So anyway, in the last hour is the first time I have ever actually visited his website and have decided to do some cursory investigation on this chap.

The following quotes are taken from http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=39158.


Quote:

Now it has become more obvious that the government can't stand Sheikh Haron and the Media is trying to put him down. I think the plans of enemy will be infact useful for Sheikh Haron if Allah (SWT) wants. How can they say "haven't heard" from Ayatollah Manteghi Boroujerdi while he gave a speech to few hundereds Muslims in the Hall of Granvile in Sydney few years ago and other Shia clerics are present in the video?! All are plans of Media. We should be careful. I agree with Sheikh regarding Media Mafia.

Ayatollah Manteghi Boroujerdi is the name this chap claims he used to be known by, if you read the fine print at the bottom of his website.


Quote:

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/religionreport/st...2001/240626.htm I pasted this link earlier when ABC interviewed him a few years ago, so i'm not gonna say he doesn't exist. I'm surprised the ABC could interview him a few years ago, but now they havn't mentioned anything and are thus supporting the idea that he is a mystery and is unknown.

Interviewed by the ABC?


Quote:

I couldn't get through either of those links... But, I had seen a article on Sheikh Haron on abc religion report. They have labelled his views as dangerously liberal, and his wife & two daughters are being held hostage in Iran. This is dated back in 31st January 2001. I ask again can someone please let me know how to post a link.

Quote:

QUOTE (N0maD @ Feb 7 2008, 12:09 PM) * So is he real or not? Looks to me like some kid with too much time and an internet connection giving proper sheikhs a bad name He's real... I spoke with him on the phone

That one was posted by the board administrator....

Now, the most interesting parts about this chap Haron.

If you go to his website, he announces that Hezbollah has been established in Australia and will soon be active.

He also, in the Behind the News section, lists where he has specifically warned Qantas about things which will happen to their aircraft, which have happened.

Some serious investigation needs to be done on the aircraft engineers who work for Qantas. I know one of them, but unfortunately they wouldn't be up to the task of figuring them out.

If you ask me, this isn't a hoax, but a website front for militant Islam in Australia, much like terrorist groups around the world have a political side to them, a legitimate front which is 'disassociated' from the terrorist groups yet supports their aims and is very, very closely linked to them.

What do you think?

Quote:

What do you think?

I think it belongs in the fringe section :)

I think any support of terrorism should be investigated thoroughly.
we should not allow any front (real or not) for any extremist belief exist within our shores.

It is of some interest that muslims do not disagree with him.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Sep 29^th, 2008 at 8:29am:

It is of some interest that muslims do not disagree with him.

Considering that both myself and Abu have already stated that we believe him to be a hoax, I am interested in knowing who these 'muslims who do not disagree with him' exactly are.

Name them....

I agree wholehearterdly, this "Sheikh Haron" character should be fully investigated by the authorities, funny thing is, even though he's supposedly released videos and other information calling for jihad against Australia, he's not being investigated, why do you think that might be?


Quote:

They have labelled his views as dangerously liberal, and his wife & two daughters are being held hostage in Iran. This is dated back in 31st January 2001.

I've also seen this on the ABC website, strange that one day he was 'dangerously liberal' and his wife and daughters were being held hostage in Iran, now all of a sudden he's a 'firebrand cleric' who supports Hezbollah (Iranian government's proxy in Lebanon).

So which one is it?
Is he a dangerously liberal refugee fleeing the regime in Iran?
Or a Shi'a ayatollah that supports Hezbollah?
Or a Sunni Sheikh that supports al-Qa'idah?

Because all 3 of them are worlds apart, and I can't imagine them existing in the same person. As I've mentioned before, I've checked some of the records regarding his website and even business registration and the location of his 'enterprise' and the Ayatollah and the Sheikh seem to be based on two very different persons. There's two seperate individuals that registered their busuiness entity, one with the Manteghi name, and the other with Haron in his name, and a third with a Christian name.

abu, how do you know he's not being investigated? Do you think terrorism suspects are implicitly informed they are under investigation, and then the media told also?

