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Message started by abu_rashid on Aug 5th, 2008 at 7:53pm

Title: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 5th, 2008 at 7:53pm
Just thought I'd help mozza and jordan out a little in their quest to find the perfect Muslim reformer. Here's 7 nice & simple tips you can pass onto any prospective Muslim Reformer that you happen to run into :)


Quote:
How to be a Muslim reformer

After reading an article on Wafa Sultan (the up-and-coming Muslim reformer) in the New York Times today, it occured to me that I should get on this reformer bandwagon before the market gets saturated. I'm articulate, telegenic, exotic (yet oh so fluffy and Westernized), not to mention female (oppressed by rigid Islamic paternalism, naturally). Too bad I've got so many other little schemes on the go and can't spare the time for this one. However, I've written a handy little guide for aspiring refuseniks, male or female, Muslim or non-Muslim. Hopefully it will inspire readers to lead the charge in enlightening the benighted Islamic world.

1. Keep it simple
First and foremost, don't bother actually studying the religion or recent MENA history. Take a page from Pundita's book: no need for research when you're painting with a really big brush. If you absolutely must research, this site is a treasure trove of convenient black and white stereotyping.

2. Have an angle
Find or manufacture a useful "turning point" in your life that made you realize Islam was a bigoted and/or violent religion. In Irshad Manji's case, it was being kicked out of her madrasa for demanding proof of a Jewish conspiracy. For Wafa Sultan, it was watching the Muslim Brotherhood kill a professor at her university in Aleppo. Of course, it's helpful not to mention Hafez Assad's response. I recall Irshad was all for Emergency Law in Egypt because Naguib Mahfouz was roughed up by some Islamist thugs: "Excuse me, but if that's a reason to maim (and possibly kill), it's equally a reason for security forces to crack down on the thugs. Bring on the Emergency Law" (128).

Ahem, moving on...

3. Write a book
Start holding interviews just prior to (or immediately after) publishing a book that claims to spearhead a reform movement and/or turn the Islamic world on its head. Tell the NYT that the working title is The Escaped Prisoner: When God Is a Monster, because The Trouble with Islam Today is simply too namby-pamby.

4. Become a Western media darling
Be extremely provocative. Make rude statements about Islam and those who follow it. Make sure to have an itemized list of every horrible act commited by Muslims, rulers of Muslim-majority countries, Caliphs, etc. Make fun of Arabs and how childish and barbaric they are compared to Jews and Christians (or in Irshad's case, go one step further and blame everything on the "Arabization" of Islam). Don't bother to mention any similar acts carried out in the name of other Abrahamic religions or even atheist ideologies, such as Communism. This is supposed to be an indictment against Islam, not the vile predictability of human nature and perverse incentives.

5. Remind people that you are constantly under siege
Make sure the media is fully aware of every single death threat you receive as a result of the aforementioned provocative statements. If you're lucky, some wacko will release a fatwa that demands you be stoned, beheaded or strung up in some elaborate medieval way.

6. Rake in the cash
Watch as speaking invitations roll in from hardline right-wing Israeli and US organizations. No, it's not a Jewish conspiracy, but for some odd reason they are in full agreement with your views on Islamic reform. You're definitely on the way to winning Muslim hearts and minds if they're supporting you!

7. Remember your audience
Don't bother engaging Muslims in a respectful yet frank discussion on how to remain faithful to the Prophet's message in our modern, globalized, polarized, terrorized world. You don't even need to talk to Muslims, unless it's to get the extremists frothing at the mouth. Being a true visionary is hard work and requires far too much study, which leaves you hardly any time for gala dinners with pretentious, xenophobic ultra-liberal or ultra-conservative (really, does it matter?) activists who will praise you as a model Muslim making a real difference in the Islamic world.


Source

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by mozzaok on Aug 5th, 2008 at 8:05pm
Actually Abu, it is people like you who should be the reformers, instead of declaring all aspects of your western heritage are evil, and all aspects of Islam are perfect, perhaps a more honest appraisal of each will help you find the harmony needed to move forward.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 5th, 2008 at 8:26pm
Agreed.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 5th, 2008 at 8:42pm
Come on guys, didn't you find it even remotely funny? :)


Quote:
instead of declaring all aspects of your western heritage are evil


If I'd done that, then I might be able to take your advice on that one.


