I draw the line at punishing children for their parents irresponsible actions, and that of our governments.

OK.

Night~!

:)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 10:41pm

If he were an adult, I'd say send him home.

Different kettle of fish!

Adults make informed decisions for themselves, children don't.

This and cant be held accountable for his own circumstances.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by helian on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 10:57pm

Looks like the white trash Australia policy is alive and well.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by culldav on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 11:14pm

I will play the devils advocate here and say I have been to a lot of funerals and not once have I ever seen an 8 year old carry on like that. Something tells me this was deliberately staged for media attention.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by philperth2010 on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 11:27pm

culldav wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 11:14pm:

C'mon mate.....think about what you are saying before you put it in print....The debate should not sink to the level of exploiting the grief of a child...what makes you any better than those you are trying to condemn???

It seems the misfortune of one can plow a deeper furrow in the heart than the misfortune of millions.
Kirby Larson, Hattie Big Sky, 2006

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by culldav on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 11:32pm

How many 8 year olds have you seen behave like that at a funeral Philperth?

I have been to about 8 funerals, and I am yet to see one kid act like that.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Sprintcyclist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:40am

culldav - good on you for plying the devils advocate.

i think he was just copying what his adult role models do.
if they wanted to be terrorists and islamics, he would too.

send him back.
it was his parents (we are told) decision he came. not ours.
they claim to be not around anymore.
send him back.
he has NO right to be here.
he's not an aussie, he did not arrive acording to our laws.

bye bye

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by abo_rashid on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:47am

as aboriginal i think its best if australia be white man majority land instead of lettin all these brown man in because white man has been good to noongah better than brown man would be.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by cods on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 4:46am

culldav wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 11:14pm:

thats a terrible thing to say.. this child lost both parents under the most appalling conditions..I dont understand how anyone can think like that letalone put it up on here. yes I do find middle-easterners react differently to us.. we seem more stoic and sombre does that make us unfeeling with no emotions??

cullday I am sure you got this wrong and I hope like Morrison you are having second thought,

look some tough things get said on here.. but lets leave the kids alone..thats going too far.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by cods on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 4:47am

Sprintcyclist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:40am:

spring I think you will find most children copy adults.. it doesnt mean they are acting.. shame on you.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mantra on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 4:52am

culldav wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 11:32pm:

How many 8 year olds have you seen behave like that at a funeral Philperth?

I have been to about 8 funerals, and I am yet to see one kid act like that.

How do you think this little boy feels? He's lost both his parents - he's in a strange country away from his friends and family he knows. It wasn't his choice to come here.

Show a little compassion for a child instead of turning everything into a hate fest.

Half the people on this forum weren't born in Australia, so if we have to tolerate you - at least show some tolerance for others new to this country - especially to those who are suffering.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 6:03am

Yes this culture are more theatrical than westerners who's children generally stand there bowing their heads with their hands behind their backs as the coffin is lowered into the grave, but I think under the circumstances, with him being estranged from his parents, being the only survivor in his immediate family, his mothers body not having been found, mentally, this would have taken it's toll, and god knows what he's endured in detention, displaced, estranged and surrounded by grieving mourning adults crying 24/7. I think even a westerners child would be distraught after having endured these circumstances.
I have only ever been to one funeral where an adult threw themselves into the grave of a small child (baby, a cot death) was my friends now deceased husband who killed himself a couple of weeks later (if that, may have even been a week). But he wasn't quite stable prior to his infant sons death sadly, he suffered with debilitating depression.

As for this little boy mimicking his role-models, from a cultural perspective....perhaps to a degree, but acting?
Most certainly not!

Culldave, what actually concerns me here is that you would think he would be acting, this tells me that for some reason or another you have failed to connect with, or feel empathy for a grieving child.
Your having even questioned this small boys reaction concerns me, particularly with an image as confronting as this.