There are Muslims saying he exists and that they support him, if you read the quotes I provided.

Maybe, seeing as his family are hostage in Iran, he is being extorted in to using religion to justify militant Islam and support these Iranian groups?

lestat - muslims in other chat rooms (before I was banned) and here have not disagreed with what he says.
they go to great lengths to say he is not legitimate, yet they do not come out and disagree with what he says.

Easel- As you've probably read through my posts I go to the site. I don't believe that "it is a website front for militant Islam in Australia", that's absoultely ridiculous, their policy is war on oppression.
There is a sentence on the homepage of the site which says: If our fair defence against your unfair attack is called terrorism then we are proud to be called terrorists. Would this sentence not apply to most countries if not all?

http://www.sheikhharon.com/our-policy.html

http://www.sheikhharon.com/index.php

Abu- When you say he is calling for jihad against Australia, what exactly do you mean? Do you mean this:

http://www.islamic-dictionary.com/index.php?word=jihad

bluebird, somewhere on the site are the permissible reasons for suicide bombing. They had prior knowledge of destruction/tamper of Qantas aircraft equipment.

easel wrote on Oct 2^nd, 2008 at 1:47am:

bluebird, somewhere on the site are the permissible reasons for suicide bombing. They had prior knowledge of destruction/tamper of Qantas aircraft equipment.

They have a video which explains a legitimate suicide attack, the example used is a pilot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5hQSxIFmTg

The Sheikh had sent a letter to a member of parliament warning him of attacks like this, and he has even offered to give the information he has to the Ceo of Qantas. So I don't really believe he is extreme.
http://www.sheikhharon.com/behind-the-news.html

Where's he getting the information then?

How would I know? :-? Join the forum and ask him.  ;)

easel wrote on Oct 2^nd, 2008 at 1:47am:

bluebird, somewhere on the site are the permissible reasons for suicide bombing. They had prior knowledge of destruction/tamper of Qantas aircraft equipment.

Is this the link you're referring to?

http://www.sheikhharon.com/behind-the-news.html

The Qantas incident was on July 25th - all the correspondence on this page is dated after this date. He CLAIMS prior knowledge, but this is no proof.

Reading the letters he seems to be more concerned with getting official recognition of his letters - and I suspect raise his profile and get his name in the news. I don't know who this Sheik Haron character is - but he certainly seems to be full of it.

The Shia community don't seem to know who he is.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,23118606-5001561,00.html

The Australian Federation of Islamic Councils think this sheik is a fake.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,22978732-31477,00.html

Australian Federal Police and ASIO are investigating a connected Youtube video from "sister zahara".
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23896804-662,00.html


Everything on this sheik haron website seems designed to inflame. So much so I really do wonder about the motives. Be it an Anglo Aussie, or a Muslim it doesn't really matter - all they're trying to do is stir up trouble.

It's not worth our time.

Welcome to OzPolitic ngali.

Perhaps it is a joke and he is trying to make money from all the free publicity.

Abu:

I agree wholehearterdly, this "Sheikh Haron" character should be fully investigated by the authorities

Why?

Because it's obviously a hoax trying to create hatred and tensions between Muslims and non-Muslims.

Jokes normally lighten the tension. It does not seem to make much effort to appear genuine.

Sprintcyclist wrote on Sep 29^th, 2008 at 3:49pm:

lestat - muslims in other chat rooms (before I was banned) and here have not disagreed with what he says. they go to great lengths to say he is not legitimate, yet they do not come out and disagree with what he says.

these comments are also in this same thread:

"Wrong. We don't defend stupidity.

As we said, if the thread was to welcome the sister, then all that hullabulloo should't have been included in her riddiculous video.

We all said Ahlan wa sahlan (ie welcome) but to have those thoughts and that attitude and then think because you're a convert you have exclusive anonymity in anything you do or say then you've obviously missed something along the way.