Quote:
and all aspects of Islam are perfect


If I didn't believe that, then I wouldn't have converted. Islam the word itself, means surrender, and Muslim means 'surrenderer', as I've surrendered my will unto the commands of God, I therefore consider those commands to be perfect and infallible. If I wasn't comfortable accepting that, then I simply wouldn't have become a Muslim. I don't know why you find this point such a stumbling block mozza, I guess it's cos you're used to Christians, who take their religion with a grain of salt. Oh well, you'll get used to it eventually.

In fact, that's why I could never have accepted Christianity, it's a half hearted religion, and therefore lacks the absolute sincerity that Islamic belief is imbued with. I think you'll find that most converts have a similar view, perhaps Malik can comment on that for us.


Quote:
perhaps a more honest appraisal of each will help you find the harmony needed to move forward


If anyone needs to move on, it's you :)

I'm quite happy and at ease with my beliefs, it's you that isn't.
It's strange, that normally the 'zealous religious proselytiser' would be the one trying to convince the godless infiedel to adopt his beliefs, in our case it's you the supposed enlightened secularist that is insisting all Muslims must convert to your way, or the highway. Interesting :)

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by freediver on Aug 5th, 2008 at 9:40pm
There are plenty of Christians who take the Bible literally. The difference is the extent to which the religion controls those who surrender to it. Islam saves people the trouble of making difficult decisions. 'Turn the other cheek' and 'do unto others' doesn't give much guidance on who to stone and who to set free, or how much tax to charge. You may call it wishy washy, but in the end you still have to think for yourself, even if your a Muslim.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 5th, 2008 at 10:10pm

Quote:
There are plenty of Christians who take the Bible literally.


Although I understand that you feel some Christians go a little far, and you therefore consider them to be "bible literalists", the fact is there's no Christians who actually take the Bible literally. Not that I've come across anyway. Even those who are most strict in adhering to Biblical practises, still leave out quite a lot of stuff, either claiming it's only for nations past, or some other excuse to put it on the side.

And believe me, I've met a lot of different types of Christians, even some who practise polygamy, who don't eat pork, who do all sorts of practises that most Christians would never consider part of their religion, but which is clearly mentioned in the Bible. Yet still they leave quite a lot out and claim it's not relevant.

In contrast, Muslims believe 100% in the divine nature of the Qur'an and that it must be followed 100%, and that removing or rendering any section, or even one single full stop,  invalid, would be tantamount to apostasy.

I do recognise you don't think this is a good thing, don't get your signals crossed. Just bolstering my original points, about why I embraced Islam.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Grendel on Aug 6th, 2008 at 5:38am
I find your avatar rather offensive aboo...

Mozz...  I gather this is an example of your most Muslims are moderate.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 6th, 2008 at 7:26am
Grendel,

What do you find offensive about it?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Lestat on Aug 6th, 2008 at 10:39am

Grendel wrote on Aug 6th, 2008 at 5:38am:
I find your avatar rather offensive aboo...

Mozz...  I gather this is an example of your most Muslims are moderate.


lol :D

Oooh...the big bad scary muslims are coming to get us.

EVERY BODY RUN>>>>>> :D :D

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Grendel on Aug 11th, 2008 at 1:16pm
lol...  you see abooo... even someone as intellectually challenged as Lestat gets it.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 11th, 2008 at 1:37pm
Well I'm an Australian and a Muslim, so I don't see the problem with it. It embodies both of those things, and I don't think it is offensive to either. Nobody else has ever expressed such an offense to me before.

Just for the record do you find these symbols/logos offensive also:

Australia-China Business Alliance:


Australian-Tibetan Buddhists:


Australian Jewish Historical Society:


National Council of Jewish Women of Australia:


The Australian and New Zealand Masonic Research Council:


Or is it as I suspected? Your bigotry is reserved only for Muslims?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Grendel on Aug 25th, 2008 at 5:57am
rotflmao

none other represents Australia as being totally Muslim

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Phil. on Aug 25th, 2008 at 6:04am
LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES    LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES


I wouldnt trust a jewish historical society. I'd get bogged in pigshit.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 25th, 2008 at 9:15pm

Quote:
none other represents Australia as being totally Muslim


No more than my avatar does, anyway. In fact my avatar is based on an Islamic organisation's logo, which just like the Buddhist and other logos above merely indicates it's an Islamic organisation that happens to be based in Australia and has Australians as it's members.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 25th, 2008 at 9:47pm
Can you at least admit that to some of us it looks like you're wanting Australia to be an Islamic nation? That's what it looks like.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 25th, 2008 at 10:34pm

Quote:
Can you at least admit that to some of us it looks like you're wanting Australia to be an Islamic nation? That's what it looks like.