There's no way this child was acting, and whilst cultural factors may play some part in the grieving process, re- mimicking adults around him which would have defined acceptable grief boundaries, told him what was acceptable... honestly, I don't think even cultural factors played a part in this instance, the kid is clearly broken, too traumatised to even care about such things as funeral etiquette, he's in a strange country, surrounded by strange people, his parents and siblings are dead, mothers body still hasn't been found, and to think, here we are months after the tragedy with a state and federal government using it as their venomous campaigns back-drop, as though to say..."See, we are the kinder party"..."We paid for their funerals"...then attempted the shuttle them all off back to the centre, child and all.

I find it disgusting that it's taken our authorities this long to bury these people, this and get this kid out of detention. Sickening actually, and forever will this image of a crying child be impressed in my mind when reflecting on changes this government made to boarder security and refugee policy.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 6:21am

Sprint and culldave.... when you fell over and hurt yourselves as small children, did your parents comfort you, or did they scold / ridicule you for showing signs of weakness?

You don't have to answer this if you don't want to...I realise it's off topic.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by chicken_lipsforme on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 7:12am

It's good that the child will be sent to his family in Sydney and not locked up.
If he has no parents in the detention centre, it serves no purpose keeping him there.
What's not good is Labor's initial policy fiddling and gross incompetence, which has led to the boat being where it was in the first place.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by helian on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 7:21am

Unlucky for the kid he doesn't have the Chinese government backing his case... Being the bunch of arselickers we are to power, there would be no question that we'd be putting him up at the Ritz.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 7:40am

The hypocrite known a mellie ans about 6 other nicks wont answer this I've been asking it since before the news of the child's release.

Quote:

She must agree with me, otherwise she'd be nothing but a low life gutter trash hypocrite for even starting the thread.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by pansi1951 on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:12am

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

OMG!

What sort of government/monster does this to a child?

An orphan at that.

Jeezus

>:(

I don't care if the child come from Mars, humans have a moral responsibility to ensure that the child is given the very best opportunity to learn and grow. Thankfully, the inept bureaucrats have seen the light, only because the matter was taken to the human rights commission by the boys lawyer.

What a travesty this country has become.

I am becoming increasingly ashamed to call myself Australian. Even animals protect their young when they are orphaned, some even become foster parents to different species, and we can't take care of a grieving child.

Shame, Australia, shame.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:16am

Ex Dame Pansi wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:12am:

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

OMG!

What sort of government/monster does this to a child?

An orphan at that.

Jeezus

>:(

So you're not happy then Pansi?
;D

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by pansi1951 on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:18am

mellie wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 7:12pm:

Cods, good news, public outrage has resulted in this boy being removed from Christmas island ....he's going to be OK now.

:)

WE ONLY KNOW WE ARE BEING *UNTS WHEN IT'S POINTED OUT TO US. HOW SAD!

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by pansi1951 on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:20am

<<So you're not happy then Pansi?>>
Grin

........................................................................

I AM BLOODY WELL OUTRAGED!!! ANDREI

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Soren on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:28am

Has anyone heard from that boy's relatives who are still in Iran? Is his second cousin in Sydney his closest living relative?

Mebbe going back to Iran IS in his best interest (not in the best interest of the Refugee Council, admittedly).

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:30am

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 7:12am:

What sickens me is that he's been locked up now since the 15th of December 2010.

I guess like always, we just 'assume' our government will do the right thing .... misplaced trust?

We really need to stop assuming!

Look where it's got us.

The child has been grieving and locked away like a dirty secret for over 2 months...and only now that we see this tragedy crumpled in a heap before our eyes TV/media do we the public gasp!

Where were the Greens?

8-)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by chicken_lipsforme on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:00am

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 8:30am:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 7:12am:

Absolutely it's misplaced trust.
But I think many people stopped assuming with this government a long time ago mellie.
And this government being the Labor government including Rudd's time as the jockey.
Labor has no clue and blunder around like Mr Magoo from one issue to another without really doing anything.
My mother would have described them as a fart between two ears, and she was a Labor voter all her life.
As for the greens, no doubt they were off skipping with the fairies.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:06am

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Have all these crocodile tears contributed to Australia's flood damage ?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:08am

You can be strongly in favor of controlled migration and still have compassion for the people stuck in this terrible situation.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:10am

The trouble they went to in order to cover their tracks, is quite admirable....if only they had invested so much time and effort doing the right thing by our country, they would have done themselves and us a good service.