Islam is the most detailed religon when it comes to raising your self awareness and making sure you always keep yourself in check in accordance with the amount of knowledge and understanding you have and qualifications you have.

Islam is not a veiled and hidden mysterious religon. It prides itself on transparency and being open and honest. If people want to hide that, twist that, misrepresent that and give a completely different picture then don't you worry, there are plenty of people both Muslim and non-Muslim who will say "Hang on, something is wrong here!" and will stand up for what is correct.

We welcome her conversion but slam the door on her ideas, period.

Don't make out like we're all guilty sinners for not accepting her each and every word, just because she is a convert.

If a non-Muslim speaks the truth and a Muslim lies, then I will applaude the non-Muslim first every time, that's what Allah expects of me, not misleading and biased defense of alien ideas."

"Humans have the right to different point of views but as Muslims there are clear cut lines and boundaries of which she/haron et al have none. Take a look at his pathetic website. Full of spam and nothing else. He is a nobody, a robot, a fake, a phoney and a pseudo and he uses and preys on innocent people to use them as his pawns.

That is not the Muslim way. If he had anything to say he would stand, like a man, like a human being with an identity and represent his views. Instead he used a sister just trying to establish hers, with no clue on how to do it and gave her a pseudo identity and I can guess how he did it."


not to mention that all discussions about sheikh haron, and all posting of his ridiculous propaganda are not allowed on mv.

I think it's safe to say MV is actually not in support of Sheikh Haron

.

gaybriel - as I said, muslims deny harons authencity, yet do not openly expressedly disagree with what he says.


Why ban discussions about him ? That'ld be healthy.
They could easily disprove him, one would think.
How repressive - hang about, that is what abu et al do here !!!!!!!!!!!

Sprintcyclist wrote on Oct 10^th, 2008 at 3:45pm:

gaybriel - as I said, muslims deny harons authencity, yet do not openly expressedly disagree with what he says. Why ban discussions about him ? That'ld be healthy. They could easily disprove him, one would think. How repressive - hang about, that is what abu et al do here !!!!!!!!!!!

the guy said he was pathetic, stupid and ridiculous- and you think he agrees with what he said? are you mentally challenged?

the discussions were banned because MV didn't want to be seen in support of him, and also because the discussions often became so heated that they became disrespectful, which is against the ideals of the forum

here is a quote from one of the mods:

"In the context of much misunderstanding and misconceptions of Islam by the general public, these types of info-ads are less than helpful.

So please, no more Sheikh Haron stuff. This website and forum are not going to be a mouthpiece for this type of propaganda. "

http://muslimvillage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=43156&hl=sheikh+haron

if the discussions got heated, some/many muslims there must have agreed with haron.

in true repressive style, ban what they do not want.
Show the right image to the outside world.

and again you're going to read into it whatever you want

there was one person on the forums named Sabar who supported Haron- everyone else was shouting him down. that's why it got heated.

and btw- some bans are more constructive than repressive

they maintain the tone of the forum and allow for constructive discussion- if people show they are unable to be constructive then the discussion is suspended (although it can be appealed by whatever party to be re-opened).

personally I think this works- especially on the internet where things can so easily degenerate into useless back and forth

Discussion of "Sheik Haron" is banned on AussieMuslims too sprint, so for someone who you claim is supported by the Muslim community, he's sure not getting a lot of suipport.

Just because he happens to say "Get out of Iraq and Afghanistan" doesn't mean he's the same as the Muslims. Socialists also say this, are they the same as the Muslims?

It's quite obvious Sheik Haron is a fake, and is probably perpetrated by right wing Australians or Arabic Christians or Bahai's (I've actually confirmed this link myself) in order to sour the relations between Muslim and non-Muslim Australians. Don't be so gullible as to fall for it. That's my sincere advice to you.

more censorship from the islamics.

no abu, I did not say haron was supported by you islamics.
I said you do not disagree with what he says.

And you still don't. You never have.
Why should you, what he says is in agreeance with the islamics fanaticism.