To a sane and rational person, no.

To a nationalistic rednecked yobbo, perhaps.

Either way, I've stated my intention in using the logo, it indicates I am a Muslim and an Australian, if you don't like it, bad luck. Build a bridge, and get over it.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Phil. on Aug 26th, 2008 at 6:59am

abu_rashid wrote on Aug 25th, 2008 at 9:15pm:

Quote:
none other represents Australia as being totally Muslim


No more than my avatar does, anyway. In fact my avatar is based on an Islamic organisation's logo, which just like the Buddhist and other logos above merely indicates it's an Islamic organisation that happens to be based in Australia and has Australians as it's members.


Would that be Keysar Trad's organisation? ::) :P

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 26th, 2008 at 7:40am

His would be more likely to have a cedar tree, since it's the Lebanese mateship association or something.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Phil. on Aug 26th, 2008 at 7:50am

abu_rashid wrote on Aug 26th, 2008 at 7:40am:
His would be more likely to have a cedar tree, since it's the Lebanese mateship association or something.


No, its called the Islamic Friendship Assosiation of Australia not the Lebanese friendship ass.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 26th, 2008 at 7:59am
Well it used to be called Lebanese.. Maybe he wasn't getting much friendship so he changed it.

Btw I like your new avatar phil, it's very befitting. Are you aware the Saudi clan have Jewish ancestry? And it's well known they're a good friend of Israel, they're just not allowed to directly say so publically.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 26th, 2008 at 10:52am

abu_rashid wrote on Aug 25th, 2008 at 10:34pm:

Quote:
Can you at least admit that to some of us it looks like you're wanting Australia to be an Islamic nation? That's what it looks like.


To a sane and rational person, no.

To a nationalistic rednecked yobbo, perhaps.

Either way, I've stated my intention in using the logo, it indicates I am a Muslim and an Australian, if you don't like it, bad luck. Build a bridge, and get over it.

There you go mantra, here's a fine example of his well thought out, articulated posts that are non-abusive etc etc.

I don't give a crap about your avatar, you can have what you like as far as I'm concerned, but at least have the stones to admit what it really looks like and that it means different things to different people. Oh that's right, only your way is right because only muslims are. How could I forget?

Glad to see phil can still post in here. Grown up a little now, abu?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 26th, 2008 at 8:00pm

Quote:
Glad to see phil can still post in here. Grown up a little now, abu?


Why wouldn't Phil be allowed to post in here?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 26th, 2008 at 8:21pm
Signature......?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 26th, 2008 at 8:40pm
Thanks, I didn't notice that.

Are you attempting to assist me in 'stifling free speech'? :)

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Phil. on Aug 26th, 2008 at 10:21pm

abu_rashid wrote on Aug 26th, 2008 at 8:40pm:
Thanks, I didn't notice that.


As blind as the cult you follow.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by mantra on Aug 26th, 2008 at 10:38pm

Quote:
[quote]To a sane and rational person, no.

To a nationalistic rednecked yobbo, perhaps.

Either way, I've stated my intention in using the logo, it indicates I am a Muslim and an Australian, if you don't like it, bad luck. Build a bridge, and get over it.

There you go mantra, here's a fine example of his well thought out, articulated posts that are non-abusive etc etc.[/quote]

Well Jordan - Abu does sound a bit condescending, but I will have to admit that I've responded to posts in a similar manner when I've been angry or baited by someone.  It's a form of defence when all avenues have been exhausted, but you want to win the argument.  

It's probably not pleasant to the recipient, but then you've got to look at both sides of the debate and consider whether unnecessary pressure was put to bear on the perpetrator of such scorn.


Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 27th, 2008 at 7:24am

DILLIGAF wrote on Aug 26th, 2008 at 10:21pm:

abu_rashid wrote on Aug 26th, 2008 at 8:40pm:
Thanks, I didn't notice that.


As blind as the cult you follow.

Sorry phil, I didn't mean to dob you in. I thought abu may have grown up a bit. What was I thinking?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 27th, 2008 at 8:12am

Quote:
Sorry phil, I didn't mean to dob you in. I thought abu may have grown up a bit. What was I thinking?


The rules are the rules, and will remain so.

You know that, and the reason you mentioned it, was because you wish for me to ban him, so that you can continue to claim to be victimised by the big bad mean censoring muslims.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 27th, 2008 at 9:16am
No, wrong again. I mentioned it because I thought you'd finally grown up and allowed members to choose their own avatars and the like, even if it was offensive to you. The rules are only so because you made them so. You can change them too. Your little forum is so reflective of the wider world in which muslims try to censor and ban things because of their belief system.......the rest of the forum can say what it wants about Islam and you have to deal with it.......the rest of the world can too, and muslims worldwide will just have to deal with it, rather than trying to force people into respecting and believing what Islam dictates. Grow up.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 27th, 2008 at 5:49pm

Quote:
No, wrong again. I mentioned it because I thought you'd finally grown up and allowed members to choose their own avatars and the like, even if it was offensive to you.


so you don't find Phil's signature at all offensive jordan?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by jordan484 on Aug 29th, 2008 at 5:06pm
Should I?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by abu_rashid on Aug 31st, 2008 at 8:05pm
Off-Topic replies have been moved to this Topic.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Frank on May 20th, 2021 at 4:40pm

Lestat wrote on Aug 6th, 2008 at 10:39am:

Grendel wrote on Aug 6th, 2008 at 5:38am:
I find your avatar rather offensive aboo...

Mozz...  I gather this is an example of your most Muslims are moderate.


lol :D

Oooh...the big bad scary muslims are coming to get us.

EVERY BODY RUN>>>>>> :D :D



Formally, dawa refers to a ‘call’ to Islam. But in reality, Islamist groups use a wide range of mechanisms to advance their goal of imposing Islamic law (shariah) on society. In western countries, dawa aims both to instil extremist views among existing Muslims and, to a lesser extent, to convert non-Muslims to a fierce version of political Islam.

Shariah law is hostile to women’s rights (legally and in the family sphere), religious minorities, religious tolerance, freedom of expression, freedom of association, freedom of conscience, social pluralism — in short, all the values Karl Popper described as being the foundation of the ‘open society’. Although Islamists use proselytising in their dawa programme, it extends well beyond that, to a process of personal indoctrination and total social and institutional transformation.

Some adherents to dawa reject democracy, while others see it as a useful mechanism, provided either Islamists win (as they did after the Arab spring in Egypt) or that electoral options are restricted to Islamist choices determined well in advance (as in Iran). Other Islamists who pursue dawa are politically ‘quietist’, focused on Islamising all of society and its institutions before tackling the political domain. Pluralistic, reformist Muslims (to say nothing of ex-Muslims) are viewed by Islamists as a problem that must be dealt with.

A number of Islamist groups countenance violence as a tactic. But whether or not violence is used, the endpoint favoured by Islamists is at odds with British society and its governing institutions. If Boris Johnson’s government avoids tackling the ideological infrastructure of Islamism, the UK will be forced not only to deal with spasmodic eruptions of violence, but with a fracturing of society.
...

In July last year, for example, Austria announced the creation of an Observatory for Political Islam in order to tackle Islamism within its borders. In France, in the wake of the murder of French teacher Samuel Paty, President Emmanuel Macron made waves with his initiatives to counter Islamist separatism — and to build up mainstream Islam.

If Britain is to do the same, it needs to look at its own homegrown dawa networks. Groups linked to the Muslim Brotherhood should be investigated, but so should Jama’at-e-Islami, Hizb ut-Tahrir and similar organisations. Some are registered as ‘charities’, though the destination of some funds is questionable. Shawcross has experience of dealing with these groups, having looked into many of them while running the Charity Commission. This may explain some of the ire of his critics.