Rudds a very greedy and naughty schoolboy.

8-)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:12am

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:06am:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Have all these crocodile tears contributed to Australia's flood damage ?

I believe my policies are humane, this and place a particular emphasis on vulnerable persons.

Unlike that of a Greedy GALP Inc

8-)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:36am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:08am:

You can be strongly in favor of controlled migration and still have compassion for the people stuck in this terrible situation.

Are you referring to your "shoe-shiners" or "third world trash" ?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:47am

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:36am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:08am:

You can be strongly in favor of controlled migration and still have compassion for the people stuck in this terrible situation.

Are you referring to your "shoe-shiners" or "third world trash" ?

I think you are confusing flippant off-the-cuff references with policy beliefs.
They are not the same.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:58am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:47am:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:36am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:08am:

You can be strongly in favor of controlled migration and still have compassion for the people stuck in this terrible situation.

Are you referring to your "shoe-shiners" or "third world trash" ?

I think you are confusing flippant off-the-cuff references with policy beliefs.
They are not the same.

Sleeping with Tony Abbott ?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by culldav on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:23am

Mellie,

I have been to many funerals, and I have never seen an 8 year old behave to those extremes before. I never said the kid the acting, but lets be realistic here, its fairly easy the get an 8 year old to cry if you really want too. You also had the psychological situation where this kid was hearing these “banshees” wailing and carrying on at the tops of their voices coupled with all the men with no one really in control of the situation, so obviously the kid was going to mimic the adults.

FFS, How many 8 year olds do you know of who have the mental ability of knowing what death and grief is really all about and then have the ability to express that understanding in a adult way?

FFS, if this wasn’t a deliberate media set-up to illicit sympathy, then I will stand rooting.

The thing I fear the most is the mental well being of the child. It would seem from the media reports that this group For’s now blame the Australian Government for what happened, and therefore will they now direct all their hatred into that child.

Maybe it would be best if the Government sent the child back to family in Iran and removed him from the For’s influence and place where the disaster happened so he can recover.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:35am

I agree, the funeral was staged for political reasons, hence so close to the NSW state election, but given Muslims inherent culture of being quite dramatic at funerals, (not uncommon for them to throw themselves into the graves of relatives, this or have to be physically restrained from doing so)... ....this child was grieving as was to be expected.

This said, he has lost both parents, at least one sibling, he's displaced, and has been confined to a detention centre with strangers for the past 2 months...(Convenient that Gillard and Keneally should let them out now).... he's been through allot, what else can we do?

Staged for the media, you mean the act of the boy becoming emotional?

No way, these Muslims go to town when they grieve, they wouldn't have even noticed the cameras were there...they get right into it.

It's just, our government made the most of a bad situation, like they are currently cashing in on flood donations from the royal family and Obama, they wish to remain confidential.

This government have so much to answer for.
>:(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mantra on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:35am

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 9:12am:

I believe my policies are humane, this and place a particular emphasis on vulnerable persons.

Unlike that of a Greedy GALP Inc

8-)

Your policies!!!!

Are you a Liberal party policy maker Mel? ::)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Equitist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:41am

culldav wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:23am:

Of the funerals you have been to, were the children you observed the tragically- orphaned offspring of not one but two deceased persons!?

Have you not noticed that: during funeral proceedings, there are sombre intervals punctuated by happy and angry moments - and that there are points where various people weep hysterically and other points at which the very same people laugh heartily!?

As you suggest, the media will have focused on the moments where this child was feeling heightened grief - since it would not be sensational to show him at those times on the same day when he was laughing and jostling as he kicked a soccer ball around or was otherwise being distracted by normal interactions with other adults and same-aged peers...