Gaybriel wrote on Oct 11^th, 2008 at 1:10pm:

Sprintcyclist wrote on Oct 10th, 2008 at 3:45pm: gaybriel - as I said, muslims deny harons authencity, yet do not openly expressedly disagree with what he says. Why ban discussions about him ? That'ld be healthy. They could easily disprove him, one would think. How repressive - hang about, that is what abu et al do here !!!!!!!!!!! the guy said he was pathetic, stupid and ridiculous- and you think he agrees with what he said? are you mentally challenged?

haha..finally, see, someone else has seen what I have seen.

Yes Gaybriel..I seriously think that he might really be mentally challenged.

i saw that too lestat.

still muslims do not disagree with what he says.

Why ??

yes, yes they do.

let's compare this to someone who is also controversial like fred nile.

if you had christian/catholic forums that banned discussions about fred nile, had people on those forums calling him and his ideas stupid, ridicuolous, unscholarly, un-christian- had people questioning the validity of his claim to being a reverand.- would you say they support him?? or agree with him??

It seems to be like you have constructed some imaginary muslim populace in your mind. unless there are massive riots of the streets in protest against every stupid thing a muslim says or does- you assume, based on your own prejudice, that 'they' must be in support of them (again this imaginary monolith of 'they' despite the diversity of the muslim population- not just in terms of race and ethnicity- but just in terms of basic individualism). then again, if there were riots you'd probably see it as evidence of how barbaric and violent muslims are.

I think you would take any action by muslims and twist it to suit your prejudice. if muslim village allowed open discussion about sheikh haron, you would say- well if they disagree with him so much then why don't they ban the discussion like they ban others? or you'd go in and choose quotes from the ONE person on the forum who actually supported him.

but then MV does ban discussion and now they're oppressive fascists who censor everything and are just hiding their real agenda.

and again- where do you get your impression of the muslim community from?? do you conduct surveys with all muslims in australia?

I at least have the sense to say that yes, some muslims may agree with him- but based on my own personal friendships and associations with many muslims- the overwhelming majority seem to think he's a crackpot.

you have two muslims on here saying he's a joke and not even worth paying attention to- and yet you continue to act as if they're not doing enough to damn him. what should they get "To sheik haron australia says no" tattooed on their foreheads?

honest to god. why must every muslim go out of their way to try and satisfy your apparently insatiable need to get the response YOU want out of everything?

what is it that would satisfy you to say that muslims don't agree nor support haron?

and if you're going to say that you get your impression of muslims from random extreme muslim sites on the internet, or anti-muslim sites- then obviously those references are about as reliable as a rotten plank of wood.

I could go to christian sites that promote the beating of women, the bashing of minorities etc- but they are of course COMPLETELY INSANE and NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF THE MAJORITY OF CHRISTIANS

rant over

and abu- don't have a go at bahai's, I have good bahai friends and they're lovely people.

I've had at least two independent sources from people I know personally confirm that haron is real- that they have spoken and met with him

I think it's more likely this guy exists and is just extremely stupid and ridiculous- rather than it being some massive religious conspiracy by christians or bahais.

I mean seriously- pull your head in.

gaybriel - what haron says is in agreeance with the loran.

uhuh - beating women is not in the bible.
It IS in the koran.

bashing minoriities is not in the bible.
Killing and humiliating infidels IS in the koran.


Lots of chirsitians DO openly disagree with fred niles etc
No muslims disagree with hilali.


Go figure

Sprintcyclist wrote on Oct 12^th, 2008 at 9:14pm:

gaybriel - what haron says is in agreeance with the loran. uhuh - beating women is not in the bible. It IS in the koran. bashing minoriities is not in the bible. Killing and humiliating infidels IS in the koran. Lots of chirsitians DO openly disagree with fred niles etc No muslims disagree with hilali. Go figure

oh so now we've moved to hilali. stick to the topic.

oh and wrong and wrong re the quran