Other dawa groups are registered as mosques and Islamic centres, but if these are Islamist in orientation they should be investigated too. Then there are the schools that impart an Islamist ideology as well as the informal groups that gather online and in person.

Some dawa programmes have benign elements that qualify as ‘religious teachings’, including harmless exhortations to pray, fast during the month of Ramadan or give to those less fortunate. But others preach that almost all modern-day activities are haram, or prohibited. Men and women mingling together socially is considered taboo, and genders must be segregated. Some organisations offer services related to shariah family law. Many of these archaic rules compromise the rights of women: divorce, inheritance, and child custody rules all favour men in ways incompatible with modern equality.
The people targeted by dawa programmes tend to be young, impressionable Muslim men and women. They are often from immigrant communities, including those with low incomes and little education. Prisoners, as well as young children and teenagers, are also targeted. By far the largest category of people approached are those born into Islam, but non-Muslims are also targeted.

France failed to tackle the structural challenge of Islamism in a timely manner — with calamitous results. Britain ought to waste no time in investigating the infrastructure of dawa as it exists in the UK. To miss the chance for such an assessment now will come back to haunt the UK in years to come.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali



The same goes for every Western country: review not just charities but dawa programs.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 20th, 2021 at 4:45pm


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 20th, 2021 at 4:48pm
They put away another muzzo terrorist the other day.....for 44 years.

Hope he likes being passed around by all the big boys.

But according to the duplicitous duo, the islamophile brothers.

Right wing are more dangerous.

Let me see.

We have had a murdering muzzo murder people in a cafe.
We have had murdering muzzos running down people in cars
We have had murdering muzzos slashing and stabbing people.

Where are all the far right terrorists??????

Oh yeah, all the graffiti on the walls.
And some muzzo shela was insulted once in Newcastle.

The horror of it all.

This is the level of stupidity we are trying to counter.

Bwyannnnnn thinks this signature make sense in his argument about Islamic democracy.

There is no democratic control in any Islamic countries.
They murder the opposition, their families and any that they can to defeat them.

If this is democracy, then we are all in serious trouble.

and in power, the Imams run riot enforcing barbaric punishments for the most trivial crimes???

Bwyannnnnnn.......YOU HAVE LOST IT MATE.
bwyannn_3_009.jpg (200 KB | 7 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 20th, 2021 at 5:06pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 20th, 2021 at 5:11pm
They put away another muzzo terrorist the other day.....for 44 years.

Hope he likes being passed around by all the big boys.

But according to the duplicitous duo, the islamophile brothers.

Right wing are more dangerous.

Let me see.

We have had a murdering muzzo murder people in a cafe.
We have had murdering muzzos running down people in cars
We have had murdering muzzos slashing and stabbing people.

Where are all the far right terrorists??????

Oh yeah, all the graffiti on the walls.
And some muzzo shela was insulted once in Newcastle.

The horror of it all.

This is the level of stupidity we are trying to counter.

Bwyannnnnn thinks this signature make sense in his argument about Islamic democracy.

There is no democratic control in any Islamic countries.
They murder the opposition, their families and any that they can to defeat them.

If this is democracy, then we are all in serious trouble.

and in power, the Imams run riot enforcing barbaric punishments for the most trivial crimes???

Bwyannnnnnn.......YOU HAVE LOST IT MATE.
Back to top      
83038794ed927490ed79e44b13683284--the-muslim-in-the-mind_003.jpg (12 KB | 9 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 20th, 2021 at 5:40pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 21st, 2021 at 9:21am
I haver been on this forum for some years now.

In that time I have seen some interesting posts, some good debate and some idiots.

But, without a doubt, bwyannnnnnn is the most stupid of all posters.

He has never actually put forward any reasoned debate on any topic.
He states "facts" from sources known to be false and clings to them like a drowning man clings to a stick.
His favorite ploy is to simply ignore logic, fact and reason, simply stating some pathetic mantra he has heard somewhere as if this is the final and indisputable truth which overrides any argument.

His obvious mental state is evident in that he honestly believes that people take him seriously.
His multiple educational feats, none of which have ever been demonstrated, and which when challenged are ignored.
His doctor of divinity, yet another made up qualification.
And his mystical army service which he has never fully defined.