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am

Thinking about it, I have only ever been to two funerals in my life.

One of them, bizarrely enough, was for a bloke I have never met.

We arrived in Townsville for a holiday and my wife's great uncle died. I ended up at his funeral. Until we got there and I saw the pic on the front, I didn't even know what he looked like.

It's a sorry state of affairs all around.

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.
These people need to play the hand they were dealt - not move to another table.

If you get my drift.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:08am

Equ, the Gillard government always had intentions of "Saving the Orphan" it's just they waited for opening night (the funeral)...to create the illusion that they were 'saints'.... when in fact, had they not reversed Howards policies, this funeral wouldn't be happening to begin with.

Did you know just in airfares alone, it cost us $300,000 to bring them over.

Thus I wonder, how many relatives did they bring out?

What's a one way ticket to Australia from Iraq/Afghanistan these days?

Because it looks as though none of them will be going home anytime soon. Not if they can help it.

Heroes Labor are not!

::)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Equitist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Yes, I do get your drift - but I doubt you get the ironic flightiness of your own comments...

You are suggesting that these families should have stayed put in a country beset by horrific circumstances - and stayed out of the boats - yet you proudly boast that your own family has country-shopped throughout your lives from a far more safe, prosperous and stable birthplace via planes...

Clearly, in your narrow world, some human beings are more equal than others - and some cannot hope to seek a re-deal because they've been dealt a crap hand of cards at a rigged casino table...

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:13am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

I've only been to 4 myself, two grandparents, godson's, friends father.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:14am

The comparison would be valid thy if we had gone around turning up in countries without visas and claiming welfare from day 1.

At any time in my family history - be it my grandparents move to South Africa, my parents moves to varied places and my own moves to varied places - it has always been skilled, legal migration. Offering skills to the receiving country, paying into the country and adding value.

Not hopping in a boat and turning up without an invite simply because you didn't like where you were born.

The comparison or the attempted one is simply ludicrous.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:19am

Quote:

I feel sorry for these people but at the end of the day we cannot allow soft factors (as we call them in Finance management) to drive through policies which should be dictated by harder factors and economic argument.

Such is life you know. We can't have everyone in Australia.

by-Andreihicks

Well put.

It's sad, tragic, but if we don't start tending to ourselves we are going to lose the global race and will be nothing short of a UN refugee waste disposal centre. This is what they have in mind for us it seems.

There comes a point where you have to sit back and take stock of the debits/credits ....

Look how well Rudd did, the twit!

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Equitist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:35am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:14am:

The comparison would be valid thy if we had gone around turning up in countries without visas and claiming ~~wel~~WEALTHfare from day 1.

At any time in my family history - be it my grandparents move to South Africa, my parents moves to varied places and my own moves to varied places - it has always been skilled, legal migration. Offering skills to the receiving country, paying into the country and adding value.

Not hopping in a boat and turning up without an invite simply because you didn't like where you were born.

The comparison or the attempted one is simply ludicrous.

Hmmnnn....one set of rules for rich, white and Xtian folk, another for poor, dark and/or Muslim folk...

One small elite group can get richer, stuff all the rest - ludicrous!

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by culldav on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:38am

Mellie,

I have to disagree on the point about the 8 year old grieving. I believe the child was simply placed in a psychological situation where he saw all the other adults crying and wailing and not completely understanding what was going on her cried simply because the adults cried.

We all know small children can get upset very quickly and very easily when they see an adult or parent cry.

I have been to one of those Razzamatazz funerals where they carry on with people wanting to jump down the hole and so forth and others have to hold them back.

I was told from the “horses mouth” all this garbage was just an act, and in certain cultures female mourners and relatives of the deceased were expected to act out this grief in public as a sign of respect whether they like them or not.

This kind of made sense to me.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Equitist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:51am

FFS, we saw only a few selected snapshots of the child's behaviour on that day - all grieving people need an outlet for their grief, which may or may not be trigged by the tears and wails of others on the day of a funeral...

Either way, it is best to have an outlet than to bottle up grief inside - and crying is a great release-valve for all human beings (especially children)...

Seriously, why are people like you trying to make political mileage out of this young child's natural grief and post-traumatic stress arising from the terribly-tragic circumstances - of losing not only his mother and father but also his brother in a terrifying boat wreck!?!?!?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:55am

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:35am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:14am:

Hmmnnn....one set of rules for rich, white and Xtian folk, another for poor, dark and/or Muslim folk...

One small elite group can get richer, stuff all the rest - ludicrous!

Rules being -

SKILLS and ADD VALUE

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:59am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:55am:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:35am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:14am:

Hmmnnn....one set of rules for rich, white and Xtian folk, another for poor, dark and/or Muslim folk...

One small elite group can get richer, stuff all the rest - ludicrous!

Rules being -

SKILLS and ADD VALUE

do you think that's why your daddy got the sack?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Sprintcyclist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:01pm

equit
Quote:

.......grief and post-traumatic stress arising from the terribly-tragic circumstances - of losing not only his mother and father but also his brother in a terrifying boat wreck!?!?!?.............

bought on entirely due to their own voluntary premeditated illegal warned against dangerous actions.
They ALSO endangered needlessly the lives of innocent others.

send them all back.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by culldav on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:20pm

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:51am:

If you want to live your entire life with 'rose coloured' glasses on thats fine, but don't have a go at others because they have taken theirs off.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:26pm

Alevine, grow up!

::) Ignore the trolls guys.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm

culldav wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:38am:

Do you think 8 year olds aren't capable of feeling grief?

I have to ask you something, do you have kids?

My daughter was beside herself when our cat got knocked on the road when she was 7...

She sobbed as we had a little funeral for him, and she was very aware of her loss.

As I'm sure this boy is also.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:33pm

I was beside myself with grief when my cat had to be put down at the vet when I was age 5, I understood exactly what was happening, and knew we were there to say goodbye to my Siamese cat Garnji...(my father named him, my parents bought him before I was born, he was 13).

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:35pm

I too think we should be more selective and culturally consistent with our nations intake of immigrants, so as to uphold our own nations culture and values.

:)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:37pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:26pm:

Alevine, grow up!

::) Ignore the trolls guys.

So do we ignore you then, cods? ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:39pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:35pm:

I too think we should be more selective and culturally consistent with our nations intake of immigrants, so as to uphold our own nations culture and values.

:)

cods, in your opinion, what are the nation's culture and values?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations, not those we permit conditional membership at a nominal fee, so long as they toe the line with our trade agreements.

For christs sake, is that the best you have Buzz?

Here, enjoy your first history class, and if you weren't of migrant class yourself, you would already know this, and would not have used the above retort.

Quote:

Culture

Mostly due to their history of British rule, many Commonwealth nations possess certain identifiable traditions and customs that are elements of a shared Commonwealth culture. Examples include common sports such as cricket and rugby, driving on the left, the Westminster system of parliamentary democracy, common law, widespread use of the English language, designation of English as an official language, military and naval ranks, and the use of British rather than American spelling conventions (see English in the Commonwealth of Nations). None of these is universal amongst, nor exclusive to, the Commonwealth, but are more commonly found within its members than elsewhere.

When we speak of 'actual' commonwealth nations, we speak of nations which share our culture, ...similar sports, literature, colonial law, values, etc....

Lol, you are so lame sometimes buzz...your naivety astounds me.

Did you actually think because the commonwealth let India host their games after greasing our palms with a billion dollar bribe, that this made them one of us?

;D GOLD!

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:56pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

doesn't really answer the question does it, cods? What's Australia's values and culture, in your opinion?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:01pm

I am still waiting for you to answer my question,Alevine...

re- Your inability to name one thing a Muslim country has done (without our help) to stamp-out terrorism in it's own nation.

8-)

I asked you first...

You made the statement, now back it up!

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:04pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Is it a crime wanting to be around people who share your culture?