In short, his infantile mannerisms and methodology.
His immature posts and responses.
His asinine lack of understanding
and his seriously flawed logic, label him as a child, pretending to be an adult.

His continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY.jpg (25 KB | 10 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by moses on May 21st, 2021 at 2:18pm
abu_rashid wrote: Reply #5 - Aug 5th, 2008 at 10:10pm

In contrast, Muslims believe 100% in the divine nature of the Qur'an and that it must be followed 100%, and that removing or rendering any section, or even one single full stop,  invalid, would be tantamount to apostasy.


The above statement is the proof that every muslim supports islamic human rights atrocities.

The qur'an is the cause and motivation for the millions of human rights atrocities, carried out by muslims over the last 1400 odd years.

All muslims revere and support the qur'an as being infallible and must be followed 100%.

Therefore all muslims support the engendered human rights atrocities.

We will never stop islamic extremism until muslims have the courage to denounce and purge the evil in their qur'an.

Of course this will sound the death knell for islam. (no  more infallible crapola crapola, no more islam)

This is the reason the twisted leftards and *moderates* refuse to renounce the evils of islam, they prefer the raping torture and slaughter over islam imploding.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 21st, 2021 at 5:06pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 21st, 2021 at 8:15pm
I haver been on this forum for some years now.

In that time I have seen some interesting posts, some good debate and some idiots.

But, without a doubt, bwyannnnnnn is the most stupid of all posters.

He has never actually put forward any reasoned debate on any topic.
He states "facts" from sources known to be false and clings to them like a drowning man clings to a stick.
His favorite ploy is to simply ignore logic, fact and reason, simply stating some pathetic mantra he has heard somewhere as if this is the final and indisputable truth which overrides any argument.

His obvious mental state is evident in that he honestly believes that people take him seriously.
His multiple educational feats, none of which have ever been demonstrated, and which when challenged are ignored.
His doctor of divinity, yet another made up qualification.
And his mystical army service which he has never fully defined.

In short, his infantile mannerisms and methodology.
His immature posts and responses.
His asinine lack of understanding
and his seriously flawed logic, label him as a child, pretending to be an adult.

His continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_007.jpg (25 KB | 9 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Aussie on May 21st, 2021 at 8:18pm

Valkie wrote on May 21st, 2021 at 8:15pm:
I haver been on this forum for some years now.

In that time I have seen some interesting posts, some good debate and some idiots.

But, without a doubt, bwyannnnnnn is the most stupid of all posters.

He has never actually put forward any reasoned debate on any topic.
He states "facts" from sources known to be false and clings to them like a drowning man clings to a stick.
His favorite ploy is to simply ignore logic, fact and reason, simply stating some pathetic mantra he has heard somewhere as if this is the final and indisputable truth which overrides any argument.

His obvious mental state is evident in that he honestly believes that people take him seriously.
His multiple educational feats, none of which have ever been demonstrated, and which when challenged are ignored.
His doctor of divinity, yet another made up qualification.
And his mystical army service which he has never fully defined.


In short, his infantile mannerisms and methodology.
His immature posts and responses.
His asinine lack of understanding
and his seriously flawed logic, label him as a child, pretending to be an adult.

His continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.


You sure you are not mistaking Brian for Effendi?

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Frank on May 22nd, 2021 at 1:08pm

Aussie wrote on May 21st, 2021 at 8:18pm:

Valkie wrote on May 21st, 2021 at 8:15pm:
I haver been on this forum for some years now.

In that time I have seen some interesting posts, some good debate and some idiots.

But, without a doubt, bwyannnnnnn is the most stupid of all posters.

He has never actually put forward any reasoned debate on any topic.
He states "facts" from sources known to be false and clings to them like a drowning man clings to a stick.
His favorite ploy is to simply ignore logic, fact and reason, simply stating some pathetic mantra he has heard somewhere as if this is the final and indisputable truth which overrides any argument.

His obvious mental state is evident in that he honestly believes that people take him seriously.
His multiple educational feats, none of which have ever been demonstrated, and which when challenged are ignored.
His doctor of divinity, yet another made up qualification.
And his mystical army service which he has never fully defined.