White pride is nothing to be ashamed of, nor is black pride!

:)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:07pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:01pm:

I have:
http://www.jamestown.org/single/?no_cache=1&tx_ttnews[tt_news]=35910

You want me to cut and paste it here, would that suit you better?

Now, what are the Australian culture and values you are so desperately trying to protect, cods?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:08pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Are you being racist, and implying only white people live in commonwealth nations?

Australia is traditionally a Commonwealth nation and we have all colours here.

But what should cement us together irrespective of creed or kind is our distinct Australian culture.

Buzz, On Australia day, did you fly the Australian flag?

I'll bet you didn't, and bet you sat inside with the sh1ts all day on the net abusing others who did.

Much like you are now.

Am I close?

If you want to feel a sense of belonging, start by wanting to.

8-)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:12pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:08pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Are you being racist, and implying only white people live in commonwealth nations?

Australia is traditionally a Commonwealth nation and we have all colours here.

But what should cement us together irrespective of creed or kind is our distinct Australian culture.

Buzz, On Australia day, did you fly the Australian flag?

I'll bet you didn't, and bet you sat inside with the sh1t all day on the net abusing others who did.

Am I close?

8-)

cods, why can't you answer what our distinct culture is?

Irrespective of what you may think of my answer re: muslim blah blah, if you know the answer to this question then answer it! Prove me wrong!

Poor cods.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:16pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:04pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Is it a crime wanting to be around people who share your culture?

:)

Not at ALL
But I wouldn't outlaw someone who invited me to sample THEIRS
We've just played host to an American we met ten years ago on a forum, not unlike this one
He brought with him a friend from Japan, where he has been working as an English tutor

I find multi-cultural interaction SO enriching

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by nichy on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:19pm

It can be buzz, but I suggest you read 'On Radji Beach', and you just might begin to understand why some Australians are sensitive to certain races.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:19pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:16pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:04pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Is it a crime wanting to be around people who share your culture?

:)

Unfortunately bigots who can't even name the culture and values they are trying to uphold don't agree with you on multicultural interaction being enriching.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:24pm

I could eloquently define my culture for you beautifully, at the drop of a hat, but I refuse to be dictated to by an unpatriotic internet troll who intentionally accuses others of being multiple handles for the purpose of harassing genuine posters off the boards.

I have one handle, and to my knowledge, so does Cods... and I feel you may have offended her with your BS.

If this is your idea of winning the war of cyber terror, think again.

And say hi to your new PM Tony Abbott, he is a great bloke and will serve our nation allot better than Gillard has.

:)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:26pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Please have a look at the racial make up of South Africa and Canada.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:28pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:59am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:55am:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:35am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:14am:

Hmmnnn....one set of rules for rich, white and Xtian folk, another for poor, dark and/or Muslim folk...

One small elite group can get richer, stuff all the rest - ludicrous!

Rules being -

SKILLS and ADD VALUE

do you think that's why your daddy got the sack?

The pilots were sacked because the Government sold them out.
It had nothing to do with what we are talking about.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:32pm

nichy wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:19pm:

It can be buzz, but I suggest you read 'On Radji Beach', and you just might begin to understand why some Australians are sensitive to certain races.

NO
I CAN'T understand

How ANYONE can hold such HATRED for a new generation of an ENTIRE RACE based on atrocities committed by a few individuals 70 years ago

ODD ...

We don't seem to have the same degree of HATRED towards today's Germans ?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:33pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:24pm:

but cods, why won't you seriously just explain Australia's, not your, culture? Oh, and values.

Sigh, cods I feel you will never be able to do this. Hence you shouldn't really speak on the subject, or try to defend something you can't even explain. :(

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:33pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:28pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:59am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:55am:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:35am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:14am:

Hmmnnn....one set of rules for rich, white and Xtian folk, another for poor, dark and/or Muslim folk...

One small elite group can get richer, stuff all the rest - ludicrous!

Rules being -

SKILLS and ADD VALUE

do you think that's why your daddy got the sack?

The pilots were sacked because the Government sold them out.
It had nothing to do with what we are talking about.

I think it does. Their skills and limited value to the national economy weren't needed, so we got some better pilots at a better cost. Makes sense totally.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:36pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:26pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Please have a look at the racial make up of South Africa and Canada.

what is the racial make up of South Africa?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Prevailing on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:39pm

Hey its great how the hardline dictatorship is so generous to asylum seekers and so heartless to Australians dont you think? :)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by buzzanddidj on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:40pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:28pm:

The pilots were sacked because the Government sold them out.

Just to CLARIFY ...

NO pilot was "sacked"
They ALL lodged letters of RESIGNATION, when they were knocked back on their TWENTY NINE per cent wage increase demand

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Equitist on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:42pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:32pm:

nichy wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:19pm:

It can be buzz, but I suggest you read 'On Radji Beach', and you just might begin to understand why some Australians are sensitive to certain races.

Speaking of which, I've been unable to track the heritage of that cold-hearted control-freak Scott Morrison - he does have a certain 'look' about him when he pulls his cunning stunts, does he not!?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Prevailing on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:44pm

Prevailing wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:39pm:

Hey its great how the hardline dictatorship is so generous to asylum seekers and so heartless to Australians dont you think? :)

9 11 was an inside job anyone?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezIU6ZxYU3A 8-)

Yes its true - only Governments do Genocide - there are no phantom terrorists. :)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:44pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:40pm:

NO pilot was "sacked"
They ALL lodged letters of RESIGNATION, when they were knocked back on their TWENTY NINE per cent wage increase demand[/size]

And to just clarify on your clarification -

The wage demand would have put them on a par with their peers in like for like countries and the demands were LESS than those demanded over the same time period by teachers, nurses and industrial workers.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by gizmo_2655 on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Come on Skippy...What IS the current Liberal policy in dealing with an orphaned child??

As far as I know, this is the first time the question has come up while Tony Abbott and the current front bench was in the position to make comments...

Don't judge the current Lib team on Howard's team.....because the question never came up then either..Did it???

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:50pm

Prevailing wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:39pm:

Hey its great how the hardline dictatorship is so generous to asylum seekers and so heartless to Australians dont you think? :)

Our federal and state Labor government donates more to other nations flood appeals than it's own, preferring to tax their victims of disaster instead, even when President Obama and the Royal family have already picked up the bill, and been most generous when it came to secreting our Labor squanderers an undisclosed amount of money.

8-) But keep donating anyway...this and paying your flood ~~tax~~ levy, labor need it to bribe people to vote them back in next time.

Though, I doubt even that will be enough!

::)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:56pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:36pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:26pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:00pm:

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:52pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 12:29pm:

Equitist wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 11:09am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Andre believes our immigration intake should be from "Commonwealth countries"
But he goes a bit coy when you remind him that India is a part of that demographic

Buzz, you thick skull, he was referring to the "real commonwealth" nations

Actually, he was referring to the WHITE "Commonwealth nations"
(not that he'd ever ADMIT it)

Please have a look at the racial make up of South Africa and Canada.

what is the racial make up of South Africa?

80% Black
6% Afrikaner
4% Anglo
8% Coloured
2% Asian

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:00pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Unless you want us judging Gillard on Mark Lathams or Rudds team...

given she did aferall say...

"My judgement is that Mark Latham is the leadership candidate who is best positioned to develop and articulate a bold vision of Labor policy for the 21st century and I think that is what the electorate want from us."
- Ms Gillard 2003

Perhaps Mark Latham should be leading the party then?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:08pm

Julia Gillard locking up more children in detention than John Howard
JULIA Gillard is locking up more than 1000 children in immigration facilities, beating the Howard Government's own "cruel" record.

And rising numbers of boatpeople are locking out thousands of asylum seekers waiting in overseas refugee camps.

The Coalition will move to guarantee places for asylum seekers who are languishing in overseas refugee camps when Parliament resumes, accusing the Prime Minister of allowing people smugglers to run Australia's refugee intake.