In short, his infantile mannerisms and methodology.
His immature posts and responses.
His asinine lack of understanding
and his seriously flawed logic, label him as a child, pretending to be an adult.

His continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.


You sure you are not mistaking Brian for Effendi?



No. Brian's stupidity is unique. He LIKES being stupid for the sake of getting humiliated for it. With that he stands alone.


Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 22nd, 2021 at 6:52pm
Your continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_020.jpg (25 KB | 10 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 22nd, 2021 at 10:23pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 23rd, 2021 at 8:54am
Your continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_028.jpg (25 KB | 10 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 23rd, 2021 at 3:16pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 23rd, 2021 at 4:31pm
Your continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_031.jpg (25 KB | 9 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 23rd, 2021 at 5:17pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 24th, 2021 at 8:44am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_038.jpg (25 KB | 9 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 24th, 2021 at 10:30am



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Bias_2012 on May 24th, 2021 at 10:38am
FD might have something to say if you blokes keep going on like that. It's not good for advertising

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 24th, 2021 at 3:07pm
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_042.jpg (25 KB | 11 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 24th, 2021 at 4:36pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Matty is incapable of understanding reasoned debate.  Unfortunately.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 24th, 2021 at 4:58pm
Your continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_052.jpg (25 KB | 10 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 24th, 2021 at 5:24pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 25th, 2021 at 8:36am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_058.jpg (25 KB | 11 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 25th, 2021 at 3:13pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 26th, 2021 at 7:47am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_065.jpg (25 KB | 12 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 26th, 2021 at 12:41pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 26th, 2021 at 1:59pm
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_072.jpg (25 KB | 10 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 26th, 2021 at 5:24pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 27th, 2021 at 8:25am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_079.jpg (25 KB | 11 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 27th, 2021 at 10:21am



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 27th, 2021 at 11:25am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_084.jpg (25 KB | 9 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 27th, 2021 at 12:41pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 27th, 2021 at 2:27pm
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_092.jpg (25 KB | 7 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 27th, 2021 at 3:18pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish irrational Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 28th, 2021 at 8:38am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_101.jpg (25 KB | 7 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 28th, 2021 at 3:02pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish irrational Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 29th, 2021 at 9:07am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_110.jpg (25 KB | 12 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 29th, 2021 at 2:01pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 29th, 2021 at 5:17pm
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_115.jpg (25 KB | 6 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 29th, 2021 at 5:35pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)




Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Frank on May 29th, 2021 at 7:01pm

Brian Ross wrote on May 29th, 2021 at 5:35pm:


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Imbecile.


Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 29th, 2021 at 7:04pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agnes.   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 30th, 2021 at 8:52am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_124.jpg (25 KB | 14 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 30th, 2021 at 2:29pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agnes.   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)


Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 30th, 2021 at 3:39pm
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_135.jpg (25 KB | 12 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 30th, 2021 at 3:55pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agatha.   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 31st, 2021 at 8:37am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_145.jpg (25 KB | 12 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 31st, 2021 at 1:36pm



Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agatha.   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)


Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by NorthOfNorth on May 31st, 2021 at 1:43pm

Brian Ross wrote on May 31st, 2021 at 1:36pm:


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agatha.   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)

I'm amazed that you literally have nothing else to do with what's left of your life.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on May 31st, 2021 at 3:41pm
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_155.jpg (25 KB | 11 )

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Brian Ross on May 31st, 2021 at 4:08pm


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agatha   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)



Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by NorthOfNorth on May 31st, 2021 at 4:53pm

Brian Ross wrote on May 31st, 2021 at 4:08pm:


Oh, dearie, dearie, me.  Childish Islamophobia.  Tsk, tsk.  ::) ::)

Soren AKA Frank has created a sock, Agatha   Tsk, tsk. ::) ::)

A snide, infantile and vindictive ad hom attack, Brian.

Title: Re: How to be a Muslim reformer
Post by Valkie on Jun 1st, 2021 at 8:51am
Bwyannnnnnn's continual posting of the same thing over and over, with not reasoned debate is beyond mental illness.
Its a sign of some serious mental problem that needs attention.

This is a plea from all those in this forum.

Bwyannnnnnn, please, for your own sake......GET SOME HELP.
BWYANNN_EXACTLY_163.jpg (25 KB | 9 )

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