New figures obtained by The Sunday Mail confirm 1046 minors are being held in detention. The previous high-water mark was nearly 10 years ago when 842 children where held in detention in September, 2001, according to the Human Rights Commission.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/national/julia-gillard-locking-up-more-children-in-detention-than-john-howard/story-e6freooo-1225996704418

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:11pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:00pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Perhaps Turnbull should be leading the party?

Don't forget that thats it's only until the very last few moments of a leadership spill where everyone will still declare their loyalty to the current leader.

So please, spare us.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by chicken_lipsforme on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:11pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:00pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Such vision that red haired souless barren athiest witch has. ;D

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by chicken_lipsforme on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Good points Andrei.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:25pm

Quote:

The Coalition will move to guarantee places for asylum seekers who are languishing in overseas refugee camps when Parliament resumes, accusing the Prime Minister of allowing people smugglers to run Australia's refugee intake..

But then the floods came, so perhaps they are busy with this right now.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by chicken_lipsforme on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:31pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Well I don't know how much that really matters.
Countries don't have to abide by conventions, but do comply for other reasons, and not because they must.
And no-one says that we have to be nice to people that engage criminals to smuggle them into our country.
We could just as easy in the blink of an eye lower our refugee intake to match say NZ annual amount, and still comply with the convention.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:32pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Some wonder if the Convention is still relevant in the 21st century, given it was initially drafted after WWII.

We have grown much since then, in case you hadn't noticed.
8-)

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by mellie on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:36pm

Abbott is the right man for the Job, Turnbull sat on his hands and refused to challenge anything Labor said...he was useless as a leader.

But I suppose we could get him to run errands between channel 7 and Labors press secretary if he'd like?

Given he appears to have a talent/flair for ratting on both sides of government.

He should have been a channel 7 reporter.

;D

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:38pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Sorry remind us again what legal obligations the UN Convention on Refugees places on the signatories?

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Vanessa on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:40pm

The child is welcome in my country, and so are all the other asylum seekers.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by skippy. on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:41pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Liberal party policy is to detain ALL REFUGEES AND PROCESS THEM OFF SHORE, they do not make allowances for children of any kind orphaned or not.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:46pm

mellie wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:32pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:23pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:21pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 10:57am:

Good points Andrei.

refugee convention disagrees with you.

Some wonder if the Convention is still relevant in the 21st century, given it was initially drafted after WWII.

We have grown much since then, in case you hadn't noticed.
8-)

Oh I agree!! Don't get me wrong, had you bothered to read my opinion in the other forum (unlike your just complete utterance of newspaper cut outs) you would've noticed I called for a change to to the convention!

I should say though, I must admit I got it wrong: Not only doesn't the convention disagree with Hickory, but international law does too. See, international law prohibits a country from resending a person back to a place they are trying to escape due to a situtation that would deem them to be a refuge. Hence, Andrei's idea that you work with the hand you are dealt with isn't supported, because international law allows people to leave an area they deem dangerous.

Try again.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by Andrei.Hicks on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:53pm

skippy. wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:41pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Liberal party policy is to detain ALL REFUGEES AND PROCESS THEM OFF SHORE, they do not make allowances for children of any kind orphaned or not.

Agreed.
And I support it.

Title: Re: Gillards grieving detention orphan, disturbing
Post by alevine on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:56pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:53pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 2:41pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Feb 18^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

skippy. wrote on Feb 17^th, 2011 at 4:59pm:

So you disagree with liberal policy, mel?
You dont think refugees should be held in detention?

Liberal party policy is to detain ALL REFUGEES AND PROCESS THEM OFF SHORE, they do not make allowances for children of any kind orphaned or not.

Agreed.
And I support it.

Someone's still a little bitter about their daddy losing their job :(

I hear Wesfarmers have released a statement personally asking you to not even consider applying. Something about "It was a good joke but the time has now come to stop laughing."

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D